Trade the Pick?

[twslam07]

This offseason, the Kings should be content with what they have and the position they are in. Considering they resign Thornton and Dalembert, we will have the same team from last year with one more year of development under their belt. Their guards will be Evans, Thornton, Udrih, and Garcia. Their forwards will consist of Garcia, Casspi, and Greene. And their bigs will be made up of Cousins, Dalembert, Thompson, and Whiteside. This is a solid team which only needs some minor additions to take it to the next level.

I am guessing that our first rounder will land somewhere between 3-7. This means we will be unable to draft Williams to fill our spot at SF. So who should we take? Should it be a backcourt player, a frontcourt player, or perhaps the next best SF on the board? I do not think we should go with a frontcourt player because Evans, Thornton, Udrih, and Garcia are more than capable of getting the job done for us at the guard spot. We could possibly take a frontcourt player. Someone like Kanter interests me, but by taking him, it will leave no minutes for Whiteside to get on the floor. This will, in a way, shelter him which will limit his opportunity to grow as a player. If we decided to take the next best SF available, it will seem like we are reaching a bit to draft Jones, Leonard, Hamilton, or Honeycutt. That’s why I think it might be beneficial to call up the Bobcats during draft time and see if they would be willing to trade up to get a higher pick. The Bobcats have the 9th worst record and we have the 5th worst record. If the lottery drops us in relatively the same spots for the draft, they might be interested in moving up. Also the Bobcats have the Blazers 1st round pick which is the 19th worst record in the league. We could possibly do a deal that involves our 1st rounder (5th pick) and Casspi for the Bobcats 1st rounder (9th pick) and the Blazers 1st round pick (19th pick). This would put us in a good spot to take a SF for the future and another possible frontcourt or backcourt player to add depth.

After we drafted a young and promising SF, I still think it is necessary to sign a veteran SF to hold the starting job for a few years. I would be happy with Battier, Kirilenko, or Prince although Battier would be my first choice. If we can sign one to a 6-7 million a year deal for 3-4 years I would be very satisfied.

If we were able to pull this off our team would look like:

PG – Evans, Udrih
SG – Thornton, Garcia
SF – Battier, T. Jones, Greene
PF – Cousins, Thompson
C – Dalembert, Whiteside

I didn’t include the 19th pick selection in this roster because I honestly don’t know who would fall to us. But I think going with the best player available with this pick would be the wisest thing to do.

 

[Bricklayer]

From a team positiioning standpoint I wouldn't be surprised to see us trade the pick...but for a vet. I think we are clearly moving beyond the kiddie days here and looking to win now, and that's hard to do with major cogs of your team 19-20, as we've seen the last few years.

My bigger question is just who would it actually be worthwhile to trade the pick for? In my mind, most of our rotation slots are filled, and all of the shots in our offense are pretty much accounted for, and what we need now is a defensive corps to supplement them. But many of the very best guys in the league at providing that defensive kick are available as FAs (Kirilenko, Prince, Battier). So its not clear to me just who we could logicially move the pick for. You might be able to try to swing it to a team like Portland for Batum (beware young kids who's progress stagnates), or the Knicks for Landry Fields (who might just be Ime Udoka with a better shot), on the theory they might like to take a shot at landing a star. Then you could sign a Kirilenko anyway, trade the pick for a Batum or Fields type, and just call the position fixed. But who knows if those deals are out there, and trading a high pick is always a risk when you are only brining back 2nd tier guys.

 

[tevans13]

In my opinion, if we dont win the lottery and get number 1 or 2 then I say we could trade for a mid-late first and a veteran. I wouldn't mind at all going with Faried with that pick. I think it's to early to tell right now before everyone is worked out. There is just to much that can happen between now and draft night.

 

[bajaden]

I tend to agree with Bricky. Its all well and good to say we should trade our pick. But for who? Until you actually see an offer its hard to make a judgement. If we don't want another kiddie on the team in the present, then we could take a gamble on an international player, and leave him in europe or whatever league he plays in for another year or so. Aka Peja. The reality is, that unless we get lucky in the lottery and end up picking 1st or 2nd, whoever we pick isn't going to get much playing time. Which as I said before, isn't necessarily a bad thing. Gives the player time to develop without pressure.

