Yeah Pats have been stocking up. The biggie of course is the Raiders #1 from the Seymour move last year.
NFL Talk
- Thread starter kingsboi
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kingsboi
Hall of Famer
What's with the Seahawks and their running backs? First Leon Washington now Marshawn Lynch. Then they cut Julius Jones. I like the move of course for Seattle, maybe Lynch needed a change of scenery. As for Vincent Jackson, I sure hope he doesn't go to the Pats. I want him to either stay with San Diego or go to a team where they lack wide receivers, I just doubt he will want to go to a situation where the team he goes to is losing so that of course will play a vital part in his decision.
kingsboi
Hall of Famer
Time for Week 5 picks;
JAC vs BUF
DEN vs BAL
KC vs IND
GB vs WAS
STL vs DET
CHI vs CAR
TB vs CIN
ATL vs CLE
NYG vs HOU
NO vs ARI
TEN vs DAL
SD vs OAK
PHI vs SF
MIN vs NYJ
Upset picks for the week is Buffalo & 49ers getting it's first wins against Jacksonville & Philadelphia. I also picked Carolina to win this week because the Bears are without Jay Cutler this week and from what I saw last week with Collins, I don't like what I see. Here's to a fun & exciting Sunday of NFL football!
JAC vs BUF
DEN vs BAL
KC vs IND
GB vs WAS
STL vs DET
CHI vs CAR
TB vs CIN
ATL vs CLE
NYG vs HOU
NO vs ARI
TEN vs DAL
SD vs OAK
PHI vs SF
MIN vs NYJ
Upset picks for the week is Buffalo & 49ers getting it's first wins against Jacksonville & Philadelphia. I also picked Carolina to win this week because the Bears are without Jay Cutler this week and from what I saw last week with Collins, I don't like what I see. Here's to a fun & exciting Sunday of NFL football!
mcsluggo
Starter
cutler is out?? are you sure??
(if so, i am screwed... my two qbs are vick and cutler)
(if so, i am screwed... my two qbs are vick and cutler)
Cutler practiced yesterday, thought he was cleared.
Guess not: http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=AuZPUvYizJo_2KyqzQog111DubYF?slug=ap-bears-cutler
Guess not: http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=AuZPUvYizJo_2KyqzQog111DubYF?slug=ap-bears-cutler
SacKings7
Starter
So apparently a Jackson for Mankins deal is being discussed. I have nothing against Mankins, but I wouldn't be happy with this trade if it went down. The Chargers wouldn't give McNeill a long term contract, what are the odds they give one to Mankins? And while their other guards aren't quite on Mankins level, they're still pretty good.
Also saw today that the Pats are looking at bringing Deion Branch back. I think that move could really jump start his career again
Also saw today that the Pats are looking at bringing Deion Branch back. I think that move could really jump start his career again
I'd be dancing on the ceiling if Jax for Makins goes down. And I'll get a chuckle if Branch comes back so long as its cheap.
kingsboi
Hall of Famer
The whole Jackson for Mankins deal would be awesome for the Pats. Immediate replacement for Randy and younger & better in this point in his career. If New England can pull it off, good for them. It's just another reason why they are one of the best organizations in the league and run by top notch owners/GM's.
MassachusettsKingsFan
All-Star
I didnt love the Moss deal as a Pats fan, but I 'get' why they did it. That being said, Im not a huge fan of bringing Vjax along. I rather go after Branch or Lee Evans.
Here me out.
Pats D is bad. It really is. Brady has been forcing the ball to Moss all season. When it works, we get a quick score, when it doesnt .. we go 3 and out. In order for this team to be successful, they need to keep that D off the field as much as possible. Long drives allow the defense to rest and strategize. We need that.
Going back to that dink n dunk offense would work wonders for the young defense. With Edelman back .. Woodhead there as another short yardage reciever... I just think lining up Edelman, Welker, Woodhead, and the TE's give us plenty of short yardage threats and will allow us to really chew that clock. You bring in Vjax, who by the way could easily be a worse locker room guy then Moss .. well then your back to square 1. And dont get me wrong, square 1 for this team isnt bad .. I mean, we are 3-1 .. but I think taking the time to bring in Vjax and have him learn our complex system at this point in the season .. I think our practice time would be better off somewhere else.
