John Henson the best fit next to Cousins?

[Glenn]

I thought Drummond lost 20 pounds. Where did that "fact" come from? As a matter of fact, assuming you believe measurements that are posted publicly, he has gained weight. Does anyone think he will hit 300 pounds?

 

[Bricklayer]

I thought Drummond lost 20 pounds. Where did that "fact" come from? As a matter of fact, assuming you believe measurements that are posted publicly, he has gained weight. Does anyone think he will hit 300 pounds?

278lbs...racking up 7% body fat. That's virtually unheard of. Let's just say at this stage we have no evidence at all he's going to get fat.

That is of course no guarantee of anything but shirtless poster ability -- while no other prospect has ever weighed 275 or more wiht less than 10% body fat (amongst those that took the body fat test), the ones who were closer to the 260-265 range and under 10% haven't been guys who tore up the league: some dude named Jason Keep in 2003. Art Parahouski, Thabeet. Brandon Hunter, Joey Dorsey, Festus Ezili etc. Still, the attempts to take what is unquestionably a huge and very iimpressive positive and somehow turn it into a negative are very bizarre. The guy is a physical specimen.

 

[Glenn]

278lbs...racking up 7% body fat. That's virtually unheard of. Let's just say at this stage we have no evidence at all he's going to get fat.

Perhaps. I still wonder why it was said he lost 20 pounds prior to the combine when he actually gained weight. I thought he was 271 in college and 278 now. That's evidence although weak. 7 pounds a year gets your there in a few years. I was joking then I said it and am joking now. I sure don't have the energy nor time to get into an argument.

As athletic as he is, I still am not impressed with his attitude. There is plenty of evidence to support this. Is anyone surprised that he did well at the combine? Of course he did. His physical abilities are not the problem. Are we suddenly changing our minds because he measures well on physical skills? It's when he is playing 5 other guys of better skill then high school players that is the issue. It's not going to get easier in the NBA.

 

[cuad]

There is no way that any of the combine body fat measurements are legit. At 7% body fat, there's no way he'd have the energy to play basketball.

 

[rainmaker]

There is no way that any of the combine body fat measurements are legit. At 7% body fat, there's no way he'd have the energy to play basketball.

That just might be the most ridiculous post of the year. Care to attempt to back that up? I know I can back up the ridiculousness of that statement, but you made it so I'm curious at to what would make you state such as thing.

 

[Vlade4GM]

Just curious, what method do they use to measure body fat at the combine?

 

[cuad]

Ok I admit that was dumb and wrong, but combine body fat measurements are still inaccurate. I'd guess that they use regular old skinfold calipers.

 

[Glenn]

That just might be the most ridiculous post of the year. Care to attempt to back that up? I know I can back up the ridiculousness of that statement, but you made it so I'm curious at to what would make you state such as thing.

Here's what I know: Jerry Rice, as people might or might not know, was a perfectionist and was constantly looking for ways of getting better. One year he thought he would get as thin as possible to improve his speed. He got down to slightly below 5% body fat and found that he lost a lot of energy. That proves nothing as far as Drummond goes but at least it shows that cuad is not an idiot. There IS a point where you can get too thin. Considering Drummond has gained a little weight I doubt if he has to worry much.

 

[Vlade4GM]

I was actually kind of disappointed by Drummond's measurements. Yeah, he measured in taller than people expected, but I was expecting him to have at least a 9'3 standing reach, and he ended up just having an average reach for a center despite having a 7'6 wingspan and wearing 2 inches thick shoes.

 

[SacTownKid]

I was actually kind of disappointed by Drummond's measurements. Yeah, he measured in taller than people expected, but I was expecting him to have at least a 9'3 standing reach, and he ended up just having an average reach for a center despite having a 7'6 wingspan and wearing 2 inches thick shoes.

Low sloping shoulders. I want to see his max standing vert. If his running vert is 38 but his standing vert is 28, then not so impressive because you don't get a running start for most blocks. In the end it's all numbers, over 9 feet is pretty long for a forward.

