Nocioni heading home? (Chicago)

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r3ali5t

Prospect
#1
#1
There's a rumor on ESPN that says we may send Nocioni to the Bulls for Tyrus Thomas. I don't know if the salaries match but does anyone think this is a good trade for us? I say go for it, Thomas is really athletic and blocks shots, the only problem is that he's undersized..
 
N

Nighthawk1

Starter
#2
#2
WHere do we sign up. TT is an expiring and that is really all that matters. He has some potential even though he gets pushed around in post D also.
 
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AriesMar27

Guest
#9
#9
i dont care where he goes, he just needs to go... tyrus thomas would be a nice player to try out, i wanted him to come here last year instead of nocioni.
 
Capt. Factorial

Capt. Factorial

trifolium contra tempestatem subrigere certum est
Staff member
#10
#10
Well, Noc for Thomas wouldn't work straight up under the salary cap.

Noc + KT for Thomas + Hinrich would work, but I'm not sure what to think. I'd like to see Thomas here, because he's a good defender, blocks shots and rebounds well. He's not a great offensive player, but we don't need that out of him. But on the other hand, what in the world do we do with Hinrich for all that time? He's got two more guaranteed years (Noc has two plus a TEAM option), and he's more expensive than Noc. On top of that, Thomas's rookie deal ends this year, and his qualifying offer is $6.25M. I just have this feeling that once all of the teams that can't get a top-tier free agent this offseason start looking at the second tier, he'll be on somebody's list for a $7-8M contract. Unless we can evaluate him quickly this season, we might end up spending a lot of money to retain a guy when we don't even know how good he's going to be. And pick up extra money in Hinrich's contract for the privilege.

I'm just not sure whether it would turn out to be a good move. Kinda 50-50 on it.
 
S

Smills91

Starter
#11
#11
timmytrio43 said:
Id do it ... but i bet its more along the lines of K9/Nocioni to CHI Hinrich/T.Thomas to SAC Id actually like that Hinrich is one yr less than Noch
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Not according to Shamsports he doesn't. Nocioni has a team option in 12/13....thus making both Hinrich and Nocioni enders in 2012. If Hinrich expired in 2011, I'd be all over that deal.
 
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Lafayette

Guest
#13
#13
The word is that the Bulls want Defense and thats what Thomas doesn't do, he doesn't fit the team. Noc is coveted for his D. I think they need to dump atleast 3 players for 1 to trim the fat. Garcia is on his way back and he'll want to step in and play aswell.
 
ElRey

ElRey

Starter
#14
#14
Lafayette said:
The word is that the Bulls want Defense and thats what Thomas doesn't do, he doesn't fit the team. Noc is coveted for his D. I think they need to dump atleast 3 players for 1 to trim the fat. Garcia is on his way back and he'll want to step in and play aswell.
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Is Tyrus Thomas that bad of a defender?
 
DocHolliday

DocHolliday

Starter
#16
#16
ElRey said:
Is Tyrus Thomas that bad of a defender?
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If TT can't defend I don't want him. I think the writing is on the wall right now that Westphal wants players that can D up, as well as be athletic and score effectively. He wants a tough team, no cream puffs.

Now if he was just here for the rest of the year and then it would free cap space for the off season I'd be all for that, just don't re-sign him if he isn't that tough.

Now on Hinrich, I don't think Sac would take that deal. Why do they need another guard. He's 6-3 might be able to play the 2 some, but seems more like a point. So we'd have Evans, Beno, Sergio, Hinrich? And someone mentioned getting someone to take Beno from us...why?? He's scoring better than Hinrich this year, they are both the same height, and Beno is actually 15 lbs heavier than Hinrich which I like.
 
Capt. Factorial

Capt. Factorial

trifolium contra tempestatem subrigere certum est
Staff member
#17
#17
Lafayette said:
The word is that the Bulls want Defense and thats what Thomas doesn't do, he doesn't fit the team. Noc is coveted for his D.
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That's strange, because my understanding of Tyrus Thomas is that he's a good defender, not a poor one. In fact, according to the DRtg stat, which estimates points allowed per 100 possessions, Thomas was a good defender his first season (93), an average defender the past two (103/104), and has been good again this year (96) in limited minutes. Nocioni was a good defender his first three years (100/102/99) but hasn't been very good the last three (109/111/111). Perhaps they want someone who can play perimeter defense, but overall Thomas looks to be the stronger defender and is seven years younger.

