Grades v. Raptors 11/25

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Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#1
Trying to figure out – do you actually celebrate after a 2pt come from behind win over a 1-11 team on your home floor?? Guess it beats the alternative, but I feel like I just barely out-armwrestled my girlfriend, and had to cheat by tickling her feet to do it.


Garcia ( C ) – struggled with the shot beyond a few cuts, but was helping on the glass. Some solid passes to set people up. Finally hit his first three of the season in the 4th. Scrappy game making some contributions here and there in various areas, but mixed in with poor shooting and a variety of bad plays. Kind of settling into a role as a low level utility starter just trying to fill in the holes. Going to go ahead and grade him on that sort of scale rather than a no minute rookie scale.
Reef ( B+ ) – in the first half was unstoppable in there inside vs. the defenseless Raptors, and we actually fed Reef to take advantage of it. Scored on by Rafael Araujo but it took Chris Bosh a while to get going against him. In the early going was providing no boards, but picked it up as the game went along. Quieted down in the second half, and down the stretch was rarely heard from. In the end, ended up with pretty much a draw against Bosh, which is pretty much the best we could have hoped for coming in. Thought about the A- here, but multiple A's in such a sad game seemed unwarranted, there was a late game fade, and the Raptors generally had a very easy go of it inside once again and I'm trying to find some way to factor in our pathetic defense in these grades. Still one of Reef's better games for us, and had an impact tonight.
Miller ( B+ ) – early on having problems against Rafael Araujo of all people on defense, while the rebounding started off was better than it has been, but faded on us. Was occasionally playing a little "bigger" role from down in the post as opposed to staying up at the elbow. Quit rebounding in the third, but returned to passing. The Raptors were as unimpressed as most teams with his defense of the lane. Yet another one of his remarkably consistent 16 8 8 efforts, and is going to get his normal 16 8 8 grade.
Bonzi ( A- ) – Bonzi rides to the rescue again. Solid first half playing his game, but really began to assert his physical inside game in the third, and broke up a stupid selfish fastbreak by Mike James for good measure. Got into it with several of the more physical Raptors (Araujo, Graham). Began to lose control of Jalen Rose defensively in the third. Along with Bibby, really bailed us out down the stretch by swelling up big on the glass and inside, and then capped it off by hitting the game winning post shot with 2 seconds to go. Another 9 rebound effort, and still backing it up on the court.
Bibby ( B+ ) – started off well offensively, but not able to stay with the superquick Mike James early on defense. Splashed in lots of threes again to compensate for the lack for Peja, and it looks like Rick has made an adjustment which finds Mike in Peja’s corners while the SF is out. Hit a number of big shots later in the game to hold us in it. Is really getting one-dimensional right now – big scoring night after big scoring night and those shooting woes are long gone. But assists, boards, defense…25pts 3rebs 1ast -- odd numbers from a PG. Nonetheless, one of two guys (the other being Bonzi) most responsible for saving us from the big embarrassment.
Thomas ( C ) – extended 2nd quarter minutes where he did a little of this and a little of that. Wild behind the back pass in the early 4th missed by a mile and almost deserves an extra "minus" all by itself. Is the only "big" coming off the bench at all for us right now, and this was another non-impact effort.
Hart ( D+ ) - not much in either of his stints once again – guy is rather frighteningly resembling the PG who was given up on by the Spurs rather than the guy who seemed to step forward for the Bobcats last year., Scored on a cut in the 4th, notable just because it came within the flow of the offense. But then came right back and made a turnover up top. Continues to make an argument for just playing Mike 48min, and is frustrating his friendly grader here by giving me no grounds to give him any positive ticks. D+ just because he’s often been worse in this young season.
Martin ( D+ ) – Came back down to earth with a thud, and could get nothing going offensively. That inconsistency problem again. Came right in and missed a wild shot and never looked really comfortable. Did make some subtler contributions though – a pass to set up Reef, drew an offensive foul against Mike James, stepped into the passing lanes for a steal up top etc.. Gave us absolutely no punch off the bench, but not a completely worthless outing.


