Kings Summer League Info/Questions/Discussion (merged)

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
What was your impression of Shakur, Brick? Anything there to build on?

I came in a bit late, so not sure what I missed of his, but generally he and Watkins were (predictably) the best of the bench, no? Off of one game maybe a chance as a defensive roleplaying PG with good size -- good backup type? Hard to tell given the level of competition tongiht. If I just had a little chinese heritage I think I'd be off to offer my service to the Chinese tonight -- can dribble (well, with one hand), will compete.
 

Entity

Hall of Famer
Brick in fact Watkins was the only sub in the frontcourt he came in for both hawes and Willams. Shakur came in at pg and at the sg spot for about 2 min. that Medely guy sucked as did donta smith. that was pretty much all that played David Young came in but statyed out of everybodys way the whole 2 min.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
well its always like that. The ppl that didn't like the draft pick will never speak highly of them until they do it in a real game. regaurdless that Spencer Hawes just put together one of the best all around games we have seen by a rookie here in years.

Er...no.

But he did display what he does well -- that postgame and offensive feel. Of course I never really considered that in question -- that was his great NBA level skill coming out of school. As for the rebounding/defense...not much was proven. But then again, its summer league and not much is going to be proven anyway.
 
Hawes looks like what was advertised to be honest, though I wasn't aware how good his mid range game was.

He never really got a chance to show off what he can do in the low post with a defender on his back, though. Most of his points on the inside came from wide open dunks he was fed by other players.

He had a couple of nice passes: one while running the break and another when he was trapped underneath the basket.

His mid range game is what looked the best to me. He seemed like he had range out to about 20 ft or so, and could probably shoot decently from the NBA 3 with some work.

Of course, he didn't look very good in terms of rebounding. He wasn't in position to get rebounds a lot of the time and only came away with 7. He also seemed to have a problem guarding Yi due to his lack of quickness.

As for Shakur, he seemed to play out of control and made a lot of bad decisions.
 
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Entity

Hall of Famer
7 is good considering Garcia and Williams were flying after them like gnats. 7 is as high as Yi or anybody else for that matter had.
 
Kings Grades vs. Team China?

J. Williams: A- (3-8 FT's about the only flaw and must improve this year)
S. Hawes: B+ (nice debut, perhaps better than expected but it's China)
F. Garcia: B (looked bored at times, intense at times, too good for TC)
P Jeter: C- (dribbled lots, rarely penetrated, made Sun Yue look better)
M. Shakur D+ (shot is uglier than ever, defense is ok considering its TC)
D. Watkins C+ (showed he has some talent but not likely to make roster)

D. Smith, D.Young, N. Coner Medley - InComplete - who are these guys?
 
What a sorry game by the Chinese. I hope we get some better competition in the later games. Even in Summer League, you shouldn't have to be carried by Wang Zhizhi.
 
7 is good considering Garcia and Williams were flying after them like gnats. 7 is as high as Yi or anybody else for that matter had.
(And Justin the gnat-catcher grabbed 11.)
7 rebounds would be more impressive if it weren't matched by 7 fouls and 7 turnovers.
 
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Entity

Hall of Famer
7 rebounds would be more impressive if it weren't matched by 7 fouls and 7 turnovers.

some of those were concurrent. remember offensive fouls count as turnover and that was about 3 of those. and some players can't handle a good quick pass. Put Chris Webber with that group and you see his turnovers go up no matter how good of a passing big man he is. really don't go by the box scores on this
 
After watching the entire game I just wanted to give my impression of our three main guys, so here it goes.

Justin Williams: Was actually the calming influence on the floor for us. You knew when he was near the ball good things were going to happen, on both sides of the floor. His rebounding and defense was dominating and even though the box score had only 1 block for him he easily had 3 and that doesn't count the few that were called goaltending that shouldn't have been. The only knock on him is that he didn't show a lot on the offensive end other than wide open dunks because he didn't have to. Played with a lot of intensity out there which is nice.

Francisco Garcia: First half = wild and missed shots. Second half = wild and made shots. One time down the floor he would do some beautiful creating for an open layup or dunk and the next he would take a spinning fadeway from the 3 point line. His defense was solid and so was his point guard play when he decided to do so. He really needs to calm down though, he actually missed a few guys who were wide open underneath just so he could take another shot.

Spencer Hawes: Simply as advertised. Showed a few nice moves in the post, had a sweet jump shot, and finished well around the hoop. I thought he relied on the jumper a little too much but that was probably because our guards weren't giving him the ball enough in the post. He should be the focal point of the offense. The rebounding was very poor, the fact that he even got 7 amazes me. Also, it doesn't appear that athleticism or length was the problem here, it was effort. When a rebound was near him he would get it over others most of the time, but even if it was just a little ways away he would completely give up on it. Wouldn't even reach over or move towards it.

