It's official - the 49ers suck
- Thread starter VF21
- Start date
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
I could have told you that years ago when I still lived in Sacto. 
BTW, that was truly a putrid anti-Montana collapse by Tim Rattay in the second half there. How many TOs did he have there? 4? 5?
But there's always a silver lining -- Niners should have their complete choice from the college kids this spring.
BTW, that was truly a putrid anti-Montana collapse by Tim Rattay in the second half there. How many TOs did he have there? 4? 5?
But there's always a silver lining -- Niners should have their complete choice from the college kids this spring.
slugking50
All-Star
I could say, "I told......." but I wont
We are actually worse then I thought...... Sad to say.....: sighs :
We are actually worse then I thought...... Sad to say.....: sighs :
crypticone
G-League
It doesn't matter who is available in the draft. John York will not pick anyone if he thinks that the guy will eventually be worth a bundle of money. This team will not have another winning season until they change owners and get a coach who's style isnt more conducive to coaching Pee Wee football. With all these coaching legends coming out of retirement, maybe we can convince Bill Walsh to come back. Anyway, I am a true fan and was with the Niners when they were an awesome team and a class organization, and I am certainly not going to abandon them now that times are bad. I will just mentally prepare myself every week for my 3 hours of frustration. I have tickets to a couple of games coming up and was thinking about pulling out the old New Orleans Aints brown paper bag.VF21 said:I was so excited yesterday, until they seemingly beyond all belief were able to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory...
Okay, let's see...
Who's looking good for the draft?
It's not easy being a 49er fan right now.
...sigh...
G_M
Starter
The 49ers are going to be BAD for long time! They are becoming Clipperesque in their management style.
20 to 30% of their salary for the next two yeras is "DEAD" money paid out to players no longer on the team. Furthermore, York is a disaster as an owner. If the 49ers get the 1st pick they won't be able to sign the player. York is the genius who let Mooch go to sign Erickson. York did not want to pony up for a legit coach so he hired Erickson.
Oh well...it was a GREAT run!
20 to 30% of their salary for the next two yeras is "DEAD" money paid out to players no longer on the team. Furthermore, York is a disaster as an owner. If the 49ers get the 1st pick they won't be able to sign the player. York is the genius who let Mooch go to sign Erickson. York did not want to pony up for a legit coach so he hired Erickson.
Oh well...it was a GREAT run!
You and I seem to think pretty much alike, with the possible exception of your assessment of Dennis Erickson. I'm a big HUR-RI-CANES fan, and was actually pretty up about Erickson's hiring. For whatever reason, including having his hands pretty much tied by York the D***, I'll agree he hasn't been very effective. I've been a fan of the 49ers through the fairly good years, the horrible years, the Montana-Young years, and now. I'm not about to give up. I do like the idea of the brown paper bag, however!crypticone said:
York needs to be gone.
BRING BACK EDDIE D AND BILL WALSH!!!
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Been a long time since Erickson coached the Canes. He's never done squat in the pros. Very odd hiring -- established mediocre coach. Not a great coach being brought in. Nor an unproven guy who they hoped MIGHT be great. But an established middling coach who's teams always underacheived in the pros. Weird.
But it really doesn't matter with this roster. The best of coaches would be lucky to get 4-5 wins out of the Niners talent.
But it really doesn't matter with this roster. The best of coaches would be lucky to get 4-5 wins out of the Niners talent.
Not a weird hiring if you consider York's proclivity for not wanting to spend the big bucks. Get a big enough name to keep the hounds at bay, but spend ONLY as much as you have to.
York doesn't care if the franchise wins or not. I personally think he's sticking it to the team on a regular basis as a way to get a vicarious thrill out of sticking it to his brother-in-law.
It wouldn't surprise me at all to find out York is trying to alienate the fans so he can sell the team. (Hmmm. Maybe someone should make a movie about something like that... )
York doesn't care if the franchise wins or not. I personally think he's sticking it to the team on a regular basis as a way to get a vicarious thrill out of sticking it to his brother-in-law.
It wouldn't surprise me at all to find out York is trying to alienate the fans so he can sell the team. (Hmmm. Maybe someone should make a movie about something like that...
)SaCTowNFeveR
Bench
Man what a disappointing season, being a niners fan I really have stopped watching their games, it disgusts me. But I really didn't expect much from them this year because they're kind of in a rebuilding stage, but the injuries are killing them. I'm just use to them making the playoffs but this season is hard to watch. 
The only problem with a rebuilding season is if you're not able to buy the materials you need to do the job correctly.
Have I mentioned lately that I think Denise DeBartolo York and her husband, York the D***, should be stripped of all ownership rights?
BRING BACK EDDIE!!!
Have I mentioned lately that I think Denise DeBartolo York and her husband, York the D***, should be stripped of all ownership rights?