 

[Vlade4GM]

Low sloping shoulders. I want to see his max standing vert. If his running vert is 38 but his standing vert is 28, then not so impressive because you don't get a running start for most blocks. In the end it's all numbers, over 9 feet is pretty long for a forward.

He's not a forward though.

 

[Bricklayer]

He's not a forward though.

he might be

that guy in college may have been 20lbs too heavy and told to play out of position


would also lie to note I think they may have chanced something in how they were measuring reach this year. Nobody measured really long. Davis measure dout at 9' even. If so he's going to block about half a shot a game. I'm wondering if maybe in years passed they measured it wiht shoes, and then this year switched to without?

 

[cuad]

Here's what I know: Jerry Rice, as people might or might not know, was a perfectionist and was constantly looking for ways of getting better. One year he thought he would get as thin as possible to improve his speed. He got down to slightly below 5% body fat and found that he lost a lot of energy. That proves nothing as far as Drummond goes but at least it shows that cuad is not an idiot. There IS a point where you can get too thin. Considering Drummond has gained a little weight I doubt if he has to worry much.

That's the kind of thing I was getting at, but 7% is probably way above that threshold, so that was still a bad post.

 

[Hallama]

I'd take Drummond if available at 5. Even with my concerns:

Was exposed at UCONN to a degree (taking into account, he could've been still in HS)
Might take 2-4 years to groom
After those 2-4 years, he may be an "east coast" guy = Knicks, Celts, Brooklyn
Questionable bball IQ
Questionable motor

That's what an unique talent he may become, risks be damned. Just watching the deep playoff push should show you need the horses. It's cute having a playoff team, but if you want to go deeper, you've got to take the risk.

 

[Vlade4GM]

he might be

that guy in college may have been 20lbs too heavy and told to play out of position


would also lie to note I think they may have chanced something in how they were measuring reach this year. Nobody measured really long. Davis measure dout at 9' even. If so he's going to block about half a shot a game. I'm wondering if maybe in years passed they measured it wiht shoes, and then this year switched to without?

I have no reason to think he might be. In fact, I find it incredibly disturbing that he's comparing himself to Kevin Durant. That doesn't sound like someone who takes himself seriously, it sounds like a dreamer who just wants screw around and get attention.

That would be relieving to hear, but I wouldn't assume so unless there's some kind of confirmation.

 

[bajaden]

There is no way that any of the combine body fat measurements are legit. At 7% body fat, there's no way he'd have the energy to play basketball.

Well, I can't speak for everyone, but back in the day when they did the Body fat test using a water tank, I measured out to 7% body fat, and I had plenty of energy. So I'm not sure what your basing your statement on.

 

[bajaden]

Ok I admit that was dumb and wrong, but combine body fat measurements are still inaccurate. I'd guess that they use regular old skinfold calipers.

I have no idea how they measure, but I would assume they use the same system that the NFL uses. Its fast, and its accurate.

 

[bajaden]

Here's what I know: Jerry Rice, as people might or might not know, was a perfectionist and was constantly looking for ways of getting better. One year he thought he would get as thin as possible to improve his speed. He got down to slightly below 5% body fat and found that he lost a lot of energy. That proves nothing as far as Drummond goes but at least it shows that cuad is not an idiot. There IS a point where you can get too thin. Considering Drummond has gained a little weight I doubt if he has to worry much.

Its also not unusual to lose body fat, replace it with muscle, and gain weight. So esentially you could be in better shape, but weigh more.

 

[bajaden]

He's not a forward though.

I think if you play Powerforward, then your a forward. I would assume thats where the Kings would play him if they drafted him.

