LPKingsFan
All-Star
I'd rather not pay over $13 million a year for 15 and 10, thanks.
Who NEEDS RonRon? That's who to work with.
- Thread starter CruzDude
- Start date
I'd rather not pay over $13 million a year for 15 and 10, thanks.
Oh god no...I'll take a little insanity over a whiner any day. Randolph doesn't compliment Miller in the paint either. We want that golden boy that IT refuses to play and nothing else.
C Diddy
Starter
They could always keep Kenny on the bench.
Don't forget that Ron was at one point considered a certifiable nut case. At least with Randolph we'd get a guy capable of scoring a lot down low and would require the occasional double teams. With Kenny Thomas, teams just have trouble deciding whether to ignore him completely or put their SF on him.
Not that I particulary like Randolph, but we'd address the Salmons off the bench problem, appease Bibby and dump Thomas in the process.
We'd still be left with too many overpaid PF, but at least one of them would be a legitimate starter.
CruzDude
Senior Member sharing a brew with bajaden
And then there are the Bucks. Today's Racine Journal-Times says they are open to dealing Villaneueva, Simmons, Charlie Bell or Dan Gadzuric. But in same article they squelch two, "almost laughable rumors" that they will not trade for Zack Randolph and they will not trade for Ron Artest. Gee! wonder why not? Two head cases on the market and both 15/10 type guys.
Arby's Roast Beef
Starter
I like him going to the Raptors if we get Calderon back. Then we can move Bibby to wherever
I love Calderon too, and in many ways he's a godsend for my fantasy team, but he's not entirely different from Beno Udrih, except with much better passing and slightly less range perhaps. Anyway, Calderon should stick with the Raps and be deemed untouchable after those stats he's putting up, and the Raps need a PG after Ford's injury.
Zach Randolph? Let's just not touch a Knick. Has talent, but is really earthbound, and do we really need any more earthbound players?
Arby's Roast Beef
Starter
I wouldn't mind Bell on this team. Multidimensional combo guard--explosive, athletic, can shoot the three ball, drive, and defend. He started last year, but is coming off the bench this year, so perhaps could be expendable. However, if we do get Bell, a proven commodity, I think Quincy Douby might as well be gone--we don't need a glut of PG/SG types, and their games are eerily similar IMO.
Gadzuric was a guy, three to four years ago, would've drawn much interest on our part. Athletic shotblocking rebounding per 48 minute king then, he seems to have wallowed on Milwaukee's bench now, and it's hard to perceive any definite value out of him. He's still fairly young, so I'd think he still make a nice 2nd stringer. Again, though, if we get him, there's a positional battle between him and Justin Williams--one might have to go. Considering the potential Justin has flashed, I doubt we'd try to land Gadzuric.
Villanueva has potential still, although now it's more potential to become a qualified starter as opposed to star. Just too soft, which should go against the players we're supposed to be looking for, but his triple threat skills with ability to drive, shoot with range and pass, and also some rebounding. Not sure if he's the guy we should be looking for, as he doesn't fill a definite need at all, but talent is talent.
Dime Dropper
All-Star
Artest does not even come close to >>>>>> Deng. Try being realistic. And Ron has nowhere near the trade value of Deng. If anyone here even thinks Chi would even think about trading Deng for Artest for a second, they're crazy.
Honestly, now. Artest, a 27 y/o nutcase with questionable decision making, for a 21/22 y/o with a great attitude and huge upside. I can't believe someone would be so ridiculous to not want to trade Artest for Deng. Chicago would laugh at us if we asked that. Let's get a tad more realistic.
Do you honestly believe they'd even look at that deal with a straight face? Please...
They wouldn't give up one of those guys as the main piece for Ron.
I can't believe how some people only look at our side of the deal.
While we're at all this, why don't we try to trade for LeBron, Howard and Chris Paul. We would be a solid up and coming team, great to watch and we would still get to keep our best young players (Martin, Hawes) since we're not being realistic. I'd do it.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
Artest does not even come close to >>>>>> Deng. Try being realistic. And Ron has nowhere near the trade value of Deng. If anyone here even thinks Chi would even think about trading Deng for Artest for a second, they're crazy.
Honestly, now. Artest, a 27 y/o nutcase with questionable decision making, for a 21/22 y/o with a great attitude and huge upside. I can't believe someone would be so ridiculous to not want to trade Artest for Deng. Chicago would laugh at us if we asked that. Let's get a tad more realistic.