Here me out.
Pats D is bad. It really is. Brady has been forcing the ball to Moss all season. When it works, we get a quick score, when it doesnt .. we go 3 and out. In order for this team to be successful, they need to keep that D off the field as much as possible. Long drives allow the defense to rest and strategize. We need that.
Going back to that dink n dunk offense would work wonders for the young defense. With Edelman back .. Woodhead there as another short yardage reciever... I just think lining up Edelman, Welker, Woodhead, and the TE's give us plenty of short yardage threats and will allow us to really chew that clock. You bring in Vjax, who by the way could easily be a worse locker room guy then Moss .. well then your back to square 1. And dont get me wrong, square 1 for this team isnt bad .. I mean, we are 3-1 .. but I think taking the time to bring in Vjax and have him learn our complex system at this point in the season .. I think our practice time would be better off somewhere else.
kingsboi
Hall of Famer
Well you are obviously entitled to your own opinion. That may be the case too, it really could go either way. It's tough to say, I mean he could bring that deep threat once again and will catch everything, compared to learning the playbook with 4 weeks already in the books will take some time I'm sure. We will have to see how this plays itself out, I expect Vincent to stay in San Diego, but if he doesn't, I'll be happy for him that he can go somewhere else and finally play.
I hear you loud and clear and I too have been extremely frustrated with Brady forcing it deep, one thing though is that Moss had started taking plays off again and he also dropped a few easily catchable balls (leads the league in drops iirc). But if VJax comes cheap because of his associated risks then I am all for it even though I have long favored a return to a possession offense (which they were doing even with Moss in the lineup). To be honest I am more concerned about losing Moss as a decoy than as a deep threat.
I don't think Vincent Jackson is that good, and I don't think Belichick would trade one diva receiver who, for all his warts, hasn't had any off the field problems (had the traffic incident several years ago, that I think got a little larger than life), and was basically upset about his contract status, and then go trade for another diva receiver that has had more DUIs than standout seasons, and give him a new contract, which is the reason he's not on the field to begin with. On top of that, the Patriots have their own RFA holdout that they won't do a new deal for (although they at least offered him one). It just seems like they'd be going right back to what they were just trying to get out of. Except Jackson isn't nearly as good as Moss, and he's looking for a long term deal that he hasn't quite justified with his play ... yet. Doesn't seem like a Patriots-like move, in the middle of what seems to be a return to the old Patriot way.
SacKings7
Starter
Jackson is most effective running deep routes, but he can be a serviceable short-yardage guy too, depending on what kinda shape he's in at the moment. San Diego just likes to run a lot of deep routes with their receivers (Rivers is pretty accurate throwing long balls). I agree with Superman though and think that the system made him look better than he actually is. I mean, the offense hasn't really missed him too much other than the 4th quarter of game 1. Then again, they haven't played against a really good defense yet either.
kingsboi
Hall of Famer
I guess I'm in the minority here about Vincent Jackson. I think he's a very good receiver, he catches everything thrown to him and he's tall so he can just jump up and grab the ball in double coverage. I don't know if you want to say he is what he is by the system he plays, it's really not fair to say until you see him play elsewhere and his production drops significantly. I just want to see him back playing somewhere, whether it's SD or anywhere else. He is always a touchdown threat/Redzone target and he will produce. He might be a diva with this whole contract situation, but a lot of receivers are divas in their own way. Whether it's involving money, publicity stunts, entertainment purposes, media talk, etc.
No, I don't think he's a diva with his contract situation. I think he's a diva because of a bunch of other things. I actually sort of side with him on his contract situation, until we start talking about actual contract demands. I think it sucks that he got grandfathered in as an RFA -- including everyone else that essentially had their rookie contract altered because of the CBA status -- and I think AJ Smith is a tool. It's pretty clear that VJ will never play for the Chargers again, so why not trade him to the Vikings when the deal was all but done? Now he'll either trade him for less at the deadline, or he'll just lose him in free agency. Sucks.
