Lowry talk heating up .. Kings in the mix (ESPN)

Hoovtrain said:
Not that i trust HW, but if its #5 for Daley and #16, i will be done.

http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba2-chicago-bulls-chasing-dwight-howard
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I don't do that deal. No way. We had Daly and didn't do enough to retain him. Then we go through another year of sucking, to come away with the 5th pick, only to trade it away for a 1 yr rental of Daly, the same player we let walk?

So basically, trade away the 5th pick to make up for last years mistake, while still being stuck with Chuck/Cisco/Salmons?

Hell no.

Tell Hou to send Lowry or tell them to F off and get on the phone with Chi and Philly.
 
Dally, as an expiring aging big - forgive me shotblocking fanatics - is not worth close to any of the picks mentioned.

Taking/valuing Dally as an expiring over #14 or #16( or to make it more simplistic - a 1 year rental of a guy who declined to resign here not so long ago and will be a UFA at the end of this year, over a guy like Henson/Harkless/Taylor/Jones/Leonard/Zeller on a 5 year rookie contract with RFA status at the end of it) is just bad bad bad bad bad. I don't even wanna think of the possibility the Kings will bite on that horrible, short and narrow minded move.
 
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Boogie-havoc said:
Dally, as an expiring aging big - forgive me shotblocking fanatics - is not worth close to any of the picks mentioned.

Taking/valuing Dally as an expiring over #14 or #16( or to make it more simplistic - a 1 year rental of a guy who declined to resign here not so long ago and will be a UFA at the end of this year, over a guy like Henson/Harkless/Taylor/Jones/Leonard/Zeller on a 5 year rookie contract with RFA status at the end of it) is just bad bad bad bad bad. I don't even wanna think of the possibility the Kings will bite on that horrible, short and narrow minded move.
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Daly will be better than 5 out of those 6 names in all liklihood. Worst case, 4 of the 6. You can decide on your own which of them. You acquire vets because you KNOW that they can play. You don't hope. The odds of any of the above guys ever racking up 582 career starts , or being Top 40 all time in blocked shots are fairly long. The odds of more than 1 or 2 of them acheiving that sort of competence are VERY long.

The concern here is the #5, and probably specifically MKG, although obviously you can see the Drummond principle at work here as that is the guy the teams are maneuvering for, not a strong roleplayer.
 
Via Insider:

Last week, Rumor Central's Nick Borges broke down the many options Toronto has with the No. 8 pick, and now there is word that the Raptors could be looking to trade it for Rockets point guard Kyle Lowry.

Bill Ingram of HoopsWorld.com writes in a chat session today that he's "hearing Lowry for the No. 8 pick."

If this happens, it would likely open the door for Toronto to amnesty Jose Calderon, who is due to make just over $10.5 million in the final year of his deal next season. It would also end the talks of Steve Nash signing with the Raptors.

In addition, this would be big for Houston, which is rumored to want two lottery picks that it can then package in a deal for Dwight Howard. The Rockets are said to have a deal in the works with Sacramento for the No. 5 pick.
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I don't like this. Not at all. Is just a rumor though.

But I'd much rather be in Toronto's position than ours if this were to happen. We need cap room and flexibility, not add possibly the 14 and 16 picks along with Daly, while not getting either the #5 pick (turned player) or Lowry.
 
Bricklayer said:
Daly will be better than 5 out of those 6 names in all liklihood. Worst case, 4 of the 6. You can decide on your own which of them. You acquire vets because you KNOW that they can play. You don't hope. The odds of any of the above guys ever racking up 582 career starts , or being Top 40 all time in blocked shots are fairly long. The odds of more than 1 or 2 of them acheiving that sort of competence are VERY long.

The concern here is the #5, and probably specifically MKG, although obviously you can see the Drummond principle at work here as that is the guy the teams are maneuvering for, not a strong roleplayer.
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As I said, short term thinking.

Remind me what's Dally contract situation? If we're so eager we can nab him (Let alone Serge Ibaka) just another year down the line in the Free Agency period and still have the pick.