Well it was just one game of summer league, we'll see what happens next game.
 
KINGS SUMMER LEAGUE SCHEDULE
DayDateOpponentTimeArenaTV/Webcast
SaturdayJuly 7vs. China 7 p.m. Cox PavilionWebcast
TuesdayJuly 10 vs. Washington1 p.m.Cox Pavilion NBATV/Webcast
Thursday July 12vs. New York7 p.m.Cox Pavilion NBATV/Webcast
SaturdayJuly 14vs. Houston5:30 p.m. Thomas & Mack Cntr Webcast
SundayJuly 15vs. Los Angeles Clippers7:30 p.m.Thomas & Mack Cntr Webcast


2007 NBA SUMMER LEAGUE SACRAMENTO KINGS ROSTER
No.PlayerPos.Ht.Wt.BirthdateCollegePrevious NBA TeamYrs. Pro
41 Daniel Artest F 6-5 280 11/13/1982 Southern Nevada R
42 Keith Butler C 7-1 255 03/04/1983 DePaul R
22 Nik Caner-Medley F 6-8 240 10/21/1983 Maryland R
8 Quincy Douby G 6-3 175 05/16/1984 Rutgers SAC 1
32 Francisco Garcia F-G 6-7 195 12/31/1981 Louisville SAC 2
31 Spencer Hawes C 7-0 245 04/28/1988 Washington R
13 Pooh Jeter G 5-11 175 12/02/1983 Portland NBDL R
40 Oliver Lafayette G 6-2 180 05/06/1984 Houston R
16 Christian Maraker C 7-1 255 03/04/1983 Pacific R
55 Mustafa Shakur G 6-3 190 08/19/1984 Arizona R
25 Donta Smith G 6-7 215 01/27/1983 Southeastern Illinois ATL 2
33 Cezary Trybansk iC 7-2 240 09/22/1979 N/A TOR 2
35 Darryl Watkins C 6-11 258 11/09/1984 Syracuse R
30 Justin Williams C 6-10 260 05/12/1984 Wyoming SAC 1
54 Major Wingate C 6-10 250 11/10/1983 Tennessee R
5 David Young G 6-5 205 08/18/1981 North Carolina Central SEA R


In legible format: http://www.nba.com/kings/news/2007_Summer_League_Roster_070307.html

Two notes:
1) Justin Williams does NOT weigh 260. Zach Randloph weighs 260. That is a blatant fabrication.
2) Christian Maraker is NOT 7-1 255 and a center. Somehow the stats from Keith Butler seemed to have been copied into his line. He's closer to about 6-8/6-9 235, and a forward.
I"m not sure if the topic has been bantered about, any reason why Price is not on the summer league team?
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
It was announced early on that he would not be competing. Theories abound, of course, but the most prevailing one is that as a free agent he doesn't want to risk injury.
 
wish I could have gotten to see this game, sounds like Hawes and JT really put on a good show for themselves.
And by JT..you mean Justin Timberlake? ;)

I saw the first quarter. Hawes got some nice buckets and played solid defensively (against Wang I believe). Garcia forced up a few shots. Shakur had a couple of nice passes (although he must have played worse from that point on).
 
I gotta admit, I was really surprised by how aggresive Spencer Hawes is on the offensive and defensive end. I thought he would be like more of a brad miller type of player and shy away from jump shots and playing in the post. he also sets good picks. Hopefully he will continue to play like this for the rest of the summer league and when our season begins.

Oh and Justin Williams better be signed to a contract next season otherwise im not going to look forward to next season. :)
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
I gotta admit, I was really surprised by how aggresive Spencer Hawes is on the offensive and defensive end. I thought he would be like more of a brad miller type of player and shy away from jump shots and playing in the post. he also sets good picks. Hopefully he will continue to play like this for the rest of the summer league and when our season begins.
No, that was always Hawes' big selling point: advanced post game and comfortable aorund the hoop. The questions aren't whetehr he'll be a jumpshooter (although he has made some disturbing comments about wanting to model himself after Brad), but whetehr he'll rebound or clog up the lane on the other end.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Well, finally saw the rest of that one:

1) ugly game, we had three guys play well, and that was more than enough given that they had zero guys play well and did not break 50pts.

