Sacramento Free Agency <crickets chirping>

[mac]

This is where I wish there was such a thing as a sarcasm font. Not sure if you really mean "poor Hassan" or are being facetious. I'm all for continuing to develop Whiteside, but the Kings really lack enough NBA-caliber talent. Scola certainly isn't exactly what the Kings need, but you could argue that he's a top-10 talent at either center or power forward. Barring something that hasn't become public, I think the Rockets are nuts.

That being said, two questions:

1) What is the rule for picking up an amnesty (ied) player? Does he go to the high bidder regardless? In other words, Scola might prefer to go to a contender but he'd have to report to the Kings?

2) If the Kings had Cousins, Scola and Thompson (yes, and Whiteside), would they have to consider trading T-Rob at some point to fill the need at small forward? Not saying that's what they ought to do -- I was as happy as anyone when he fell to them -- but if they're suddenly flush at 4-5 and can parlay Robinson into a good small forward, isn't that a legitimate strategy for getting where they want to be?

Funnily enough I didn't actualy mean it to be sarcastic. My point is that Hassan Whiteside potentially fills a very big need for us, and can become a good rotational role player. But if we keep piling on bigs that neither allow him to have actual playing time or provide a mentor for him to learn from in order to become the player we want him to be. So Scola teaches Whiteside how to do a good up and under post move, brava we end up with yet another offensive big and still no defensive big.

In other words - if you add Scola and actually intend to give him playing time you might as well tell Hassan to stay home till we clear our frontcourt.

 

[thedofd]

No, because where as Scola is a known commodity, Robinson was nearly the consensus number two pick in one of the "deepest" drafts in years. To get rid of a younger player with all the physical tools to become a major player for the team down the line because you claimed another team's European smallish PF isn't going to go down as one of the better moves in the NBA. Unless you're getting back a major star in return (see Favors/D-Will trade), the general rule is that you don't trade a top five pick in their first year. So unless you're sending TRob away in a trade that nets us Lebron or KD, no.

I take your point, but most of the analysis I read regarding this draft was that Robinson was the No. 2 (or five) guy in a draft where there was one superstar and a lot of good players. I have no doubt that Robinson will be a good player. A star? Perhaps, but it's no lock. Clearly you'd like to get a "major star" if you traded him, but good luck. But maybe you'd settle for a solid starter and a first-round pick. I mean, would the Kings be better off with TRob in the mix of bigs next year or with, for example, Wilson Chandler as their starting small forward and an extra draft pick in the bank? I don't even know that that trade is doable. But if you're Geoff Petrie, you know that ownership isn't going to shell out for free agents. So you build your team piece by piece either by drafting good players or making trades for them. Again, I'm not advocating shipping off TRob for the first offer that comes along. But picking up Scola would potentially allow the Kings to deal from a position of strength to fill other glaring needs -- a starting caliber small forward, another point guard, etc. It's just something to think about.

 

[thedofd]

Funnily enough I didn't actualy mean it to be sarcastic. My point is that Hassan Whiteside potentially fills a very big need for us, and can become a good rotational role player. But if we keep piling on bigs that neither allow him to have actual playing time or provide a mentor for him to learn from in order to become the player we want him to be. So Scola teaches Whiteside how to do a good up and under post move, brava we end up with yet another offensive big and still no defensive big.

In other words - if you add Scola and actually intend to give him playing time you might as well tell Hassan to stay home till we clear our frontcourt.

Hassan may have the potential to become a poor man's Dikembe Mutombo. I think that's his upside. Nothing wrong with that, and as I said, I'd like to see him get the chance to develop. That being said, there's a Hassan Whiteside-type guy in every draft, so his potential wouldn't prevent me from going after a well-established player.

 

[Section 101]

Poor Hassan. No minutes for him this year then.

Ideally they would trade Hayes.

It takes assets to trade for players whether its draft picks or players. If you can get a valued asset cheap you dont pass it up because of someone on the team now.

 

[Bricklayer]

You get him on the cheap, play him this year and he becomes a great asset next year.

No, he just messes things up. He's like the worst fit next to Cousins you could find. He plays the same position as our lottery pick this year. He woudl basically guarantee Whiteside was a wasted pick too. He just doesn't fit. And after a year of platooning wiht us where everybody up fornt gets hurt, and Scoal has averaged 12pts 5rebs, he's all of a sudden not such a great asset either.