Do you honestly believe they'd even look at that deal with a straight face? Please...
They wouldn't give up one of those guys as the main piece for Ron.
I can't believe how some people only look at our side of the deal.
While we're at all this, why don't we try to trade for LeBron, Howard and Chris Paul. We would be a solid up and coming team, great to watch and we would still get to keep our best young players (Martin, Hawes) since we're not being realistic. I'd do it.
We're not talking about upside for the Bulls. It's in the Kings interest to buy upside; it's in the Bulls interest to buy NOW. The Bulls have a center who is being paid huge $$$$ and isn't getting younger; they got him because of NOW, not because of upside. And NOW Artest would be a major upgrade for their team. If the Bulls want a chance to be a serious threat now they go for Artest. Otherwise, they can just muddle along.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
Artest does not even come close to >>>>>> Deng. Try being realistic. And Ron has nowhere near the trade value of Deng. If anyone here even thinks Chi would even think about trading Deng for Artest for a second, they're crazy.
Honestly, now. Artest, a 27 y/o nutcase with questionable decision making, for a 21/22 y/o with a great attitude and huge upside. I can't believe someone would be so ridiculous to not want to trade Artest for Deng. Chicago would laugh at us if we asked that. Let's get a tad more realistic.
Do you honestly believe they'd even look at that deal with a straight face? Please...
They wouldn't give up one of those guys as the main piece for Ron.
I can't believe how some people only look at our side of the deal.
While we're at all this, why don't we try to trade for LeBron, Howard and Chris Paul. We would be a solid up and coming team, great to watch and we would still get to keep our best young players (Martin, Hawes) since we're not being realistic. I'd do it.
Who says Chicago is interested in upside? The last recent FA addition was a veteran center who they paid big $$$$. Does that trade indicate to you that they are interested in upside, or that they are interested in NOW? I think the Kings should buy upside and sell NOW. The Bulls should sell upside and buy NOW. Otherwise they can both just muddle along like what they are currently doing.
Dime Dropper
All-Star
Go to a Bulls message board and propose a trade with Deng and Artest being the main pieces. See if you don't get laughed at. I wouldn't even take a trade like that seriously if I were the Bulls, it's ridiculous.
Since the Bulls wouldn't give up Deng as their main piece for Kobe, I'm fairly sure they won't be doing it for Ron Artest. They have a very nice young team, I'm sure they'll be happy to "muddle along" for a few years until all their young guys mature and they can compete. Meanwhile, we'll just muddle along as we have done the past few years.
EDIT; If the Bulls weren't interested in upside, as you put it, I'm 100% sure they could get a hell of a lot more than Artest for him.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
I never proposed a trade with Deng.
mojorizen7
Prospect
My SUNS need Artest but they won't explore it because the franchise has always undervalued defense. There is some friction building between GM Steve Kerr & D'Antoni but it'll more than likely play itself out in the off-season when we get bounced again with D'Antonis flawed system of basketball.
I've been hoping that a deal could somehow get done between our teams but it's not likely.
Good luck the rest of the way KING's fans.
GO SUNS
I've been hoping that a deal could somehow get done between our teams but it's not likely.
Good luck the rest of the way KING's fans.
GO SUNS
Packt
Starter
I didn't want to start another thread for this, but we should also be looking at teams who want cap space. Artest isn't expiring, but there's a high chance he'll opt out. That would mean we take on a bad contract and in exchange get a first round pick. If the organization isn't looking to clear capspace, that would make for a more attainable goal. Now, if they want capspace, Artest will most likely walk. Getting youth with small contracts, and expiring players and/plus a pick won't happen.
I propose:
Artest to Minnesota for Walker.
Toine has a bad contract, but he has a Mikki type deal where we can end it prior to the 09-10 season if wanted. We'd get one of their 1st round picks. Obviously it won't be their top pick, maybe the Boston or the future Miami pick, but thats still better than nothing.
You guys get the idea. Take on someone elses junk and get a pick in exchange.
To the Lakers: Artest, Thomas
To Sac: Brown, Rad, 1st
Brown is expiring, be we'd have to take on Rad, but he may be slightly more useful than Thomas, and he might interest former fans. It might give Divac a reason to come back to town. The Lakers get to audition Artest, and Thomas is a year shorter.
