OFFICIAL trade thread. Post trade proposals HERE! (merged)
- Thread starter CaminoChaos
- Start date
I would really like to see some article from Indiana speaking about Ron Artest. If they are saying things such as "next season with Ron Back" or "If we would have had Ron". If I don't see statments such as that, then i don't feel Artest is desired in Indiana any longer. that being said and Petrie and the whole Kings organization saying we need defense so bad. Shouldn't we be putting together some combos to get the Defensive Player of the Year. Not to mention he is by no means a liability on offense, he is an easy 15-20 guy in our lineup of Bibby, Peja, and Miller. So if Indiana is frustrated with Ron and don't want his services any longer then Petrie should be on the phone night and day becuase of the problem we have this guy is the best one out there at pluging that hole. Don't settle for less go for THE one.
Kenny Thomas and Corlis Williamson to Indiana
Ron Artest and Johnathan Bender to Sacramento
why the kings do it. Defense at the 2, toughness, no loss in offense
why the Pacers do it. get 2 quality SF/PF guys to fill voids so O'neal can play center if need be and they lack no offense, also to get rid of a guy that has brought alot of unwanted attention to the organization. and 3 to get rid of an undesired contract in Johnathan Bender.
Now sure we take a hit to cap with bender but we get better quality at the 2 and Kenny's 5 year undesired contract is gone.
Kenny Thomas and Corlis Williamson to Indiana
Ron Artest and Johnathan Bender to Sacramento
why the kings do it. Defense at the 2, toughness, no loss in offense
why the Pacers do it. get 2 quality SF/PF guys to fill voids so O'neal can play center if need be and they lack no offense, also to get rid of a guy that has brought alot of unwanted attention to the organization. and 3 to get rid of an undesired contract in Johnathan Bender.
Now sure we take a hit to cap with bender but we get better quality at the 2 and Kenny's 5 year undesired contract is gone.
Entity - Check out PacersDigest.com/forums. If there are comments about Artest anywhere, you'll find them there...
As far as your trade proposal goes, I can hear Larry Bird and Kevin McHale's laughter from here. "Two quality SF/PF" to fill voids on the Pacers? And neither of them is named Peja Stojakovic? That would so NOT happen. The Pacers aren't ready to cut Artest loose quite yet...and if they do, it won't be for two overblown contracts.
As far as your trade proposal goes, I can hear Larry Bird and Kevin McHale's laughter from here. "Two quality SF/PF" to fill voids on the Pacers? And neither of them is named Peja Stojakovic? That would so NOT happen. The Pacers aren't ready to cut Artest loose quite yet...and if they do, it won't be for two overblown contracts.
i used the word quality because Petrie did. But with this trade its not just about the players Inidana is getting. with trades and with our trade exception we should be looking at it from this stand point. "Hey if you take these guys for that guy, we will take that guy that is the 3rd highest player on your team and getting 3 min a game off your hands. Kinda like quid pro quo you scratch my back and i will take the monkey off yours. Indaia with Artest and Bender uses only Artest who has given them problems. Indiana with KT and CW get 2 guys that can play SF/PF If need be we can throw in some future draft picks.
I see where you are coming from but, with Petrie and Maloofs crying defense. I don't see how plugging mediocer players at the SG and PF positons do it. Either we have to get 1 superstar or 2 guys that are indeed "Quality" players. If neither of those happen we won't see past the first round for a while. maybe we could convince the cat he would do well in Indiana. Anyway here is my lineup wish.
Bibby/Jackson
Artest/Evans/Barnes/Martin
Peja/Artest/Evans/Barnes/Martin
Kwame Brown/Wayne Simein/Bender
Miller/Skinner/Ostertag
Or if it takes Jackson in the deal to get Ron swap Jackson at backup for a resigned Eddie House. Basically i don't see how you can cry defense and not make a huge push for the best. Anything less is a loss in the offseason and an early exit next season.
Bibby/Jackson
Artest/Evans/Barnes/Martin
Peja/Artest/Evans/Barnes/Martin
Kwame Brown/Wayne Simein/Bender
Miller/Skinner/Ostertag
Or if it takes Jackson in the deal to get Ron swap Jackson at backup for a resigned Eddie House. Basically i don't see how you can cry defense and not make a huge push for the best. Anything less is a loss in the offseason and an early exit next season.
Artest may have BEEN the best, but there's no guarantee he'll return to his previous level. He's been off the court for a year.
Do you have any trade ideas that don't include Ron Artest? And did you check out that website? Try posting your trade idea over there and see what they think...