As for Jackson's play, I don't know exactly how good he is. But he's not elite, by any stretch of the imagination. I don't need to see his production drop off; it's not that impressive already. He had a good 2009, and an above average 2008, but when you compare him to the truly elite receivers, he's not even close. Despite Randy Moss' taking plays off and sometimes being a poor sport, he out-produced VJ last season, and by a fair margin. He even out-produced him in 2008 when Matt Cassel was throwing the ball. Not to mention the hard working and dynamic guys like Brandon Marshall, Andre Johnson, Reggie Wayne, etc., who blow VJ's numbers out of the water. I'd even put guys like Desean Jackson, Anquan Boldin, Santonio Holmes, Roddy White, Sidney Rice, Steve Smith (both of them) ahead of VJ, based off production and their respective roles. I'm not knocking him, I just hear so many people talking about him like he's a legitimate #1 receiver, and he hasn't proven that to this point. He's good, but not that good, at least not from what I see.
He would add a dimension to the Pats passing game that will definitely be lacking without Moss. People talk about Welker's receptions the past three years, which are incredibly impressive, but you have to give Moss' deep threat credit for Welker having room to operate underneath. It's a lot easier to run in routes when you have a freak running a go route on the outside. VJ would, at the very least, provide that threat, and I have no doubt that he'd benefit from playing with a great quarterback like Tom Brady. As good as Rivers is, he's not Tom Brady. But his contract status is a huge problem that I can't see the Pats getting past, not to mention the fact that AJ Smith's asking price is a 1st and a 2nd, and he doesn't appear to be willing to budge. And again, the Pats still don't have Mankins on the field. I think Belichick would rather turn that 1st rounder into a couple of 2nds in April, than give it up with a 2nd for a receiver that duplicates what he just traded away. I just don't see how it makes sense.
The thing with the Pats (and its always a gamble) is whether a player buys into "The Patriots Way" and sometimes you get guys like Moss that will do it for a few seasons and then get concerned with their contracts or whatever and they'll be gone as fast as you can snap your fingers because BB doesn't tolerate it. Since almost every great wide out these days is a diva (save Larry Fitzgerald) Pats fans just have to accept the revolving door. That is why I'm willing to take a chance on Jax though, if he comes cheap.
SacKings7
Starter
Yeah I realize it's not fair to him for me to say that, I'm just basing it off the Chargers offense last year compared to this year. The only new addition at receiver is Patrick Crayton, and he doesn't see the field regularly. Malcom Floyd, Legedu Naanee and even Buster Davis have made up for Jackson's production without missing a beat, and they are hardly household names at this point. Obviously there's Gates too, but Gates has brought it year in and year out
kingsboi
Hall of Famer
Well, Vincent Jackson may not be a legitimate number one receiver. But he has the tools to become one. He just needs to prove consistency and show he is worthy of a big pay day. As for the Chargers not missing a beat, their number one option is Gates and he is a TE. You don't see that too often, so I think Vincent along with Gates were options 1a & 1b. I personally still think they will miss him down the stretch IF they do make the playoffs. He takes pressure off some of the other receivers because he is a vertical threat, but we will have to see. Regarding what Superman said about him not playing as a Charger again, that may be the case, it is a interesting topic for sure.
kingsboi
Hall of Famer
Sunday night football wraps up with the Eagles pulling out the victory in a close one, I didn't watch the game after the first half so I can't make too much evaluation about the entire game. From what I did see though, both teams were scoring and going at each other and Kolb def. looked much better than the previous week. Kudos to him and the Eagles for getting a road win and the 9ers, just...wow. How about Washington beating Green Bay? Can you say impressive! McNabb threw the ball all over the yard and the Redskin D performed well today. The Texans disappointed me majorly by getting spanked like that at home, by the Giants. I guess that's what happens when you can't play a lick of defense, teams will just expose you down the field and attack your vulnerable cornerbacks, I'm sure they miss Dunta Robinson by now. They should not be this bad on defense, they have a awesome linebacker core, a great pass rusher in Mario Williams, decent DB's & Safeties, I'm not sure if it's the scheme or what, but it is what it is, maybe next week Houston. The Lions killed the Rams at home, I'm telling ya, if Detroit had Matt Stafford they could put some scare in teams, that team can put up some serious points, I can't wait till Matt comes back. The Chiefs 3-0 record came to an end, as expected by the Colts. I must say, the Colts offense looks super slugious. They took a very long time to put seven on the board and it was a