next years line-up
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OptimusRhyme
Jive Turkey
I wouldn't play Thomas on SF Permenently, he is too used to playing Power Forward, and the quicker SF (Tmac,Vince,Lewis,) would be able to easily beat him off the dribble,, but I'm sure he could take 10-15 minutes a game at the SF spot.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Joker112 said:
Someone else mentioned that + I'm not sure. He really is only SF sized + is very quick. But of course he loses that quickness advantage at SF and I'm not sure if he can guard the McGrady's of the world on the perimeter. I do think its an interesting idea and might solve a lot of our rebounding/hustle issues though. The Marion principal without the hops.
Joker112 said:
It's not gonna be anywhere near as hard as people thought Webber's would be.
Besides, with someone like Thomas, you package in someone with an expiring contract AND another key player - like Peja - to get the deal to go down.
Having said that, however, the idea of using Thomas at the 3 is intriguing, especially if we get another SF who can defend and body up on people like TMac.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
HndsmCelt said:
6'7", if that actually.
He's a tough guy though. Just too small to face off with the top PFs, but if he COULD actually make the transition to SF (ball handling, perimeter defense would be issues) he'd be one of the toughest in the league. Wouldn't mind seeing it happen. Just have my doubts he has the skills to excel there.
I appreciate the contribution of Peja and Mobley but deals have to be made.
I'd like to see either Maggette or Artest or both on the Kings roster next year. Peja for Maggette and Mobley for Artest if it's actually possible. Artest is a nutcase, but he's a guarantee when it comes to defense. Plus, he can guard a variety of positions. Maggette can take it to the hoop, defend, and get to the free throw line often. The Kings need rebounding, defense, athleticism, and points in the paint. Artest and Maggette can definitely do better than what we got now. They may not make a big dent in rebounding and points in the paint, but they will improve those stats to some extent and bring the much needed athleticism and defense.
I'd like to see either Maggette or Artest or both on the Kings roster next year. Peja for Maggette and Mobley for Artest if it's actually possible. Artest is a nutcase, but he's a guarantee when it comes to defense. Plus, he can guard a variety of positions. Maggette can take it to the hoop, defend, and get to the free throw line often. The Kings need rebounding, defense, athleticism, and points in the paint. Artest and Maggette can definitely do better than what we got now. They may not make a big dent in rebounding and points in the paint, but they will improve those stats to some extent and bring the much needed athleticism and defense.
AriesMar27 said:
I'm sorry to disagree (well, no I'm not but I'm trying to be polite) BUT that excuse would only hold water if Peja wasn't missing every type of shot, including sure-thing lay-ups, from virtually everywhere on the court. He isn't hitting from his favorite corner. He isn't hitting off his two steps to the left fadeaway. He isn't even hitting all his free throws. So, to say we just don't have anyone to pass the ball to Peja ISN'T the problem.
What I've seen is him miss short, long, to the left, to the right - and airball. I've seen him pass up GOOD lucks and dump the ball back to players who are nowhere near as open as he has been.
I'm just not buying into the excuse that no one is passing to him.
HndsmCelt
Hall of Famer
I tendto think he can... will not be the fastest and will get burned a bit on defense but he will have the same advantages Nasty has against smaller SF's, witht he aded advantage of a good jumper. Bottom line is IF kenny stays at teh PF he will NEVER be a good starter, but he COULD be a top SF. Likewise aslong as Skinner playes center he will always be a second rate cneter with good moments and good games, but he could be a strong durable work horse PF who palys a vital role on a squad that needs help with boards, blacks and insde defense but does NOT need more than5-10 points a game out of him... Hmm anyone know a team like that?Bricklayer said:
A
AriesMar27
Guest
VF21 said:
he's a pansy when it comes to lay ups..... but he really doesnt have the synergy(i think thats the word) with the players that he had last year or the year before... with the passes that are thrown his way... he isnt really set up, the ball is just thrown to him.... how many christie bullet-pass lay ups did he miss? how many double screen wide open shots did he miss with vlade and miller setting him up? it was almost a sure thing, but now.... these guys dont care about setting him up for anything.... and he doesnt have the mentality to go out and just dominate.... they just throw him the ball...
i live in los angeles so the only time that i see kings games are on tnt(when we lose) and clipper/laker games..... so i cant asses the entire situation as well as some of you... but from what ive seen, no one cares about getting peja the shot that he needs... which is something that the team needs in order to win games without "bibby heroics" or "cat consistency"....
