Unconfirmed Jimmer rumor:

[Big Cuz 15]

I would be ok with Dunleavy if Jimmer took Outlaw with him. Honestly, what was Petrie thinking locking up Outlaw for four years? Worried someone was going to outbid them for such marginal talent?

But I would be fine with a Larry Sanders for Jimmer Trade. Oh and Brockman was traded to the Rockets.

goof brothers HAD to add salary to meet the minimum. outlaw benefited from it.

 

[upinsmoke]

Just a reminder there is no rush to move Jimmer because after this season he is essentially a expiring deal worth 2.5M. Aside from Jimmer really making a big stride this year the best case would be to package him with Hayes for a impact or expiring player.

 

[Gary]

I saw him start and play meaningful minutes a number of times here in the bay area. He wasn't consistent, but there is talent there, especially defensively which I've personally seen well outside of garbage time. He's no savior,but for Jimmer? How much more could we realistically get? I really don't know where you get the he's a garbage player suited for garbage time.

He's shown more in important minutes than Jimmer ever has, and has the potential to fill a role we sorely need, so I don't see how it'd be a bad deal. Also not sure why you think he wouldn't see any minutes with our team, as we are incredibly short up front, and he's the only one who'd bring shotblocking from a help defense perspective. Per 36 he put up about 10/8/3/2 last year which isn't bad for a potential defensive minded role player, or for someone we'd be giving Jimmer up for. Obviously not perfect by any stretch but he fills a much greater need for us than a 5th guard.

Not trying to compare him to Jimmer. I don't want Jimmer, never have, but I would rather get a pick than Udoh.. Because at least with a pick there is a chance to get someone good. With Jimmer for Udoh, it's nothing traded for nothing.

 

[Mass]

I know Jimmer still has that Jimmermania fashion for somebody, but if we look at the reality, trading him for Sanders or Udoh would be a no brainer for us. Jimmer has shown nothing. He can't stay on the floor, he can't dribble, he still makes the same mistakes, like jumping before knowing what to do with the ball. It's our 5th guard at least (personally I think it's our 6th, Salmons is a better option right now), so there's no room for him.

 

[bajaden]

He's done well in garbage time but only some of the times. Other times he does crappy in garbage time. Let's face it, he's a garbage player suited for garbage time.. He hasn't really had any consistent minutes against first teams, and when he did Udoh was not consistently good enough to keep those minutes. I would say no thanks because he wouldn't even see time on the floor with our team. Not to mention the guy is just raw, and he isn't very good to boot.

I watched a lot of Warrior games, and your going a little over the top. Udoh played well in many games, and of course he had his share of games where he didn't play as well. But the bottom line is, he improved every year, and he does block a lot of shots. I'd take him over Sanders since I just got through watching Sanders in Las Vegas, and overall he was alright, but he really gets pushed around a lot under the basket. . If Sanders could put on another 20 pounds of muscle, it would make a big difference in his game. Udoh is just bigger, and stronger. We need depth in our front court, and we don't need a star player. Someone like Udoh would be a nice fit to give you some minutes off the bench. He still has upside as well. And all his play wasn't in garbage time.

 

[bajaden]

I would be ok with Dunleavy if Jimmer took Outlaw with him. Honestly, what was Petrie thinking locking up Outlaw for four years? Worried someone was going to outbid them for such marginal talent?

But I would be fine with a Larry Sanders for Jimmer Trade. Oh and Brockman was traded to the Rockets.

Hey, I'm not about to defend picking up Outlaw, but he wasn't the one that locked him up for 4 years. He inherited that contract when he bid on him.

 

[bajaden]

Just a reminder there is no rush to move Jimmer because after this season he is essentially a expiring deal worth 2.5M. Aside from Jimmer really making a big stride this year the best case would be to package him with Hayes for a impact or expiring player.

I agree with you. Which means that if were trying to move him, its because were trying to aquire someone. If were just trying to dump him, then whats the point.

 

[bajaden]

I know Jimmer still has that Jimmermania fashion for somebody, but if we look at the reality, trading him for Sanders or Udoh would be a no brainer for us. Jimmer has shown nothing. He can't stay on the floor, he can't dribble, he still makes the same mistakes, like jumping before knowing what to do with the ball. It's our 5th guard at least (personally I think it's our 6th, Salmons is a better option right now), so there's no room for him.