We just don't have time to fool around with that kind of thing.

 

[thedofd]

We just don't have time to fool around with that kind of thing.

How so? Do you see the Kings as a playoff team as currently constructed? If not, why not acquire assets and try to make a significant move?

 

[Bricklayer]

How so? Do you see the Kings as a playoff team as currently constructed? If not, why not acquire assets and try to make a significant move?

I see the Kings team as a franchise already two years past when it should have started turning the corner, with stacks of some of the best young talent in the game threatening to rot on the vine. People all summer long have been spazzing out and arguing for basically random moves to just once again ruin any chance we have of a cohesive, sensible team structure. And we just cannot afford anymore of that. You want the team to improve? Then it has to make sense. Team building is an art too. You can mess up a team that should be winning otherwise as easily as you can build a winner. Especially if you are talking about a young team. Scola just doesn't fit, and directly interferes with numerous goals (Boogie getting his shots, JT earning his money, TRob developing into a starter, Whiteside proving he's got a role going forward, defensive improvement, rebounding improvement). After his significant slide last year it would be like deciding to go sign Carl Landry again. Not for us.

 

[mac]

No, he just messes things up. He's like the worst fit next to Cousins you could find. He plays the same position as our lottery pick this year. He woudl basically guarantee Whiteside was a wasted pick too. He just doesn't fit. And after a year of platooning wiht us where everybody up fornt gets hurt, and Scoal has averaged 12pts 5rebs, he's all of a sudden not such a great asset either.

We just don't have time to fool around with that kind of thing.

Exactly. I think Section's point about using him as a trade asset does make sense, but the problem is that we really don't have the minutes available to play him, considering our offseason acquisitions so far have been 2 PFs. You would be burying both Hayes and Whiteside, who coincidentally are our 2 defensive bigs.

If this were some fantasy league or game I'd pick up Scola in a heartbeat, stick him at the end of my bench and pretend that I never acquired him. When necessary I'd have a good player to help me win a few more games, and then when the time came I would trade him for other assets. But it doesn't work that way - you pick up a guy like Scola you just have to play him. There are no attitude issues or anything that can give you an excuse to give him no minutes.

 

[mac]

Hassan may have the potential to become a poor man's Dikembe Mutombo. I think that's his upside. Nothing wrong with that, and as I said, I'd like to see him get the chance to develop. That being said, there's a Hassan Whiteside-type guy in every draft, so his potential wouldn't prevent me from going after a well-established player.

Yes, and unless you give these players the time to develop you're not going to ever get your poor man's Mutombo. I certainly hope that we aren't in a position where we can draft a prolific defensive big who can just step in and contribute, because that would mean that despire acquiring your well-established player we still suck. And why would you want to waste a year you could have spent developing a guy you think can fill a need, only to go and look to fill that need with a similar player you need to develop a year or two from now?

And this isn't about having a great shotblocker or anything like that. It's about having a defensive big - be it of the Chuck Hayes or Serge Ibaka variety. I don't know how good a defender Thomas Robinson is going to be, but I do know that his strengths are likely to be more on the offensive end than the defensive one. That fact is already established for Cuz and JT. Now go all you want into the need for shotblocking and team defense and what not, but I'm pretty damn sure that you need to have at least one very good defensive big man if you want to have a good defensive team.

I see it as just one of those very unfortunate cases where we have to pass on a very good deal due to fit and team chemistry. As it is there won't be enough minutes for Scola with Cuz/JT/Robinson around. Then we still have Hayes and Whiteside who you'd have to give essentially zero playing time to. That's a huge waste of last year's main offseason acquisition. Could you at least try to salvage things by trading Hayes? Yes, but if there was deal worth doing I think we would have traded Hayes by now (after having added Robinson and re-signed JT). Then again, maybe Hayes is going to be traded!

 

[steelevt]

Yes, and unless you give these players the time to develop you're not going to ever get your poor man's Mutombo. I certainly hope that we aren't in a position where we can draft a prolific defensive big who can just step in and contribute, because that would mean that despire acquiring your well-established player we still suck. And why would you want to waste a year you could have spent developing a guy you think can fill a need, only to go and look to fill that need with a similar player you need to develop a year or two from now?

