Trading Our Cap Space
- Thread starter twslam07
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I sincerely doubt Ryno gives back a single dime in any buy-out scenario (and he shouldn't) and if I'm not mistaken, the contract still counts towards their cap next year right? So that doesn't really accomplish anything for them
It's insanely scary having Vlade deal with Morey, but he has to know he holds literally all the leverage here. Houston just can't lose Capela. Get 2 first round picks and Melton, who I actually like as a prospect to compete with Mason for the back-up PG spot. If they don't budge, offer Capela our cap and force them into extreme cap hell.
Houston can't go anywhere else either for a Ryno dump. This would be a major haul for Vlade and by far the best deal he's made if he can pull it off.
It's insanely scary having Vlade deal with Morey, but he has to know he holds literally all the leverage here. Houston just can't lose Capela. Get 2 first round picks and Melton, who I actually like as a prospect to compete with Mason for the back-up PG spot. If they don't budge, offer Capela our cap and force them into extreme cap hell.
Houston can't go anywhere else either for a Ryno dump. This would be a major haul for Vlade and by far the best deal he's made if he can pull it off.
Well they've lost Ariza who was a key contributor to the team. I don't see them finishing with the best record again. If CP3 misses the same amount of games this year, then I think they'll only win around 45-50 games. He's old and aging.
However, I think the starting price should be their 2019 pick. I would be ok with 2019 and a pickswap in 2022 or something.
However, I think the starting price should be their 2019 pick. I would be ok with 2019 and a pickswap in 2022 or something.
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...ys-luxury-tax-not-influencing-offseason-moves
I think the only thing that's screwing up Houston is Capela's desire for a max contract. Capela needs to realize that this isn't 2016 anymore. Teams are no longer overpaying for average players. He's not worth 16% of a team's cap space. Neither is Steven Adams, but Adams got lucky with the cap jump. Jusuf Nurkic's contract is more comparable to what Capela should get. Capela might Nerlens Noel himself if he's not careful. There's literally no market for him right now.
I don't think Houston is particularly worried about the luxury tax. I think they really just don't want to overpay Capela. I also think an underrated play in all of this was their playoff series against GS. Capela was completely taken out of the game when the Warriors went small-ball. The Rockets are trying to win a ring, not just settle for the playoffs. Kinda off-topic, but Cousins' ego is going to come in question. I don't think the Warriors can play him down the stretch in the playoffs without giving up something.
We have 100% leverage with RYNO, but none in the Capela situation since we don't actually want him.
I think the only thing that's screwing up Houston is Capela's desire for a max contract. Capela needs to realize that this isn't 2016 anymore. Teams are no longer overpaying for average players. He's not worth 16% of a team's cap space. Neither is Steven Adams, but Adams got lucky with the cap jump. Jusuf Nurkic's contract is more comparable to what Capela should get. Capela might Nerlens Noel himself if he's not careful. There's literally no market for him right now.
I don't think Houston is particularly worried about the luxury tax. I think they really just don't want to overpay Capela. I also think an underrated play in all of this was their playoff series against GS. Capela was completely taken out of the game when the Warriors went small-ball. The Rockets are trying to win a ring, not just settle for the playoffs. Kinda off-topic, but Cousins' ego is going to come in question. I don't think the Warriors can play him down the stretch in the playoffs without giving up something.
We have 100% leverage with RYNO, but none in the Capela situation since we don't actually want him.
I think again we need to look at this in terms of what the Rockets save. If the Rockets want to sign Capela to a long term deal starting at about $20M, then Ryan Anderson will cost them $40M in salary and $60M in luxury tax over the next two years. It looks like we could actually squeeze Ryan Anderson in for "free", which would save the Rockets a literal $100M (and cost us $40M, by the way). Or, we could send Z-Bo and they could stretch him, which would also keep them out of the tax and save them more like $89M and cost us about $29M. On either extreme, their savings are huge but our costs are not insignificant.
I would say that my absolute floor on a deal like this is both the 2019 and 2021 unprotected, and I start out asking for a good deal more than that. 2021 has the potential to be a scary deep draft because it is thought that will be the year that the one-and-done rule is relaxed, so the best players from both the 2020 AND 2021 high school classes will be in it. I definitely want to be double-dipping in that draft. But I digress. If Houston is asking me to eat $30-40M of salary AND save themselves $90-100M, they can't possibly expect to do that for one draft pick in the 20s. Look. It's midnight on Christmas Eve, every other toy store in the city is closed, you somehow haven't yet managed to get your kid the season's hottest toy, and I've got one left. You can have it, but you can't POSSIBLY think I'm selling it to you for retail value. 2019 + 2021 unprotected, minimum. I like the idea of throwing Melton on the pot. And some pick swaps, because why not? You want to save $90-$100M? Open your wallet.
