NFL 2023-2024 Thread

hrdboild

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#1,651
#1,651
kingdivac said:
DIsagree, the 49ers had a good defensive game against the Browns. This 3rd loss is also on Purdy - you can't have 2 INTs and a fumble. The defense was a close 2nd . The 2nd INT was really poor, while the first one he misjudged the looper. Getting Samuel will help the offense, but I have no idea why Shanahan isn't playing his RB depth. Hard to watch, both sides of the ball. The secondary was terrible today too. I expected a better game, and immediately you could see the same garbage from the last 2 games. Anyway Late game turnovers iwill absolutey bury you.r team.
Click to expand...
All three of those turnovers were the direct result of Purdy scrambling to stay upright long enough to get rid of the ball. No QB is going to look good when defenders are coming at them unblocked from all angles. On the fumble he got stripped from behind by a guy he couldn't even see.

We were already thin at the offensive tackle position before Trent Williams got injured but without him this isn't even an NFL caliber O-Line. Shanahan and Lynch pretended the O-Line wasn't a problem all off-season and maybe it isn't if Trent Williams stays healthy but this is the NFL where injuries are expected. This is two years in a row now that they've needed to spend a high draft pick on an offensive lineman or sign one in free agency and they chased after skill positions and edge rushers instead.

Speaking of... where were Javon Hargrave and Drake Jackson in this game? This front office has thrown way too much money and draft capital into the D-Line for that unit to completely fail to show up like this.
 
K

kingdivac

All-Star
#1,653
#1,653
hrdboild said:
All three of those turnovers were the direct result of Purdy scrambling to stay upright long enough to get rid of the ball. No QB is going to look good when defenders are coming at them unblocked from all angles. On the fumble he got stripped from behind by a guy he couldn't even see.

We were already thin at the offensive tackle position before Trent Williams got injured but without him this isn't even an NFL caliber O-Line. Shanahan and Lynch pretended the O-Line wasn't a problem all off-season and maybe it isn't if Trent Williams stays healthy but this is the NFL where injuries are expected. This is two years in a row now that they've needed to spend a high draft pick on an offensive lineman or sign one in free agency and they chased after skill positions and edge rushers instead.

Speaking of... where were Javon Hargrave and Drake Jackson in this game? This front office has thrown way too much money and draft capital into the D-Line for that unit to completely fail to show up like this.
Click to expand...
hrdboild said:
All three of those turnovers were the direct result of Purdy scrambling to stay upright long enough to get rid of the ball. No QB is going to look good when defenders are coming at them unblocked from all angles. On the fumble he got stripped from behind by a guy he couldn't even see.

We were already thin at the offensive tackle position before Trent Williams got injured but without him this isn't even an NFL caliber O-Line. Shanahan and Lynch pretended the O-Line wasn't a problem all off-season and maybe it isn't if Trent Williams stays healthy but this is the NFL where injuries are expected. This is two years in a row now that they've needed to spend a high draft pick on an offensive lineman or sign one in free agency and they chased after skill positions and edge rushers instead.

Speaking of... where were Javon Hargrave and Drake Jackson in this game? This front office has thrown way too much money and draft capital into the D-Line for that unit to completely fail to show up like this.
Click to expand...
You gotta make throws wthether you're scrambling or not. To expect your QB to consistently have time to throw against good defenses is unrealistic. Gotta make deciaions and plays on the move. Burrows did just that. Sure the offensive line has to play better but Purdy's iturnovers are starting to accumulate in an unsustainable way. He's gotta check down or make more short runs. 3 turnover games cannot be a trend.. Purdy is no slouch for scrambling - commit to it earlier.
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#1,664
#1,664
Literally a free look at Chase Young is insane. Not only are we using one of our comp picks, but if we don't resign him, we're pretty much guaranteed to get a 3rd round comp pick back.

I think we'll have to really look at what it would take to keep him and who it would cost to do so. 24 year old elite pass rushers just don't fall in your lap for free like this.
 
SLAB

SLAB

Hall of Famer
#1,665
#1,665
The_Jamal said:
Literally a free look at Chase Young is insane. Not only are we using one of our comp picks, but if we don't resign him, we're pretty much guaranteed to get a 3rd round comp pick back.