And this isn't about having a great shotblocker or anything like that. It's about having a defensive big - be it of the Chuck Hayes or Serge Ibaka variety. I don't know how good a defender Thomas Robinson is going to be, but I do know that his strengths are likely to be more on the offensive end than the defensive one. That fact is already established for Cuz and JT. Now go all you want into the need for shotblocking and team defense and what not, but I'm pretty damn sure that you need to have at least one very good defensive big man if you want to have a good defensive team.

I see it as just one of those very unfortunate cases where we have to pass on a very good deal due to fit and team chemistry. As it is there won't be enough minutes for Scola with Cuz/JT/Robinson around. Then we still have Hayes and Whiteside who you'd have to give essentially zero playing time to. That's a huge waste of last year's main offseason acquisition. Could you at least try to salvage things by trading Hayes? Yes, but if there was deal worth doing I think we would have traded Hayes by now (after having added Robinson and re-signed JT). Then again, maybe Hayes is going to be traded!

this line of thinking is understandable, but the only problem is we are a bad team. i mean a really bad team. so it might be worth the risk to take a player that is definitely better than JT and see how it works out. one problem with kings fans is that we wear these rose colored glasses that make us think hassan whiteside will become this great player when no one else in the league thinks so. he's not one of these players that they keep an eye on incase he blows up. he's been in the league a few years now and still is riding the bench. would it be great if he had a break out year? of course, but if he cant beat scola/JT/hayes, he isnt the savior we are hoping for. speaking of JT, this is the player some members didnt want to trade for amare if i remember correctly because of his upside. part of the argument was because amare's knees werent insurable but in the end, i would think amare is better than JT. we seem to pick out all the flaws of players who arent on our team, yet dont want to give up our own inferior players due to unattainable potential that we wish they players would reach. seriously, i can understand the argument that scola might not work with cuz, but how much worse can we be that 5th worst team in the league. and if you are worried about the development of hassan, if he cant show in practice that he will outwork/outplay hayes or scola, than maybe he isnt the next mutombo/ibaka

 

[thedofd]

I see the Kings team as a franchise already two years past when it should have started turning the corner, with stacks of some of the best young talent in the game threatening to rot on the vine. People all summer long have been spazzing out and arguing for basically random moves to just once again ruin any chance we have of a cohesive, sensible team structure. And we just cannot afford anymore of that. You want the team to improve? Then it has to make sense. Team building is an art too. You can mess up a team that should be winning otherwise as easily as you can build a winner. Especially if you are talking about a young team. Scola just doesn't fit, and directly interferes with numerous goals (Boogie getting his shots, JT earning his money, TRob developing into a starter, Whiteside proving he's got a role going forward, defensive improvement, rebounding improvement). After his significant slide last year it would be like deciding to go sign Carl Landry again. Not for us.

I guess I'm not seeing the "stacks" of young talent. Cousins is a great piece and Evans could be if he improves his jumper and settles on a position. Thornton is a nice player, but I don't see him as being exceptional. I like TRob and think the Kings got a steal there, but the consensus among NBA talent evaluators was that he's not a franchise guy. Isaiah was a nice find, but I think most teams we see him as a pace-changer rather than a fulltime starter. JT is a role player, and Fredette may be some day.

But the small forward position is a fustercluck, there's no backup point guard, and there's a dearth of real NBA-quality depth. Thanks to ownership, no free agent help is forthcoming. If you're not willing, at some point, to fill a genuine need by trading one of your valuable young pieces, the only way to improve is through the draft.

My idea of building a quality team, short of acquiring a superstar or two, is to get legit starters at every position -- preferably with a couple of guys who have the potential to make an All-Star team or three at some point -- and have a bench with at least three multi-position guys (5-4, 4-3, 3-2, 2-1). Then you mix in a couple of guys with specific skills, such as shot-blocking or three-point shooting. The Kings are on their way, but lack a legitimate starting small forward and, one might argue, a fulltime starting point guard.

In my view, Scola is a legitimate player -- an insurance policy against injuries or Cousins going off the deep end or TRob having a rough rookie year. Maybe he becomes an integral part of the team, maybe he's a future trade chip to help get the SF or PG. But he has value, which is more than you can say about a third of the Kings' roster or most players they're likely to have a crack at in their current situation.

