Brian Skinner

[CaminoChaos]

I got a question for you all.

Would you start Skinner? This guy was the most consistant player in the preseason and everytime he comes in produces. Last night he blocked something like 5 shots and no telling how many shots he altered. Lately I've been impressed with his interior offense. He has a sweet little half hook and has improved his mid range shot. I see him as a poor man's Ben Wallace but with a little more offensive skill. Every championship team in NBA history have had a defensive minded big man on there team. Duncan, Wallace, Shaq, Rodman and Hakeem to name a few. I believe he deserves to play more minutes. He would compliment Miller or Reef very well and give us that interior big man we all have been asking for.

Just a thought to discuss.

 

[nbrans]

I don't know that I'd start him because I'm not sure if the benefits he brings on defense outweigh his drag on the offense over the course of 30-35 minutes. As active and strong as he is, he's still undersized even for a power forward, so he's not going to be effective enough on defense against every opposing power forward to justify big time minutes. But if he continues to play the way he did the last two games I'd be in favor of him taking all the minutes at the backup PF and C slots. KT has really not shown much of anything off the bench besides a wildly inconsistent jump shot, and maybe if there's an actual battle for minutes it will light a fire under both of them.

Unfortunately, Skinner has had consistency problems of his own, and at least in the beginning of the season he wasn't showing much more than the rest of the bench. I'm in favor of him getting more minutes, but I'm not terribly confident that he will continue to be as effective as he was the last two games.

 

[Folsom Al]

To SHOWCASE him for a future trade - sure

To win games .... fat chance

To have a stronger defensive presence ... gotta play "TEAM D" 48 minutes

To save the season ... that's too much to put on one individual

... I'll stop there

... my point is, although the franchise has to start somewhere to PICK-UP THE PIECES, starting Skinner is a BAND-AID MOVE.

Deal with the problems ... not the symptons

 

[Diabeticwonder]

Skinner definately deserves more minutes. However, I would only start him if somehow we pulled off a trade involving Brad in order to bring back a star power forward. Starting him next to KG would be fine, but even next to someone like Bosh would be fine with me as well.

 

[Warhawk]

Who is the backup 5 right now if Skinner starts?

And why showcase him to trade him? He's the only shotblocker that gets on the floor, and even then he isn't there for long....

I just don't get that.

 

[Jerryaki]

i'd start him, just because it would 1) put another guy on the floor who seems more into the game than the starters have been showing, 2) provides some interior defense, and 3) gives more shots to the scorers.

 

[Diabeticwonder]

When Skinner wasn't playing at all this season, Brad was being backed up at the 5 by Reef, KT and Corliss who are obviously not centers. I understand that this team is not very good and will win 30 or so games this year. However, I would like to see the guys who give an effort be the ones playing like Skinner and even Ronny.

 

[HaraWish]

I got a question for you all.



Would you start Skinner? This guy was the most consistant player in the preseason and everytime he comes in produces. Last night he blocked something like 5 shots and no telling how many shots he altered. Lately I've been impressed with his interior offense. He has a sweet little half hook and has improved his mid range shot. I see him as a poor man's Ben Wallace but with a little more offensive skill. Every championship team in NBA history have had a defensive minded big man on there team. Duncan, Wallace, Shaq, Rodman and Hakeem to name a few. I believe he deserves to play more minutes. He would compliment Miller or Reef very well and give us that interior big man we all have been asking for.



Just a thought to discuss.

That's what I want to say exactly! Thank you.

Miller and Skinner for our starters. I like KT, too. So give him enough PT. But I think Miller and Skinner combination can have synergy. They can compensate one's weak points.

Please Adelman. We have nothing to lose any more. Just try that please.

ps : backup C? We have Jamal Sampson. He has no chance to show his stuff, so his talent is hard to say. But he was signed for backup C. Just trust him.

 

[piksi]

Who is the backup 5 right now if Skinner starts?