Well I don't think he's quite as bad as you paint him, but regardless of that, I think its more a matter of whether you want to keep him and wait till he improves enought to earn time or not. If they think they need to take big steps this next season, then Jimmer, regardless of how good he may be in the future, might be more valuable in helping us aquire someone that can help right now.

 

[ParniValjak]

I would do this trade because in 12 months time Jimmer becomes worthless to us. He is not going to get many minutes with Evans, Thornton, Thomas and Brooks. Then you would have to say that Salmons and maybe even Garcia are ahead of him on the depth charts. We might as well get something for him while we can.

I would like Udoh as the 4th or 5th big and he also has genuine size, strength and some potential as well so its worth the gamble. We thin out an overcrowded back court to address a thin front court. I would prefer Udoh over Sanders simply because he can defend now. Sanders is just too skinny and weak to defend in the NBA at this stage. He needs to beef up a fair bit before he can cement his spot as a rotation player.

In dream world we could trade Jimmer and Salmons back to Bucks for Beno and Udoh. The reason I do this is because Beno is an expiring deal and with Beno and Cisco coming off the books next season, we would clear up $13.5 million of cap space which gives us ability to re-sign Evans and retool again with more additions.

 

[MassachusettsKingsFan]

Bucks make a lot of sense as a trade partner for is. They have a glut of shot blockers and rim protectors and we have none. Interesting that Petrie may be targeting that type of player, though.

 

[pshn80]

I do think jammer has to go. He has value so we should get value in return. As usual, because I knw nothing of the potential players you mention, I'll leave it to Petrie with confidense. Jammer is talented good guy but I don't think we would ever find a use for him.i

 

[bajaden]

I would do this trade because in 12 months time Jimmer becomes worthless to us. He is not going to get many minutes with Evans, Thornton, Thomas and Brooks. Then you would have to say that Salmons and maybe even Garcia are ahead of him on the depth charts. We might as well get something for him while we can.

I would like Udoh as the 4th or 5th big and he also has genuine size, strength and some potential as well so its worth the gamble. We thin out an overcrowded back court to address a thin front court. I would prefer Udoh over Sanders simply because he can defend now. Sanders is just too skinny and weak to defend in the NBA at this stage. He needs to beef up a fair bit before he can cement his spot as a rotation player.

In dream world we could trade Jimmer and Salmons back to Bucks for Beno and Udoh. The reason I do this is because Beno is an expiring deal and with Beno and Cisco coming off the books next season, we would clear up $13.5 million of cap space which gives us ability to re-sign Evans and retool again with more additions.

If you look at the Bucks roster, what you suggest isn't that far fetched. The Bucks are very thin at SG, and could actuall use a little experienced help at SF as well, so Salmons would be a good fit for them. He played for them before, so he knows their system. They still haven't come to any resolution with Dellfino, so all they have right now at SG is a rookie Doron Lamb, unless you want to count Ellis as an undersized SG. However, if they were interested in Salmons, I suspect they would try to stick us with Gooden's contract. Gooden is still a decent player, but he's a very overpaid player.

 

[gunks]

Jimmer for Udoh would be pretty rad.

Jimmer for a sandwich would be pretty rad in my book.

Udoh, according to Warriors fans, is not much of a stats guy but brings good defense and intangibles. Henson tore it up in the SL, so maybe the Bucks think he's made Udoh redundant? I remember one game against the Dubs where Udoh visible frustrated Cousins, really messed up his offense. I wouldnt mind having that kind of defender in our frontcourt, even if he is 4th/5th big.

 

[King Baller]

I would do this trade because in 12 months time Jimmer becomes worthless to us. He is not going to get many minutes with Evans, Thornton, Thomas and Brooks. Then you would have to say that Salmons and maybe even Garcia are ahead of him on the depth charts. We might as well get something for him while we can.

