[Game] Kings v. Jazz - Wednesday, Jan. 17 - 7 PT

[SacTownKid]

Bogi Willie Fox. Developing those guys is ALL that matters. And ZBo/Hill add nothing to that effort

I've got to tell you, Bogdan is developed for the most part. They are surely blowing it with Buddy however. If any of those rumors about Viveks opinion of Hield coming over were true he needs to start getting seriously p*ssed.

 

[jcwkings]

That's the thing. They are featuring Mitchell in pick and roll.

What do you mean? under Joerger Mitchell could look forward to a dribble hand off from Kosta Koufos 20 ft from the basket with five seconds on the shotclock.

 

[kingdivac]

I see 19 turnovers led to 9 more shots for the Jazz, and a big chunk of the end result deficit.

 

[Henkel]

What if they would have taken Lauri Maerkanen and Donovan Mitchell 5/10? Both guys look like they will be stars in this league.

Mitchell
Bogi
?
Maerkanen
Willie

Thats a pretty damn good core if you ask me with 2018 pick to potentially fill the SF of the future role.

Last years draft had talent through out the first round. Vlade passed on a lot of talent at the 10th or at the 15th & 20th pick to draft Jackson and Giles. Doesn't look like a smart decision so far.

 

[206Fan]

Remember, this is an 8 year pro. I swear that Grant and Jerry think he's some 18 year old kid. Nope. He's going to be 26 come the summer.

This is what I mean by the fact that Bogdanovic should be held to a higher standard.. I'm not going to praise a 25yearold who's been playing pro basketball since 18 for his bball IQ.

He's been a tremendous player, but I think it's the FO asking Jerry and Grant to pump up noise around him. We saw Jerry get critical about Joerger for a split second when he said he doens't understand why they don't run Fox and WCS in PnR.

 

[SacTownKid]

What do you mean? under Joerger Mitchell could look forward to a dribble hand off from Kosta Koufos 20 ft from the basket with five seconds on the shotclock.

True, true, and remember, it will make him a better player down the line too. The first chapter in the "NBA Coaches Guide to the 3 Year Rebuild" is appropriately titled, "Before you learn to crawl, you must first learn to suck".

 

[SacTownKid]

Last years draft had talent through out the first round. Vlade passed on a lot of talent at the 10th or at the 15th & 20th pick to draft Jackson and Giles. Doesn't look like a smart decision so far.

The worse decision is going for volume 2 years straight and then burying it behind vets some nights and a platoon on others on a 13 win team. Buddy, Bogdan, Fox, and Willie are clearly the players with the highest investment either monetarily, trade, or draft pick wise on the team that figure into the picture long term. They need to be the focal point of the offense and play minutes accordingly. Then trickle in the others around that.

 

[Kingz19]

Poor Z-Bo. He gets ripped apart when he has bad games. He gets ripped apart even more when he has good games...or spectacular games like most of December.

30-15-6

“I’m sooo sick of seeing Z-Bo out there. What good is a win if its Z-Bo? I want Lins and the embarrassing ineffectiveness of Skal Labissiere”

10-6

“Ugggh, we’ll never win with Z-Bo out there playing so poorly. If I wanted missed shots and bad defense..once again...Skal, please”

 

[The Effort Police]

Poor Z-Bo. He gets ripped apart when he has bad games. He gets ripped apart even more when he has good games...or spectacular games like most of December.

30-15-6

“I’m sooo sick of seeing Z-Bo out there. What good is a win if its Z-Bo? I want Lins and the embarrassing ineffectiveness of Skal Labissiere”

10-6

“Ugggh, we’ll never win with Z-Bo out there playing so poorly. If I wanted missed shots and bad defense..once again...Skal, please”

So what? What's your point? The only thing Zbo can do right is not be here. Damn straight. Get his ass outta here.

And he had 6 or 7 good games in December and has been abysmal every time else, and you say he's been a "good" king. Hell no, he's been terrible overall.

 

[Joshoua]

Poor Z-Bo. He gets ripped apart when he has bad games. He gets ripped apart even more when he has good games...or spectacular games like most of December.