If Artest is as good as you think, don't you think the Pacers would know better than anyone that his talents outnumber his shortcomings? And, if so, do you really think they're going to dump them for "quality players" like Thomas and Williamson? As I said, if you think it's such a good idea, post it on PacersDigest. I'll be watching for it...
EDIT: In fact, I'm intrigued. I'LL post the trade proposal over there for you. I just hope they don't die of laughter...
Do you have any trade ideas that don't include Ron Artest? And did you check out that website? Try posting your trade idea over there and see what they think...
If Artest is as good as you think, don't you think the Pacers would know better than anyone that his talents outnumber his shortcomings? And, if so, do you really think they're going to dump them for "quality players" like Thomas and Williamson? As I said, if you think it's such a good idea, post it on PacersDigest. I'll be watching for it...
EDIT: In fact, I'm intrigued. I'LL post the trade proposal over there for you. I just hope they don't die of laughter...
Well yeah because they are fans. If Philly fans would have proposed KT, Corlis, and skinner to me for Webber and Barnes i would have laughed also.
You and Bricklayer seem to have this nitch of scoffing ppls ideas that seems like we are getting to good of a deal or that we are getting a raw deal.. you should face it if we don't get a good deal or if we get a raw deal either way you will be one sad VF21 next year come playoff time when we are under .500
You and Bricklayer seem to have this nitch of scoffing ppls ideas that seems like we are getting to good of a deal or that we are getting a raw deal.. you should face it if we don't get a good deal or if we get a raw deal either way you will be one sad VF21 next year come playoff time when we are under .500
as far as garuntees go you can't garuntee anybody that playes professional sports its all a gamle. and yess i do bring up Ron Artest alot in my trade suggestions. I am sticking with the genre of the franchise wanted to press defense yet keep the core 3 and to do that you need a great not a good defensive sg that can still score. If you got anybody else in mind please clue me in so my mind can wonder on trade scenerios for that person. or the PF position.
Yes, they're fans. So are we... what's your point?
Um, what? I think I'm well aware we need to make some quality trades to get our team back into contention. What I'm arguing is whether or not Ron Artest would be the missing piece. You're sold on him; I'm not. And even if I was, you wouldn't get Indiana to trade him for chump change, which is what Corliss and Kenny would be.
My point in posting the trade on the Pacers board was to gauge fan reaction. You're convinced Indiana is sick of Ron and ready to trade him. Based on the numerous threads I've read on their board, that simply isn't the case. You have nothing to base your assumption on other than your own desire to see him in a Kings uniform.
Scoffing ideas that are too good or not good enough? Yep. Because that's generally the way it goes. Trades have to benefit each team SOMEHOW or they don't get done.
Um, what? I think I'm well aware we need to make some quality trades to get our team back into contention. What I'm arguing is whether or not Ron Artest would be the missing piece. You're sold on him; I'm not. And even if I was, you wouldn't get Indiana to trade him for chump change, which is what Corliss and Kenny would be.
My point in posting the trade on the Pacers board was to gauge fan reaction. You're convinced Indiana is sick of Ron and ready to trade him. Based on the numerous threads I've read on their board, that simply isn't the case. You have nothing to base your assumption on other than your own desire to see him in a Kings uniform.
Scoffing ideas that are too good or not good enough? Yep. Because that's generally the way it goes. Trades have to benefit each team SOMEHOW or they don't get done.
Do you see how our midseason trade beneifited us or how christie for doug benefitted orlando. I am just going by what was said by Petire. you can't preach defense then sign Karreem Rush or Speedy Claxton.
As far and the fans go that is a mut point. Hell you and i are fans and we didn't want to see Webber go for that 3-way sack of ****.
I am however interested on who you think is our ideal 2 guard if a guy that plays great defense averages 18 7 and 4 is not the missing piece exactly who do you think is????
As far and the fans go that is a mut point. Hell you and i are fans and we didn't want to see Webber go for that 3-way sack of ****.
I am however interested on who you think is our ideal 2 guard if a guy that plays great defense averages 18 7 and 4 is not the missing piece exactly who do you think is????
you are right there are alot of others but most of them for some odd reason think that the Memphis bench should be our starters. If Bonzi Wells and Stromile Swift are our answers i have been watching the wrong games. or Larry Hughes who will be getting a bibby type deal that we have not chance of getting. Hell yeah if we could get Hughes i would be happy with that.
just say you own a team and you pay a guy 7 mill a year for 3 min a game and another that gets suspended every year. and someone offered to take that off your hands for Bjax Kenny and corlis
just say you own a team and you pay a guy 7 mill a year for 3 min a game and another that gets suspended every year. and someone offered to take that off your hands for Bjax Kenny and corlis
It's not a matter of him being the perfect replacement. It's a matter of the Pacers letting him go for two of the three pieces of **** you've referred to.