Portland, despite having developed a nice core, kept drafting young players who either contributed later, or became part of trade to aquire someone that they needed. So if you draft wisely, that pick will have value to someone, at sometime. And thats never a bad thing. Oh, and by the way. As to whom you draft. The best player available regardless of position. Remember Joe Kleine instead of Karl Malone. Yeah, but we needed a center. Bad idea!

 

[Dime Dropper]

I'm never a fan of trading away picks, especially one as high as ours. Even if we don't get a top two pick, there will be some very good players left. People always feel they're in a bad spot no matter what. If we had the 10th pick, people would be dying to get into the top 5.

Very good players are taken every single year in the draft, without exception. It's just about drafting right. Personally, I feel there are some guys who could really help the team in the near future and long-term. You can never have enough talented young players. You can always trade them down the line - they're a hot commodity.

I think Knight would bring alot of special intangibles to the team - leadership, IQ, hard work. Not to mention he's a very good prospect. I won't get into other players because this isn't the thread for it.

It's all hypothetical. Trading away a high pick is rarely a good idea in theory, but you would have to see the proposal to decide.

 

[bajaden]

I'm never a fan of trading away picks, especially one as high as ours. Even if we don't get a top two pick, there will be some very good players left. People always feel they're in a bad spot no matter what. If we had the 10th pick, people would be dying to get into the top 5.

Very good players are taken every single year in the draft, without exception. It's just about drafting right. Personally, I feel there are some guys who could really help the team in the near future and long-term. You can never have enough talented young players. You can always trade them down the line - they're a hot commodity.

I think Knight would bring alot of special intangibles to the team - leadership, IQ, hard work. Not to mention he's a very good prospect. I won't get into other players because this isn't the thread for it.

It's all hypothetical. Trading away a high pick is rarely a good idea in theory, but you would have to see the proposal to decide.

I agree. People tend to take a snapshot view of the draft. Many of whom haven't even seen the players they would discard, play. Kevin Martin was the 26th pick in the draft. Guess what, Beno was number 28 in that same draft. Thornton, who everyone now loves, was a second round pick. Gilbert Arenas was a second round pick. So just because you don't have the first pick in the draft, it doesn't mean you can't get a good player. The pick has value, and trust me, there are teams drafting down at the bottom that would love to move up to where we end up picking.

I will admit to having a selfish approach to the whole thing. I've probably watched well over 200 college games this year. Thats a lot of time to put in with the sole intent of being informative about the players in the draft. So from my point of view, if you just trade that pick away, I've just wasted all of that time. So selfishly, I hope they don't trade the pick. But if the deal is good enough, then so be it..

 

[Section 101]

Can we trade Bricklayer for Cementmixer? Would help more constructing the new arena.

 

[Vlade4GM]

Like all trades, it depends on who it's for. You don't just throw it away though, you don't want to end up like Houston trading Gay for Battier.

 

[Spike]

Can we trade Bricklayer for Cementmixer? Would help more constructing the new arena.

Can't have one without the other. We'd have to package Dime Dropper in a deal that would bring us more money and flexibility.

 

[Kingster]

I'm not inclined to trade the pick because I doubt you'd get top $ for it unless it was the 1st or second pick. But if I could trade the pick, I'd think about Tony Parker. He's got the rings, the cred, the leadership ability, and still has the skill. He'll be 29 in a couple of weeks. San Antonio has got to be thinking about a major rebuild after the old guys got ousted in the 1st round. Trading Parker would be their first step. I haven't done the homework on his contract, but maybe our #1 and XXXX is worth a conversation.

 

[bajaden]

Can't have one without the other. We'd have to package Dime Dropper in a deal that would bring us more money and flexibility.

Actually its mortar, but why quibble. I may have to maintain a lower profile lest I be traded away.