30-15-6

“I’m sooo sick of seeing Z-Bo out there. What good is a win if its Z-Bo? I want Lins and the embarrassing ineffectiveness of Skal Labissiere”

10-6

“Ugggh, we’ll never win with Z-Bo out there playing so poorly. If I wanted missed shots and bad defense..once again...Skal, please”

You’re funny I’ll give you that

 

[Kingz19]

So what? What's your point? The only thing Zbo can do right is not be here. Damn straight. Get his ass outta here.

And he had 6 or 7 good games in December and has been abysmal every time else, and you say he's been a "good" king. Hell no, he's been terrible overall.

False. He was strong in November. Excellent in December. It was not just 6 or 7 games and a few games in January and sporadic bad games throughout the season isn’t “most of time”

Besides, Don’t even try to edit and make it about his play now since you gave the response of “yeah, you’re right, I can’t stand the sight of Z-Bo and it doesn’t matter how well or bad he plays.”

My point was to show/spoof the ridiculousness of treating the guy as if he can’t do anything right and his mere presence is an affront. It was inspired by the ridiculous attitude towards Z-Bo on this , forum so your ridiculous “what’s your point?” post as if I’m being the jackass is no surprise...and my point

 

[Kingz19]

You’re funny I’ll give you that

I’ll take it

 

[The Effort Police]

False. He was strong in November. Excellent in December. It was not just 6 or 7 games and a few games in January and sporadic bad games throughout the season isn’t “most of time”

Besides, Don’t even try to edit and make it about his play now since you gave the response of “yeah, you’re right, I can’t stand the sight of Z-Bo and it doesn’t matter how well or bad he plays.”

My point was to show/spoof the ridiculousness of treating the guy as if he can’t do anything right and his mere presence is an affront. It was inspired by the ridiculous attitude towards Z-Bo on this , forum so your ridiculous “what’s your point?” post as if I’m being the jackass is no surprise...and my point

Zbo's signing was idiotic. I hated it from day one, I hate it now, nothing he does can placate me and I'll admit it as many times as you want me to and I'll do it happily. It just so happens that he's been atrocious except for a couple weeks in December (even if you think otherwise), but they mold their dinosaur, league worst offense around him and he's the only one that benefits from it and it doesn't change no matter how he performs. But make no mistake, I feel his signing was a waste of time and money no matter what he does here. Him playing like trash like he has all year just makes it harder on the eyes is all, and a bit more puzzling that they keep going to him.

 

[eMBarkat10n]

Bogdan is clearly the best player on the Kings roster as I type this message.

I don't remember exactly who it was, but I think it was Joe Freaking Ingles, who had an open look at a three (which he made, by the way), and no one, and I mean NO ONE, even attempted to rotate over to him and defend the darn shot. Well, at least out of the few who were supposed to rotate over to him and defend the darn shot. Even Grant commented right after that, with Jerry following right after, and both were just irritated by that defensive sequence/lack of defense.

And, you'd figure that with the veterans we have on this team, one of them would recognize that and do something about it. But, nope. As a matter of fact, it was the young kid, Mr. D Fox, who gave somewhat of a "stare of death" to the rest of the starters. Like, "Dudes, What in the heck are you doing?" ROTATE! ROTATE! ROTATE!". If he did actually say something, I hope he was a tad bit meaner about it. Just a tad bit...

At times, this team has clearly shown us that it can be great. Also, at times, this team has clearly shown us that it can be somewhat close to the worst team in the history of the NBA. Thankfully, we have seen more of the good stuff than the bad.

With all of that being said...

You're all darn right, kids!

It's ALWAYS a DARN good time to be a KINGS fan! ALWAYS!

 

[Cojc]

Fortunately or unfortunately I dropped off to sleep in the first quarter. I live in Ohio and sometimes I just can not watch the game.
Moved out of Ca in 1998 when My job moved me. Had season tickets for years and always get the nba package on tv. I watch most of the Kings games and just a few of the others.

The early season games I really enjoyed as winning a few games always is great and I saw that on here also.
But I wanted to see the Kings of the future play and I understood the need to not throw them to the wolfs if you know what I mean.