So the 1 year we'll have Dally who's headed straight to the Free Agency market a year older(Let's again remember, a guy who declined, no matter if cause of him or us, to resign for us just last summer)

Is better for this franchise then Terrance Ross\ Moe Harkless\ John Henson\ Tyler Zeller\ Terrance Jones\ Mayers Leonard on a 5 year rookie contract deal, with their entire future ahead of them, and a RFA status after those 5 years?

I'll absolutely agree to disagree, and pray to god the Kings organization doesn't share your line of thinking. You make it sound like Dally is the ultimate savior of this franchise.
 
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No way we can be so stupid. I don't want to believe these rumors. How can they even think about trading the 5th pick for Dally and #14? #5 is worth much more than that, we need to value our assets, not just dump them away.

Anyways, I just want to believe these are rumors and nothing more, and Petrie usually doesn't let the media know what he's really doing. At least I hope so.
 
Bricklayer said:
Daly will be better than 5 out of those 6 names in all liklihood. Worst case, 4 of the 6. You can decide on your own which of them. You acquire vets because you KNOW that they can play. You don't hope. The odds of any of the above guys ever racking up 582 career starts , or being Top 40 all time in blocked shots are fairly long. The odds of more than 1 or 2 of them acheiving that sort of competence are VERY long.

The concern here is the #5, and probably specifically MKG, although obviously you can see the Drummond principle at work here as that is the guy the teams are maneuvering for, not a strong roleplayer.
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I like Daly and would love to have him back. But the #5 is too much, especially without unloading a bad contract which defeats the purpose of Hou making the trade and I doubt they take on. No way one year from now do I want to see Daly walk, and we essentially flipped the #5 for the #14, and still may have Chuck/Cisco/Salmons.
 
Mass said:
No way we can be so stupid. I don't want to believe these rumors. How can they even think about trading the 5th pick for Dally and #14? #5 is worth much more than that, we need to value our assets, not just dump them away.

Anyways, I just want to believe these are rumors and nothing more, and Petrie usually doesn't let the media know what he's really doing. At least I hope so.
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It would be a widely criticized move for certain. And if that didn't do it for you, I imagine that taking on Dally's salary would mean that they would let JT walk in free agency because the Maloofs salary restriction on Petrie.
 
Lowry could help us a lot. He fixes the position problem with Tyreke while giving us something we need offensively (a reliable outside shooter, someone who can initiate the offense and then play off the ball like Mike Bibby used to do) as well us something we need defensively. Dalembert is the right type of player, but you don't trade a #5 pick for an aging veteran with one year left on his contract. Especially not when you already had a deal to sign that player in the off-season and pulled it off the table to make an offer to someone else. If that's where this is headed -- Dalembert and a lower pick -- sign me up to lead the march to Petrie's house with pitchforks. That's too absurd to be believable.
 
JB_kings said:
It would be a widely criticized move for certain. And if that didn't do it for you, I imagine that taking on Dally's salary would mean that they would let JT walk in free agency because the Maloofs salary restriction on Petrie.
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No, that's not a concern at least. We are so cheap, and the new CBA demands you spend so much of your cap, that we could have both players and be safely under the $50mil salary mark.
 
Capt. Factorial said:
That would be completely and totally stupid. Remember the last time we traded down in the draft to bring back a player who had left and didn't really want to be back (hint: it wasn't very long ago)? This would be worse.
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I'll add to that -- if we had just taken Brandon Knight or Bismack Biyombo with our pick last year instead of trying to fix all of our problems at once we wouldn't need to make this Houston deal, all we'd have to do is take the best player available whether it's Robinson or MKG or Barnes and add them to one of the best young cores in the league. Throwing away top picks impulsively (or wasting them) is how franchises stay in the basement for years on end.
 
All the latest rumors seem to be pointing to Lowry headed to Toronto. So why again would the Kings want to trade their #5 for a pick or two in the mid-teens? Pull the plug on this one before the pitchforks come out. If the front office loves Dally so much, go bid on him next summer. Don't waste a #5 draft pick on him.
 
I hope these are just rumors. I do not want to see us lose a #5 pick that could be MKG, Robinson, or Drummond. Dalembert we can try to sign next year. The two picks are worth a lot, but they're only worth like Marcus Thornton in value.
 