field goal game all the way up to the 4th quarter, I believe. How about Arizona beating the Saints? I don't think many people would of picked that one to happen. The Saints have been struggling since opening week on offense and it looks like the injuries of Pierre Thomas, Reggie Bush & Darren Sharper is hurting them both on offense & defense. They do have a winning record, but their games haven't been as lopsided as last year, that's to be expected of course, they are indeed the champs and every team they face is going to give them their best and want to come out with something to prove. If the Saints don't start shaping up pretty soon in these next couple of weeks, they are headed in for some real trouble. The Chargers just look all out of sorts themselves, yes their putting up plenty of points, but they can't stop anybody. Their special teams this year is just pathetic. I don't know if it's those same Chargers that always start slow and then towards the end of the season step it up, it will be interesting to see if they do that once again. The Cowboys drop to 1-3 and already are 0-2 at home. Tennessee played a well rounded game with balance on the ground and through the air. Finally, Chris Johnson had a good game again, it's been quiet from his side of things for the last couple of weeks. None the less, impressive win for the Titans. Cowboys are in for one hell of a ride, I can tell ya that much. Finally, it seems Carson Palmers' days in Cinci are slowly coming to an end, atleast I hope so. 3 interceptions, 2 coming within a minute of the game and the last one that cost them the game. It also doesn't help that the defense just looks out of sort, I mean Tampa Bay should not be scoring 24 points on Cincinnati's defense. It might be time to start thinking new QB in the next draft and address their major need for a pass rusher, or two. I'm just disappointed that this season is going to go to waste, all that talent on offense they have and they just can't get it done, what a shame. It's how the NFL works though, you can't be a "paper" team you have to be a team on the field. One final game left tomorrow, I am really looking forward to the Monday Night match up, Revis vs Moss Part II should be fun!
They were out of sync all game long. Was really frustrating to watch. But the Chiefs hadn't given up more than 14 points all season. Their defensive front had bullied everyone they'd played, and they got some great pressure yesterday. Crennel has always had a measure of success against the Colts offense, and he apparently still has it, though the Colts helped out with dropped passes, underthrows, bad routes, bad reads, etc. But, I've been saying it since Week 1, the Chiefs defense is for real. I thought the secondary would get hurt a little more yesterday, and save for a few big plays back there, they would have given up a couple more touchdowns. They'll get better, the front seven is one of the best in football, and as soon as the offense catches up, the Chiefs will be a force.
kingsboi
Hall of Famer
Your telling me. As a Bengals fan, I am slowly starting to hate Carson Palmer by the weeks. I really feel we need to go in another direction and start young at QB again, draft two new receivers since Chad & TO will be gone pretty soon and just draft DE's & OL's.
kingsboi
Hall of Famer
This year is going to be an interesting year for sure in football. No team really besides MAYBE the Jets & Steelers look poised to be Superbowl bound, yes the Ravens are 4-1 but I still don't see them getting there. As for the Chiefs, I still don't believe in their defense, I need to see a couple more weeks of them playing and then I will make further evaluation whether their defense is for real.
Def not sold on the Chiefs but the AFC West is theirs for the taking.
I'm steaming mad about the Chargers giving the Raiders a freebie. That #1 draft pick headed to the Pats could fall from at top 3 to a 5-7 thanks to that. Nice going jerks. At least the Lions won.
Speaking of the Lions, with their kickoff return for a TD this week there has been at least one kickoff returned all the way every week this season (most weeks have had 2). Has that ever happened this far into the season? It seems doubtful to me. Also when was the last time no team made it any better than 3-0?
I'm steaming mad about the Chargers giving the Raiders a freebie. That #1 draft pick headed to the Pats could fall from at top 3 to a 5-7 thanks to that. Nice going jerks. At least the Lions won.
Speaking of the Lions, with their kickoff return for a TD this week there has been at least one kickoff returned all the way every week this season (most weeks have had 2). Has that ever happened this far into the season? It seems doubtful to me. Also when was the last time no team made it any better than 3-0?
1970.
Rockmeister
All-Star
Wow, what a long a** paragraph. It would have been easier to read had you at broken it up in a couple of paragraphs.
kingsboi
Hall of Famer
Yeah, I figured that out after I posted it and didn't feel like going back and putting them back into paragraphs.
Is that for the latter question? Any idea on the kickoff returns? My google is broken
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