I really want the big center from Arizona in the draft or the guy from duke but still a lot of college games left to be played. Our interior presence is very bad and now that we have a great or soon to be great back court someone that actually draws a double team down low once in awhile would be nice.

I knew like a lot of us this season it would be bad but I watch most every game to see the youth or the new person that gives me hope.

Go Kings!!!

 

[JCTNKINGFAN]

Willie is the king of running up his point total in garbagetime.

I’m curious, just when does “garbage time” start? I guess it could be argued that it started at tip off .

From ESPN GameCast play-by-play:

· Willie had 8 points (4/5 FG) and 4 rebounds at the half in about 17.5 minutes, decent numbers.


· After 3 quarters, he had 13 points and 6 rebounds in a total of a little less than 26 minutes. If you were to do a PER36 calculation that projects to roughly 18/8.


· He provided another 5 points and 2 rebounds through the first 6 minutes of the 4th quarter, for a total of 18 points and 8 rebounds through approximately 32 minutes.


· From the 6-minute mark of the 4th quarter to the 2-minute mark, he scored an additional 8 points (3/4 FG, 2/2 FT) and collected 2 more defensive rebounds, giving him his game total of 26 points and 10 rebounds in approximately 37 minutes.

Now, I used to consider the last 2-3 minutes of an NBA game to be garbage time because even a double-digit lead is not safe with the 24-second shot clock and the 3-point shot. Of course, we are talking about the Kings here, so maybe it does start a lot earlier, maybe even at tip off.

He didn’t even play in the last 2 minutes of the game. Coach had him on the floor most of the 4th quarter, though. Would you have him just quit trying and quit working on stuff?

Honestly, looking at the box score it looks like Willie and of course Bogs were our two bright spots (again). Then again these are “old” guys, 24 and 25 respectively, and their careers are due to start winding down now, anytime.

 

[dude12]

This thread is hilarious to read.

 

[King Baller]

Well I watched the game and my summation is that Donovan Mitchell is really good.

It is ironic that the two of the best rookies were picked at #13 and #27

Maybe the Kings need to strive for those picks <LOL>

 

[ESP47]

Well, that was embarrassing. And depressing I might add.

Mitchell throwing down a monster dunk on ZBo as well as a windmill off a steal. Then going on to destroying us, basically saying you should have picked me because there's not a damn player on your team that can do anything close to what I can do.

Now we're all sitting here hoping a kid sitting on the bench in a suit with eleventeen knee surgeries is going to make us forget about yet another draft blunder.

 

[King Baller]

Well, that was embarrassing. And depressing I might add.

Mitchell throwing down a monster dunk on ZBo as well as a windmill off a steal. Then going on to destroying us, basically saying you should have picked me because there's not a damn player on your team that can do anything close to what I can do.

Now we're all sitting here hoping a kid sitting on the bench in a suit with eleventeen knee surgeries is going to make us forget about yet another draft blunder.

Well yes it does feel that way to the impatient Fan inside of me. All that said my practical side says that not all young players come out of the gate like DM has. De'Aaron is 14 months younger so lets see what De'Aaron looks like in 14 months before we all go jump off a bridge

Overshadowed by Mitchell going 25 for 25 and scoring 100 points (Or something resembling that) Bogdan and Willie had very good games. George Hill continues to shoot the ball very well. Why are the Kings not launching 300 or so per game?

When the other team attempts 9 more shots that you................................................................................

 

[dude12]

Our team defense is rather sketchy right now.

 

[kingsfan1984]

Well, that was embarrassing. And depressing I might add.

Mitchell throwing down a monster dunk on ZBo as well as a windmill off a steal. Then going on to destroying us, basically saying you should have picked me because there's not a damn player on your team that can do anything close to what I can do.

Now we're all sitting here hoping a kid sitting on the bench in a suit with eleventeen knee surgeries is going to make us forget about yet another draft blunder.

Could be worse...detroit drafted luke kennard or Monk over Mitchell

 

[ppine]

Our team defense is rather sketchy right now.

That would be an under statement. It is dreadful.

