Kings @ Bulls Game Thread
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I have to imagine that this is the worse the offense is going to look all season. Our three main guys are shooting way under their lifetime percentages. To pull out a gritty win like this is terrific. Especially since I was thinking it was going to turn out just like the Minnie game when Bibby turned the ball over twice towards the end of the fourth. Great win for the team. Hopefully, they can understand what is working and what isn't.
Wow, KMoney is clutch. So was Mike. Artest came up in the 4th quarter but all his 3 pointers concern me. He needs to take 3 a game max, cuz if you take away the 3 point shooting he did(1/6) than he shot 6 of 14 on 2s and got to the free throw line a lot. That's pretty good. He needs to realize he's not Ray Ray, Kobe, or TMac and even those guys get people saying "well he takes too many 3s". He has an advantage that they don't, his post skills(as you all know). If he used those right he could put up super star numbers(25 PPG). He's got a real nice mid range J and a real nice post game. It would have more impact because he'd get more open looks for other guys.
The bench sucked. Shareef played bad, Kenny played MUCH worse. Miller is still making me angry and he played bad. Really only Bibby/Martin/Artest gave us anything at all. It was a great win and we stole one from the bulls but there are still problems that have to be addressed. Other guys got to start playing better.
The bench sucked. Shareef played bad, Kenny played MUCH worse. Miller is still making me angry and he played bad. Really only Bibby/Martin/Artest gave us anything at all. It was a great win and we stole one from the bulls but there are still problems that have to be addressed. Other guys got to start playing better.
Ron Artest is not a 25 PPG guy. He's just not good enough. Not even close.
Bibby sucked. I don't know how you can give him any kudos. He had some 11TOs while shooting 30%. He hit a clutch shot, but hogging the ball doesn't mean you did anything worthwhile.
Artest sucked. 7-20. He got lucky at the end with some calls that were borderline suspect fouls. He also had 4 TOs. He let his man torch us for 30 or something too.
Martin was spectacular. He had some clutch steals ... clutch shots ... the kid did it all. Really impressed.
SAR wasn't terrible. He had 6 boards and looked more comfortable on the glass late in the game. He seemed to overthink his shots ... but 7 shots is not enough shots to get any rythm. He's still too damn passive and the sitting at the 3-point arc is just silly.
KT and Miller combined for a jelly donut. Combined: 3-13, 11reb, 6TOs.
Bibby sucked. I don't know how you can give him any kudos. He had some 11TOs while shooting 30%. He hit a clutch shot, but hogging the ball doesn't mean you did anything worthwhile.
Artest sucked. 7-20. He got lucky at the end with some calls that were borderline suspect fouls. He also had 4 TOs. He let his man torch us for 30 or something too.
Martin was spectacular. He had some clutch steals ... clutch shots ... the kid did it all. Really impressed.
SAR wasn't terrible. He had 6 boards and looked more comfortable on the glass late in the game. He seemed to overthink his shots ... but 7 shots is not enough shots to get any rythm. He's still too damn passive and the sitting at the 3-point arc is just silly.
KT and Miller combined for a jelly donut. Combined: 3-13, 11reb, 6TOs.
shareef did not play that bad. The worst thing that happened to him was getting blocked by wallace twice but he did grab 6 reb off the bench and had that stop at end of the game. Really martin was the only person that gave us any thing positive tonight.
I still agree with Roman that the off should be centered around Sar, Martin, and Bibby. Sar should handle the post and Martin and bibby should do their slashing, cutting and dashing. I think that the off would better off.
I still agree with Roman that the off should be centered around Sar, Martin, and Bibby. Sar should handle the post and Martin and bibby should do their slashing, cutting and dashing. I think that the off would better off.
Its not the bench that sux, it is Mussleman's offensive schemes that are really chaotic looking. I wasn't a big fan of Adelman's coaching stle, but the team needs to work a lot on it offense to be close to the offense Adelman. If the team does not lower its turnovers and improves its offense, there is no use for all that good defense as our bad offense will offset all that good defense.
Secondly, Mussleman has to learn to call timouts before things get out of control. A lot of times Kings were committing turnover after another turnover and he was simply watching on the sideline.
Thirdly, coaches have to stop sucking up to big players like Ron and correct them where they are wrong.
There is no doubt Ron is an exceptional player but if he wants to be MVP he has to play with his strengths and not his weekness. Someone has to tell him to stop jacking those three pointers, which are as bad as their turnovers.
This was a lucky win and not a well deserving win.
It's not that I think SAR is some amazing post player - because since I've defended him it seems people think I'm his biggest fan. I'm not. I think he's got a lot of holes in his game, is soft, passionless ... but he's a nasty low post scorer.
It wasn't too long ago he dropped 50 on Ben Wallace. I doubt he could ever duplicate it, but he's not anyone to be trifled with.
I just think we would be better off and get better, more efficient (read: more productive) shots if we run the offense into the post. That means SAR should be getting touches and Artest should be getting low post looks. We should do this at least on half of our possessions.
This would open up our offense immensely.
The only downfall I see from this is Brad Miller. Nothing against the guy, but he clogs the lane. Not him, personally, but his man. Centers don't go out to cover Brad at the top of the key and that leaves post players contending with their man and a roaming center. It's only made worse when Brad Miller can't find the rim.
It wasn't too long ago he dropped 50 on Ben Wallace. I doubt he could ever duplicate it, but he's not anyone to be trifled with.
I just think we would be better off and get better, more efficient (read: more productive) shots if we run the offense into the post. That means SAR should be getting touches and Artest should be getting low post looks. We should do this at least on half of our possessions.