Adelman ( B- ) – This….was not a confidence booster. A record booster, but not one that makes you feel better about us. Complete lack of defense in the first half had me worried – that would be the template of how to lose to the Raptors. They will not stop you under any circumstances, but if you return the favor, who knows? And sure enough, by the end of the game we had scored our expected 100+, but then again, so had the Raptors who frolicked right through the lane at will. We damn near gave this one away, and on several occasions in the 4th were one or two possessions form being knocked out of the game by the team with the worst record in the league, on our home floor. Started to hear the boobirds a bit in the 4th, and damnit if I don’t understand their frustration, much as I dislike booing the home team. With the game in some real danger finally decided to play just enough defense in the final 6 minutes to secure the victory, but even so, the final shot/nail in our coffin missed by about 2 inches. Rick has settled into a short 3 man bench right now, but is just getting nothing on every other night. Our only "big" off the bench is 6’7". Our backup PG sucks, and there are no options except some undrafted rookie. And Kevin is wildly up and down. Team did not feel like it had any real intensity tonight, and it was up to a couple of individual players (notably Bonzi) in the late going to crank it up and save us. Peja was out again, and you wouldn’t have thought it would matter against this team. And actually it really did not. We scored just fine. We just refused to stop anybody. Liked Rick milking Shareef inside early, and the post play for Bonzi to win it was risky, but worked. Took advantage of the one on one abilities of those two players more than we have been. They say a win is a win. I say B.S., and this is not the first time this season I have caught myself thinking that maybe it wouldn't be that bad for us to lose one of these things just to teach our guys a bleeping lesson and snap them out of the malaise. But nonetheless, a "W" it is, no matter how ignominious, now all we have to do is beat the expansion Bobcats on Monday to make it back to a wobbly .500. Of course if we give this same effort, that’s no guarantee.
 
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6th

Homer Fan Since 1985
#2
Bonzi................A

Shareef.............A

Brad..................B

Bibby.................B

Garcia................C-

Team Defense.....D

Bench................D
 
A

AriesMar27

Guest
#6
the kings are now 1 game behind 8th seed minny..... shooting past the sonics, lakers, hornets and jazz..... go kings...

bonzi, reef, bibby and miller get an "A"... the rest of the team.... i dont know... the 4 of them scored 81 points.... that bench needs to step up big time vause if peja were playing they wouldnt have any since they combined for peja's average...
 

6th

Homer Fan Since 1985
#7
piksi said:
somebody is in a giving mood tonight;)
LOL

Well, they were shooting for a big fat F, but then they go a few crucial stops in the last 2-3 minutes that saved the game. ;)
 
#8
whatever individual grades are given tonight are irrelevant, basically (no offense Brick. i appreciate the effort you put into the grades after every game). the team defense was as bad as it could be. the kings simply COULD NOT stop the TORONTO RAPTORS. the raptors shot well over 50%. they basically stopped themselves in the waning moments of the fourth. the kings didn't do it. i haven't been this frustrated and disgusted by the kings in the midst of a win in a long time. something really needs to be done. whether it be a trade or a kick in the ***, this kings team needs to start playing some defense. i mean, this is straight ridiculous. yes, the raptors are young and athletic, and they're improving, but they're the friggin toronto raptors. they haven't been a good ball club in my lifetime. the kings need to show a little pride and toughness, especially in a HOME GAME. you simply do not allow such a god awful team a free pass to the basket on your court. i don't know how many ball players there are on this board, but i bet most of them can testify to being embarrased when they get scored on. i've never been a great defender, but i absolutely hate it when i get scored on. it sucks. so you do your best to try and prevent the same person from abusing you time and time again. i cannot believe that the kings do not have this sense of pride, beyond bonzi wells (who i friggin love). i'm embarrassed for them, frankly. its sad.