I would like Udoh as the 4th or 5th big and he also has genuine size, strength and some potential as well so its worth the gamble. We thin out an overcrowded back court to address a thin front court. I would prefer Udoh over Sanders simply because he can defend now. Sanders is just too skinny and weak to defend in the NBA at this stage. He needs to beef up a fair bit before he can cement his spot as a rotation player.

In dream world we could trade Jimmer and Salmons back to Bucks for Beno and Udoh. The reason I do this is because Beno is an expiring deal and with Beno and Cisco coming off the books next season, we would clear up $13.5 million of cap space which gives us ability to re-sign Evans and retool again with more additions.

I like that trade for the Kings for the exact reasons you state. Udoh is a decent interior defender and Beno can play and is expiring. Do the Bucks do it?

KB

 

[bajaden]

Jimmer for Udoh would be pretty rad.

Jimmer for a sandwich would be pretty rad in my book.

Udoh, according to Warriors fans, is not much of a stats guy but brings good defense and intangibles. Henson tore it up in the SL, so maybe the Bucks think he's made Udoh redundant? I remember one game against the Dubs where Udoh visible frustrated Cousins, really messed up his offense. I wouldnt mind having that kind of defender in our frontcourt, even if he is 4th/5th big.

Having been at summer league, and watched Henson play, I think saying he tore it up is a bit of an overstatement. I saw one game where he played very well, but I saw two games where he was extremely inconsistent with his jumpshot, and his post game lacked strength. I'm not going to say he played badly, but I'd hardly rave about him as compared to some of the other players I watched. He seriously needs to get stronger. His weakside help was pretty good, but his man defense at the basket needs work, and as I mentioned, strength.

In short, he did nothing to convince me that he won't have problems matching up against top NBA bigs. I think in time, he'll be OK, but I do think It will take some time. In regards to the Bucks, don't forget they resigned Llyasova at the PF position. He's going to pull down around 30 minutes a game. They still Drew Gooden, and he's making around 5 mil a year with 3 yrs left on his contract. When you add Udoh, Sanders, and Henson, thats 5 PF's trying to get minutes. Someone has to go.

 

[kupman]

If Jimmer is traded I am not going to flip out or anything, but I still hold out hope for him becoming a solid player for us. He is the 5th guard for us and that is perfect for him at this point. I don't think he deserves any more than about 8 minutes per game or so until he proves he deserves more.

Plus, I am not sure how many games the first 4 guards will all be healthy at the same time. Injury time would provide a nice opportunity to see if Jimmer can handle/deserve more than 10 minutes per game.

It is unfortunate that Jimmer is being judged with only an abbreviated rookie season that did not include a training camp or summer league. He may have more NBA game than we know at this point. Even last season, among all his inconsistencies I did see periods when he looked very NBA capable as a shooter and passer (I have never seen it from him defensively to date).

 

[Gary]

I watched a lot of Warrior games, and your going a little over the top. Udoh played well in many games, and of course he had his share of games where he didn't play as well. But the bottom line is, he improved every year, and he does block a lot of shots. I'd take him over Sanders since I just got through watching Sanders in Las Vegas, and overall he was alright, but he really gets pushed around a lot under the basket. . If Sanders could put on another 20 pounds of muscle, it would make a big difference in his game. Udoh is just bigger, and stronger. We need depth in our front court, and we don't need a star player. Someone like Udoh would be a nice fit to give you some minutes off the bench. He still has upside as well. And all his play wasn't in garbage time.

We are going to have to disagree then. If we had Udoh on this Kings team he wouldn't see the floor so there is no reason to even trade for him. He's not good enough. He may have looked good in games here and there, but he was never consistent enough to be any good. Not to mention his defensive rebounding is atrocious.

He is a good free throw shooter though!

I don't want him anywhere near the Kings though. He is not better than anyone we currently have.

 

[bajaden]

We are going to have to disagree then. If we had Udoh on this Kings team he wouldn't see the floor so there is no reason to even trade for him. He's not good enough. He may have looked good in games here and there, but he was never consistent enough to be any good. Not to mention his defensive rebounding is atrocious.

He is a good free throw shooter though!

I don't want him anywhere near the Kings though. He is not better than anyone we currently have.

