LPKingsFan
All-Star
Amick in the Athletic today reports that the team is shutting down inquiries regarding Fox, pursuing “many avenues” but known to have had “extensive talks” with the Nets about Cam Johnson.
Potential Free agent/trade/sign tracker
- Thread starter iowamcnabb
- Start date
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
I find myself going back and forth in regards to adding Cam Johnson. In order for a trade to work financially it likely has to be Kev/Trey or Kev/Devin. Would we start Cam? If so, you still don’t have any bench wing depth and you now have Keon, Devin and Monk fighting for minutes off the bench. If you trade Devin you are risking him turning into a game changing defensive culture changer. It also leaves us thin at back up center.
Joshyjosh31
Starter
If the trade is Lyle’s, Huerter, and two firsts for
Cam and Sharpe I would start Cam over Derozan and even monk but I doubt we go either route and have Cam off the bench which is fine. Cam has the size to play back up PF in this era so a bench of Ellis, Carter, Cam, and Sharpe is very good very good defense and shooting. Ellis and Carter probably play 15-18 mpg untill Derozan is moved to the bench next year.
The best move to me is a starting lineup of Fox, Monk, Cam, Keegan, and Sabonis. The offense would almost be unstoppable plugging in Cam’s 40% elite shooting and we would surround monk and Sabonis with another capable wing defender. Derozan would be an elite scorer vs second units and get the benefits of ellis/carter defensively
LPKingsFan
All-Star
I don’t know if these are accurate but, financially at least, Huerter for Johnson’s contracts are close enough to work on the fanspo trade machine. On ESPN, one of the vet mins is enough to bridge the gap. But maybe that pushes the Kings into the tax?
Joshyjosh31
Starter
His reporting should only be taking seriously when he cites a source from previous posts when he doesn’t it he’s stating his opinion mixed with other reports. I think he’s saying he thinks Carter gets it done which is his opinion going off earlier tweet where he cites the athletic.
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
According to Spotrac’s trade machine even two minimum contracts doesn’t get us there. This hypothetical was Kev, Jordan and Orlando. I’m not sure
LPKingsFan
All-Star
Oh interesting. The sites I checked may just account for salary matching, while spotrac’s seems to flag an issue with the tax here. Are the Kings hard capped because they did a sign and trade? I don’t think they used the full non taxpayer MLE, is that right? I used to enjoy geeking out over the cap rules, but they’ve gotten so complicated, and arguably counterproductive (the Warriors somehow can keep adding guys) that it’s not fun anymore.
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
the sign and trade with Deebo hard capped us at the first apron.
twslam07
All-Star
I think something might be wrong with Spotrac’s trade machine.
We are hard capped at the 1st apron due to the S&T for DeRozan, but we are not quite at the 1st apron yet. I believe we’re $5.9 mil under the 1st apron which would allow us to take back $5.9 mil more in salary than we’re sending out.
In fact, I think a Huerter for Johnson swap is legal without including any other players as Johnson’s salary is only $5.6 mil more than Huerter (and we have $5.9 mil to work with). I just tried a Huerter for Johnson trade on Fanspo’s trade machine (which I really like personally) and it says it’s legal.
I tried executing the same trade in Spotrac’s trade machine and it says it is not legal because we can’t take back any more salary than we are sending out (which I disagree with based on my understanding of the CBA). I also just tested Lyles for Nance in Spotrac’s trade machine (which has us taking back $3+ mil more than what we’re sending out) and it says it’s legal. How can Spotrac’s trade machine be okay with us taking back more money in a trade for Nance but then say we can’t take back more money when trading for Johnson? Doesn’t make sense to me.
I think Spotrac’s trade machine is still working out the kinks.
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ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
The quote was including Carter, not picks + Carter.
They're likely going to have to sweeten the deal for Brooklyn to want in. Otherwise, why would a rebuilding Nets team want Huerter and Lyles for Cam Johnson?
I'm not in favor of this proposed trade with Carter, because I think he will be better than Johnson.....and like Murray, Johnson's best spot is the 3. Wait till you can you find someone who fits and their best spot is at the 4. Otherwise keep your best young talent for now and look to move Huerter in another deal
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
Pretty sure that 5.9 mil was before the McDermott signing. maybe Spotrac isn’t including that because it’s not fully guaranteed and they have a decision on that coming up?