[/end rant]
 
#10
We shot 50%. They shot 52%. Yes, the team defense was VERY bad. We have a lot of wwork to do. I'm sure that most eveyone would agree. However, we DID win. They did not give up. They came back from 8 or nine down more than once in the fourth. They could have quit, but THEY DID NOT GIVE UP.

I am all about pointing out where we need work. I think the flaws are obvious. However, I am getting tired of all the negativity. I am choosing to look at the positives and get as much enjoyment out of these games as possible. THIS IS MY PERSONAL OPINION. It is NOT a knock on those who choose to look at the negatives more.

Bottom line for me: WE WON. The team hung in and stuck it out to get the win. They could have quit or fallen apart as they have many times in the past. They did not. WE WON.
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#11
The Bulls beat the Spurs. The Hawks beat the Pacers. I'm not gonna squawk about tonight's game. At least the Kings got the W... Yes, there are lots of flaws but I agree wholeheartedly with chelle. They won, and the way they won - with a designed play to the low post - is exciting to me. Seeing plays out of BOTH the high and low post is exciting to me.

I'm gonna be happy about this game because the W looks just the same as one where you win by 20. And the confidence our starters are beginning to have in each other - well, at least 4/5 of our starters - is only going to pay more dividends down the road.

One game at a time. One step at a time.

Sure, we still stink on defense, but there are positives to take away from tonight.

Team grade? B... The bench may not have helped much but they kept the Indians at bay until the calvary could arrive.

:D
 
#14
Trying to figure out – do you actually celebrate after a 2pt come from behind win over a 1-11 team on your home floor?? Guess it beats the alternative, but I feel like I just barely out-armwrestled my girlfriend, and had to cheat by tickling her feet to do it
A+ for that comment:D

C+ For the team. We really should have annihalated the Raps.
 
#15
Wow, Brick - lofty grades. We've ended up two points away from some serious anurism here. Since you are grading relative to expactations, one has to ask: are we that bad?
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#16
bozzwell said:
Wow, Brick - lofty grades. We've ended up two points away from some serious anurism here. Since you are grading relative to expactations, one has to ask: are we that bad?
There is a real issue there -- how do you assess/aportion the pathetic defense which nearly sunk us? Offensively our 4 core starters all put up impressive numbers, but defensively it was just terrible. And not so much one on one, although that is a problem, but absolute, complete, totally selfish lack of hustle and help defense. Nobody helps, nobody rotates. As far away from what we saw from the Spurs on Monday as possible. And its just hard to assess that blame accurately. Always a hole in any grades. You can grade offense, and you can grade individual defense where you know who's responsibility it is, but these sad defensive efforts that have plagued us this season are hard to figure out and point out one guy who was the problem. Just no defensive teamwork. And its hard to knock the grades down too low on the major guys -- Reef had one of his best games for us (on offense). Bonzi and Bibby kind of won it. Brad threatened a triple double again. Kind of frustrating.
 
#17
The bench is horrible. Why not give Ronny Price some minutes here and there and see what he can do. Jason Hart is giving this team absolutely nothing offensively and although he's always in the 8th grade defensive stance, it's not as though he's doing much on that end of the floor either.
 
#18
Remember this fall, when there was so much talk from the Kings' camp about being too full of point guards and everyone battling for minutes?

My, how quickly we've come to legitimate arguments for playing Mike 48/night.
 
#19
Diabeticwonder said:
The bench is horrible. Why not give Ronny Price some minutes here and there and see what he can do. Jason Hart is giving this team absolutely nothing offensively and although he's always in the 8th grade defensive stance, it's not as though he's doing much on that end of the floor either.
I would like to see what Ronnie Price can do as well. From everyone's comments on the preseason I was expecting more out of Hart, atleast defensively. So far i'm not impressed but I'm willng to be pateint.
 
