So you want the Kings to get a backup center, OK who?

[SacTownKid]

Maybe Hawes & JT can handle the center position for the full year, without being injured or fouling out, but it's improbable. And, the reason for picking up a backup center isn't for long term development or to make us a playoff team, It's to keep from being blown out game after game after game. A backup center isn't going to make us a playoff team, but it sure would be nice to go to a home game with the expectation that we had a chance to win against a below 500 team.

JT was pathetic against Oden, and May wasn't any better. And, there are plenty of big Centers in the West, that make it reasonable to believe that we are going to be outsized in the front line most of the year.

There were vet centers that signed for min one year contracts this summer. Whether they would have signed with us for the same amount, I can't know. But, there were players better than Ely that were available, back when we had $7M in cap space.

Even PW said in a recent interview that the team needs height.

In the highlights I saw, it seemed like Kenny Thomas and Sean May shared most of the duties guarding Oden when he was in.

 

[LPKingsFan]

Westphal himself said we need more tall guys. Are we willing to take on a bad contract? I'm sure the Bobcats would be willing to lose one of Diop or Nazr... would they take Beno or Noce back?

 

[Telemachus]

And, there are plenty of big Centers in the West, that make it reasonable to believe that we are going to be outsized in the front line most of the year.

Who are these big centers that you speak of? Yao and Duncan are the only other big centers that I can think of, and Yao will be out most of the season. I know some would try to include Bynum, but he plays small and soft IMO. So who else is there?

 

[HighTopKicks]

Who are these big centers that you speak of? Yao and Duncan are the only other big centers that I can think of, and Yao will be out most of the season. I know some would try to include Bynum, but he plays small and soft IMO. So who else is there?

Just look at the Official 2009 Free Agent Tracking Thread (merged). There were several that signed 1 yr deals.
Rasho Nesterovic (IND) (TOR -- 1yr $1.9mil)
Francisco Oberto (ATL) (WSH -- 1yr $1.99mil)
Glen Davis (BOS) (R) (DAL -- 2yrs $6.8mil)

We had the money, we could have tried to sign Gortat.
You don't really believe that Ely was the best player available?

 

[Telemachus]

Just look at the Official 2009 Free Agent Tracking Thread (merged). There were several that signed 1 yr deals.
Rasho Nesterovic (IND) (TOR -- 1yr $1.9mil)
Francisco Oberto (ATL) (WSH -- 1yr $1.99mil)
Glen Davis (BOS) (R) (DAL -- 2yrs $6.8mil)

We had the money, we could have tried to sign Gortat.
You don't really believe that Ely was the best player available?

First, I was referring to the statement that there were a lot of big centers in the Western Conference (I don't see it). Don't really care about the 3 players you just listed. Rasho is on the downside of his career, and has also basically been a solid backup center (nothing special). He barely even rebounds or blocks shots anymore. I don't see him added much more that Ely (who I don't expect a lot out of). Oberto has done nothing in his career but show a few glimmers now and then. He also happens to be a foul waiting to happen. Davis is a nice player, but the Kings already have several undersided PFs. Why would they want another one?

 

[bajaden]

Just look at the Official 2009 Free Agent Tracking Thread (merged). There were several that signed 1 yr deals.
Rasho Nesterovic (IND) (TOR -- 1yr $1.9mil)
Francisco Oberto (ATL) (WSH -- 1yr $1.99mil)
Glen Davis (BOS) (R) (DAL -- 2yrs $6.8mil)

We had the money, we could have tried to sign Gortat.
You don't really believe that Ely was the best player available?

Well Davis isn't a center. He's another undersized PF. A big undersized PF, but undersized non the less. Rasho is way past his prime, and would be nothing more than another Ely, just more marquis. I'm not a big fan of Oberto, besides there ought to be a rule about how many spanish players you can have on your team. Just kidding folks, just kidding..