Corliss - he played that position the whole last season

 

[kupman]

Yes, I would start him for the the very reasons you give. He deserves to start much more than some of the guys who are starting now based on how they played 2-3 years ago. On will not mention any names - but his wife is absolutely stunning.

 

[Kiddo]

Yes, I would start him for the the very reasons you give. He deserves to start much more than some of the guys who are starting now based on how they played 2-3 years ago. On will not mention any names - but his wife is absolutely stunning.

Skinner isn't married. But his girl, a blonde from the Bay, is pretty hot.

He should be starting, given his work ethic and his willingness to battle.

 

[DavisAggie]

That's what I want to say exactly! Thank you.

Miller and Skinner for our starters. I like KT, too. So give him enough PT. But I think Miller and Skinner combination can have synergy. They can compensate one's weak points.

Please Adelman. We have nothing to lose any more. Just try that please.

ps : backup C? We have Jamal Sampson. He has no chance to show his stuff, so his talent is hard to say. But he was signed for backup C. Just trust him.

RA needs to mix it up a bit,

Starting:

C: Skinner (same height as Ben Wallace and I think BW does just fine)
– Backup Miller

PF: Miller (will run the offensive from the top of the key)
– backup SAR

SF: Bonzi
– backup KT

SG: ?
– backup KM/Garcia

PG: Bibby
– backup Jason Hart

? = Whoever we get for Peja via trade.

 

[gman23]

RA needs to mix it up a bit,

Starting:

C: Skinner (same height as Ben Wallace and I think BW does just fine)
– Backup Miller

PF: Miller (will run the offensive from the top of the key)
– backup SAR

SF: Bonzi
– backup KT

SG: ?
– backup KM/Garcia

PG: Bibby
– backup Jason Hart

? = Whoever we get for Peja via trade.

PG: Bibby
-B/U Price

 

[Bricklayer]

I think you could take advantage of the SAR injury and start Brian alongside Brad to change the tone up front. People continue to act like the insertion of a non-scoring banger into the starting lineup is some sort of freaky thing that only terrible teams do. Quite the opposite -- most of the really good teams have at LEAST one.

Random thoughts:

-- Skinner has solid size for a "4" -- 6'9" 250+? About Webb sized.

-- Skinner is far too small as a "5", but unless we suddenly are willing to play Sampson, he's all we've got off the bench. Which makes starting him tricky.

-- KT of course occasionally puts together quarters like the first yesterday to argue for his continuing to start. He's not doing any worse than SAR really.

-- We are 13-20. We suck. Is "disrupting our offense" really that big a deal at this point? I mean who cares? We're on pace to win about 30 games. What we really need is a shakeup coming from some quarter. Geoff, Rick, someone. Because what we've got isn't working.

-- Skinner has started before too -- started for Milwaulkee when they made the playoffs a couple of years back. He is not an elite player. Not even an elite banger. But like that entire pile of midsized forwards we have lying aroound, a guy who can and has started games.

-- BTW, Skinner has NOT been consistent for us this year. Which is really all the excuse Rick needs. But He started the year horribly after the strong camp, and continues to have games where he gives you nothing. Then he has games like yesterday.

-- This has truly become another Ostertag situaion. Just stupid.

 

[CruzDude]

Skinner at C, backup Brad
Brad at the 4, backup KT, Corliss
Bonzi at 3 (Peja for now), cisco backup
KM at 2, backup Cisco,
Bibby at 1, backup Ronnie Price, Hart

Skinner CAN play the 5. His task is to clog the middle, cut out (down) on other team layups, swat 4-5 a game, be a defensive presence and get 3-5 put-backs a game for 10 pts or so. But he can eliminate 10-20 pts a game from the other team with his defense. Why not try it for 5-8 games?

Brad played the 4 the last 2 years and backup to Vlade at the 5 so we know he can do that.