 

[mac]

this line of thinking is understandable, but the only problem is we are a bad team. i mean a really bad team. so it might be worth the risk to take a player that is definitely better than JT and see how it works out. one problem with kings fans is that we wear these rose colored glasses that make us think hassan whiteside will become this great player when no one else in the league thinks so. he's not one of these players that they keep an eye on incase he blows up. he's been in the league a few years now and still is riding the bench. would it be great if he had a break out year? of course, but if he cant beat scola/JT/hayes, he isnt the savior we are hoping for. speaking of JT, this is the player some members didnt want to trade for amare if i remember correctly because of his upside. part of the argument was because amare's knees werent insurable but in the end, i would think amare is better than JT. we seem to pick out all the flaws of players who arent on our team, yet dont want to give up our own inferior players due to unattainable potential that we wish they players would reach. seriously, i can understand the argument that scola might not work with cuz, but how much worse can we be that 5th worst team in the league. and if you are worried about the development of hassan, if he cant show in practice that he will outwork/outplay hayes or scola, than maybe he isnt the next mutombo/ibaka

I'm not looking for a savior here - I'm looking for players that can fill the needs that I have on the team. Scola does not do that while Whiteside does. If you asked me straight up who I'd rather have - Scola, developed Whiteside or JT, my answer would quite easily be Scola. But if you changed the question and asked, who would I rather add to my existing frontcourt of Cousins and TRob, it would be JT/ a developed Whiteside. A team that has Shaq and Blake Griffin will not get great improvement by adding Amare Stoudemire. Why? Because there are only so many shots to go around, and if you want Amare to get his points then Griffin or Shaq will have to get less. They also wont benefit from having the defensive attention spread out, because all the attention remains in the paint.

Whiteside was brought in as a raw project. You can't possibly expect him to develop if he doesn't get actual minutes on the floor. It doesn't matter how hard he works in practice if he goes into an actual game and seems clueless - and the only way that he can stop being clueless is by continuing to get proper game experience. You're also forgetting that his progress has been impeded by injury, which is why he hadn't been getting playing time till late last season.

Now if you're looking to have Scola replace JT then it's a different story. You say that we tend to focus on other players' flaws but not our own. While I don't disagree, there's a flip side to that argument, which in this instance is you don't know how good Scola would be when paired with Cousins, whereas you do in the case of JT. There have been countless examples of pair-ups that look formidable on paper, but end up with one player having a very sub-par season and later being traded away.

I'm not looking at arguing against trading away JT though. My main argument is that we should stop doing all we can to stop Hassan Whiteside's development, because he will help us far more than Scola can if he develops into a good defensive big. And for him to develop, he needs to get playing time, plain and simple.

 

[bajaden]

I'm not looking for a savior here - I'm looking for players that can fill the needs that I have on the team. Scola does not do that while Whiteside does. If you asked me straight up who I'd rather have - Scola, developed Whiteside or JT, my answer would quite easily be Scola. But if you changed the question and asked, who would I rather add to my existing frontcourt of Cousins and TRob, it would be JT/ a developed Whiteside. A team that has Shaq and Blake Griffin will not get great improvement by adding Amare Stoudemire. Why? Because there are only so many shots to go around, and if you want Amare to get his points then Griffin or Shaq will have to get less. They also wont benefit from having the defensive attention spread out, because all the attention remains in the paint.

Whiteside was brought in as a raw project. You can't possibly expect him to develop if he doesn't get actual minutes on the floor. It doesn't matter how hard he works in practice if he goes into an actual game and seems clueless - and the only way that he can stop being clueless is by continuing to get proper game experience. You're also forgetting that his progress has been impeded by injury, which is why he hadn't been getting playing time till late last season.

Now if you're looking to have Scola replace JT then it's a different story. You say that we tend to focus on other players' flaws but not our own. While I don't disagree, there's a flip side to that argument, which in this instance is you don't know how good Scola would be when paired with Cousins, whereas you do in the case of JT. There have been countless examples of pair-ups that look formidable on paper, but end up with one player having a very sub-par season and later being traded away.

I'm not looking at arguing against trading away JT though. My main argument is that we should stop doing all we can to stop Hassan Whiteside's development, because he will help us far more than Scola can if he develops into a good defensive big. And for him to develop, he needs to get playing time, plain and simple.