 

[bajaden]

I think everyone knows that I'm not a fan of how Drummond played this season, but if my choice is to choose between Henson, Drummond, and Sullinger as a big man, then I'm going to take a flyer on Drummond. I think Henson is just as much a risk long term as Drummond is, just for different reasons. Sullinger can't jump, and certainly can't play PF. Our only use for him would be to use him as a backup to Cousins. And thats fine, if thats what your looking for.

As far as Drummond comparing himself to Durant, I could care less. At least he compared himself to one of the best players in the NBA, that has a great work ethic. I'd be more worried if he compared himself to Brendan Haywood.

 

[hiero]

Personally, I want to see the name Drummond or Henson called on draft night for the Kings. I've watched Henson play against bigger players and don't remember him getting squashed. He should be just fine.

I'd be pretty happy with either, Henson has shotblocking iq and defensive awareness that you just can't teach. he's a difference maker on the defensive end big time. obviously needs weight but he has cousins there to help our against bigger guys.

 

[rhythmless]

I think if you play Powerforward, then your a forward. I would assume thats where the Kings would play him if they drafted him.

The position nomenclature is antiquated and inaccurate to describe today's game. It's mroe like this nowadays:

Lead guard
2 Swingmen
2 Bigs

If you get Drummond/Cuz, Cuz takes the slower player and Drummond takes the faster player. Not a lot of days where one will lose out on height, so all you have to do is switch based on mobility and/or better offensive player. I don't care what you call them, PF/C, C/PF. If Drummond is drafted, he's drafted specifically to rebound, take the star big, play weakside defense, shotblock, and be the highflying defensive anchor next to the supremely talented groundbound offensive juggernaut that is DMC. Every weakness of DMC can be covered up if Drummond turns into what he can be. IF.

If it works, you're looking at a big man duo that will be the talk of the league, with a perfect efficient hustle big in JT.

 

[Vlade4GM]

I think if you play Powerforward, then your a forward. I would assume thats where the Kings would play him if they drafted him.

Everyone is suggesting that he basically play the role of a center offensively and defensively, whether you call him a PF or not, is immaterial.

 

[Vlade4GM]

As far as Drummond comparing himself to Durant, I could care less. At least he compared himself to one of the best players in the NBA, that has a great work ethic. I'd be more worried if he compared himself to Brendan Haywood.

The problem is that it gives off the impression that he doesn't know what he really is. That's a problem with today's bigs, they're obsessed with playing out on the perimeter, and they end up playing stupid and having crappy fundamentals because of it. I'm so completely sick of it, it's ruining the game.

 

[bajaden]

The problem is that it gives off the impression that he doesn't know what he really is. That's a problem with today's bigs, they're obsessed with playing out on the perimeter, and they end up playing stupid and having crappy fundamentals because of it. I'm so completely sick of it, it's ruining the game.

You could say that, or, you could say that he has an entirely different opinion of what his skills are and how he should be played. That he does know who he is, and UCONN didn't. Doesn't mean he's right. If you watched him play in highschool, his game was entirely different than how he was used at UCONN. I'm not trying to make excuses for him. But possibly explain his statement, and perhaps to some degree, his lackluster performance this year.

Personally I don't care what you call him. 50 years ago you had two guards, two forwards, and one center. Nothing has changed but the nomenclature. Silly to even argue over it.

 

[SacTownKid]

he might be

that guy in college may have been 20lbs too heavy and told to play out of position


would also lie to note I think they may have chanced something in how they were measuring reach this year. Nobody measured really long. Davis measure dout at 9' even. If so he's going to block about half a shot a game. I'm wondering if maybe in years passed they measured it wiht shoes, and then this year switched to without?

I doubt it, we would have heard something. I think it's just because he gets a lot of his height from his neck, both he and Drummond have lower shoulders than say Demarcus Cousins who has very broad and high shoulders. It's not always length, its also timing and that's the super talent that Davis has. I doubt his superstar potential big time but we've seen just insanely timed blocks from him. He's also a quick leaper. Then again Crowder grew almost 2 inches so who knows.