We need a point guard who runs the team, who consistently gets 8+ assists, or directs the offense. Bibby is a 2-guard, our Ray Allen so-to-speak. KM and Cisco both have a bunch of experience doing PG functions.

1. stop easy layups and points in the paint for other team.
2. get someone to take charge of offense and its is NOT Bibby

 

[Bricklayer]

Brian Skinner is not blocking 4-5 shots a game.

Nor is saving 10-20 pts agame for anybody.

Nor can he be a signifcant impediment to big centers like a Big Z, Yao, Shaq, Curry, Haywood etc.

But he COULD help in those areas. Certainly be more effective at them than any of our 4/3 tweeners.

 

[BK_KingsFan7]

If he's not starting, he should at least be playing about 25 minutes a game. But I defenitely think he should start. And I'm not really worried about him disrupting our offense. If anything, it would open up more shots for Brad and Mike.

 

[Kings113]

I'd def. like to see Skinner start.

 

[sidney]

Get a ruler and look at what 3 inches looks like. Skinner clearly is stronger than Brad and can jump, block, and d up better that him even considering those whopping 3 inches. He is also listed as 4 pounds heavier than Brad so he's the same size body.

Undersized shmundersized. Skinner plays taller than he is and Brad plays smaller than a 7 footer.

The fact that this guy gets little to no time despite the fact that his strengths are our weaknesses is a joke. With Reef out, this is the time to give him 30 minutes a game.

Brad 36
KT 30
Skinner 30

 

[SacTownKid]

BTW Brian is actually 6'10". And pretty much what Brick said is right. I wish Rick would start he and Brad together. They at least don't get in eachothers way like Reef/Kenny and Brad do.

 

[kingsfan916]

I dont think i would start him but i would give him atleast 25 min a game

 

[CruzDude]

Brian Skinner is not blocking 4-5 shots a game.

Nor is saving 10-20 pts agame for anybody.

Nor can he be a signifcant impediment to big centers like a Big Z, Yao, Shaq, Curry, Haywood etc.

But he COULD help in those areas. Certainly be more effective at them than any of our 4/3 tweeners.

Right. He doesn't do any of those. I said his "task" is to do (try to do) those things. By preventing many easy layups by every team, its points other teams don't score and any he scores is an added +

All that insinuated he COULD help. But RA never gives him much of a chance. As others in this thread say, he needs at least 25min a game to get his game going. Real question is why does Adelman not use him more? Miller and Peja have all but disappeared lately.

 

[nbrans]

By the way, I took a look at 82games to see how Skinner measures up defensively, and I was quite surprised -- I don't think these numbers can be counted on 100%, but his defensive numbers are pretty bad, and are actually slightly worse than Brad's.

Skinner is giving up a PER of 19.3 to his opponent in the PF slot and 20.6 in the C slot. By comparison, Brad is giving up a PER of 20.5 at the C spot, Shareef is giving up 13.7 at PF, and 15.7 at C. KT is giving up 16.9 at PF. Since the "average" PER is supposed to be 15, this is a little alarming.

He also doesn't really rebound all that much better than Brad. His reb% (a Hollinger stat calculating what percentage of missed shots he rebounds) is 13%, which puts him in between Brad's 12.6% and Kenny's 13.7%. SAR, unsurprisingly, checks in at a paltry 10.7%.

Obviously these numbers should be taken with one big grain of salt, and the defensive numbers I cite strictly measure one-on-one defense and don't take into account help defense, shotblocking, lane clogging, etc. etc. Plus the sample size is maddeningly small (I'm looking at you, Adelman). But all the same, Skinner is by no means a panacea for the Kings' defensive woes.

 

[Wuster]

Start him.

 

[SkinnerBox]

I agree, start him. We have plenty of scorers. If Miller wants to keep running to ofense from the high post, move him to PF. We have too many like minded players, and our biggest weakness is letting people trot down the lane like it's the Mass Pike. Start Skinner for one game where the opposing center isn't a giant and see how he does.