 

[bajaden]

I'm not inclined to trade the pick because I doubt you'd get top $ for it unless it was the 1st or second pick. But if I could trade the pick, I'd think about Tony Parker. He's got the rings, the cred, the leadership ability, and still has the skill. He'll be 29 in a couple of weeks. San Antonio has got to be thinking about a major rebuild after the old guys got ousted in the 1st round. Trading Parker would be their first step. I haven't done the homework on his contract, but maybe our #1 and XXXX is worth a conversation.

What you say about the Spurs makes sense. But Pop's said amost immediately after their final game that he wasn't about to blow up the team. Of course people can change their mind. But for the moment, it appears that Pop's thinks the team still has another run left in it. I'm sure that adding some other peices are in his thinking. Seldom works. Were living proof of that.

 

[Kingster]

What you say about the Spurs makes sense. But Pop's said amost immediately after their final game that he wasn't about to blow up the team. Of course people can change their mind. But for the moment, it appears that Pop's thinks the team still has another run left in it. I'm sure that adding some other peices are in his thinking. Seldom works. Were living proof of that.

Pop is a smart guy. He's not saying there's going to be sale on his talent anytime soon. But I think everybody can read the tea leaves, especially Pop.

 

[Bricklayer]

Pop is a smart guy. He's not saying there's going to be sale on his talent anytime soon. But I think everybody can read the tea leaves, especially Pop.

There are no tea leaves to read for Pop. This is his team. He has said repeatedly when Timmy retires, so does he, and even goes so far as to recognize the wisdom of that so he can maintain his incredibly overrated just-happened-to-coach-a-Top-15-player-all-time-for-his-entire- career status. Tim doesn't have enough time left to make it until another rebuild, and they just won 60+ games last year. Logic says they aren't going to blow it up until Tim and Pop ride off into the sunset together. Probably try to add some real size again, go from there. Wonder if they'll try to convince Oden to come.

Beyond that of course you have the general problem of Parker just not being that good, especially after DeMarcus pulls his scrawny little limbs off after TP sleeps with Boogie's woman.

 

[RookieOfTheDay]

Not unless it's for someone really good. I don't want to see a high pick traded on a middle of the road vet or anything just in the name of adding experience.

 

[twslam07]

It would be a mistake to be looking to trade our pick for a veteran. Sure if a valuable opportunity presents itself then let’s trade it, but I don't think we should be calling up teams trying to trade it away for a veteran. Batum's not going to happen and Granger's not going to happen. Yeah it would be awesome to be involved in a trade that would send one of them our way, but why are we kidding ourselves?

If we do not trade down, we will take the best player available which will create a crowded frontcourt or backcourt depending on who we take. My logic is simply trading down to around the 10th pick so we can still take the best player available, but that player will be a SF that we can use for the future. I know I mentioned trading our 1st and Casspi for the Bobcats' two 1st round picks (9th and 19th), but I am open to possibly trading back to around the 10th spot and taking a team’s 2012 1st round pick.

After the draft, free agency will be the time to add new veterans, not through trading our 1st round pick. I saw a couple of you were mentioning how there comes a time where you don't want "kiddies" on your team anymore. I disagree with this. Many franchises have this mindset where they like to get really young really fast and then let that team age until players get too old which will require them to start all over again (the spurs are/will be a great example of this). I prefer that my Kings consistently look to add new "kiddies" to the roster year after year to prevent this "rebuilding" phase from happening. If we continue to build through our youth and through the draft each year, it would be a challenge for the team to have to revert back to a rebuilding phase. This is why trading picks for an older veteran does not sit well with me.

 

[Bricklayer]

It would be a mistake to be looking to trade our pick for a veteran. Sure if a valuable opportunity presents itself then let’s trade it, but I don't think we should be calling up teams trying to trade it away for a veteran. Batum's not going to happen and Granger's not going to happen. Yeah it would be awesome to be involved in a trade that would send one of them our way, but why are we kidding ourselves?

If we do not trade down, we will take the best player available which will create a crowded frontcourt or backcourt depending on who we take. My logic is simply trading down to around the 10th pick so we can still take the best player available, but that player will be a SF that we can use for the future. I know I mentioned trading our 1st and Casspi for the Bobcats' two 1st round picks (9th and 19th), but I am open to possibly trading back to around the 10th spot and taking a team’s 2012 1st round pick.

