Kings active in trade talks?
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Sure, but its not about making a splash this season. Its about accumulating assets as quickly as possible and establishing a culture. Ideally to establish a culture, you would like to go on a futile late season run where all of a sudden you were playing .500 or better ball for the final month and building on that going into the summer. And because of the expected potency of this particular draft, at no other time is there the opportunity to potentially gain so many proven talented players from teams looking to score big in the draft. As long as we aren't acquiring 36yr old vets on ending contracts, any major talent we acquire now, whether in the next 6 weeks, or after the season, IS a move for the future. For next year, for the culture.
For what it is worth. A friend of mine in LA says that the radio station there is reporting that the Kings are interested in "re-acquiring" the first round pick that they owe Cleveland, and that our involvement would be to 1) get our pick back, 2) get a pick from LAL (second round) and/or 3) acquire a player from one of the teams to make it worth our while. That would suggest that someone higher level than Jimmer is involved- maybe JT and Jimmer, with us getting back our Cavs pick, a second rounder from LAL, and someone like Meeks or an equivalent from Cleveland.
Another question. All indications are that we are still trying to get Andre Miller. Is this to have Miller backup IT and act as a mentor? Or start Miller and mentor Ray Mac? Food for thought.
I still have this feeling IT is going to be traded. Mostly because he is going to demand a lot more money after this year.
I still have this feeling IT is going to be traded. Mostly because he is going to demand a lot more money after this year.
Same way we traded it away -- just the same as trading a pick. We just get the restrictions lifted.
And thing is, that could have SEVERAL implications. Because really for us that wouldn't matter for us this year unless we made a late season mega rush. It was already ours if we picked Top 12. but now, you get that encumbrance off that pick, and all of a sudden you have a valuable trade asset if you want to use it that way, that you could use before this very trade deadline. Or you have a valuable trade asset over the summer, although not as valuable as it will be now with us guaranteed losers in a strong draft.
In any case, getting that encumbrance off our pick is MUCH better for us than getting an L.A. pick unless it be one in this year's lottery.
And thing is, that could have SEVERAL implications. Because really for us that wouldn't matter for us this year unless we made a late season mega rush. It was already ours if we picked Top 12. but now, you get that encumbrance off that pick, and all of a sudden you have a valuable trade asset if you want to use it that way, that you could use before this very trade deadline. Or you have a valuable trade asset over the summer, although not as valuable as it will be now with us guaranteed losers in a strong draft.
In any case, getting that encumbrance off our pick is MUCH better for us than getting an L.A. pick unless it be one in this year's lottery.
One thing that no one seems to be considering is that IT is an incredible fan favorite, with his face splashed all over everywhere. Little kids love him. I know it's not de rigueur around here to consider fan reaction, but in this case I think we should.
Trading IT for anything less than a true star would not sit well with the fans who are paying to come see the team. The new ownership is working very hard to romance those fans and I simply cannot see any way they could easily justify trading IT away.
The more I think about it, the more I think the players truly being shopped are not named Thomas or Cousins.
Trading IT for anything less than a true star would not sit well with the fans who are paying to come see the team. The new ownership is working very hard to romance those fans and I simply cannot see any way they could easily justify trading IT away.
The more I think about it, the more I think the players truly being shopped are not named Thomas or Cousins.
I understand. But winning will make the fans forget. So if we trade IT and it makes the team better, fans will get over it.
If we sign IT after this season and pay for Rudy Gay, we are saying that's it. We're rolling with these guys for the next 4 years because we have no cap space to get anyone else. I can't see Pete D being done with remaking this team after one season. Someone's got to go.
If we sign IT after this season and pay for Rudy Gay, we are saying that's it. We're rolling with these guys for the next 4 years because we have no cap space to get anyone else. I can't see Pete D being done with remaking this team after one season. Someone's got to go.
the new ownership has shown no compunction about trading anybody away. I don't know the IT plans -- the contract situation complicates that immensely. But if they think the team will get better with a trade I doubt they give a rat's ass how the fans react to it. Fans will always respond if you do something that starts the team winning.