Now I found Gortat inticing. However he signed a five year deal for over 30 plus million dollars. I believe he makes something like 5.8 mil his first year, so I'm not sure the Kings could have matched the deal, and even if they could. Let me see? Do I sign with the Kings that won 17 games, or do I sign with the Magic who were in the NBA finals? Hmmm! Let me think about that one for a while. Tough choice.. Anyway, just because someone you like is out there doesn't mean he wants to come here for what we can afford right now. And I'm not sure the Kings are in a position to blow that kind of money on someone who, maybe looks promising, but is still essentially unproven.

 

[PacMan]

I would have like to see them bringing in Patrick O'bryant or Robert Swift. They're both scrubs like Ely, but at least they're TALL scrub.

 

[bajaden]

I would have like to see them bringing in Patrick O'bryant or Robert Swift. They're both scrubs like Ely, but at least they're TALL scrub.

I would agree for one more reason. Their both young. If your going to hire a backup for one year, why not at least give a shot to a young one and see if there's anything there. Besides, the price would be cheaper based on years of service.

 

[King Baller]

I guess we all took Scot Pollard for granted while he was here.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scot_Pollard
I remember how well he defended Karl Malone! Scot was tough on the boards too!

KB

 

[HighTopKicks]

First, I was referring to the statement that there were a lot of big centers in the Western Conference (I don't see it). Don't really care about the 3 players you just listed. Rasho is on the downside of his career, and has also basically been a solid backup center (nothing special). He barely even rebounds or blocks shots anymore. I don't see him added much more that Ely (who I don't expect a lot out of). Oberto has done nothing in his career but show a few glimmers now and then. He also happens to be a foul waiting to happen. Davis is a nice player, but the Kings already have several undersided PFs. Why would they want another one?

Just because you don't like them doesn't mean that they couldn't have helped the team. Some other teams, teams that were more successful then the Kings, thought that they were worth a contract.

I for one would rather have any of them, then to have nothing at all. And, the Kings are one misstep away from having no center at all.

 

[rainmaker]

Well Davis isn't a center. He's another undersized PF. A big undersized PF, but undersized non the less. Rasho is way past his prime, and would be nothing more than another Ely, just more marquis. I'm not a big fan of Oberto, besides there ought to be a rule about how many spanish players you can have on your team. Just kidding folks, just kidding..

Now I found Gortat inticing. However he signed a five year deal for over 30 plus million dollars. I believe he makes something like 5.8 mil his first year, so I'm not sure the Kings could have matched the deal, and even if they could. Let me see? Do I sign with the Kings that won 17 games, or do I sign with the Magic who were in the NBA finals? Hmmm! Let me think about that one for a while. Tough choice.. Anyway, just because someone you like is out there doesn't mean he wants to come here for what we can afford right now. And I'm not sure the Kings are in a position to blow that kind of money on someone who, maybe looks promising, but is still essentially unproven.

Gortat was one of my first options this offseason for adding depth to our frontline. Personally, I think he would be a great fit, but 6M per yr is a little much.

There have been rumors that orlando might move him near the trade deadline. I would seriously consider trading some of our older vets for a younger Gortat despite the price tag. He would be more than servicable as the first big off the bench for the next 5 yrs, and as long as we swap some of our vets contracts for his, I think it would be a good option.

 

[fnordius]

Who are these big centers that you speak of? Yao and Duncan are the only other big centers that I can think of, and Yao will be out most of the season. I know some would try to include Bynum, but he plays small and soft IMO. So who else is there?

One might argue that any of these guys were big, relative to our 6'7" backups:
Oden, Amare, Kaman, M. Gasol, Chandler, Dampier, Al Jefferson, Nene. Add them to the 3 already named, and you have every starting C in the WC except for Okur and Biedrins... and we usually have problems with them, too.

 

[Bricklayer]

One might argue that any of these guys were big, relative to our 6'7" backups:
Oden, Amare, Kaman, M. Gasol, Chandler, Dampier, Al Jefferson, Nene. Add them to the 3 already named, and you have every starting C in the WC except for Okur and Biedrins... and we usually have problems with them, too.