I propose:
Artest to Minnesota for Walker.
Toine has a bad contract, but he has a Mikki type deal where we can end it prior to the 09-10 season if wanted. We'd get one of their 1st round picks. Obviously it won't be their top pick, maybe the Boston or the future Miami pick, but thats still better than nothing.
You guys get the idea. Take on someone elses junk and get a pick in exchange.
To the Lakers: Artest, Thomas
To Sac: Brown, Rad, 1st
Brown is expiring, be we'd have to take on Rad, but he may be slightly more useful than Thomas, and he might interest former fans. It might give Divac a reason to come back to town. The Lakers get to audition Artest, and Thomas is a year shorter.
Entity
Hall of Famer
How about Ron Ron to Millwalkee for Charlie V. and Jake V. and a pick Jake is an expiring and Charlie is a young PF that hasn't realized his potential yet and maybe could in Sacramento.
Millwalkee gets a great player to pair with the vet Redd and the younsters they have to fill out the rest of the line up. If that doesn't work we could also give the KT for Desmond Mason as well.
Millwalkee gets a great player to pair with the vet Redd and the younsters they have to fill out the rest of the line up. If that doesn't work we could also give the KT for Desmond Mason as well.
LA King Fan II
Bench
IMO the Lakers are about the only team in the league that might want Artest -- especially with Ariza getting hurt. I suppose NY and Miami might, but don't like what they're willing to offer.
Odom straight up for Artest would be my preference. Odom is an underachiever but a team player who causes even worse matchup problems for other teams than Artest. And...if anything he doesn't shoot enough.
I doubt the Lakers would do it only because you're trading a nice guy for nut case. But defensively with Kobe and Artest & Bynum (when he gets back) they would be stifling.
Odom straight up for Artest would be my preference. Odom is an underachiever but a team player who causes even worse matchup problems for other teams than Artest. And...if anything he doesn't shoot enough.
I doubt the Lakers would do it only because you're trading a nice guy for nut case. But defensively with Kobe and Artest & Bynum (when he gets back) they would be stifling.
CruzDude
Senior Member sharing a brew with bajaden
K.Browne for RonRon! Are you nuts!! Read the LA reviews on Kwame since Bynum got hurt. He is a disaster with softer hands than a 6-month old. No Way. And how could any serious Kings fan EVER help the Fakers down south!!
No, we need to revisit who can benefit with RonRon to get into the elite 4 back east: Celts and Pistons are there now. Magic too and not sure if any of those 3 need a RonRon.
But the #4 slot back east is in the sights of the Raptors, the Cavs and maybe the Wizards. In the middle who could go either way are Nets, Atlanta, and maybe pacers but Bulls seem in a free fall.
For reference, the salaries to deal with showing this year/next year:
RonRon $7.4M/$8.4M
Bibby $13.5M/$14.5
Thomas $7.3M/$7.9M
Quincy $1.3M/$1.4M
Don't forget SAR on IR but getting $5.8M/6.2M/$6.6M
So we trade RonRon and move Salmons into his slot with Cisco as backup. With Bibby/Martin backcourt and Salmons/Mikki/Miller, who gets replaced for something back? no one who plays better role than them.
Raptors are not parting with main pieces: Bargnani, Bosh, Calderon and the pieces who could help make too little: SF Graham/$1.5M, etc.
Cavs seem more a Bibby trade for Gooden but Gooden only makes 1/2 of what Bibby makes so good old Donyell Marshall gets added at $5.5M or Eric Snow at $6.7M or other pieces we don't want or need.
Ahh, the Wizards. Too bad Arenas is hurt, they'd love to trade arenas for RonRon and Quincy I bet. There is Caron Butler who makes exactly the same as Artest or a package of Songaila/Stephenson $7.2M. Har har.
Thats why Petrie is the GM and twice Exec of the year. Only he can figure out something. Always has in the past if we swallow the CWebb/Philly deal.
Tough.
No, we need to revisit who can benefit with RonRon to get into the elite 4 back east: Celts and Pistons are there now. Magic too and not sure if any of those 3 need a RonRon.
But the #4 slot back east is in the sights of the Raptors, the Cavs and maybe the Wizards. In the middle who could go either way are Nets, Atlanta, and maybe pacers but Bulls seem in a free fall.