 

[AriesMar27]

atleast try it for one game against a team with weak bigs....

 

[love_them_kings]

at this point, can it hurt?? my feelings on this are that right now we need changes. Until Petrie makes a move we are going to have to find a way to mix things up if we want to win some games. Starting Skinner is one of a few things I think are worth trying just to see how it goes.

 

[SactownRoyalty]

By the way, I took a look at 82games to see how Skinner measures up defensively, and I was quite surprised -- I don't think these numbers can be counted on 100%, but his defensive numbers are pretty bad, and are actually slightly worse than Brad's.

Skinner is giving up a PER of 19.3 to his opponent in the PF slot and 20.6 in the C slot. By comparison, Brad is giving up a PER of 20.5 at the C spot, Shareef is giving up 13.7 at PF, and 15.7 at C. KT is giving up 16.9 at PF. Since the "average" PER is supposed to be 15, this is a little alarming.

He also doesn't really rebound all that much better than Brad. His reb% (a Hollinger stat calculating what percentage of missed shots he rebounds) is 13%, which puts him in between Brad's 12.6% and Kenny's 13.7%. SAR, unsurprisingly, checks in at a paltry 10.7%.

Obviously these numbers should be taken with one big grain of salt, and the defensive numbers I cite strictly measure one-on-one defense and don't take into account help defense, shotblocking, lane clogging, etc. etc. Plus the sample size is maddeningly small (I'm looking at you, Adelman). But all the same, Skinner is by no means a panacea for the Kings' defensive woes.

PER opponent comparisons on 82games are best used when looking at starters, in my experience. The position disparities get too jumbled when using primarily bench players - Peja getting minutes as a center, Garcia at power forward, etc.

But one thing that seems more reliable is the overall field goal percent against. You can find that on the on-off page for each player. Corliss looks real good by that measure, as does Hart. For what it's worth, Skinner's is quite good, too.

But the offense with Skinner on the floor, statistically-speaking, is God awful. 94.6 points per 100 possessions awful. 14.9 points per 100 possessions worse than when he's off the court. Yikes.

He hasn't been paired with a lot of starters, though. I'd support getting him a solid 18 minutes per game right now - maybe most of the second quarter and some at the end of the third/beginning of the fourth. Let's not go overboard here.

 

[Bricklayer]

PER opponent comparisons on 82games are best used when looking at starters, in my experience. The position disparities get too jumbled when using primarily bench players - Peja getting minutes as a center, Garcia at power forward, etc.

But one thing that seems more reliable is the overall field goal percent against. You can find that on the on-off page for each player. Corliss looks real good by that measure, as does Hart. For what it's worth, Skinner's is quite good, too.

But the offense with Skinner on the floor, statistically-speaking, is God awful. 94.6 points per 100 possessions awful. 14.9 points per 100 possessions worse than when he's off the court. Yikes.

He hasn't been paired with a lot of starters, though. I'd support getting him a solid 18 minutes per game right now - maybe most of the second quarter and some at the end of the third/beginning of the fourth. Let's not go overboard here.

That's the problem with so many of those +/- type stats. So very dependant on who you are on the court with, as well as who you replacing. Brian replaced Brad normally, and plays wiht the benchers. So he's teamed wiht a group that has fared terriobly together, and he replaces the one man through whom we run the bulk of our offense. Put those factors together and of course his on/off court performance is going to look bad.

As is PER for that matter. If oyu play alongside a crappy defender, then maybe the other team goes at him rather than at you. If you're Brinan Skinner, maybe a lot of your minutes are spent trying to cool off hot talented big man scorers rather than hiding on lesser lights. And of course that's before we get to the overall impact you have on everybody else's game with help.

 

[CruzDude]

Only way to find out is give him 30 min a game for 5-6 games AND put KT a the 3 since peja is injured again. Then let brad get the smaller minutes.