They swapped Chandler for Okafor, but yeah. Only a few behemoths, but a whole bunch of strong physical guys who like to bang inside. Hawes can NOT be a weenie any longer. I don't want to hear about him being "lanky". Lots of guys are "lanky", and a lot of them a lot more lanky than Hawes. The problem isn't his build, its his toughness. Its a major factor holding him back. He's got a great skill package, but must have sensitive man breasts or something.

 

[SacTownKid]

Saw Alade Aminu was waived by Miami, I wouldn't mind the Kings checking him out.

 

[Telemachus]

Just because you don't like them doesn't mean that they couldn't have helped the team. Some other teams, teams that were more successful then the Kings, thought that they were worth a contract.

I for one would rather have any of them, then to have nothing at all. And, the Kings are one misstep away from having no center at all.

I'm sorry, but Rasho and Oberto don't bring much (if anything) more to the table than Ely Does (which is a player for emergency use only). As for Davis, how would he make the Kings better? Would he be more productive for the Kings than either May or Brockman? And I might add, being paid way more than both of them put together. I personally don't think so. Everyone would be blaming Petrie next off season for having paid so much to Davis and not having any cap space to go after FAs.

I still am waiting to hear who all these "bigs" in the Western Conference are BTW.

 

[Telemachus]

One might argue that any of these guys were big, relative to our 6'7" backups:
Oden, Amare, Kaman, M. Gasol, Chandler, Dampier, Al Jefferson, Nene. Add them to the 3 already named, and you have every starting C in the WC except for Okur and Biedrins... and we usually have problems with them, too.

I had given Oden, Duncan, and Yao (who will be out for the season). As for the rest, I don't see it. Amare, Jefferson, and Nene are all PFs playing center. Dampier was a joke in his prime and has passed it IMO. Gasol is still an unknown. I like Kaman, but he is injury prone and doesn't play like he is a 7-footer (never looks as big as he is). Biedrins, Bynum and Okur are all soft players like Hawes. Okafor (was traded for Chandler) is a center in a PFs body.

The truth of the matter is that there just aren't that many good centers in the NBA right now. The league is full of teams playing PFs in the pivot for lack of a better option.

 

[fnordius]

The truth of the matter is that there just aren't that many good centers in the NBA right now. The league is full of teams playing PFs in the pivot for lack of a better option.

Out of position or not, the Cavemans and Al Jeffersons of the conference can and will:
1) Bang Hawes around
2) Embarrass Ely, and
3) Shoot over Brockman without fear of being blocked

 

[bajaden]

Out of position or not, the Cavemans and Al Jeffersons of the conference can and will:
1) Bang Hawes around
2) Embarrass Ely, and
3) Shoot over Brockman without fear of being blocked

I thought the premise was about a backup center. Not about how Hawes may or may not be able to deal with the other bigs around the league. Thats a seperate issue. So the question is, who do you want them to sign? Or trade for? The three you suggested didn't blow my socks off, and the only one with age on his side ( Davis ) would have cost too much and is not a center. Add to that, the biggest knock on Davis by his own coach is his defense.

No one is suggesting that we don't need a good backup center. The question is who and how? Arguing over and about what our deficiencies are at that position doesn't fill that need. There are a couple of guys left on the table, like Swift, but other than that, the cubboard is bare. So who would you trade and for who?

 

[HighFlyingMonkey]

Memphis should be the partner we look to deal with. They now have Gasol, Thabeet and Haddadi logjammed at Center. I'm sure Haddadi is available for a second rounder or so.

 

[bajaden]

Memphis should be the partner we look to deal with. They now have Gasol, Thabeet and Haddadi logjammed at Center. I'm sure Haddadi is available for a second rounder or so.

Interesting idea. And one that had crossed my mind. He's young so he fits that bill. I hesitated to bring him up because of his and Casspi's political backgrounds. I know we don't talk politic's here, and thats not my intent. But in lieu of where both players come from, I'm not sure both could exsist on the same team.

By no means am I suggesting that they couldn't get along. I don't know either personally and don't know Passionate either is on their national heritage. Who knows? It could be the first step toward building a bridge.