I think we'll have to really look at what it would take to keep him and who it would cost to do so. 24 year old elite pass rushers just don't fall in your lap for free like this.
Click to expand...
Is dumping Armstead something we can do next offseason? I feel we can get an equal space-eater in the middle next to Hargrave and push that money to Young, but it all depends on how AA’s contract is structured.
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#1,666
#1,666
SLAB said:
Is dumping Armstead something we can do next offseason? I feel we can get an equal space-eater in the middle next to Hargrave and push that money to Young, but it all depends on how AA’s contract is structured.
Click to expand...
Yeah, no idea. My guess is it'd cost us at least one of Aiyuk/Deebo/Kittle/Warner/Ward/Armstead and maybe Hargrave depending how his contract is structured. But absolutely worth the discussion, him and Bosa on the edge for the next 5 years is absolutely disgusting
 
SLAB

SLAB

Hall of Famer
#1,667
#1,667
The_Jamal said:
Yeah, no idea. My guess is it'd cost us at least one of Aiyuk/Deebo/Kittle/Warner/Ward/Armstead and maybe Hargrave depending how his contract is structured. But absolutely worth the discussion, him and Bosa on the edge for the next 5 years is absolutely disgusting
Click to expand...
I’ve been on the “Dump Deebo for others” wagon for awhile… but man, after seeing our offense the last few weeks. Is just the threat of Deebo in this offense, even in his post-contract reduced play state, that much of a difference maker to opposing defenses.
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#1,668
#1,668
SLAB said:
I’ve been on the “Dump Deebo for others” wagon for awhile… but man, after seeing our offense the last few weeks. Is just the threat of Deebo in this offense, even in his post-contract reduced play state, that much of a difference maker to opposing defenses.
Click to expand...
It's a huge loss. He's our big home-run hitter and he's an incredible blocking WR as well. But Trent Williams is probably as big;if not bigger for making sure the O-Line holds up too.

Idk, the energy around the team the last 3 weeks has just been so weird. In every facet; special teams has been mostly ass too. Almost wonder if Shanny is losing the locker room or something along those lines. Or theres some major blow-up with one of the coaches, (maybe Wilks?). Because it just doesn't make sense how we looked like one of the best teams ever the first 5 weeks of the season and then the entire team just falls off a cliff these past 3 weeks. Trent Williams and Deebo Samuel injuries, as important as they are, can't be the sole reason for that fall-off.
 
K

kingdivac

All-Star
#1,669
#1,669
49ers add to their front 4 , but fail again to address the DB situation - its about pass coverage, not pass rush. Dense management - failure to address the real problem - average to below-average secondary. .Doubling down on the same problem. You can't have 3 sub-par corners with Ward. You need a talented right starting cornerback to begin with. Someone of Ward's level. The other 3 are not.....none of them have formidable make up speed - they make a wrong step, they're all toast.
 
iowamcnabb

iowamcnabb

Hall of Famer
#1,670
#1,670
It’s not a terrible price but I wonder if it’s a rental? He has obviously been hurt a bunch and hasn’t been the player he was expected to be but still fairly productive. Sweat went for a second rounder but he has been super consistent and healthy
 
SLAB

SLAB

Hall of Famer
#1,671
#1,671
kingdivac said:
49ers add to their front 4 , but fail again to address the DB situation - its about pass coverage, not pass rush. Dense management - failure to address the real problem - average to below-average secondary. .Doubling down on the same problem. You can't have 3 sub-par corners with Ward. You need a talented right starting cornerback to begin with. Someone of Ward's level. The other 3 are not.....none of them have formidable make up speed - they make a wrong step, they're all toast.
Click to expand...
Don’t fully agree. A good pass rush makes the secondary look better. It’s why the defense was so good all-around in the KC Super Bowl season. That line feasted and the Sherman led secondary looked a lot better than they actually were. Now it’s a matter of the front four doing their job and making the backfield look above their level.
 
K

kingdivac

All-Star
#1,672
#1,672
SLAB said:
Don’t fully agree. A good pass rush makes the secondary look better. It’s why the defense was so good all-around in the KC Super Bowl season. That line feasted and the Sherman led secondary looked a lot better than they actually were. Now it’s a matter of the front four doing their job and making the backfield look above their level.
Click to expand...
That's not good risk management - its the old saying your team is only as good as the weakest link......49ers look exposed. The secondary pass coverage is acutally below average starting Lenoir - they need a quality right cornerback - pre-injury Mosley was much closer to that. On defense You're seeing what happens when you over-rely on one part of the team, and neglect another. You don't blame your blown coverages on poor pass rushing - the secondary needs to do its job period, independent of the pass rush. And its not about "looking" better, its about "being" better.