I'm going to agree with you one this one. I've always like Scola. He's tough, and effecient. But I just don't think he's the right fit here. He's 32 years old, and I remember reading something somewhere that his knee's were giving him problems. But that aside, I still don't think he's the right guy for our team. As for trading JT! Thats not going to happen. For one thing, I don't think he can be traded till Dec, but even if he could, does anyone really think the Kings are going to trade JT after just resigning him. If were going go after someone that got amnestied, then go after Haywood. At least he can block shots.

 

[bajaden]

this line of thinking is understandable, but the only problem is we are a bad team. i mean a really bad team. so it might be worth the risk to take a player that is definitely better than JT and see how it works out. one problem with kings fans is that we wear these rose colored glasses that make us think hassan whiteside will become this great player when no one else in the league thinks so. he's not one of these players that they keep an eye on incase he blows up. he's been in the league a few years now and still is riding the bench. would it be great if he had a break out year? of course, but if he cant beat scola/JT/hayes, he isnt the savior we are hoping for. speaking of JT, this is the player some members didnt want to trade for amare if i remember correctly because of his upside. part of the argument was because amare's knees werent insurable but in the end, i would think amare is better than JT. we seem to pick out all the flaws of players who arent on our team, yet dont want to give up our own inferior players due to unattainable potential that we wish they players would reach. seriously, i can understand the argument that scola might not work with cuz, but how much worse can we be that 5th worst team in the league. and if you are worried about the development of hassan, if he cant show in practice that he will outwork/outplay hayes or scola, than maybe he isnt the next mutombo/ibaka

Whiteside has played in the league 2 years, and I use the word Played, loosely. The only way he saw the inside of ARCO his first year was in a suit behind the bench. He had a short stint in the D-League, and then they discovered he had an injury, which for the most part ended his non season. Last year, he only got into games during garbage time until the end of the season when Smart started giving him more time. He actually looked pretty good in a couple of those games, and unfortunately, he sprained his ankle and once again, his season ended.

Now if you want to say he's raw, no argument. The Kings knew he was raw when they drafted him. But to say he's been in the league for a few years, implying that he's already had his shot at proving himself, is an exaggeration to say the least. Some of his problems are his fault, and some are just fate. But regardless of the cause, he's still someone with one great, unteachable talent (shotblocking), and someone thats worth going the extra mile for, to see if he can bring the rest of his game up to the NBA level.

 

[ParniValjak]

Whiteside has played in the league 2 years, and I use the word Played, loosely. The only way he saw the inside of ARCO his first year was in a suit behind the bench. He had a short stint in the D-League, and then they discovered he had an injury, which for the most part ended his non season. Last year, he only got into games during garbage time until the end of the season when Smart started giving him more time. He actually looked pretty good in a couple of those games, and unfortunately, he sprained his ankle and once again, his season ended.

Now if you want to say he's raw, no argument. The Kings knew he was raw when they drafted him. But to say he's been in the league for a few years, implying that he's already had his shot at proving himself, is an exaggeration to say the least. Some of his problems are his fault, and some are just fate. But regardless of the cause, he's still someone with one great, unteachable talent (shotblocking), and someone thats worth going the extra mile for, to see if he can bring the rest of his game up to the NBA level.

Maybe I am reading too much into this and putting too much faith into Clifford Ray but is it a coincidence that both Cousins and JT started playing on another level and Whiteside started getting more game time after Ray was hired as a big men coach?!

I am encouraged that Whiteside has been in Sacramento working out and I would be even more giddy about it if I knew that he was working out with Clifford Ray. There is no doubt that Whiteside has not answered any questions in the last 3 years and as you said some of it is his doing and some if just bad luck. However, his unteachable talent is so unique that we have to persist with it provided that Whiteside is willing to put in the work and all reports are that he is. You just have to look at him at draft night and now to see that he has obviously worked on getting bigger and stronger.

I would just like to see him focus on doing the things that he is good at (protecting the rim and rebounding) and not worry about the rest of it too much (scoring). Once he gets to the point where he is consistently brings the things he is good at, then you start introducing the rest of the things into his game.

He is long, athletic, mobile and on paper a perfect player you want next to Cousins. If Whiteside can develop into a 25mpg 7/7/3 type guy we would be absolutely set. Those numbers are modest and he can be a lot more than that but I would settle for consistent 10-15mpg this season with some shot blocking. He is raw as hell but it is not far fetched to say that he is potentially a better shot blocker than Ibaka and that is saying something about just how scary good a shot blocker this kid can be. Lets just hope he puts in the right work and puts it together for us. I would hate to see us give up on him only to see him flourish on some other team.