Well here's the thing Gary. You make these blanket statements, but many times they don't jell with the facts. In fact, Udoh is a better defensive rebounder than he is an offensive rebounder. If you go to 82 games, he pulls down almost twice as many defensive rebounds as he does Offensive rebounds, grabbing 14.2% of all available defensive rebounds against 7.4% of offensive rebounds. Per 100 possesions, offensively, he's almost neutral, but defensively, his team allows 5.2 pts less per 100 possessions when he's on the floor. So obviously, he has some impact defensively, and thats what I'm looking for. Apparantly you don't like him but its beyond me why your so adament about it.

He is one that came to the game late, so that put him behind the curve so to speak. But after he transfered from Mich. to Baylor, he made a dramatic leap in his junior year ability wise. And thats exactly what your looking for in a young player. For the lights to go on. I have no idea how good he'll be in the future, but he's certainly better now than your painting him.

 

[Gary]

I said he wasn't a good defensive rebounder, and he's not.. The stats prove it. When you play 20+ minutes and on multiple occasions get like 1 or 2 rebounds then there is something wrong. He's a better offensive rebounder then defensive IMO because he playes close to the offensive glass.

My main problem is that he wouldn't even get minutes on this team. My other problem is that he's not very good. Watched him probably as much as you have and his consistency was my biggest problem with him. There were games when he was in the game and didn't do a dang thing.. Rebound or block a shot. Or maybe had a block but no rebounds. I would have to check the stats.. But I followed him a bit and I just wasn't impressed with his play in GS. Maybe he will turn it around in Mil but I don't think he has the tools to consistently contribute.

 

[DesertFox]

I said he wasn't a good defensive rebounder, and he's not.. The stats prove it. When you play 20+ minutes and on multiple occasions get like 1 or 2 rebounds then there is something wrong. He's a better offensive rebounder then defensive IMO because he playes close to the offensive glass.

My main problem is that he wouldn't even get minutes on this team. My other problem is that he's not very good. Watched him probably as much as you have and his consistency was my biggest problem with him. There were games when he was in the game and didn't do a dang thing.. Rebound or block a shot. Or maybe had a block but no rebounds. I would have to check the stats.. But I followed him a bit and I just wasn't impressed with his play in GS. Maybe he will turn it around in Mil but I don't think he has the tools to consistently contribute.

This seems pretty appropriate, especially for a guy like Udoh.
What's the difference between a guy who scores a ton of points but does nothing but get burned on D, and a guy who plays great D and doesn't contribute on O?

Plus-minus stats are certainly flawed, but they tell more than just points or rebounds. And Udoh isn't some scrub like Whiteside who couldn't crack a rotation, he's been a 20 minute rotation player despite his offense and rebounding. It would be nice to have more players who will play great D and stay out of the way.

Because of his game and fit, Udoh should push Trob for 3rd big minutes, and if Hayes (and his contract) wasn't already here I wouldn't hesitate swapping him for Jimmer.

 

[ParniValjak]

If you look at the Bucks roster, what you suggest isn't that far fetched. The Bucks are very thin at SG, and could actuall use a little experienced help at SF as well, so Salmons would be a good fit for them. He played for them before, so he knows their system. They still haven't come to any resolution with Dellfino, so all they have right now at SG is a rookie Doron Lamb, unless you want to count Ellis as an undersized SG. However, if they were interested in Salmons, I suspect they would try to stick us with Gooden's contract. Gooden is still a decent player, but he's a very overpaid player.

Oh no doubt they would try to get rid of that Gooden contract but that would be where I walk away unless Gooden deal is an expiring contract (can't be bothered checking)!

My main objective in this trade would be to get a shot blocker who can play now and provide depth in the front court AND improve cap flexibility where I get a whole bunch of expirings so that I can re-sign Tyreke and add another piece in the off-season (if not earlier)

I still have a hard time believing this rumour because Jimmer is everything that Skiles does NOT look for in a player.

 

[Prince_XY]

Hmmm.

Why do I get this feeling that it will be Gooden that we will get if ever this rumor of trading Jimmer comes to fruition.

 

[Gary]

Hmmm.

Why do I get this feeling that it will be Gooden that we will get if ever this rumor of trading Jimmer comes to fruition.