Anyway, that's defense. Actually I think the losing is more due to the fall-off on offense. Purdy cannot have 2 interceptions / game and especially not late in games - going forward, puts too much stress on the rest of the team. Purdy has been excellent with avoiding interceptions up until the Vikings game, but he's starting to skate on thin ice.
 
hrdboild

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#1,673
#1,673
The biggest problems are CB and O-Line but maybe there weren't any reasonable deals available for either position. Getting more pressure on the QB should theoretically make the rest of the defense look better but adding Javon Hargrave was supposed to make us unstoppable in the pass rush and that group has regressed from last season so it's not just about personnel. We'll see if this helps.
 
2

206Fan

All-Star
#1,674
#1,674
hrdboild said:
The biggest problems are CB and O-Line but maybe there weren't any reasonable deals available for either position. Getting more pressure on the QB should theoretically make the rest of the defense look better but adding Javon Hargrave was supposed to make us unstoppable in the pass rush and that group has regressed from last season so it's not just about personnel. We'll see if this helps.
Click to expand...
It's 100% the scheme. Remember when Lynch used to pick up random FAs from off the street or low-risks trades at DE who could consistently get us sacks?

2022:
  • Samson Ebukam: 5 sacks
  • Charles Omenihu: 4.5 sacks
2021:
  • Arden Key: 6.5 sacks
  • Samson Ebukam: 4.5 sacks
  • Kentavius Street: 3 sacks
  • Jordan Willis: 3 sacks
2020:
  • Kerry Hyder: 8.5 sacks
  • Dion Jordan: 3 sacks

We were a sack producing factory despite whoever signed up on the line... what's happened this year? We even signed one of the best pass rushers in FA. Drake Jackson doesn't get enough criticism. He's sucked outside the 1st game. But Wilks needs to do a lot more. This DL is too talented to be looking awful.
 
Kingz19

Kingz19

Hall of Famer
#1,675
#1,675
I’m happy about it. It’s a big time talent. Defensive line is one of those areas where you can never have too much talent. Rams loaded up their defensive line when they won the Super Bowl.

I had hoped for a cornerback though. Despite the disappointment of the defensive line. It definitely isn’t a talent issue and I was confident that ship would be righted eventually. Either through better performance(Bosa in particular) and coaching adjustments.

we’ll see.
 
hrdboild

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#1,678
#1,678
206Fan said:
It's 100% the scheme. Remember when Lynch used to pick up random FAs from off the street or low-risks trades at DE who could consistently get us sacks?

2022:
  • Samson Ebukam: 5 sacks
  • Charles Omenihu: 4.5 sacks
2021:
  • Arden Key: 6.5 sacks
  • Samson Ebukam: 4.5 sacks
  • Kentavius Street: 3 sacks
  • Jordan Willis: 3 sacks
2020:
  • Kerry Hyder: 8.5 sacks
  • Dion Jordan: 3 sacks

We were a sack producing factory despite whoever signed up on the line... what's happened this year? We even signed one of the best pass rushers in FA. Drake Jackson doesn't get enough criticism. He's sucked outside the 1st game. But Wilks needs to do a lot more. This DL is too talented to be looking awful.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I agree. I said pretty much the same thing a couple of weeks ago. Top tier defensive coordinators are generally pretty hard to come by and we've lost two of them in the last three years to the NFL head coaching carousel. Not every replacement is going to be a good fit.

But that's also why picking up yet another edge rusher without changing the scheme seems like a waste of time to me. At least if Lynch had gotten another elite CB there's a chance this scheme might have worked better with tighter coverage on the WR's or if he'd filled the hole at LB vacated by Al-Shaair to shore up the middle of the field and eliminate some of the quick check-down throws and almost sacks. Doubling down on what's already not working while allowing the overmatched secondary and O-Line to continue getting pushed around doesn't inspire a lot of confidence. I'll give this a chance though. Maybe with the bye week more guys will get healthy and the team will play with better energy and finish their tackles.
 
fansinceday1

fansinceday1

Starter
#1,680
#1,680
Everytime i bring up our lack of O-line on the 49er sites i would always get lectured about how hard it is to address. Well, we are a good team so all our draft picks are late, after all the good o-line guys are gone. Or teams never part with their good o-line guys, cause they are so hard to come by in the first place. Or maybe the 49ers just choose to skimp on that part of the team. The Jaguars just gave up a DAY 3 draft pick for Ezra Cleveland. A DAY 3 PICK. Ezra Cleveland is a beast. He performed well with Minnesota and was only available because Kirk Cousins went down with a season ending injury. The vikings will be looking to rebuild after this season. He would have addressed a huge need for the 49ers. But no, we grab ANOTHER DE. The 49ers just choose to go budget on their offensive line. There is no other explanation.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.