 

[bajaden]

I've been giving this a lot of thought. Shows I have too much time on my hands, but, I can't get Meyers Leonard out of my head. He did a great job at the combine, and proved he's up there in an elite class as far as athleticism goes for big men. He played on a guard oriented team, with bad guards. They seldom got him the ball in the post when he wanted/needed it. Despite the team being dysfunctional, he did manage to make good improvements from his freshman to sophmore years. Personally, I would take him over Zeller or Henson. Simply on upside alone. He's a better athlete than Zeller, and probably a better athlete than Henson. And unlike Henson, he already weighs 245 pounds. He also proved he could block shots at Illinois.

If he had played at one of the top basketball schools, I'd bet your house that he would be rated higher on most mocks. I think this kid is going to be pretty good in a couple of years, and in the end, be a better player than either Henson or Zeller. You notice I'm not comparing him to Drummond. So many grey areas with Drummond, its hard to make a comparison. He's not the athlete Drummond is, but he's not that far behind. And he seems to have more fire in his belly.

You have to admit, this draft is a lot more fun to talk about than last years. A lot more talent available.

 

[vikinginferno]

^Totally agree on this being a fun draft. Definitely one of the more exciting ones in recent memory with a lot of good players and really no idea how it will play out after Anthony Davis first. The next 5 or so players could go anywhere in that range.

 

[hrdboild]

I've been giving this a lot of thought. Shows I have too much time on my hands, but, I can't get Meyers Leonard out of my head. He did a great job at the combine, and proved he's up there in an elite class as far as athleticism goes for big men. He played on a guard oriented team, with bad guards. They seldom got him the ball in the post when he wanted/needed it. Despite the team being dysfunctional, he did manage to make good improvements from his freshman to sophmore years. Personally, I would take him over Zeller or Henson. Simply on upside alone. He's a better athlete than Zeller, and probably a better athlete than Henson. And unlike Henson, he already weighs 245 pounds. He also proved he could block shots at Illinois.

If he had played at one of the top basketball schools, I'd bet your house that he would be rated higher on most mocks. I think this kid is going to be pretty good in a couple of years, and in the end, be a better player than either Henson or Zeller. You notice I'm not comparing him to Drummond. So many grey areas with Drummond, its hard to make a comparison. He's not the athlete Drummond is, but he's not that far behind. And he seems to have more fire in his belly.

You have to admit, this draft is a lot more fun to talk about than last years. A lot more talent available.

I've been thinking the same thing. Meyers Leonard looks like he'll be a better pro than either Tyler Zeller or John Henson. He'd be an excellent target at 10 for whoever swings a deal with NO.

 

[rainmaker]

I've been giving this a lot of thought. Shows I have too much time on my hands, but, I can't get Meyers Leonard out of my head. He did a great job at the combine, and proved he's up there in an elite class as far as athleticism goes for big men. He played on a guard oriented team, with bad guards. They seldom got him the ball in the post when he wanted/needed it. Despite the team being dysfunctional, he did manage to make good improvements from his freshman to sophmore years. Personally, I would take him over Zeller or Henson. Simply on upside alone. He's a better athlete than Zeller, and probably a better athlete than Henson. And unlike Henson, he already weighs 245 pounds. He also proved he could block shots at Illinois.

If he had played at one of the top basketball schools, I'd bet your house that he would be rated higher on most mocks. I think this kid is going to be pretty good in a couple of years, and in the end, be a better player than either Henson or Zeller. You notice I'm not comparing him to Drummond. So many grey areas with Drummond, its hard to make a comparison. He's not the athlete Drummond is, but he's not that far behind. And he seems to have more fire in his belly.

You have to admit, this draft is a lot more fun to talk about than last years. A lot more talent available.

I'm curious Baja, care to rank your picks for our team? I'd be interested to see your top 5 picks which we realistically have a shot at, although I'd say even with the slight possibility MKG drops to us Davis is the only one we have no shot at.