GS reported offering Barnes and Bogut + 1

[Entity]

OK they are Offering Barnes, bogut, + 1 pick for howard. what if we took all that and they had the space to outright sign howard. wouldn't that be the same thing. of course we would have to get rid of an outlaw or jimmer contract to make it work Or more if we could i.e. hayes.

we get Bogut 1 year rental. target here is Barnes good SF and a #1 pick in next years draft. make it happen PDA

 

[jdbraver]

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OK they are Offering Barnes, bogut, + 1 pick for howard. what if we took all that and they had the space to outright sign howard. wouldn't that be the same thing. of course we would have to get rid of an outlaw or jimmer contract to make it work Or more if we could i.e. hayes.

we get Bogut 1 year rental. target here is Barnes good SF and a #1 pick in next years draft. make it happen PDA

I would be very surprised if Barnes were included. That being said I'd still like to pick up bogut. Low risk, big reward on the last year of his contract.

 

[Entity]

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I would be very surprised if Barnes were included. That being said I'd still like to pick up bogut. Low risk, big reward on the last year of his contract.

Barnes is included already reported this morning. he is included to the lakers for a S&T but lakers want curry or Thompson along with Barnes. Lakers getting greedy as hell. we should jump while the jumping is good.

 

[MassachusettsKingsFan]

Lakers would take Barnes for nothing if they are going to lose Howard anyway, and if they don't want Bogut they could swing him to the Kings.

 

[jdbraver]

Lakers would take Barnes for nothing if they are going to lose Howard anyway, and if they don't want Bogut they could swing him to the Kings.

Why would the Lakers swing Bogut to us?

 

[Chupacabra]

God I HATE LA! Give them nothing! Take from them EVERYTHING!!

 

[Mass]

OK they are Offering Barnes, bogut, + 1 pick for howard. what if we took all that and they had the space to outright sign howard. wouldn't that be the same thing. of course we would have to get rid of an outlaw or jimmer contract to make it work Or more if we could i.e. hayes.

we get Bogut 1 year rental. target here is Barnes good SF and a #1 pick in next years draft. make it happen PDA

I think that Howard wants a 5 years deal. So he has to sign with LA, and then be traded wherever he wants. GS can only offer a 4 years contract.

 

[Entity]

Lakers would take Barnes for nothing if they are going to lose Howard anyway, and if they don't want Bogut they could swing him to the Kings.

I don't want bogut. I want barnes. 13 mil for 1 year for a guy that might at best play 30% of the games. no thanks. the only reason i even mention is to fill the SF hole with Barnes. but if has to be a s&T then we are out of it because the lakers surely would not send Barnes our way.

 

[steelevt]

I think that Howard wants a 5 years deal. So he has to sign with LA, and then be traded wherever he wants. GS can only offer a 4 years contract.

I saw someone post that they took away the 5th year in sign and trades. I might have been mistaken though. But I wouldn't mind taking this trade. We get an ender in bogut, our sf in Barnes, and a pick in a strong draft.

 

[Bricklayer]

I saw someone post that they took away the 5th year in sign and trades. I might have been mistaken though. But I wouldn't mind taking this trade. We get an ender in bogut, our sf in Barnes, and a pick in a strong draft.

I've raised a question a few times about Barnes, and here is a demonstration of that question.

Is he actually a future legit starter? His extreme statistical similarity to an old friend illustrates what we don't know:

Barnes Rookie '12-13: 25.4min 9.2pts (.439 .359 .758) 4.1reb 1.2ast 0.6stl 0.2blk 1.2TO
Casspi Rookie '09-10: 25.1min 10.3pts (.446 .369 .672) 4.5reb 1.2ast 0.7stl 0.2blk 1.3TO

 

[MANoICE]

Bogut for 1 year for chump change, Yes Please.
Bogut + Barnes for more chump change, where do I sign and when.
Bogut+Barnes+1 rd. Pick, I think I just passed out.

I do any of these deals and I get them done yesterday. Bogut finished the season strong and helped a lot defensively for the W's. Even if he goes back to his injury riddled self, it is only a 1 year deal and then clearing 13 Mil. of cap space to re-sign DMC and/or go after a much better free agent class. I do this even if the pick isn't in 2014. Extra picks are always welcome.

 

[Entity]

I've raised a question a few times about Barnes, and here is a demonstration of that question.