F
Fillmoe
Guest
peja 4 artest?
A
AriesMar27
Guest
Fillmoe said:
we should have done that at the trade deadline with the webber trade, then tanked the season for a lottery pick.....
then trade the pick, thomas and corliss for kg.... and mobley for maggette...
stevetaebo
Bench
I like the idea of having Brad and Skinner starting. It will help clean up the boards with bigger guys
stevetaebo
Bench
AriesMar27 said:
I rather trade Peja for someone more stable. Package Peja and thomas/williamson for paul pierce
A
AriesMar27
Guest
^^^ that'll do but wont happen with the celtics winning games now....
stevetaebo
Bench
AriesMar27 said:
yep, that was the one of the things i was semi bent about. awww, the celtics got toine back and are now good and wont break up their team.
but thank god we didnt get odom, i would have been pissed
ParniValjak
All-Star
Gee some people are a fickle lot
after an , albeit, quick read of the thread ---- it is a specious argument as to whether Peja can "return" to his old form or merely be a role player. Folks, he WAS a role player, and an effective one as long as he has the other players feeding him the ball and doing all the physical work of screens, penetrate and pass, etc etc that Peja clearly is not willing to do on his own. His unwillingness allows for no grade (apologies to grade-meister Brink) as to capability. So really he has gone from an effective role player to an ineffective role player.
Now as to this review that says Peja was so much more effective when #4 was out 50 games. (No, this is not to fuel that old fire!) Well hell, 20 points were out of the lineup. Didn't someone, all, have to pick it up for the Kings to be successful? OK Peja did his part. Nice. That doesn't get high grades (again) in my book, he did what he was supposed to do, as did Miller, Bibby et al.
I don't know the long term solutioin, I do know that Peja is not a team leader, never will be, is and always will be a role player. Interesting dichotomy, the more you build a team around his role (extremely strong and athletic players), the less you need his role.
just my free thoughts.
Now as to this review that says Peja was so much more effective when #4 was out 50 games. (No, this is not to fuel that old fire!) Well hell, 20 points were out of the lineup. Didn't someone, all, have to pick it up for the Kings to be successful? OK Peja did his part. Nice. That doesn't get high grades (again) in my book, he did what he was supposed to do, as did Miller, Bibby et al.
I don't know the long term solutioin, I do know that Peja is not a team leader, never will be, is and always will be a role player. Interesting dichotomy, the more you build a team around his role (extremely strong and athletic players), the less you need his role.
just my free thoughts.
mcsluggo
Starter
an ineffective nearly 20 point/game role player? Most people would accept 18 plus points form their scoring role players.
I do agree that he ALWAYS was a role player, though. Folks, he-was-what-he-was, and frankly, he still is-what-he-was. Thats why I find this whole burning Peja in effigy campaign confusing.
He is less effective than he was in the past, given. Does this surprise anyone? He has always been a system guy. He worked the king's well oiled system to the max. Now the system is broken OF COURSE Peja's game would suffer the most from this. Duh.
Almost all the people that are furious with Peja right now fall into one of two camps. Either you bought the foolish "MVP" talk from last year and now feel like you have egg on your face, and are blaming Peja for your embarrassment. Or you were primarily a Webber-jocker in the foolish Peja v Webber battle royalle that occured the last 18 months. Now that Webber was uncerimoniously dumped, you blame Peja.
Either way, take a step away from the anger. Peja is just Peja. He is a player with some clear flaws, but he also has strengths, especially if the team is able to get back into a better position to capitalize on them, which will require time for coach A and yoda to indoctrinate the new key parts (whomever they may be in the offseason as well) into the "kings way" of playing.