This would open up our offense immensely.
The only downfall I see from this is Brad Miller. Nothing against the guy, but he clogs the lane. Not him, personally, but his man. Centers don't go out to cover Brad at the top of the key and that leaves post players contending with their man and a roaming center. It's only made worse when Brad Miller can't find the rim.
I disagree, it was a mix bag for bibby tonight sure he didn't shoot or handle the ball well but did pass the ball well and came up big when we needed him. Wasn't great and wasn't bad. And same thing with artest and sar. If i had to give out grades it would be like:
C for mike
C for Artest
C for Sar
A for Martin
And i will take it easy on brad and give him a D
And F's for everybody else.
C for mike
C for Artest
C for Sar
A for Martin
And i will take it easy on brad and give him a D
And F's for everybody else.
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How you can say Bibby sucked and defend SAR as not playing terrible in the same breathe just amazes me.
Bibby is out there playing with one freakin' hand. He had 9 assists despite all the blown baskets by some teammates. And he was our second leading scorer after Martin.
On the post game show when asked about Bibby's TO's, Musselman said to lay some of the blame on the coaches. They decided they had to ride Bibby to the end even tho he was dead tired. He also said they are concerned about the wrist. In practice, Bibby has trouble just catching the ball.
What you saw out there was a gutsy Bibby doing everything he could to get his team a win.
Bibby is out there playing with one freakin' hand. He had 9 assists despite all the blown baskets by some teammates. And he was our second leading scorer after Martin.
On the post game show when asked about Bibby's TO's, Musselman said to lay some of the blame on the coaches. They decided they had to ride Bibby to the end even tho he was dead tired. He also said they are concerned about the wrist. In practice, Bibby has trouble just catching the ball.
What you saw out there was a gutsy Bibby doing everything he could to get his team a win.
Yeah, but a C for Bibby (in my book) is him sucking. Anything less than a B game for him is a pee-poor game. He's better than he's been playing. But, I'd still give him a D. 11 TOs is a whole team's worth of TOs. Yes, he had 9 assists, but 6-7 of those assists weren't from good passes but just great shots by Martin. You can give him the excuse of having the bad hand - but if that's the cause then he shouldn't be on the floor.
I'd give Artest a C-. Reason being is that if we distributed 5-8 of those ill-advised shots of his, this team is better. He had a load of TOs himself. On defense he was out of position ... a lot. He reminded me of a safety in football ... and Deng took advantage of that. If Ron plays with this intensity all season, we'll be lucky to have him a 70% strength in 50 games.
I'd agree with the SAR grade, but might go with a C- there as well. Simply because he lacked aggression. There were two or three moves he should have finished, but instead he kicked it out for a poor 3 point attempt.
I'd give Artest a C-. Reason being is that if we distributed 5-8 of those ill-advised shots of his, this team is better. He had a load of TOs himself. On defense he was out of position ... a lot. He reminded me of a safety in football ... and Deng took advantage of that. If Ron plays with this intensity all season, we'll be lucky to have him a 70% strength in 50 games.
I'd agree with the SAR grade, but might go with a C- there as well. Simply because he lacked aggression. There were two or three moves he should have finished, but instead he kicked it out for a poor 3 point attempt.
Let's see . . .
Bibby - Playing hurt because there is nobody to play in his place, 9 assists, 23 points, 3 steals, 4 rebs .... yeah, he sucks.
Ron - 22 points, 13 rebs, 4 assists, 2 steals . . . guess he sucks, too.
I know that Bibby had too many to's and Ron took too many ill advised shots, but I do believe they had a BIG part in us winning this game.
Bibby - Playing hurt because there is nobody to play in his place, 9 assists, 23 points, 3 steals, 4 rebs .... yeah, he sucks.
Ron - 22 points, 13 rebs, 4 assists, 2 steals . . . guess he sucks, too.
I know that Bibby had too many to's and Ron took too many ill advised shots, but I do believe they had a BIG part in us winning this game.
I didn't "defend" SAR. I don't think he played a bad game considering what we asked him to do. He didn't get touches. He rebounded at a good clip. He defended well. What more do you want? He can't score 12-15 on 7 shots every night. It wasn't a good game, it wasn't a bad game. He was a pair of hands and some legs for us. That's all we asked him to be.
I don't care about Bibby playing with a hurt hand. If it's hurt and it's detrimental to his game - he should sit. For all those 9 assists, he had 11 TOs. Last I checked a 1:1 ratio is bad ... Bibby doesn't even have that.
Also, you can say players missed their shots, but you can say that about everyone. I'm sure SAR would have had more assists if people hit the shots he passed to them. I'm sure Miller would have. etc. etc. etc.
Bibby didn't make any spectacular passes or set ups to his teammates that earned a lot of those assists. A lot of them were just simple long jumpers after he passed them the ball. Nothing special. Nothing he created.
I don't care about Bibby playing with a hurt hand. If it's hurt and it's detrimental to his game - he should sit. For all those 9 assists, he had 11 TOs. Last I checked a 1:1 ratio is bad ... Bibby doesn't even have that.
Also, you can say players missed their shots, but you can say that about everyone. I'm sure SAR would have had more assists if people hit the shots he passed to them. I'm sure Miller would have. etc. etc. etc.
Bibby didn't make any spectacular passes or set ups to his teammates that earned a lot of those assists. A lot of them were just simple long jumpers after he passed them the ball. Nothing special. Nothing he created.
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