 

[Arby's Roast Beef]

^^^
Haddadi's a very good option for us, better than Sean Williams which I mentioned below--young, super tall, appears to be a rebounding machine, blocks shots, and is a foul magnet--pretty much all the traits you want in your bigs. I think there's sort of a Marcin Gortat-like masking of how good he is because of how few minutes he plays, and as you mentioned given the Grizz's big men abundance he could potentially be available. Would be a good player to trade for while his value's still low.

 

[fnordius]

I had thought we'd probably pick up someone like Taj Gibson as a backup big in the draft. The FA opportunities are over, so a trade would seem to be the only option left. But who?

I'm okay with the Haddadi idea, but... for who? Rodriguez? No. Mason + Greene? The Grizz are below cap, but only by like $1.4M, and we're not below cap, so we're limited to a pretty normal trade. I have a hard time figuring out what I'm willing to gamble on a guy who has a total of 120 minutes of NBA PT.

I guess I'd do Mason + May, if Memphis were willing, but I can't imagine Geoff doing that. I think his mandate for this year is to win as many games as possible without costing anything, and Haddadi is just the sort of project I don't think would get him excited.

I'm expecting a season of small ball and awkward rotations.

 

[HighFlyingMonkey]

I had thought we'd probably pick up someone like Taj Gibson as a backup big in the draft. The FA opportunities are over, so a trade would seem to be the only option left. But who?

I'm okay with the Haddadi idea, but... for who? Rodriguez? No. Mason + Greene? The Grizz are below cap, but only by like $1.4M, and we're not below cap, so we're limited to a pretty normal trade. I have a hard time figuring out what I'm willing to gamble on a guy who has a total of 120 minutes of NBA PT.

I guess I'd do Mason + May, if Memphis were willing, but I can't imagine Geoff doing that. I think his mandate for this year is to win as many games as possible without costing anything, and Haddadi is just the sort of project I don't think would get him excited.

I'm expecting a season of small ball and awkward rotations.

How are we not below the cap? Shamsports has our salary at 52M, the cap is set at 58M. I'm not a capologist, is there something I'm missing?

We could do a May + Future 2nd for Haddadi and just absorb the rest of his salary.

 

[bajaden]

I had thought we'd probably pick up someone like Taj Gibson as a backup big in the draft. The FA opportunities are over, so a trade would seem to be the only option left. But who?

I'm okay with the Haddadi idea, but... for who? Rodriguez? No. Mason + Greene? The Grizz are below cap, but only by like $1.4M, and we're not below cap, so we're limited to a pretty normal trade. I have a hard time figuring out what I'm willing to gamble on a guy who has a total of 120 minutes of NBA PT.

I guess I'd do Mason + May, if Memphis were willing, but I can't imagine Geoff doing that. I think his mandate for this year is to win as many games as possible without costing anything, and Haddadi is just the sort of project I don't think would get him excited.

I'm expecting a season of small ball and awkward rotations.

Mason's contract isn't yet guaranteed, so I doubt it can be traded. The current salary cap is set at $57,700,000.00. The Kings total salaries at the moment is $54,839,558.00. A difference of $2,860,442.00. Haddadi is scheduled to make $1,697,999.00. So it would be possible to trade a 2nd round pick and just absorb his salary. Or, we could trade Greene who is scheduled to make $1,004,000.00, and just absorb the rest. The second option would free up time at the SF position and fill the need for a backup without taking on much more salary. It would also give Greene a fresh start..

 

[fnordius]

The cap is $57.7M. I took our being a hair over cap from one of the first matches that came up on Google when I looked. Obviously, most such figures are wrong, even the two of you posting above on what our payroll is were $2.84M apart, and both numbers can't be right.

If we are, in fact, enough below cap to pull off a trade for Haddadi, I'd be up for anything which seemed likely to improve the team in the long haul. Second rounder? Absolutely, if Memphis were game.

 

[bajaden]

The cap is $57.7M. I took our being a hair over cap from one of the first matches that came up on Google when I looked. Obviously, most such figures are wrong, even the two of you posting above on what our payroll is were $2.84M apart, and both numbers can't be right.