Gooden doesn't want to play here.. He was the guy that asked for a trade when he was traded to us and only played in one game.

 

[Bricklayer]

Hmmm.

Why do I get this feeling that it will be Gooden that we will get if ever this rumor of trading Jimmer comes to fruition.

Whole I am slightly unnerved by Jerry's gushing about him while he was briefly here, fact is Gooden has a long deal, and if nothing else I think its pretty apparent we are avoiding adding long term money right now with Reke and Cousins coming up for extension. Would they swap Jimmer + Hayes for Gooden? That I don't know. Gooden plays no defense, so he would fit right in with our M.O.

 

[bajaden]

I said he wasn't a good defensive rebounder, and he's not.. The stats prove it. When you play 20+ minutes and on multiple occasions get like 1 or 2 rebounds then there is something wrong. He's a better offensive rebounder then defensive IMO because he playes close to the offensive glass.

My main problem is that he wouldn't even get minutes on this team. My other problem is that he's not very good. Watched him probably as much as you have and his consistency was my biggest problem with him. There were games when he was in the game and didn't do a dang thing.. Rebound or block a shot. Or maybe had a block but no rebounds. I would have to check the stats.. But I followed him a bit and I just wasn't impressed with his play in GS. Maybe he will turn it around in Mil but I don't think he has the tools to consistently contribute.

So the fact that I looked up his stats, and just quoted the percentages to you, that show just the opposite, means nothing to you. I mean, don't let the facts get in the way of good story. To you it doesn't mean a thing that his stats show him being a better defensive rebounder. Well, just make up anything you want.

Edit: Just so you know, I wasn't saying he was a terrific rebounder, I was just desputing the offensive/defensive observations you made. So for the record. In his short career, he has 255 defensive rebounds against 180 offensive rebounds. Unless I was mis-taught math, I'd say the defensive rebounds win.

 

[Gilles]

One injury to the frontcourt player and there's a real possibillity (foul trouble or sucktitude) for a situation when Udoh would get all the minutes he could handle. He would momentarily become best overall defensive player. Jimmer for Udoh? Where should I sign?

 

[upinsmoke]

Udoh 11th in the league in Blocked shots FWIW. I think Jimmer is going to be on the roster opening day and Smart is going to bury him on the bench until he shows improvement.

 

[bajaden]

Udoh 11th in the league in Blocked shots FWIW. I think Jimmer is going to be on the roster opening day and Smart is going to bury him on the bench until he shows improvement.

Hey, you could be right. But if we want another frontcourt player, the Bucks do have a surplus, and all we need is an insurance player in case of injury or foul trouble.

 

[Gary]

So the fact that I looked up his stats, and just quoted the percentages to you, that show just the opposite, means nothing to you. I mean, don't let the facts get in the way of good story. To you it doesn't mean a thing that his stats show him being a better defensive rebounder. Well, just make up anything you want.

Edit: Just so you know, I wasn't saying he was a terrific rebounder, I was just desputing the offensive/defensive observations you made. So for the record. In his short career, he has 255 defensive rebounds against 180 offensive rebounds. Unless I was mis-taught math, I'd say the defensive rebounds win.

Hey, the stats I pull up say he's a worse rebounder than Mikki Moore per 48 but whatever float your boat. If you want another Mikki Moore that can block a shot or two then by all means become a Udoh hugger.

Every single one of our front court player is a better rebounder than Udoh. Cousins almost doubles his rate. Hayes having a terrible year is better than Udoh too, and Thompson is much much better.

OK so I probably exaggerated a bit saying he was a "atrocious" defensive rebounder but he is not average unless you call one less rebound than Mikki Moore (when he played with us) decent. So Average? no... Below average? Yes... By quite a bit, because Moore, when with us, was not a good rebounder. Udoh is worse than Moore by more than a rebound a game per 48.

I will say this again, The Kings do NOT need this guy. He's not good enough to get minutes on this team.

 

[Entity]

here is the thing though Gary. you compare to Mikki Moore who was a starter most of his time here if not the 3rd big. We are talking about a 5th big here not Cousins replacement or anything.