For reference, the salaries to deal with showing this year/next year:
RonRon $7.4M/$8.4M
Bibby $13.5M/$14.5
Thomas $7.3M/$7.9M
Quincy $1.3M/$1.4M
Don't forget SAR on IR but getting $5.8M/6.2M/$6.6M
So we trade RonRon and move Salmons into his slot with Cisco as backup. With Bibby/Martin backcourt and Salmons/Mikki/Miller, who gets replaced for something back? no one who plays better role than them.
Raptors are not parting with main pieces: Bargnani, Bosh, Calderon and the pieces who could help make too little: SF Graham/$1.5M, etc.
Cavs seem more a Bibby trade for Gooden but Gooden only makes 1/2 of what Bibby makes so good old Donyell Marshall gets added at $5.5M or Eric Snow at $6.7M or other pieces we don't want or need.
Ahh, the Wizards. Too bad Arenas is hurt, they'd love to trade arenas for RonRon and Quincy I bet. There is Caron Butler who makes exactly the same as Artest or a package of Songaila/Stephenson $7.2M. Har har.
Thats why Petrie is the GM and twice Exec of the year. Only he can figure out something. Always has in the past if we swallow the CWebb/Philly deal.
Tough.
Packt
Starter
Me, nuts? NO, Ron is nuts, which is why we're shopping him. Not only is he nuts, he's a ballhog, turnover prone, chemistry messer upper, and all around team destroyer. Kwame has brick hands and can't catch a ball but he is a real expiring contract. We also dump Kenny, a wannabe starter, chemistry killer, overpaid undersize non hustling, never warmed up to the fans, doesn't give high fives, locker room cancer. We should also get a pick back. Now who's really helping who.
I know well what LA fans think of Kwame, which is why this deal might actually be doable. We'd be swapping Thomas for Radmonovic and a 1st. Rad is cheaper on a yearly base, and is only one year longer. Plus he can run with this offense better. Would get destroyed at the four against the elites, but so would everyone else on our roster. And we get the pick, which if you believe Geoff is a great finder of dirty rocks, he could salvage the Peja and Webber deals in one swoop.
I've been against letting Ron audition for the Lakers, but these days I'm not sure what there is to be afraid of. We have John Future Salmons ready to replace him. And even if by chance the Lakers do get the advantage, so what. We have a twenty eight year young stud that will lead us to fun & exciting land.
I know well what LA fans think of Kwame, which is why this deal might actually be doable. We'd be swapping Thomas for Radmonovic and a 1st. Rad is cheaper on a yearly base, and is only one year longer. Plus he can run with this offense better. Would get destroyed at the four against the elites, but so would everyone else on our roster. And we get the pick, which if you believe Geoff is a great finder of dirty rocks, he could salvage the Peja and Webber deals in one swoop.
I've been against letting Ron audition for the Lakers, but these days I'm not sure what there is to be afraid of. We have John Future Salmons ready to replace him. And even if by chance the Lakers do get the advantage, so what. We have a twenty eight year young stud that will lead us to fun & exciting land.
allrightythen
Starter
What are the chances of Ron not getting traded before the deadline, opting out then going somewhere via a S&T in the offseason?
I ask because he claims to want to go somewhere to win a championship(of course then he says he's interested in the Knicks
) but who, with a chance to win, is going to have the cash to sign him if he does opt out and become a free agent?
I ask because he claims to want to go somewhere to win a championship(of course then he says he's interested in the Knicks
) but who, with a chance to win, is going to have the cash to sign him if he does opt out and become a free agent?
CruzDude
Senior Member sharing a brew with bajaden
Once RonRon opts out then any team has to pony up the full tab for him without unloading anything and that ADDs to that teams Salary Cap situation. RonRon makes $7.8M this year and would get $8.4M next year. He is underpaid when he plays up to his potential so that means getting $10M+ for a new deal with someone else. Don't believe any contender or top 6 or 7 team back east can handle that $$ cold turkey added to the salary rolls.
That is why a sign & trade makes sense. But that has to get done by Feb 21. If nothing happens by then, RonRon has to wait until July1 to do anything. But one thing could be a straight trade for his next year $8.4M then he becomes an expiring. Or a S&T for his new salary..........assuming others see the value in that.
I think it has to get done by trade deadline this year. Otherwise it gets messy.
On the other side of the coin, if we don't trade him and he opts out then that $8.4M comes off our salary cap (I think). Any other team would then have to pay $8.4M for that one year unless a S&T can be done.