I would say that my absolute floor on a deal like this is both the 2019 and 2021 unprotected, and I start out asking for a good deal more than that. 2021 has the potential to be a scary deep draft because it is thought that will be the year that the one-and-done rule is relaxed, so the best players from both the 2020 AND 2021 high school classes will be in it. I definitely want to be double-dipping in that draft. But I digress. If Houston is asking me to eat $30-40M of salary AND save themselves $90-100M, they can't possibly expect to do that for one draft pick in the 20s. Look. It's midnight on Christmas Eve, every other toy store in the city is closed, you somehow haven't yet managed to get your kid the season's hottest toy, and I've got one left. You can have it, but you can't POSSIBLY think I'm selling it to you for retail value. 2019 + 2021 unprotected, minimum. I like the idea of throwing Melton on the pot. And some pick swaps, because why not? You want to save $90-$100M? Open your wallet.
It's not about wanting to Capela it's about showing strength and strong-arming Houston into giving us multiple picks+Melton for saving them a literal $100 million over the next 2 years as Capt showed in the post above. I think it's also worth not pissing off your young 24 year old 3rd best player on a 60+ win team, which I'm guessing Capela is starting to get incredibly frustrated at this point with how good he is. If they're low-balling him and we come out offering 5-6 mil more per season, he'll gladly sign the offer sheet with us and then Houston won't have a choice but to match. They can't lose him, we're literally the last fish on the market with pretty much no one left to go spend money on.
Capela and Adams are easily worth their money. If I have a star already in place (like a Russ/PG/Cp3/Harden), I'm looking for guys like Adams and Capela as my next piece to build my roster. They're just so valuable defensively, on the glass and with their offensive efficiency.
Also the Houston window is now. They just spent a boatload of money on CP3, they aren't particularly young, and Anderson completely got left out of the rotation down the stretch. Unloading him gives them the opportunity to go add next off-season to guys that fit their system better.
So from their perspective:
-You don't pee off Capela
-Unloading Anderson keeps you out an insane luxury tax bill over 2 years.
-You get freedom to go add Melo (lol) and more pieces next off-season as well.
-Anderson was a total 0 in the playoffs for them. Do they really want to pay that kind of bill for a guy who gives them nothing in the games that matter again?
Capela and Adams are easily worth their money. If I have a star already in place (like a Russ/PG/Cp3/Harden), I'm looking for guys like Adams and Capela as my next piece to build my roster. They're just so valuable defensively, on the glass and with their offensive efficiency.
Also the Houston window is now. They just spent a boatload of money on CP3, they aren't particularly young, and Anderson completely got left out of the rotation down the stretch. Unloading him gives them the opportunity to go add next off-season to guys that fit their system better.
So from their perspective:
-You don't pee off Capela
-Unloading Anderson keeps you out an insane luxury tax bill over 2 years.
-You get freedom to go add Melo (lol) and more pieces next off-season as well.
-Anderson was a total 0 in the playoffs for them. Do they really want to pay that kind of bill for a guy who gives them nothing in the games that matter again?
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The 2 guys from our team that are expendable and can actually help them would be Shumpert and Koufos but now your talking about 22M. WCS and Shumpert would be financially even better but WCS is not a throw in. As long as Anderson has that second year remaining, that is a monstrous contract for a guy that is physically starting to look cooked and most likely getting late, late firsts and a Melton......just doesn’t look so enticing
Capela turned down 5 yr 85 (17ave) We can offer 4 yr 88(22 ave), with a stetch we can offer the 100 max
Without the offer sheet, Capela can be pissed all he wants, but his option is play for 1 yr 7 mil to go to UFA next year
or maybe get only the 85 mil over 5 yrs Rockets hold the cards if no offer sheet
If Capella plays for the 7 mil, rockets can sign Melo, plus additional players without ryno gone
We need to make the offer sheet or threaten to or we have
no leverage in a Ryan Deal
worst case get clint on offer sheet, get Bjelica with an exception
Stretch Bmac, trade Davis for a cheap 3rd PG
Fox,mason, cheap pg
Bogs,Buddy, Shump
Bjelica, JJ
Bags,Giles,Skal,Zbo
Clint,WCS,KK
Without the offer sheet, Capela can be pissed all he wants, but his option is play for 1 yr 7 mil to go to UFA next year
or maybe get only the 85 mil over 5 yrs Rockets hold the cards if no offer sheet
If Capella plays for the 7 mil, rockets can sign Melo, plus additional players without ryno gone
We need to make the offer sheet or threaten to or we have
no leverage in a Ryan Deal
worst case get clint on offer sheet, get Bjelica with an exception
Stretch Bmac, trade Davis for a cheap 3rd PG
Fox,mason, cheap pg
Bogs,Buddy, Shump
Bjelica, JJ
Bags,Giles,Skal,Zbo
Clint,WCS,KK
Well it's a really bad cap situation for the Rockets if Capela does sign a $20mpy+ contract.