The reason Tyreke is still talked about is because that stupidity didn't make us better. It made us worse, and we are just a bad as we were last year while the very position Tyreke played is now a glaring weakpoint, not only the weakest on the team, but one of the weakest in the league. If we traded IT and the same thing happened to PG, oh yeah, they would catch hell. Don't know if they care, but they would catch it. On the other hand if the team suddenly started winning all complaints would be muted. I haven't seen any connection at all to the moves they have made and fan feelings, nor even to their own public statements. I think they will do anything to create a winner, and as long as you have a smart front office that is a good thing really.
The reason Tyreke is still talked about is because that stupidity didn't make us better. It made us worse, and we are just a bad as we were last year while the very position Tyreke played is now a glaring weakpoint, not only the weakest on the team, but one of the weakest in the league. If we traded IT and the same thing happened to PG, oh yeah, they would catch hell. Don't know if they care, but they would catch it. On the other hand if the team suddenly started winning all complaints would be muted. I haven't seen any connection at all to the moves they have made and fan feelings, nor even to their own public statements. I think they will do anything to create a winner, and as long as you have a smart front office that is a good thing really.
I do not think the Kings will just let him walk. I think the front office knows he has value to this team. It's a question of where they decide the bar for that value will be.
NOBODY knows what he's going to ask for. I like IT and I think he has talent. I'm not totally convinced he cannot be a starting PG, especially if we shore up our SG and PF positions with some guys who can actually play defense. I think he's more valuable as a 6th man, but I could easily be wrong.
Is he perfect? Oh, hell no, but we've seen worse.
Remember, the NBA is a business ... and right now, IT is VERY, VERY GOOD for business. You don't just pull the trigger on a trade that takes that away without considering that part of the equation. Around here a lot of people want to just think about the nuts and bolts, but that's not realistic. You don't build someone up to the extent IT has been built up by the team, the broadcasting crew, etc. and then just toss him out for any old trade. You really don't. People can argue all they like, but you have to consider the public reaction right now, especially if the arena deal goes to a vote (which I don't think it will but that's neither here nor there). You do not want to do anything to rock the boat as far as the growing fondness for IT in and around Sacramento. He's one of the top two players talked about by most people...
NOBODY knows what he's going to ask for. I like IT and I think he has talent. I'm not totally convinced he cannot be a starting PG, especially if we shore up our SG and PF positions with some guys who can actually play defense. I think he's more valuable as a 6th man, but I could easily be wrong.
Is he perfect? Oh, hell no, but we've seen worse.
Remember, the NBA is a business ... and right now, IT is VERY, VERY GOOD for business. You don't just pull the trigger on a trade that takes that away without considering that part of the equation. Around here a lot of people want to just think about the nuts and bolts, but that's not realistic. You don't build someone up to the extent IT has been built up by the team, the broadcasting crew, etc. and then just toss him out for any old trade. You really don't. People can argue all they like, but you have to consider the public reaction right now, especially if the arena deal goes to a vote (which I don't think it will but that's neither here nor there). You do not want to do anything to rock the boat as far as the growing fondness for IT in and around Sacramento. He's one of the top two players talked about by most people...
You could easily be right ... or my sense that IT is a very important PR cog right now could also be right. I guess only time will tell but I haven't seen the kind of fan attention IT gets in a very, very long time...from the very fans Vivek and Co. are hoping to woo b[ack. The family who comes together and watches games, spending good money to do.
I don't think Tyreke is talked about that much except on various forums. He wasn't anywhere near as well liked by the average fan - including the mom and dad who take their kids to the game - as IT is. I didn't really think too much about it until the last game I went to. Isaiah is almost to minor rock star status. Vivek is a businessman. He knows the value of merchandizing. It's for that reason that I think we have to at least consider that IT won't be traded away for anything other than a truly clear upgrade. Anything else could easily backfire, alienating some of the very fans they've been working so hard to win back.
I'm just giving my two cents. I of course do not know for sure, but I do know the reactions of a lot of the people I've seen at Sleep Train. IT lights them up.
I don't think Tyreke is talked about that much except on various forums. He wasn't anywhere near as well liked by the average fan - including the mom and dad who take their kids to the game - as IT is. I didn't really think too much about it until the last game I went to. Isaiah is almost to minor rock star status. Vivek is a businessman. He knows the value of merchandizing. It's for that reason that I think we have to at least consider that IT won't be traded away for anything other than a truly clear upgrade. Anything else could easily backfire, alienating some of the very fans they've been working so hard to win back.