That is why a sign & trade makes sense. But that has to get done by Feb 21. If nothing happens by then, RonRon has to wait until July1 to do anything. But one thing could be a straight trade for his next year $8.4M then he becomes an expiring. Or a S&T for his new salary..........assuming others see the value in that.
I think it has to get done by trade deadline this year. Otherwise it gets messy.
On the other side of the coin, if we don't trade him and he opts out then that $8.4M comes off our salary cap (I think). Any other team would then have to pay $8.4M for that one year unless a S&T can be done.
CruzDude
Senior Member sharing a brew with bajaden
I think Packt points up only one of the real problems in dealing with the Lakers: Kwame is NOT someone we want, ever. And Radmonovic is a Peja wannabe, a 3 point shooter period, no other game. Besides can't see the Maloof's ever dealing with the Lakers for anything. Too much bad blood.
No, it has to be a team (or teams) back east or a 3rd team east or west but not the Lakers.
No, it has to be a team (or teams) back east or a 3rd team east or west but not the Lakers.
Artest would be hard to move. You are looking at a unrestricted, unstable free agent. At best he is simply a expiring contract. So you might get a guy on a MLE sized deal that a team no longer wants. Example would be guys like Luke Walton, Vladi Radmanovic, etc..
Why would any team throw away good young talent and picks in a trade for a guy that will be a UFA in a few months? It makes no sense.
Why would any team throw away good young talent and picks in a trade for a guy that will be a UFA in a few months? It makes no sense.
And why are the Kings going to give up a good player like Ron for a player like Walton or Radmanovic? At worst Ron is an expiring contract. I would take the expiring contract over a bad player with a terrible contract such as Radman and to a lesser extent Walton.
Ron can give a team a huge boost they could need to make the playoffs or put them over the top. If you're saying he's not worth 1 single draft pick you better give me a freaking break. We're not asking for a package like the one MN got for KG. We're asking for maybe a good young player and an expiring contract, or to dump Kenny Thomas and get a late 1st round pick.
I don't see how it makes no sense. You're talking about a guy who is a top 20 player and can make a significant impact on the defensive end. The guy could put Dallas for example over the top. He could give the Suns some extra toughness they need. He could put the Lakers over the top(although I'd be mad if Petrie helped out that team because I hate them). He could put multiple Eastern Conference teams into the playoffs or Eastern Conference finals. Also, it might not matter than he's an unrestricted FA. I can't imagine a team with cap room this offseason(Philly is one of them I think) paying him if they're a rebuilding team. If he gets traded to a good team who will give him a decent contract I don't see why he'd leave. And it's not exactly as if every team has a bunch of cap space they'd be willing to use on Ron, because this offseason the majority of the teams with cap space are rebuilding teams(correct me if I'm wrong here).
Walton and Radmanovic are just examples of MLE level players nothing more.
Ron can be a huge boost but even most Kings fans know by now that he comes with baggage. The only certain about Artest is that nothing is certain.
Artest has already said he is opting out and is looking to go to a team with a shot at winning a championship. Problem is every team with a shot at the title are already over the salary cap. So they have no need to make a play for Ron and give up talent when they can simply wait till the off season and be on a equal playing field with every other championship caliber team.
With that said very few non-championship type teams are going to be ballsy enough to give up anything of value only to rent him for a few months.
Right now the safe thing for most teams is to wait till he becomes a free agent. Teams like LA, Denver, PHX, etc.. cannot afford to send a player away for him then have him out opt and leave. Leaving them with less than they had originally. Because Artest is unpredictable.
If they trade for him and they're a contender/good team, he will stay around because they'll have his bird rights. They can pay him more and they're a contender, so he's not going to leave to go to an equal team for less money. He already said he'll listen to his agent as far as contract stuff goes.
I'm kinda agreeing with you here. IF the Kings decided to move Artest, then I think getting Odom back for Ron/Thomas would be a realistic building block for a deal.
Odom is really doing NOTHING in LA. Artest overall is better, but Odom might be a better fit for the Kings cuz he can play the 4 more consistently AND rebound the ball better. It basically sheds a year off of Kenny's deal and buys us another year of having a strong chance of competing again next year. I don't think dealing are talent for mediocre 'young' pieces is all that great of an idea because it'll just dilute our talent base even further and keep us stuck in mediocrity longer.
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