After the draft, free agency will be the time to add new veterans, not through trading our 1st round pick. I saw a couple of you were mentioning how there comes a time where you don't want "kiddies" on your team anymore. I disagree with this. Many franchises have this mindset where they like to get really young really fast and then let that team age until players get too old which will require them to start all over again (the spurs are/will be a great example of this). I prefer that my Kings consistently look to add new "kiddies" to the roster year after year to prevent this "rebuilding" phase from happening. If we continue to build through our youth and through the draft each year, it would be a challenge for the team to have to revert back to a rebuilding phase. This is why trading picks for an older veteran does not sit well with me.

You can't prevent rebuilding from happening. You just can't. It goes beyond even just league structure and gets to biological structure -- guys get old. But the league structure half of it is this: as your team gets older one of two things happens. Either you continue to suck, in which case you rebuild with minimal talent to start with, or you start to win a lot, in which case you start having great records. Adn with great records comes really low draft picks (as in picking in the 20's evey season). And when you are picking that late, you are fortunate to even get a long term NBA player let alone a star. So your aging team dies a slow death jsut because of its own success, and there is nothing really to be done about it. You make your run, adn then if you are smart you blow it up as quickly as possible, get terrible, load up on young talent, and start climbing up again. But you can never avoid the need to rebuild eventually. By the very act of being good you are going ot have bad draft picks and likely be capped out on salary paying for all your good players. You have no way to keep renewing yourself.

 

[hrdboild]

You can't prevent rebuilding from happening. You just can't. It goes beyond even just league structure and gets to biological structure -- guys get old. But the league structure half of it is this: as your team gets older one of two things happens. Either you continue to suck, in which case you rebuild with minimal talent to start with, or you start to win a lot, in which case you start having great records. Adn with great records comes really low draft picks (as in picking in the 20's evey season). And when you are picking that late, you are fortunate to even get a long term NBA player let alone a star. So your aging team dies a slow death jsut because of its own success, and there is nothing really to be done about it. You make your run, adn then if you are smart you blow it up as quickly as possible, get terrible, load up on young talent, and start climbing up again. But you can never avoid the need to rebuild eventually. By the very act of being good you are going ot have bad draft picks and likely be capped out on salary paying for all your good players. You have no way to keep renewing yourself.

Or you wildly overpay your best player, spend money on role-players like it's going out of style to bolster your championship roster, sign the most expensive coach in the league, and then have an all-NBA center like Dwight Howard or Shaquille O'Neal drop into your lap anyway. Rebuilds are for suckers. (ie everyone without a $3 billion TV deal)

 

[ParniValjak]

I might be biased since he plays for the team in Europe but....

 

[Smills91]

There's only one potential deal that I view as 'long-shot' realistic that would entice me to move the pick and that's to the pacers for Danny Granger. If the Indy management gets shaken up for say....Kevin Pritchard, then I can see him wanting to move Granger's contract and land a top 5 pick in the draft to build the team up in his image and build around the already solid, young foundation of Collision, George and Hibbert.

 

[Vlade4GM]

There's only one potential deal that I view as 'long-shot' realistic that would entice me to move the pick and that's to the pacers for Danny Granger. If the Indy management gets shaken up for say....Kevin Pritchard, then I can see him wanting to move Granger's contract and land a top 5 pick in the draft to build the team up in his image and build around the already solid, young foundation of Collision, George and Hibbert.

3 high volume shooters in Evans, Thornton, and Granger? Somehow I don't think they'll mesh very well. I mean, the trade in and of itself would be great value for us considering we're picking at the 5th or 6th pick, but that's probably why Indy won't do it. I don't know if Granger really takes us anywhere, maybe in NBA live.