I don't think we'll be able to get our ideal 2 guard because we're just about out of bargaining chips, especially if Petrie is serious about building around Peja, Bibby and Brad.
In MY ideal world, Petrie would get a frustrated Kevin Garnett to come to the Kings, giving up Peja and Brad and whatever else it took to do the deal. Kenny Thomas could move to SF, with Kevin and Brian playing a combo 4/5... I personally would LOVE to see Bibby and Garnett play together. I'd like to see Evans come back because he has shown a spark of defensive ability.
We're not gonna solve all the problems right away, IMHO. If you're going to suggest an Artest trade, I think you have to be realistic and Corliss and Kenny won't get the job done.
I don't think we'll be able to get our ideal 2 guard because we're just about out of bargaining chips, especially if Petrie is serious about building around Peja, Bibby and Brad.
In MY ideal world, Petrie would get a frustrated Kevin Garnett to come to the Kings, giving up Peja and Brad and whatever else it took to do the deal. Kenny Thomas could move to SF, with Kevin and Brian playing a combo 4/5... I personally would LOVE to see Bibby and Garnett play together. I'd like to see Evans come back because he has shown a spark of defensive ability.
We're not gonna solve all the problems right away, IMHO. If you're going to suggest an Artest trade, I think you have to be realistic and Corliss and Kenny won't get the job done.
being realistic if we would have started last season with the team we ended with. we would have a top 10 pick. Hell if it takes Peja i would do it. especially with his contract coming up next year. lets see 1 year of a guy averaging 25 3 1 for 3 years of a guy averaging 18 7 and 4 Plus huge improvment on defense. As far as Garnett goes hell yeah but why would Minn wan't two slow unathletic non defensive non rebounding players for a former MVP that can turn a game around at any moment.
Entity - You aren't going to convince most Pacer fans that trading Thomas, Williamson, etc. for anybody would be worth their while. Well, one of them did say we could have Austin Croshere, but I think even he was being sarcastic. The most telling response was:
They don't think Artest is going anywhere and, if he does, it's gonna take something a bit more impressive than our leftovers to get the deal done.
They don't think Artest is going anywhere and, if he does, it's gonna take something a bit more impressive than our leftovers to get the deal done.
i am going to bed on this one. You are putting way to much stock in what the fans say. Do you think LA fans wanted shaq to go to Miami. or closer to home did you want to see Webb leave. Did Millwalkee want Ray Allen to leave. No on all counts but yet it was done. I don't care what some fan of Indiana thinks GM's dp weird things Look at the New York Knicks.
You haven't come up with even ONE logical reason for the Pacers to make that deal. You're ASSUMING facts not in evidence. There is NOTHING to indicate the Pacers are ready to dump Artest AND even if they were, they wouldn't do it for chump change...
And for the record? There are a LOT of Laker fans who wanted Shaq to leave.
Did I want to see Webber leave? No. Is it relevant? No. It was widely discussed among a lot of fans and a LOT of them were relieved to see him traded for a variety of reasons.
You're trying to say that there's a large contingency in Indiana that wants Artest gone. I'm trying to get you to understand that simply doesn't seem to be the case.
Good night...
And for the record? There are a LOT of Laker fans who wanted Shaq to leave.
Did I want to see Webber leave? No. Is it relevant? No. It was widely discussed among a lot of fans and a LOT of them were relieved to see him traded for a variety of reasons.
You're trying to say that there's a large contingency in Indiana that wants Artest gone. I'm trying to get you to understand that simply doesn't seem to be the case.
Good night...
If Indiana wanted to trade Artest for the change that people are suggesting then I believe we would have a HUGE problem on our hands. Ask yourself why would Larry Bird trade a DPOTY who averages 18, 7 and 4 for a bunch of average players. I think the answer to that is that he is a cancer and a timebomb waiting to go off. Would you REALLY take that big a risk on someone who can blow up any second??????
Čarolija said:
It did but can it go off again?????
People will argue that Artest would have learned from it and won't do it again but if Indiana shops him around then that tells me it isn't so
People will argue that Artest would have learned from it and won't do it again but if Indiana shops him around then that tells me it isn't so
Thing about Artest is that once again the loss of our lockerroom leadership makes him an even riskier proposition than he would have been in years past. With Vlade/Webb/Doug around setting a tone, maybe you can control a Ron Artest. Maybe you can mellow him and make a King out of him. Now the only real hope we would have would be his odd couple friendship with Brad, but I doubt Brad really has any deep understanding of what makes the guy tick.