P

playmaker0017

Guest
#20
Padrino said:
i've never been a great defender, but i absolutely hate it when i get scored on. it sucks. so you do your best to try and prevent the same person from abusing you time and time again. i cannot believe that the kings do not have this sense of pride, beyond bonzi wells (who i friggin love). i'm embarrassed for them, frankly. its sad.
I know we're on a Bonzi contact high - and to be honest he's playing great. But his defense isn't exactly "pride worthy". It's pretty sub-par... to say the least.

Peterson, Jalen and James all penetrated at will from the perimeter.

In my opinion, Bonzi has been one of the weak links on defense. When he plays in control - that's been his only downfall.
 
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P

playmaker0017

Guest
#21
Bricklayer said:
Reef ( B+ ) – in the first half was unstoppable in there inside vs. the defenseless Raptors, and we actually fed Reef to take advantage of it. Scored on by Rafael Araujo but it took Chris Bosh a while to get going against him. In the early going was providing no boards, but picked it up as the game went along. Quieted down in the second half, and down the stretch was rarely heard from. In the end, ended up with pretty much a draw against Bosh, which is pretty much the best we could have hoped for coming in. Thought about the A- here, but multiple A's in such a sad game seemed unwarranted, there was a late game fade, and the Raptors generally had a very easy go of it inside once again and I'm trying to find some way to factor in our pathetic defense in these grades. Still one of Reef's better games for us, and had an impact tonight.
Just a few observations - Reef slowed down only because they implemented a zone defense to stop Shareef and the rest of our team couldn't break it. I find it hard to mark Shareef off for quieting during those periods.

Second, Bosh went nuts against the second unit. Berfore Reef went out the first time Bosh was 1-4. During the stint Reef was out - Bosh went 3-3. When Reef came back he was 1-2 with 2 FT line trips.

You can't really blame Reef for Bosh getting warmed up ... nor can you blame the inside guys for much of what happened. The penetration that our guards let up was terrible. Our inside had to rotate leaving guys open.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#22
playmaker0017 said:
Just a few observations - Reef slowed down only because they implemented a zone defense to stop Shareef and the rest of our team couldn't break it. I find it hard to mark Shareef off for quieting during those periods.

Second, Bosh went nuts against the second unit. Berfore Reef went out the first time Bosh was 1-4. During the stint Reef was out - Bosh went 3-3. When Reef came back he was 1-2 with 2 FT line trips.

You can't really blame Reef for Bosh getting warmed up ... nor can you blame the inside guys for much of what happened. The penetration that our guards let up was terrible. Our inside had to rotate leaving guys open.
Our interior defenders rotated to a grand total of 1 blocked shot (from reserve Kenny Thomas) and zero bodies on the floor. Meanwhile the Raptors frontline trio of Araujo/Bosh/Villanueva was going 20-33 from the field and SAR was on the court for 40 of the 48 minutes in which they did it. Not that anybody else's defense was any better.
 
#23
Bricklayer said:
But nonetheless, a "W" it is, no matter how ignominious.
Excellent grades Brick, as usual. Believe me I feel the pain of trying to give meaningful grades under these circumstances.

I did have to go to dictionary .com for the big word though. :)
Then I tried to find out why I didn't know the word and found the reason. "I am an "Ignoramous"! :D
KD
 
#24
Bricklayer said:
I have caught myself thinking that maybe it wouldn't be that bad for us to lose one of these things just to teach our guys a bleeping lesson and snap them out of the malaise.
IMO we already had TWO games like that...
 
#25
Interesting to note that six players had more assists than Bibby! I am really biggining to think that Bibby should not be a PG. He is a good shooter like Peja and it begs the question is his talent matched to his position?

I know that in the Toronto game he was basically filling in for Peja, but when your center dishes out more assists in general.... it makes one wonder...
 