 

[twslam07]

You can't prevent rebuilding from happening. You just can't. It goes beyond even just league structure and gets to biological structure -- guys get old. But the league structure half of it is this: as your team gets older one of two things happens. Either you continue to suck, in which case you rebuild with minimal talent to start with, or you start to win a lot, in which case you start having great records. Adn with great records comes really low draft picks (as in picking in the 20's evey season). And when you are picking that late, you are fortunate to even get a long term NBA player let alone a star. So your aging team dies a slow death jsut because of its own success, and there is nothing really to be done about it. You make your run, adn then if you are smart you blow it up as quickly as possible, get terrible, load up on young talent, and start climbing up again. But you can never avoid the need to rebuild eventually. By the very act of being good you are going ot have bad draft picks and likely be capped out on salary paying for all your good players. You have no way to keep renewing yourself.

I agree that teams will most likely have to rebuild at some point, but why would we trade our pick for a veteran when we can draft a good young player and simply sign a veteran? It doesn't make sense. We should still draft good young players while we can to put off this rebuilding phase as long as possible. Nobody should be unhappy with having too many good young players as they can always be traded for upgrades or future picks. Again, I am confused to why some of you feel that we should not look to add any more "kiddies" to the team. I look at this pick as being an advantage. We have many good young pieces on our team with the chance to get another one. It is weird how people are against that philosophy. Patience pays off. Our time is coming.

 

[Glenn]

I agree that teams will most likely have to rebuild at some point, but why would we trade our pick for a veteran when we can draft a good young player and simply sign a veteran? It doesn't make sense. We should still draft good young players while we can to put off this rebuilding phase as long as possible. Nobody should be unhappy with having too many good young players as they can always be traded for upgrades or future picks. Again, I am confused to why some of you feel that we should not look to add any more "kiddies" to the team. I look at this pick as being an advantage. We have many good young pieces on our team with the chance to get another one. It is weird how people are against that philosophy. Patience pays off. Our time is coming.

Our time is next year.

I agree with your first sentence but would trade the pick if it was bundled with a player or two to get a mega role player if such actually exists. Granger? I may be alone, but I still see a log jam occurring somewhere and I think a log jam at a position, like SF last year, has a potential of being harmful to chemistry. If we continue the mode of getting mellow team mates (not sure how to classify Cuz ) we'll be fine.

I personally want the team to come out of the box fast next year. I think we need another respected veteran as I think the adjustment to a new team for such a player is not like having a draft pick who is adjusting to the NBA AND the team. I don't know any reason to put off finishing the rebuild. In the most simple of rebuilds, we need a decent SF and that's it. That's not very difficult. Get all the pieces in place next year and let the team grow together. This latter concept is not given enough attention.

Wade, Bosh and Lebron did not dominate the league but have needed time together to sort out their idiosyncracies. Same is necessary for any team to maximize their potential.

If you want to go the draft route of rebuilding which is what we have done, this is the last year for a significant addition to the team. From now on the draft picks should be non lottery. I want to draft a big guy. I don't see the draft pick as a huge contributor although who really knows? I would not be disappointed to be surprised. The FA will be the major contributor and just needs to match his game to the budding stars that we have. Personally, if I was a FA SF, I'd give this team a hard look as it could be fun being a King for the forseeable future.

When your 3 studs are 22 and under, only a tragedy can screw this up and we all know that tragedies can happen.

For some reason I think we are kind of saying the same thing but not understanding the other person's words. What do you mean by "put off rebuilding." In my way of speaking, we ARE rebuilding and have been amazingly successful.

 

[Kingster]

There are no tea leaves to read for Pop. This is his team. He has said repeatedly when Timmy retires, so does he, and even goes so far as to recognize the wisdom of that so he can maintain his incredibly overrated just-happened-to-coach-a-Top-15-player-all-time-for-his-entire- career status. Tim doesn't have enough time left to make it until another rebuild, and they just won 60+ games last year. Logic says they aren't going to blow it up until Tim and Pop ride off into the sunset together. Probably try to add some real size again, go from there. Wonder if they'll try to convince Oden to come.

Beyond that of course you have the general problem of Parker just not being that good, especially after DeMarcus pulls his scrawny little limbs off after TP sleeps with Boogie's woman.