Does Noc for Thomas make sense for them, then? If so, I'd imagine they must really want to dump Hinrich. And picking up Hinrich is the part of the deal that I'd be worried about. Everything else I'd be down with.
 
R

r3ali5t

Prospect
#20
#20
Involve a 3rd team?

Yea, there's no doubt Chicago wants to unload Hinrich. What if we involve a 3rd team that may actually want him? Say the Lakers for instance. The Lakers have one big expiring in ammo (A.Morrison). Also Hinrich fits the triangle and is a pretty big guard, which Phil likes. Of course more pieces would have to be involved but the idea intrigues me.

As an afterthought though, part of me doesn't want to involve the Lakers. As a Kings fan, doing a deal with the Lakers would be like making a deal with the devil.
 
beb0p

beb0p

Starter
#21
#21
Capt. Factorial said:
That's strange, because my understanding of Tyrus Thomas is that he's a good defender, not a poor one.
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Perhaps Tyrus is a good defender but on some nights he turns into a bad defender. The "up and down" thing that frustrates Del Negro.

http://espn.go.com/chicago/columns/blog/_/post/4840715/name/friedell

When Thomas came back from a broken forearm last month, many thought that he would give the Bulls the type of energy boost that they had been missing. He did for a while; over his first four games, the Bulls went 4-0 and Thomas played very well. He was active on the floor and managed to score 21 points in a win over the Hornets on Dec. 26. Four weeks later though, Thomas doesn't look like the same player.

Del Negro was asked about Thomas' performance lately after practice on Tuesday, and it's clear if you read between the lines, the head coach is frustrated with the fourth-year pro.

"It's just a matter of working your minutes when you're out there," Del Negro said. "Running the court, getting after it defensively. Being committed to what we're doing. Executing the game plan, and hustling and playing hard. Doing the things that help us win basketball games. And the guys that are out there, that are going to do that on a consistent basis, will get more minutes. That's just the way it works. Like I said from Day One.


"We need his activity. We need him to play well, just like all the other guys. It's not about scoring. It's not about shooting and getting your shots. It's about being a good teammate, playing the right way and when there's opportunities to score and block shots, or run or make the right pass, or handle the basketball or whatever & you have to make plays. We need Tyrus to go back to doing that. And a few other guys as well."
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rainmaker

rainmaker

Hall of Famer
#22
#22
I like Tyrus, and think he could use a change of scenery. However, he isn't the big man this team needs. If all we have to give up is Noc, I'm all for it. Even Noc and another player I would be ok with. But we still need a center, and a center that can rebound and block/alter shots, and KT's expiring is our best chance, unless we trade Kevin.

Tyrus blocked nearly 2 shots per game last year, but he's not a real intimidating presence down low, and doesn't stop guards from attacking the paint, although he's better than what we have. I would love to add him to this team, but we still have to go after a center.
 
Capt. Factorial

Capt. Factorial

trifolium contra tempestatem subrigere certum est
Staff member
#23
#23
beb0p said:
Perhaps Tyrus is a good defender but on some nights he turns into a bad defender. The "up and down" thing that frustrates Del Negro.
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Well, I can't say whether Del Negro is a coach who is able to get the best out of his players. Westphal has already done quite a job of turning Donte from a lazy chucker into a defense-first, intense player. Work that magic on Tyrus and it's probably worth eating Hinrich's contract.
 
NoBonus

NoBonus

Starter
#24
#24
bajaden

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#25
#25
NoBonus said:
Okay,

Here are some "deals" that work on paper, though maybe not in logic:

Noc for Thomas and Pargo
http://www.realgm.com/src_checktrade.php?tradeid=5394841

Noc and Hilton for James (ender) and Thomas
http://www.realgm.com/src_checktrade.php?tradeid=5394849

Noc and K9 for Thomas and Brad Miller (ender)
http://www.realgm.com/src_checktrade.php?tradeid=5394859

Noc for James Johnson and Thomas
http://www.realgm.com/src_checktrade.php?tradeid=5394863
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Another one that works is Nocioni and Sergio for Thomas and Jerome James. Both James and Thomas are expiring.
 
allrightythen

allrightythen

Starter
#28
#28
I read this but its confusing, I thought Chicago wanted to make a run at a max free agent this summer, wouldn't giving up expirings for Noc take away that option?
 
Big Cuz 15

Big Cuz 15

All-Star
#29
#29
why anybody suggesting KT in the deal for some heiney? KT's expiring is worth much more. the original Noc for TT is a great deal. we get out from Noc's contract and we can see what TT can do. if he's decent we have his bird rights.
 
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