Knowing the Kings history, I'm starting to worry they'll end up with the least valuable pieces in all this Houston talk. The least valuable would be just the 14 & 16 picks.
 
I think people may be kind of sticking their head in the sand a bit here as to just how short our window is. And by our window, I mean the whole franchise's window. Sacramento's. This board's. In two year's time DeMarcus Cousins can say adios muchachos. We might already have lost our ROY. A rotting building, broke owners still pushing to leave, a fanbase turned off in droves after 7 straight losing seasons. Geoff may have retired, to be replaced by the family dog. There is a cataclysm awaiting continued failure.
 
JB_kings said:
All the latest rumors seem to be pointing to Lowry headed to Toronto. So why again would the Kings want to trade their #5 for a pick or two in the mid-teens? Pull the plug on this one before the pitchforks come out. If the front office loves Dally so much, go bid on him next summer. Don't waste a #5 draft pick on him.
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I don't think they would, so I'm going to believe that it is just rumors.
If MKG or Robinson are sitting there at the #5 spot, they are more valuable than the #14 & #16 picks.

I only trade the #5 to Houston if I get both Lowry and one of their mid-1st picks. Our #5 is more important that the Raptor's #8, so if I were Petrie that is where I draw the line.
 
hrdboild said:
I'll add to that -- if we had just taken Brandon Knight or Bismack Biyombo with our pick last year instead of trying to fix all of our problems at once we wouldn't need to make this Houston deal, all we'd have to do is take the best player available whether it's Robinson or MKG or Barnes and add them to one of the best young cores in the league. Throwing away top picks impulsively (or wasting them) is how franchises stay in the basement for years on end.
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This. Kings are pretty pathetic as a front office. It seems they are ignorant to their own lack of iq, which means theyre just oblivious enough to pull some crap that they think is smart. Just take the 5th, grab your bpa and go home. These games are for big boys and Geoff has shown that he can only handle simple tasks: draft at his original position. When those gets muddled, you get salmons. When a new CBA gets put in place, you get Travis utlaw for the same price as billups.

Dalembert won't put this team over 500. He will only leave you with a worse draft pick next year when he's gone. And you want to give up a top 5 pick for that? I wish I could breathe easy because it's just too asinine to pull, but these kings are getting to legendary status for horrible moves. Pray to whatever deity you prefer that Geoff can get out of his own way. Wellneed every one of them for this.
 
rainmaker said:
Personally, I don't do the deal without getting Lowry. Daly imo is too big a question mark with only having 1 yr left on his contract and coming in out of shape last year in Hou. Doesn't mean I don't want Daly, but I'm not moving down for the #8 and #14 in this scenario. Why? If Daly did come in out of shape or left after a year, then we essentially traded the #5 for the #8 and #14 which I'm not a fan of.

And if Tor got Lowry for the #8, imo that would mean they got the best player involved in all of this while giving up a lesser pick than us. Actually, the #5 might end up being better than Lowry(MAYBE), and in that case we don't have the player taken at #5 OR Lowry. No way I do this if we don't end up with one of the top two players in a potential three team deal.

Ranking the pieces in this rumored deal, I'd go

1) #5 pick
2) Lowry
3) Daly(risky with 1 yr remaining)
4) #8 pick
5) #14 pick
6) #16 pick (if involved)

Now, the top two here can be flipped, meaning Lowry could be better value than the #5, but I still rank the #5 and Lowry as the top two pieces in this deal, and we wouldn't get either.

Daly and the #8 could be flipped around, but imo they're the clear 3rd and 4th valuable pieces in this deal.

Need Lowry for me to do a deal.
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According to a tweet I read, Dalembert is on board with returning to the Kings now that Westphal is gone.
 
Kingster said:
If you trade back to say #14 to get your quality SF (assuming the Kings think there is one around there), you're taking two risks: 1) that the player won't have been drafted before #14, and 2) that the player is in fact a quality SF. So, one risk compounds the other. I wouldn't bank on getting that quality SF in this trade. He'd have to come via some other trade, imo.
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It really depends on what you're looking for from your SF. If you're looking for a star player, then you're correct in that there most likely won't be a star SF left at 14.
However, this is a deep draft for SFs and one of Jeffrey Taylor, Moe Harkness, T.Ross, & Quincy Miller will be availabe at 14.
Now I saw a lot of Taylor, Ross, & Miller last year and not much of Harkness since I only saw St John's play a few times.