Maybe Duncan retires this off-season. He looked pretty old and tired to me. Even with severely reduced minutes during the regular season he got taken to school by the young guns of Memphis. The only possible reason for Duncan to stay is money, but with his bank account is the money worth getting punked next year by so-so power forwards? Like I said, it's worth a conversation.

 

[bajaden]

Maybe Duncan retires this off-season. He looked pretty old and tired to me. Even with severely reduced minutes during the regular season he got taken to school by the young guns of Memphis. The only possible reason for Duncan to stay is money, but with his bank account is the money worth getting punked next year by so-so power forwards? Like I said, it's worth a conversation.

It wouldn't surprise me to see Duncan retire. But who knows. If Pop's wants to go at it one more year, Duncan will probably go along for the ride. As Bricky said, they did win 60 games, and thats not to be sneezed at. The problem is that they didn't have much left in the tank when they got to the playoffs. But there's not doubt that Duncan's skills are in decline. He's been doing this for a long time, and he's probably one of the most skilled bigs to ever play the game. He's never been a great athlete, which was the knock on him coming out of college. Now he's starting to lose some of the athleticism he did have, and it shows.

His lateral quickness is slowing down. His reactions are slower. I don't see Willie Mays tripping over his own feet in center field just yet, but I don't think he can be counted on to be one of the big offensive guns anymore.

In my dream world, he gets traded to the Kings for his last season and tutors Cousins on everything it takes to be a major player in the league. If not that, then the Kings hire him to be Cousins personal coach.. Hey, its my dream.

 

[twslam07]

Our time is next year.

I agree with your first sentence but would trade the pick if it was bundled with a player or two to get a mega role player if such actually exists. Granger? I may be alone, but I still see a log jam occurring somewhere and I think a log jam at a position, like SF last year, has a potential of being harmful to chemistry. If we continue the mode of getting mellow team mates (not sure how to classify Cuz ) we'll be fine.

I personally want the team to come out of the box fast next year. I think we need another respected veteran as I think the adjustment to a new team for such a player is not like having a draft pick who is adjusting to the NBA AND the team. I don't know any reason to put off finishing the rebuild. In the most simple of rebuilds, we need a decent SF and that's it. That's not very difficult. Get all the pieces in place next year and let the team grow together. This latter concept is not given enough attention.

Wade, Bosh and Lebron did not dominate the league but have needed time together to sort out their idiosyncracies. Same is necessary for any team to maximize their potential.

If you want to go the draft route of rebuilding which is what we have done, this is the last year for a significant addition to the team. From now on the draft picks should be non lottery. I want to draft a big guy. I don't see the draft pick as a huge contributor although who really knows? I would not be disappointed to be surprised. The FA will be the major contributor and just needs to match his game to the budding stars that we have. Personally, if I was a FA SF, I'd give this team a hard look as it could be fun being a King for the forseeable future.

When your 3 studs are 22 and under, only a tragedy can screw this up and we all know that tragedies can happen.

For some reason I think we are kind of saying the same thing but not understanding the other person's words. What do you mean by "put off rebuilding." In my way of speaking, we ARE rebuilding and have been amazingly successful.

I'm saying that this team will inevitably be a good team. Drafting good young players in the earlier part of the draft rather than trading it for a veteran will make us younger which will put off the rebuilding phase 10-15 years down the road. I just want the Kings to be as good as possible and for as long as possible.

My point is pretty much to use the high draft picks to continue to stay a younger team. There will be a time where we are not picking high in the draft anymore and then I am okay for trading picks for veterans, but when we are able to add another good young player to our team, I don't see why we would trade it.

 

[gunks]

I say keep it, or move it down for an extra 1st rounder.

We have good talent scouts in the front office, as evidenced by the great young players we've accrued over the last few drafts. Might as well nab another youngster. There will be a couple high upside/solid prospects where we pick.

 

[MassachusettsKingsFan]

If the Spurs blow it up, I go after Ginobili before I go after Parker.

It would be absurd for the Spurs to trade him... its not how they roll, but you never know. He would be so good for this team in so many ways.