If we are, in fact, enough below cap to pull off a trade for Haddadi, I'd be up for anything which seemed likely to improve the team in the long haul. Second rounder? Absolutely, if Memphis were game.

I got my cap figure from NBA.com. I got total salaries for the Kings from three different sites, and all three had the exact same figures. So I'm pretty confident that were under the cap by over a couple of mil.

 

[fnordius]

Just for fun, here's the first half dozen I find on Google, using either "Sacramento Kings payroll" or "Sacramento Kings salaries"

1. $61,248,785 http://hoopshype.com/salaries/sacramento.htm
2. $58M ("estimate") http://www.nbadraft.net/2008_stateofthecap_kings.html
3. $54,839,558 http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=9170
4. $54,619,540 http://www.sportscity.com/NBA/Sacramento-Kings-Salaries
5. $52,378,963 (but lists $0 for Brockman) http://www.shamsports.com/content/pages/data/salaries/kings.jsp
6. $50,583,286 (again, $0 for Brockman) http://aroyalpain.com/2009/06/28/2009-2010-kings-salaries/

So if one says $56M, + or - $6M, you're safe...

 

[HighTopKicks]

I got my cap figure from NBA.com. I got total salaries for the Kings from three different sites, and all three had the exact same figures. So I'm pretty confident that were under the cap by over a couple of mil.

The Sac Bee had that Kings salary slide show and the total was about $51.8M including Mason but without MM's $2M. ShamSports is in line with the Bee, but Hoopworld & Hopehype have Martin making $1M more. So, I'm of the opinion that the team salary is in the $54M or less range with Mason but without Ely. (14players)

 

[fnordius]

The Sac Bee had that Kings salary slide show and the total was about $51.8M including Mason but without MM's $2M. ShamSports is in line with the Bee, but Hoopworld & Hopehype have Martin making $1M more. So, I'm of the opinion that the team salary is in the $54M or less range with Mason but without Ely. (14players)

Here, for everyone's edification, is the Bee slideshow figures, without the annoying slideshow and text, heavily annotated.

http://www.sacbee.com/1098/story/2198929.html
Slide Show: Sacramento Kings players' salaries

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Buzz up!

By Sam Amick and Phillip Reese
samick@sacbee.com
Published: Monday, Sep. 21, 2009 - 3:51 pm
Last Modified: Friday, Sep. 25, 2009 - 2:27 pm
While Kings player salaries can be found at various Internet sites, there is widespread misinformation regarding the exact figures. Through extensive research, The Bee has finalized -- and ranked -- the down-to-the-dollar reality of the team's payroll. Check back periodically for updates and improvements.

Click the photo to see the salaries ...

------------------------------------
Brockman $457,488
Greene 870,000
May 884,881
Casspi 972,500 ("$1,167,000 with likely-to-be-earned bonuses")
Mason 1,180,000 (non-guaranteed)
Rodriguez 1,567,676 ("$1,576,696 with likely-to-be-earned bonuses")
Thompson 2,035,920
Hawes 2,232,800
Evans 3,610,080
Garcia 5,800,000
Udrih 6,031,800
Nocioni 7,500,000
Thomas 8,775,000
Martin 9,680,170

Totals
51,598,315 without bonuses
51,801,835 with likely bonuses

Ely (if we keep him) is left out, as noted.

Add in Mikki's $2M for not burdening our roster and you get a likely figure (if the Bee is correct about the rest) of $53,801,835, plus anything we pay Ely. According to ESPN, vet's minimum, with 7 years experience, is $825,497 this year, so Ely would put us at a probable $54,627,332.

 

[whozit]

How are we not below the cap? Shamsports has our salary at 52M, the cap is set at 58M. I'm not a capologist, is there something I'm missing?

We could do a May + Future 2nd for Haddadi and just absorb the rest of his salary.

On the Shamsports web page there is a little section on cap holds. According to that web page the Kings still have several cap holds that take them over the salary cap. It is sort of interesting who is listed under the Kings. The Kings have the option of waiving all of them to get under the cap, but according to the explanation given there, these cap holds do have potential benefits.