The Kings are physically holding up well to the long season. Mentally and psychologically they appear to have given up. They are going through the motions, especially on defense.

They seemed resigned to their fate as a crappy team. It still troubles me that Anthony slammed Kufous and got away with it in the OKC game. Bring on Papa, Sampson and Cooley. Then at least the opposing teams will remember that they played against a team that does not take crap.

 

[ESP47]

That wold be an under statement. It is dreadful.

The Kings are physically holding up well to the long season. Mentally and psychologically they appear to have given up. They are going through the motions, especially on defense.

They seemed resigned to their fate as a crappy team. It still troubles me that Anthony slammed Kufous and got away with it in the OKC game. Bring on Papa, Sampson and Cooley. Then at least the opposing teams will remember that they played against a team that does not take crap.

"I just told them we need to play with more life, we need to play with more athleticism, and we need to play with a lot more nasty," Dave Joerger said following the Kings 120-105 loss to the Jazz.

"I don't think we are physical enough," Bogdanovic said. "We've got to play tougher and to bring some dirty game on the floor and some smart decisions, like when it's time to help and when it's time to not help. We're still learning, we're still new."

 

[Kingster]

"I just told them we need to play with more life, we need to play with more athleticism, and we need to play with a lot more nasty," Dave Joerger said following the Kings 120-105 loss to the Jazz.

"I don't think we are physical enough," Bogdanovic said. "We've got to play tougher and to bring some dirty game on the floor and some smart decisions, like when it's time to help and when it's time to not help. We're still learning, we're still new."

I think those comments are worth highlighting. If I was forced to make a trade off between smart and nasty I'd take nasty right now. I just want them to go out and clobber some people. The cupcake play on this team has got to go!

 

[ppine]

"I just told them we need to play with more life, we need to play with more athleticism, and we need to play with a lot more nasty," Dave Joerger said following the Kings 120-105 loss to the Jazz.

"I don't think we are physical enough," Bogdanovic said. "We've got to play tougher and to bring some dirty game on the floor and some smart decisions, like when it's time to help and when it's time to not help. We're still learning, we're still new."

It is amazing that the Kings have taken this long to admit it. It has been obvious for months. At least Bogdan said something showing his emerging leadership role. Coach needs to teach nasty in practice. He has avoided the issue for way too long.

 

[ESP47]

I don't even know if I can place the blame on the players though. Fox, Hield, Skal, WCS, JJ etc are all really nice guys. It's no surprise that they don't have a lot of nasty to them.

I wouldn't hold your breath on this roster getting nasty anytime soon. It's not in their personalities.

 

[jcassio]

When the other team attempts 9 more shots that you................................................................................

With our 3 point shooting %, I would recommend that we strive to take 3’s whenever possible (ie bombs away, for those with green lights).
Joerger still sees 3-point shots as if he’s coaching 6-8 years ago. Or maybe that’s his LINS strategy...

 

[ppine]

I don't even know if I can place the blame on the players though. Fox, Hield, Skal, WCS, JJ etc are all really nice guys. It's no surprise that they don't have a lot of nasty to them.

I wouldn't hold your breath on this roster getting nasty anytime soon. It's not in their personalities.

We have talked about this before. You can teach nasty in practice by raising the intensity level all the time. Turn Papa, Sampson and Cooley loose. What do we have to lose? They are like junkyard dogs compared to Skal and Willie and Randolph.

 

[twslam07]

What do you mean? under Joerger Mitchell could look forward to a dribble hand off from Kosta Koufos 20 ft from the basket with five seconds on the shotclock.

This statement doesn't seem to be true.


*Poss = Possessions
*PPP = Points Per Possession
**stats are per 36 min

As you can see, Mitchell is only getting 1 more possession in the pick & roll and is getting more than 3x the looks via handoffs. In fact, Mitchell averages a handoff possession every 3.33 pick & roll possessions vs. Fox who averages a handoff possession every 10.4 pick & roll possessions. Where are you pulling your information?

Just looking at the PPP specifically, Fox has been very ineffective in the pick & roll, and he actually ranks 9th on the team in that stat! Whereas Mitchell is 2nd on his team at 0.82 PPP.