I'm just giving my two cents. I of course do not know for sure, but I do know the reactions of a lot of the people I've seen at Sleep Train. IT lights them up.
well, during his time in sacramento, jason williams was regarded with just as much fondness and popularity as isaiah thomas, if not more so... and then the kings decided to get serious about playoff contention. they traded j-will for a less sexy but much steadier hand in mike bibby. it was not a popular trade at the time amongst the casual fan. mike bibby had been languishing away in vancouver; he was not well-known to most kings fans. but the team jumped closer to a title with bibby at the helm, and the fans quickly moved on from j-will, who himself proceeded to languish away in vancouver/memphis...
that's certainly not a perfectly parallel example to the current situation that this new regime is faced with, but the point is, while the kings are losing, IT is, indeed, a financial boon of near-hysterical proportions for ranadive and co. after all, there's nothing american sports fans love more than an underdog, and the pizza guy serves up his napolean complex nightly to the delight of a great many. but again, the kings are losing, and they're losing a lot. i don't think for one second that ranadive and d'allesandro would hesitate to trade thomas before the deadline this season if they believed such a trade would ultimately result in an eventual shift away from the loss column, regardless of whether or not it's considered "a truly clear upgrade."
the slightness of IT's rookie contract happens to complicate the "truly clear upgrade" part, because thomas wouldn't swapped one-for-one in just about any theoretical trade of note. thus it is up to the new brain trust to determine whether or not they want to pony up what will probably be a fairly sizable contract to re-sign isaiah thomas (and, in all likelihood, for a sixth man's role), or if they'd prefer to trade him while his value is still at its highest in order to bring back a piece or two that perhaps fits the direction of the team better. again, i don't think they'd hesitate to move him if the opportunity presented itself...
that's certainly not a perfectly parallel example to the current situation that this new regime is faced with, but the point is, while the kings are losing, IT is, indeed, a financial boon of near-hysterical proportions for ranadive and co. after all, there's nothing american sports fans love more than an underdog, and the pizza guy serves up his napolean complex nightly to the delight of a great many. but again, the kings are losing, and they're losing a lot. i don't think for one second that ranadive and d'allesandro would hesitate to trade thomas before the deadline this season if they believed such a trade would ultimately result in an eventual shift away from the loss column, regardless of whether or not it's considered "a truly clear upgrade."
the slightness of IT's rookie contract happens to complicate the "truly clear upgrade" part, because thomas wouldn't swapped one-for-one in just about any theoretical trade of note. thus it is up to the new brain trust to determine whether or not they want to pony up what will probably be a fairly sizable contract to re-sign isaiah thomas (and, in all likelihood, for a sixth man's role), or if they'd prefer to trade him while his value is still at its highest in order to bring back a piece or two that perhaps fits the direction of the team better. again, i don't think they'd hesitate to move him if the opportunity presented itself...
You both may well be right. All I know for sure is I haven't seen fan reaction to any player like what I see towards IT. He is the guy the whole family can root for...and they do.
I'm not saying it will be the ultimate deciding factor, but I know enough about PR to know it will be something they consider.
EDIT: To me, it might be akin to The Family Guy killing off Brian.
I'm not saying it will be the ultimate deciding factor, but I know enough about PR to know it will be something they consider.
EDIT: To me, it might be akin to The Family Guy killing off Brian.
In exchange for Deng, the Cavs send Chicago Bynum, Cleveland's right to the Sacramento King's first round draft pick conveyed in a June 30, 2011 deal, the right for Chicago to swap its own 2015 first round draft pick with the Cavs own 2015 first round draft pick (only in the case that the Cleveland 2015 first round draft pick is between 15 and 30) and the Portland Trail Blazer's 2015 and 2016 second round draft picks acquired from the Trail Blazers via a 2013 draft night trade.
So I guess we were involved...at least inadvertently.
If they can convince Deng to re-sign with them, then that's a really good pick-up for them.
I wonder if they already consider Bennett a bust and will be looking to shop him around. (Not that I want him)
I should also mention that I think that's a much better deal than trying to pick up an old Pau Gasol.
If they can convince Deng to re-sign with them, then that's a really good pick-up for them.
I wonder if they already consider Bennett a bust and will be looking to shop him around. (Not that I want him)
I should also mention that I think that's a much better deal than trying to pick up an old Pau Gasol.
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