2) Hawes' looked smooth and professional inside and out on offense, but wasn't really dominant. He went aggressively after 2 or 3 boards in the first few minutes, although maybe only got 1 of those, and then was just a guy there the rest of the way. Had three or four right until the end of his game when he got a little pack all at once. Perhaps the difference between a guy concentrating on getting boards and then slacking off, and a guy like Justin who just goes after them instinctively and relentlessly. He's long enough to get up and dunk it given a little room, which is a nice change. Finally realized who he reminds me of physically -- Will Perdue. Narrow, long, not a good athelte, but not quite as bad as the body looks. Showed pretty decent defensive mobility against his man for a guy his size and can rotate and switch with reasonable fluidity (even challenged a three point shooter). But not surprisingly will never be able to stay with the quick guys, and was no factor as an interior defender (had few enough opportunities given the Chinese team's jumpshot orientation). In general, he did what he was advertised as being able to do. The questions remain for another day.

3) Williams did not truly blow me away simply because he's still doing the same things he was last time we saw him, and the competition here was ready made to be overwhelmed by an athletic guy going right at the rim. But they are good things to bring. Not sure how much bigger he is -- some I think, but the Chinese team is so very scrawny that everybody looked like Shaq next to them. What was most impressive wasn't really his game, but the sense (and it helped that you could hear the players talking) that he thinks of himself as not only belonging now, but of being a leader. That was surprising for a guy who just seemed to be fighting to prove he even belonged last season. But he was out there talking and encouraging the whole time as a combo defensive captain/coach on the floor + worked pretty well with Hawes. I didn't see him having added anythign particualrly to his physical game (except some extra muscle which could make a difference). But mentally he believed that he belonged, and that's a a huge step in and of itself. Here his relatively old age might help -- he's got 5 years on a guy like Hawes, and could almost call him "kid".

4) Cisco was the third gun and maybe biggest problem of them all for the Chinese, but he was actually playing the game furthest from what he can/will be doing in an NBA regular season contest. He really was at times playing it lie Kobe or someone. Predictable, in that as the old hand and most established guy on the team he kind of IS the summer league team's Kobe. And the Chinese had no answer for that sort of player. But its still hard to draw many conclusions from that sort of game. Reminded me of my "glory days" basketball game in a pickup game at a gym at Penn, where I, not known as a scorer, got stuck as the best/most established player on a hopeless team of scrubs going against a pickup juggernaught. And so looking around, I had this sudden epiphany (that alas lasted no longer than that one afternoon) that it was either me or nobody to prevent a complete pasting, and proceded to call for the ball and attack on nearly every possession and score 11 of our 13 pts (we lost 15-13 by ones) and generally play entirely and completely above my head in a way I could never duplicate. That was the feeling I had watching Cisco -- he was just doing things he would never do in a real NBA game...er...well...wait...this IS Cisco we are talking about. ;)

5) Yi actually looked better than I originally thought he did in the early going. He converted nothing, but the shots weren't jumpers, they were turnarounds in the post. There was only one stretch of jumpers to open the third quarter. Of course if you don't make them its still ugly, and he obviously did not have it yesterday. But it wasn't rampant passivity and outside shooting softness so much as...well, not having it, being the focus of the defense, and I think credit has to go to Justin as well for being right there and making every shot tough. This of course will be one of Yi's tests -- he showed a lot of moves inside and whatnot, but against a big ahtletic player, and on aback to back, he did not finish them. He has to adjust to those conditions to be an impact guy.

6) Of the benchers, Caner-Medley was an amazing foul machine and it must be a sinking feeling to know after one game that you probably have no chance of getting that dream invite to an NBA camp. Watkins had some nice solid big man moments as kind of a slightly slower Justin, and I barely noticed the other guys. Donta showed nothing, and Pooh went back and forth making one good play, one bad play, and pretty much just looked like a summer league caliber PG.
 
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Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Damn, I didn't realize Will Perdue once had 23 rebounds in a game. Come on Spencer the bar has been set.;)
I was thinking the same thing when I made the comparison -- namely that's its not a one way thing. Hawes = much better offense, Perdue likely a considerably better boarder. No monster, but he had a decent knack and even got up around 10 one year.

Same general build though. Narrow shoulders which probably defy too much bulking up, kind of a soft lanky thing going on, but good length and reach.
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
Brick - What about Shakur? Any kind of real court sense? Any possibility of him actually playing at the 1 as a legitimate point?
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Brick - What about Shakur? Any kind of real court sense? Any possibility of him actually playing at the 1 as a legitimate point?

Unfortunately I must confess that between trying to watch Hawes closely, and Justin, and Cisco, and Yi, that I still didn't get a great feel for Shakur.
 
Hawes - needs to keep feet planted on the floor when playing D. He keeps bouncing, a smart player will see that and blow right around him. Please coaches instruct him to keep feet planted.