Is he actually a future legit starter? His extreme statistical similarity to an old friend illustrates what we don't know:

Barnes Rookie '12-13: 25.4min 9.2pts (.439 .359 .758) 4.1reb 1.2ast 0.6stl 0.2blk 1.2TO
Casspi Rookie '09-10: 25.1min 10.3pts (.446 .369 .672) 4.5reb 1.2ast 0.7stl 0.2blk 1.3TO

what did omri do in the playoff against the spurs and the nuggets

 

[sidney]

I saw someone post that they took away the 5th year in sign and trades. I might have been mistaken though. But I wouldn't mind taking this trade. We get an ender in bogut, our sf in Barnes, and a pick in a strong draft.

This is correct, which means Golden State can clear their space with us just as easily as the Lakers. Makes no difference to Dwight and his contract. I'd undercut the Lakers with Bogut + Barnes for a future 2nd offer and walk away with two starters.

Is Barnes a future star? I'm not convinced but he showed in the playoffs he can be a 15/5 or more type of SF which is what we want. If it sticks we are set. If not, he's on a rookie deal. No downside to this at all. Plus we can see what a big center like Bogut looks like next to Cousins.

 

[Larry David]

The Bogut and Barnes combo works with the Lakers in a sign and trade, but if the Lakers don’t work with the Warriors they have to clear Bogut, Jefferson, and Biedrins to sign Dwight which probably requires two trades and throwing in Barnes into one of them. The Kings can’t just step into the Bogut and Barnes deal. The Warriors won’t have enough space to sign Dwight.

I broke it out in another thread ... but I think they move Bogut for a 2nd rounder. Then the Kings could take on Barnes and eat one year of Jefferson and Biedrins and the 1st for protected 2nd rounders. Kings must amensty Salmons.

That's probably how Golden State would have to work around the Lakers and still a pretty good deal for the Kings

 

[Entity]

we would be close to the cap may have to send around 3 mil somewhere or amnesty salmons.

 

[Entity]

The Bogut and Barnes combo works with the Lakers in a sign and trade, but if the Lakers don’t work with the Warriors they have to clear Bogut, Jefferson, and Biedrins to sign Dwight which probably requires two trades and throwing in Barnes into one of them. The Kings can’t just step into the Bogut and Barnes deal. The Warriors won’t have enough space to sign Dwight.

I wonder if GS has an amnesty on one of them?

 

[jalfa]

I wonder if GS has an amnesty on one of them?

used that on Charlie Bell, so they could give Deandre Jordan an offer sheet. one of the most useless applications of that provision, so far.

 

[Mojo]

I wonder if GS has an amnesty on one of them?

Golden State used their amnesty on Charlie Bell.

 

[Entity]

alot has to happen. I'd imagine if the lakers fear howard walking they may just take what the Warriors offer without sending 2 of the youngsters.

 

[Entity]

utah now in the talks about bogut. maybe we can take biedrins and barnes and send jimmer to utah in a 3 team deal. that could very well be enough to get howard for them at that point.

 

[Bricklayer]

what did omri do in the playoff against the spurs and the nuggets

We'll never know.

The playoffs are obviously the hope. But Trevor Ariza once had a great playoffs too.

Some of this goes to costs. If we can scoop him up cheap then its a no brainer. If he comes attached to giant contracts...well just imagine if you had cleared out your best young guard 4 years ago and taken back a $10mil contract all in order to get your hands on Omri. You'd be standing in line at a soup kitchen right now.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

The problem with this thinking is that the trade works as a sign-and-trade with the Lakers, but not as a salary-cap trade with us to clear space.

The Warriors have $69M in contracts right now. Bogut and Barnes add up to just shy of $17M. So if they were to trade those two guys to us for a future second rounder, well, we could eat that salary by amnestying Salmons, but the Warriors would still be at $52M - with only $6.5M of cap space to sign Dwight outright. Not gonna get it done.

With the Lakers, Bogut+Barnes's $17M is good enough to be matching salary for Howard's $20M or wherever his contract is going to start.

And it's not like the Lakers are going to kindly say, "Hey, let's make it a three-team deal with the Kings so we don't have to take back any salary" because for one, if they want Howard to walk for free, Houston will gladly help them out with that. Just don't offer him a contract - he's off the books. Besides, the Lakers are apparently already trying to sweeten any potential S&T by getting *more* than what the Warriors offered to start.