I do agree that he ALWAYS was a role player, though. Folks, he-was-what-he-was, and frankly, he still is-what-he-was. Thats why I find this whole burning Peja in effigy campaign confusing.
He is less effective than he was in the past, given. Does this surprise anyone? He has always been a system guy. He worked the king's well oiled system to the max. Now the system is broken OF COURSE Peja's game would suffer the most from this. Duh.
Almost all the people that are furious with Peja right now fall into one of two camps. Either you bought the foolish "MVP" talk from last year and now feel like you have egg on your face, and are blaming Peja for your embarrassment. Or you were primarily a Webber-jocker in the foolish Peja v Webber battle royalle that occured the last 18 months. Now that Webber was uncerimoniously dumped, you blame Peja.
Either way, take a step away from the anger. Peja is just Peja. He is a player with some clear flaws, but he also has strengths, especially if the team is able to get back into a better position to capitalize on them, which will require time for coach A and yoda to indoctrinate the new key parts (whomever they may be in the offseason as well) into the "kings way" of playing.
GoGoGadget
All-Star
mcsluggo said:
I got ready for a rant on this one, but then noticed that "almost" up there.
Some of us are just plain disappointed.
bozzwell
Starter
mcsluggo said:
You're absolutely right, except (and this is a key exception) Pedja's shooting has been off most of the season and he hasn't stepped up in the other areas of the game (for example, in last play offs at least he had some key defensive stops in the crunch time).
But, I do see your point that Pedja is what Pedja is - a great role player/shooter but not a great basketball player overall and he should be judged accordingly.
thanks GGG, I noticed the "almost" as well and almost defended my lack of campground! LOL. "he-is-what-he-always-was"... what a great summation. I am reminded the essence of magic is illusion - the elephant (so to speak) is either always there or it never was. Same with Peja I suppose.
mcsluggo said:
And yet, interestingly enough, YOU are the one that keeps bringing up the Webber scenario.
I'm sorry, but I disagree with your stereotyping of me - and yes, I know exactly what slot you've decided I belong in.
I am and have been a Kings fan since 1985. The times since 1999 have been some of the most exciting times of my life. The thrills; the joys; the excitement of seeing another Kings fan on the street, having our eyes meet and then say, at the same time, "GO KINGS!"
Yes, I thought Webber was being picked on by some around here unfairly and I said so. That's not germane to what's happening now.
What broke my heart about Peja was that HE went to the media and demanded a trade. He stabbed ALL Kings fans in the heart. He spit on us and told us he didn't want to be involved with our team any longer. He wanted to go somewhere - ANYWHERE - else and he didn't care how or when.
I have watched this year as all the drama unfolded. I have been shocked and dismayed because THE core of the team is gone. Two of the three strongest warriors were shipped to East Coast teams. I dealt with these things and I continued at every juncture to support the team.
Let go of the anger? Why? Because my beloved team is now scrambling just to make the playoffs? Because the ONE player who publicly and repeatedly announced that he didn't want to be here is still here AND not doing his job?
Sorry, but I'll keep the anger (now more disappointment than anything else) just a little longer if it's all the same to you. BUT I will still root for the team. AND I hope Peja can find a way to be productive and get this team back at least going in the right direction. Why? Because I'm a KINGS fan and whether I'm happy about it or not, the fate of this team at least this year lies with the players we have right now. I want EACH of them to produce and get the job done.
So can we just forget about knocking the "Webber jockers" and just get back to rooting for this team?
GO KINGS!!!!!
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KKSloga said:
Hypothetical trade talks are oft-times not exactly rooted in either logic, probabilty or reason. AND, as Joker has pointed out, they could actually extend Peja's contract and then trade him.
Last time I looked I wasn't the GM for the Kings, so my proposals aren't going to seal the fate of anyone anyway.
Relax... It's gonna be a long off-season if you try and assign logic and reality to trade talks around here.
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