Unique talent that Whiteside has cannot be taught or developed, its something that you are born with. The length, quick jumping and exceptional timing.

 

[Fear the Putin]

Maybe I am reading too much into this and putting too much faith into Clifford Ray but is it a coincidence that both Cousins and JT started playing on another level and Whiteside started getting more game time after Ray was hired as a big men coach?!

I am encouraged that Whiteside has been in Sacramento working out and I would be even more giddy about it if I knew that he was working out with Clifford Ray. There is no doubt that Whiteside has not answered any questions in the last 3 years and as you said some of it is his doing and some if just bad luck. However, his unteachable talent is so unique that we have to persist with it provided that Whiteside is willing to put in the work and all reports are that he is. You just have to look at him at draft night and now to see that he has obviously worked on getting bigger and stronger.

I would just like to see him focus on doing the things that he is good at (protecting the rim and rebounding) and not worry about the rest of it too much (scoring). Once he gets to the point where he is consistently brings the things he is good at, then you start introducing the rest of the things into his game.

He is long, athletic, mobile and on paper a perfect player you want next to Cousins. If Whiteside can develop into a 25mpg 7/7/3 type guy we would be absolutely set. Those numbers are modest and he can be a lot more than that but I would settle for consistent 10-15mpg this season with some shot blocking. He is raw as hell but it is not far fetched to say that he is potentially a better shot blocker than Ibaka and that is saying something about just how scary good a shot blocker this kid can be. Lets just hope he puts in the right work and puts it together for us. I would hate to see us give up on him only to see him flourish on some other team.

Unique talent that Whiteside has cannot be taught or developed, its something that you are born with. The length, quick jumping and exceptional timing.

If you check out the YouTube video of "a day in the life of hassan whiteside" from around the end of march, one of the clips in the video is him training with Clifford ray.

 

[NoBonus]

So, let's see... to address their SF shooting woes, the Kings have not signed or acquired the following people... they let other teams scoop them up...
- Nic Batum
- AK47
- Kyle Korver
- Ryan Anderson
-Gerald Wallace

Nice work!

 

[HereWeBoogie]

ya, Kings offseasons are more and more pathetic every year. but hey, id rather have them sign NOBODY than sign another Chuck Hayes for 21mil

 

[MassachusettsKingsFan]

Martell Webster was just waived by the Wolves. He'd be an interesting piece on this team. 6'7 Guard/Forward who's only 25 and can really shoot it. I'm not sure he's any worse then Dorell Wright who a lot of people on this forum wanted.

Not my first choice, but it's an interesting name in the 'we need a shooter' camp.

 

[Jkbiker]

Dave Mason:“@Aykis16: The Mavericks acquired Elton Brand for less than what the Kings bid for Travis Outlaw *weeps*” That hurts.about 10 minutes ago

Read more: http://hoopshype.com/twitter/media.html#ixzz20Xcayjxk

 

[steelevt]

Dave Mason:“@Aykis16: The Mavericks acquired Elton Brand for less than what the Kings bid for Travis Outlaw *weeps*” That hurts.about 10 minutes ago

Read more: http://hoopshype.com/twitter/media.html#ixzz20Xcayjxk

2.1 million!?!? i mean we might not NEED players like this, but for those prices how can you pass?

http://espn.go.com/dallas/nba/story...avericks-claim-elton-brand-waiver-sources-say

 

[kingjatt]

dam, dallas got away with robbery, kaman and brand had their best years together and they got him for 17 million less than what he's signed for.

so basically both billups and brand were picked up for cheaper than what petrie spent on outlaw lol bidding against ourselves again.

 

[Tetsujin]

2.1 million!?!? i mean we might not NEED players like this, but for those prices how can you pass?

http://espn.go.com/dallas/nba/story...avericks-claim-elton-brand-waiver-sources-say

Err, I doubt he would have signed with the Kings for that price. Plus we don't really have room for him. As far as I'm aware, we've already got three 4s with Darnell Jackson also fighting for our last roster spot.

 

[uolj]

Err, I doubt he would have signed with the Kings for that price.

He doesn't have a choice. Whoever bids the highest wins him.