So I don't see any hope for this at all. If a Kings-Warriors trade alone could have cleared cap space for an outright signing, that might be one thing. But since it doesn't, and the Lakers are trying to squeeze more out of the Warriors, I can't see how they'd turn it into a three-way S&T in order to take less.

 

[Darth Divac]

Hayes and Jimmer.

 

[Entity]

ok this works

Utah gets

bogut
Jimmer

Kings get (with a salmons amnesty)

Barnes
jefferson
Biedrins

GS gets howard

we then have Jefferson and Biedrins as 20 mil worth of enders. problem is we would be paying out quite a sum this year with the amnesty an all just to land Barnes.

We could try and throw hayes somewhere to help ease the salary pain.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

ok this works

Utah gets

bogut
Jimmer

Kings get (with a salmons amnesty)

Barnes
jefferson
Biedrins

GS gets howard

we then have Jefferson and Biedrins as 20 mil worth of enders. problem is we would be paying out quite a sum this year with the amnesty an all just to land Barnes.

We could try and throw hayes somewhere to help ease the salary pain.

Yeah, that looks like it does work, at least on our end (haven't checked Utah's salary numbers). But since Jefferson and Biedrins are dead weight, that equates to giving Barnes a very frontloaded 3/$30M contract (edit: 3/$38.5M because we're also amnestying Salmons) - not terribly less MORE than the deal we didn't want to give Tyreke. I can see our front office saying no to that. But it would give us some severe salary relief next year, especially if we threw in either Hayes or Outlaw...in fact I might prefer to structure that with Jimmer staying and Outlaw or Hayes going to GS - they'd still have the money to sign Howard.

What would we look like? With sending Outlaw instead, it would be:

Vasquez/IT/McCollum
McLemore/Thornton/Jimmer
Barnes/Jefferson
Thompson/Patterson
Cousins/Hayes/Biedrins

We'd need to find a backup SF on the cheap and maybe try to bring back Aldrich with the room exception. But it's not terrible (though expensive) and we would potentially be able to use the expirings of Jefferson/Biedrins at the trade deadline. My gut says that it's too frontloaded (also consider the Salmons amnesty as part of that frontload) for our FO to like it, but if they do feel Barnes is about to break out...

 

[Entity]

yeah its basically giving away 27 mil just to get barnes for 3 years.

 

[dude12]

utah now in the talks about bogut. maybe we can take biedrins and barnes and send jimmer to utah in a 3 team deal. that could very well be enough to get howard for them at that point.

I like your thinking.......somehow, someway, with someone, there is a deal to be made.

 

[Larry David]

yeah its basically giving away 27 mil just to get barnes for 3 years.

If the Kings can’t sign somebody of significance right now, you’re getting Barnes for the cost of rolling the 20 million of cap space over one summer and/or using those expiring deals at the deadline to take back a player that another team needs to clear out.

Barnes is a very good prospect. He is a SF. He would fit great next to Macklemore. It makes a lot of sense to put that type of shooting and athleticism around Cousins.

Unless Iguodala is coming into the fold, at this point, the Kings are either overpaying marginal talent at SF (they would overpay Igudodala but he’s not marginal) and/or making short term moves that preserve their cap space for next summer.

Cousins, Macklemore, Barnes is pretty good start. The Kings have good platoons at PG and PF.

 

[Entity]

they just seem to be pinching pennies. not willing to go 2 mil higher not sure they want to eat the 20 mil in expirings to get a 3 mil player

 

[Capt. Factorial]

So if I told you that going in to next summer's draft/free agency, we would have this lineup, and that it would cost about $42M, what would you think? (In parentheses is the number of years under contract)

Jimmer(1+RFA),McCallum(2+RFA)
McLemore(3+RFA),Thornton(1)
Barnes(2+RFA),Outlaw(1)
Thompson(3)
Cousins(4-5, already extended)

On top of that, IT, Vasquez, and Patterson would be RFAs. We'd have $18M to iron out the PG situation and get another rotation big man, and we'd likely have a first round pick in the mid-20s from Golden State, even if we made the playoffs and lost our own pick.

It would be very costly up front, but there's a core of Cousins/Barnes/McLemore that's kind of cheap going forward a few years. Is that core plus a bit of a question mark at PG (and the cap space to do something about it) worth basically a $27M hit this year? I don't know, but if the FO wants to be "aggressive"...!