I can say with as much certainty as you can in these things that Taylor would be a phenominal pick-up for the Kings and would fit in very well and would be able to solidify the SF spot. The other 3 players I have more questions about, but Taylor should be there at 14, and I would expect to take him to solidify the SF position. And if he isn't there, well it appears the Kings are high on Harkness, so he'd be a great concellation prize.
 
Bricklayer said:
I think people may be kind of sticking their head in the sand a bit here as to just how short our window is. And by our window, I mean the whole franchise's window. Sacramento's. This board's. In two year's time DeMarcus Cousins can say adios muchachos. We might already have lost our ROY. A rotting building, broke owners still pushing to leave, a fanbase turned off in droves after 7 straight losing seasons. Geoff may have retired, to be replaced by the family dog. There is a cataclysm awaiting continued failure.
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Well there is that, but if we give away the #5 pick to Houston and don't get Lowry back in the package we'll have even screwed up the win now strategy.
 
rainmaker said:
I don't do that deal. No way. We had Daly and didn't do enough to retain him. Then we go through another year of sucking, to come away with the 5th pick, only to trade it away for a 1 yr rental of Daly, the same player we let walk?

So basically, trade away the 5th pick to make up for last years mistake, while still being stuck with Chuck/Cisco/Salmons?

Hell no.

Tell Hou to send Lowry or tell them to F off and get on the phone with Chi and Philly.
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Whats with all the anger? Were just talking deals here. Forget the past and consider whether Dalembert could help us or not? If so, then it doesn't matter what circumstance he left under. The only thing that matters is whether its a good deal for us or not. Besides, apparently we didn't just let him walk. He didn't want to return here because of Westphal. Well, Westphal isn't here anymore. Maybe a one year rental to see how things play out is the best way to approach this.
 
Bottom line is that you would have to think Dalembert for one year is worth a #5 pick. I like Dally and he fills a need, but my answer is that he is not worth the pick.

And if the sky is falling with Cousins and everything else, renting Dally for a year isn't going to change that.
 
rainmaker said:
Via Insider:



I don't like this. Not at all. Is just a rumor though.

But I'd much rather be in Toronto's position than ours if this were to happen. We need cap room and flexibility, not add possibly the 14 and 16 picks along with Daly, while not getting either the #5 pick (turned player) or Lowry.
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Lets apply some logic here. If Houston is willing to trade Lowery straight up for the 8th pick, then obviously they would trade him straight up for the 5th pick, No? So that means, were not interested in Lowery. At least not for the 5th pick. So that means we can all stop speculating about Lowery coming to the Kings. Would I like him? Yes! Does he play a position of great need right now? NO! We need a big, and a good SF. Also, Dalembert being included in a deal is nothing more than speculation. So until a deal goes down, and Dalembert is included in said deal, maybe we can all stop grinding our teeth.

Just my stupid opinion, but we waste a lot of energy getting upset over something that hasn't even happened.
 
JB_kings said:
Bottom line is that you would have to think Dalembert for one year is worth a #5 pick. I like Dally and he fills a need, but my answer is that he is not worth the pick.

And if the sky is falling with Cousins and everything else, renting Dally for a year isn't going to change that.
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If Westphal was the issue, it may not be renting. Rent to own.
 
And if I may, why think small if Dalembert for one year is a "smart" move? Why not just take a page from the Rockets book and trade the #5, Marcus Thornton and Chuck Hayes to Orlando to rent Dwight Howard for a the same one year? Damn sure would make the playoffs and boost the team. Then at the end, you still have a sign and trade asset in Howard.
 
JB_kings said:
And if I may, why think small if Dalembert for one year is a "smart" move? Why not just take a page from the Rockets book and trade the #5, Marcus Thornton and Chuck Hayes to Orlando to rent Dwight Howard for a the same one year? Damn sure would make the playoffs and boost the team. Then at the end, you still have a sign and trade asset in Howard.
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Now see, that's just...people are flipping out for no good reason.
 
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