 

[Tetsujin]

He doesn't have a choice. Whoever bids the highest wins him.

But then you get into the whole "Will he show up and play hard for us?" thing and that still doesn't change the fact that we need another PF like we need a lobotomy.

 

[steelevt]

Err, I doubt he would have signed with the Kings for that price. Plus we don't really have room for him. As far as I'm aware, we've already got three 4s with Darnell Jackson also fighting for our last roster spot.

you're right, pf set with roleplayer jt, a rook, and darnell jackson. no need to bid 2.1 mil for a former allstar who could mentor our bigs, when we paid double that for our other mentor hayes, since we have owners with all this mone...nvm

 

[Tetsujin]

you're right, pf set with roleplayer jt, a rook, and darnell jackson. no need to bid 2.1 mil for a former allstar who could mentor our bigs, when we paid double that for our other mentor hayes, since we have owners with all this mone...nvm

We can't just keep signing the first 4 that's available though. Brand was an allstar. So was Shareef. Hell, Mikki Moore was a good role player for NJ when he was paired with Kidd. Just because you can sign someone who was good at basketball at one point doesn't mean you should. Especially when you pretty much have all of your 4 minutes accounted for (that's the only position Brand is really capable of playing at this point) in TRob and JT.

 

[steelevt]

We can't just keep signing the first 4 that's available though. Brand was an allstar. So was Shareef. Hell, Mikki Moore was a good role player for NJ when he was paired with Kidd. Just because you can sign someone who was good at basketball at one point doesn't mean you should. Especially when you pretty much have all of your 4 minutes accounted for (that's the only position Brand is really capable of playing at this point) in TRob and JT.

jt can play some 5, and we dont know what we have in trob. what if he has a jimmer year or worse a thabeet year? look at brands numbers last year, better than jt and we could have gotten him for 1/3 the price. he would have only been here a year which would help us see what he have in trob or help him get used to nba life. i would have seen it as a C: cousins/jt PF: brand/jt/trob. but in the end i understand your point. we cant overload at one position or else we would have what we have at sf right now. its just the FO is frustrating. stupid moves handcuff us into keeping bad players and not taking the risk on good/decent players. id much rather have the problem of brand/scola/hayward at less that 9million total vs salmons/cisco/outlaw at around 17 million. see what dallas did? it seemed like they were doomed when they missed out on dwight and deron williams. their team seemed in disarray and looked like it got blown up, but in a few days they got kaman, brand, collison, and looking at scola to add to dirk. i guarantee them taking these risks will end up keeping the mavs better than the kings who resigned JT and hopefully resigns twill.

 

[Tetsujin]

jt can play some 5, and we dont know what we have in trob. what if he has a jimmer year or worse a thabeet year? look at brands numbers last year, better than jt and we could have gotten him for 1/3 the price. he would have only been here a year which would help us see what he have in trob or help him get used to nba life. i would have seen it as a C: cousins/jt PF: brand/jt/trob. but in the end i understand your point. we cant overload at one position or else we would have what we have at sf right now. its just the FO is frustrating. stupid moves handcuff us into keeping bad players and not taking the risk on good/decent players. id much rather have the problem of brand/scola/hayward at less that 9million total vs salmons/cisco/outlaw at around 17 million. see what dallas did? it seemed like they were doomed when they missed out on dwight and deron williams. their team seemed in disarray and looked like it got blown up, but in a few days they got kaman, brand, collison, and looking at scola to add to dirk. i guarantee them taking these risks will end up keeping the mavs better than the kings who resigned JT and hopefully resigns twill.

But Dallas has the added benefit of being a larger market team who just won a championship a year ago, has a superstar, has a top coach, a relatively large amount of cap space, and still has a bunch of pieces to make a run.

 

[rainmaker]

dam, dallas got away with robbery, kaman and brand had their best years together and they got him for 17 million less than what he's signed for.

so basically both billups and brand were picked up for cheaper than what petrie spent on outlaw lol bidding against ourselves again.

Watch them get Scola as well. Plenty of room to bid enough for him, especially if they won the bidding process on Brand for about 2M. We don't need Scola, but it's jsut evidence of how bad picking up Outlaw was. I hated it the second it happened.

But, I'll remind everyone we're supposedly working on two trades right now. That's most likely where our SF will come from.