The other thing it could be is I heard Keith Smith say that Cam has some unlikely bonuses built into his contract that would have an impact on apron teams trying to trade for him. He said the total salary was something like 27 mil that would have to be factored into a trade I believe.
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iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
It’s supposedly Carter AND a first round pick. They are asking for multiple firsts but would allegedly take a young player they like and a first rounder. The kings are likely offering Kev/Lyles and a protected first and what “gets them over the finish line” is the inclusion of Carter.
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
I think my main issue with including Lyles as well as Carter in a potential Cam trade is that you’re just making your depth even more of an issue than if it just ended up as Cam for Huerter/salary/two firsts.
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
Keith Smith would need to provide clarity on this but I think we have to include Lyles due to the incentives in Cams contract. The Nets would have no use for Trey so I can’t see why they would just throw him in unless it was required. I agree though, better hope Craw or J can play or you are in trouble. Or hope PJ Tucker gets bought out and you can sign him (assuming we are below the first apron)
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
Also, what happens if Devin Carter is a less offense more defense version of Tyrese Maxey and Fox requests a trade this summer? Carter could be anything from a high end starter to a role playing bench piece. We just can’t know, but I’d like to find out a little more before shipping him. The kings have lacked physicality for nearly 20 years and we finally have a few guys that can bring it. Let’s see it first
LPKingsFan
All-Star
If Brooklyn is holding steadfast at multiple firsts or Carter plus another first for Cam, I might begrudgingly circle back to Kuzma.
ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
I'd rather do nothing, than trade for Kuzma. See what Christie can do with this roster, then try to make a bigger move in the off season
OptimusRhyme
Jive Turkey
Man these rumors suck. Please dont trade Carter for Cam Johnson.
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
How about this? Ivey is out for the year and the Pistons want to at least get to the play in. They get a two year look at Kev for the cost of a second rounder and an ending contract. The Nets get 2 expiring contracts 1 first rounder and 2 second rounders. Kings get Cam without giving up Carter
LPKingsFan
All-Star
That’s fair. I was just thinking that the price for Kuzma may be pretty low, so it could be worth considering, but I’m generally not a fan for a number of reasons. That said, if there’s a way to swap Huerter for a PF/SF type at a low cost, I’d be intrigued just from a roster balance standpoint (especially with Carter coming soon).
Joshyjosh31
Starter
Doing nothing shouldn’t even be an option fox is gone if that happens smh
You cannot trade Carter right now. Not only that's he's a "mystery box" but we are also very uncertain of Fox's future with the team. Then uh-oh, what if he's jrue Holiday reincarnate? Oops
ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
For the a trade to happen, the other team has to agree to it. Do you think Kuzma is enough to sway Fox? I sure don't.
I'd rather a fresh start, than to mortgage the future with a group of core players that is not a contender
Yeah, our window is really tight here to figure out a direction. Making a move right now would be silly, but if we rifle off like a 12-6 stretch until the trade deadline? Which would put us at 14-7 in the Christie era? Ok, that's when the team has "proven" to have more investment in this core.
But the absolute worst idea would be to sink more future assets right now into a Jerami Grant or Cam Johnson and the team wins 7 games from now till the trade deadline.
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
It definitely feels like the Kings need to get back to .500 before even thinking about doing an all-in trade but they’re still somehow one game back in the win column from the play-in simply by virtue of winning their last two games.
twslam07
All-Star
I think you may be right. His salary + any incentives (even unlikely incentives) might be what is being considered from a trade perspective which is…annoying
I had to thread the needle on a trade proposal to put that theory to the test. I did Huerter & Carter for Johnson and it says it’s legal. Huerter & Carter make a combined $21.519 mil while Johnson makes $22 mil. So in this scenario, the trade machine IS allowing us to take in more salary than we’re sending, but if we use the $27 mil number for Johnson (salary + incentives), it adds another $5.481 mil to be counted against the 1st apron. We have $5.9 mil to spare before we hit the 1st apron so the trade would be legal.
In summary, I do think the incentives are being factored in as it relates to the salary. I don’t know if that is technically correct but I’d take Keith Smart’s word over me.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
I feel like Kev/Trey is worlds apart from Kev/Devin. If Monte moves Devin for a non real mover talent wise and Devin lives up to his potential on either end, welcome to trouble Monte. Your time might be short. To me the only option for Monte is salary/pick. Which personally, I wouldn't touch either. Not yet at least.