#26
Bricklayer said:
Adelman ( B- ) – This….was not a confidence booster. A record booster, but not one that makes you feel better about us. Complete lack of defense in the first half had me worried – that would be the template of how to lose to the Raptors. They will not stop you under any circumstances, but if you return the favor, who knows? And sure enough, by the end of the game we had scored our expected 100+, but then again, so had the Raptors who frolicked right through the lane at will. We damn near gave this one away, and on several occasions in the 4th were one or two possessions form being knocked out of the game by the team with the worst record in the league, on our home floor. Started to hear the boobirds a bit in the 4th, and damnit if I don’t understand their frustration, much as I dislike booing the home team. With the game in some real danger finally decided to play just enough defense in the final 6 minutes to secure the victory, but even so, the final shot/nail in our coffin missed by about 2 inches. Rick has settled into a short 3 man bench right now, but is just getting nothing on every other night. Our only "big" off the bench is 6’7". Our backup PG sucks, and there are no options except some undrafted rookie. And Kevin is wildly up and down. Team did not feel like it had any real intensity tonight, and it was up to a couple of individual players (notably Bonzi) in the late going to crank it up and save us. Peja was out again, and you wouldn’t have thought it would matter against this team. And actually it really did not. We scored just fine. We just refused to stop anybody. Liked Rick milking Shareef inside early, and the post play for Bonzi to win it was risky, but worked. Took advantage of the one on one abilities of those two players more than we have been. They say a win is a win. I say B.S., and this is not the first time this season I have caught myself thinking that maybe it wouldn't be that bad for us to lose one of these things just to teach our guys a bleeping lesson and snap them out of the malaise. But nonetheless, a "W" it is, no matter how ignominious, now all we have to do is beat the expansion Bobcats on Monday to make it back to a wobbly .500. Of course if we give this same effort, that’s no guarantee.

I don't see how much of any of this is the coach's fault. Players not doing what they are supposed to do is not the coaches fault. Players playing flat with no intensity is not the coaches fault. The roster is Geoff Petrie's fault. What do you want Adleman to do? Pull starters out and put the bench in? He did that last playoffs against the Sonics but that was a different bench. If he does it with this bench, the game is lost for sure.

Adelman does yell at his players. He just doesn't do it in front of the camera. There are many times when the radio or TV broadcast is silenced because coach Adelman is getting into someone's *** on the sideline.

I thought Adelman's play calls were correct. I thought his timeouts were done at the right times. I saw him get into the ref's rear ends a number of times for bad calls. His substitutions were correct. I thought he did a great job overall.

You lay underserved blame on Adelman's shoulders for things that he has no control over.
 
#27
I see. Lose the game(s) to send a message to the starters. So you have no criticisms of Adelman's substitutions, play calling, timeouts, or dealing with the refs. Sounds like a good job even with that that one nitpick.

So until Adelman pulls the starters and starts losing games, then his bashers won't be happy. Of course if he does that, then people will start complaining that the Kings are losing and angry that he is playing a bad bench instead of the good starters...
 
#28
Was lucky enough to be at last night's game. Tale of an evolving team, legless and unproductive bench, defensive blunders - one after another (had Rose made that last 3 pointer there sure would be a lot more negativity here today!), Bonzi playing with relentless gusto and emerging as the true on-the-court leader (by example if nothing else).

Can't remember the last time I was at a game where a win felt so much like a LOSS!

Keep reminding myself this team is a work in progress and to give it time. Geesh.
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#29
Oh lord...

Being critical of the coach is NOT bashing. Had you been here more than 20 minutes or so, your comments might have a tad more credence.

You're arguing with two of the most fair posters on this board about them not being fair. NEITHER of them are "bashers."

I would strongly suggest - with emphasis on the strongly - that you read the tips for posting on this forum.
 
#30
I 50/50 agree with Doug.

Not sure how to expand on it as the other 50% disagree's. Actually thats how I win fights with my wife. Agree and then disagree behind her back!
 
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