I don't know about you guys, but the last thing I would want to do is sign Capela only to realize that he's not that much better than our young bigs, and be stuck with his albatross contract. I know this is an entirely different case than George Hill, but remember the thinking that we would be able to flip George Hill for not just a 1st round pick, but a lotto pick at the trade deadline? It backfired completely and we were fortunate enough to "dump" him onto the Cavs.
I could see the same thing with Capela. Yeah he's young, but it would be hard to trade him with that contract if Bagley and Giles turn out better than he does. I don't see the logic in going after Capela. We already have 3 young bigs on the roster. None of them are better than Capela by a mile, but he's an expensive "get" for a position that isn't highly rated in the NBA. Capela is a high-end role player. I also doubt he would have the same success here as he does in Houston. They play an up-tempo offense with 4 shooters on the floor. The Kings have a completely opposite offense than Houston. Some fans seriously think we can go into the season with only 2 shooters in our starting lineup.. insane I tell you.
I don't know about you guys, but the last thing I would want to do is sign Capela only to realize that he's not that much better than our young bigs, and be stuck with his albatross contract. I know this is an entirely different case than George Hill, but remember the thinking that we would be able to flip George Hill for not just a 1st round pick, but a lotto pick at the trade deadline? It backfired completely and we were fortunate enough to "dump" him onto the Cavs.
I could see the same thing with Capela. Yeah he's young, but it would be hard to trade him with that contract if Bagley and Giles turn out better than he does. I don't see the logic in going after Capela. We already have 3 young bigs on the roster. None of them are better than Capela by a mile, but he's an expensive "get" for a position that isn't highly rated in the NBA. Capela is a high-end role player. I also doubt he would have the same success here as he does in Houston. They play an up-tempo offense with 4 shooters on the floor. The Kings have a completely opposite offense than Houston. Some fans seriously think we can go into the season with only 2 shooters in our starting lineup.. insane I tell you.
I think a realistic deal for all sides would be Koufos & Shump out for Ryno.
I don't want the lousy 2019 pick in that case as it will not be a good one.
No way Houston gives up more than one pick.
Be patient and go for the 2022 pick and hope they eliminate one and done. They'd probably want protections on the pick too. Maybe we can get a top 3 protected if we are lucky.
To consume Anderson with no salary out, well that would cost more than Houston would pay.
The first scenario where we send Shump and Koufos out would only take about 700k of our cap space away this season. So we could then reinvest for this year or try to absorb more salary.
I don't want the lousy 2019 pick in that case as it will not be a good one.
No way Houston gives up more than one pick.
Be patient and go for the 2022 pick and hope they eliminate one and done. They'd probably want protections on the pick too. Maybe we can get a top 3 protected if we are lucky.
To consume Anderson with no salary out, well that would cost more than Houston would pay.
The first scenario where we send Shump and Koufos out would only take about 700k of our cap space away this season. So we could then reinvest for this year or try to absorb more salary.
Id say it would be far better for kings to excercise patience as fast tracking has failed again and again. Id RATHER have their 2021 pick than the 2019 as the one and done rule relaxing in 2021 as well as houston should be on the downswing by then and the pick would likely be far higher than their 2019. Include their 2023 and we will have some solid incoming assets when our young guys are at their peak.
A trade that could be possible to get into the 2019 first round would be taking on Solomon Hill's contract in exchange for like Shumpert/Mason/Jackson or something like that. The move clears space next season for the Pelicans to try sign another piece to go along with Randle/Niko/Holiday/Davis. They also currently have interest in Rodney Hood and like a Jackson for Hill swap could open up money for them to try something.
Solo gives us a athletic 3 man who has sucked since signing his new deal with the Pelicans he's got this upcoming season at just under 12mil per and next season just over 13mil. He could play decent in a uptempo team and maybe rediscover some of his form that he had in the playoffs with Indiana he's always been a solid defender and plays within himself.
Solo gives us a athletic 3 man who has sucked since signing his new deal with the Pelicans he's got this upcoming season at just under 12mil per and next season just over 13mil. He could play decent in a uptempo team and maybe rediscover some of his form that he had in the playoffs with Indiana he's always been a solid defender and plays within himself.
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