BRING BACK EDDIE!!!
slugking50
All-Star
Bricklayer said:
: sighs :
So true. We have alot of small and weak players who couldnt tackle if their life depended on it....Defensively anyways....
We have no legit QB. They both stink.We have no O-Line....... Just dreadful....
crypticone
G-League
I think we should give Dennis Erickson a lot of support in his time of need. I support him in taking the Washington State job.
slugking50
All-Star
BJax24 said:
2 things...
1. They have definately more talent.
2. They are winning despite Dennis Green. Hes an awful field manager!
slugking50
All-Star
It from Sundays CC Times but I thought this was interesting.
===================
49ers brass blame the team's decline on cap woes and injuries, but others disagree
[size=-1]By Eric Gilmore[/size]
[size=-1]CONTRA COSTA TIMES[/size]
The clock was winding down late in the fourth quarter of the 49ers' 42-27 loss last Sunday to the Seattle Seahawks, and fans were streaming out of Monster Park.
One man heading toward the exit asked his friend the question that must be on the minds of most 49ers fans about their 1-7 team.
Why did the 49ers get so bad so quickly?
Team owner John York and general manager Terry Donahue have blamed the 49ers' nose dive largely on salary cap woes and injuries.
Donahue, who received a four-year contract extension in September, said he has a plan to escape "this salary cap hell" by 2006. It's a plan that includes taking some nasty-tasting medicine now in terms of cutting high-priced veterans and building with affordable youth.
That's the 49ers' story, and they're sticking to it.
Of course there are other views. A handful of NFL executives and scouts and former 49ers weighed in on the struggles of a team that was in the playoffs just two years ago.
Where to begin?
Well, the 49ers went through so-called salary cap hell in 1999 and 2000 after a run that included the team's fifth Super Bowl championship in 1994 and 15 playoff appearances in 16 seasons.
Former 49ers president Carmen Policy and general manager Dwight Clark took most of the blame for that cap crisis and fall to 4-12 in '99 and 6-10 in 2000. The 49ers called on Bill Walsh, the architect of their dynasty, to help them get back on financial track and do the dirty work as general manager, cutting players such as wide receiver Jerry Rice.
In 2001, the 49ers went 12-4 and returned to the playoffs. Problem solved? Not exactly.
"I think the most frustrating thing for people out there that I talk to is I don't think people understand or ever had it explained to them why they're suddenly in this terrible situation again," said former 49ers center Randy Cross, now an NFL analyst for CBS.
"This was such an atrocity that Carmen and Dwight perpetrated upon the 49er kingdom, and it would never happen again. The interesting thing is, it's nobody's fault there. To me it's nothing more than really, really sad."
ESPN's Chris Mortensen may have shed some light on the 49ers' plight last Sunday when he said they had a "shoestring budget disguised as salary cap woes," a charge Donahue vehemently denied.
Donahue, however, often talks about the $28 million in cap space that goes to "dead money" this year for players no longer with the team. That's $28 million out of the $80.6 million limit.
So-called dead money appears when a team cuts or trades a player before his contract expires. The rest of that player's prorated signing bonus immediately counts against the salary cap.
"What people seem to forget is we're not talking about cash, we're talking about an accounting system," said one former NFL executive, speaking on condition of anonymity. "Even though you have dead money, you don't pay them their salaries, which could amount to God knows how much.
"You might have some dead money, but you don't have any cash out of pocket. You've already paid the signing bonuses."
When the 49ers cut quarterback Jeff Garcia after the 2003 season, for example, they took a salary cap hit of $10.3 million. But his $10 million salary for 2004 disappeared, too, saving York big bucks.
York spent $26.9 million in signing bonuses after last season on players such as cornerback Ahmed Plummer, running back Kevan Barlow and tight end Eric Johnson.
But the only 49er receiving a seven-figure base salary this year, according to the NFL Players Association's Web site, is injured linebacker Julian Peterson, the team's designated exclusive franchise player.
How does that compare with the rest of the NFC West teams? The Seattle Seahawks have 17 players receiving seven-figure base salaries this year. The Arizona Cardinals have 15. The St. Louis Rams have six.
"The last two years we've had the lowest player (compensation) in the league," Donahue said. "Because we had the highest for so long. The old saying, what goes up, must come down.
"We'll come out of that as soon as we get our cap in order. We're almost out of it now. Although it's been a very painful process, we're almost out of it."
According to Donahue, the 49ers spent $69 million over the salary cap from 1994-2002, thanks to various bonuses. The last two years they've spent "roughly $30 million" under the cap figure in actual cash.
"Next year we have to be under the cap again, (but) it won't be like this," Donahue said.
One former 49er, speaking on condition of anonymity, said the team's problems start with York and his wife, Denise DeBartolo York. He criticized them for their frugal ways and their inability to make the team's dream of a new stadium -- the key to earning much-needed extra revenue for signing free agents in the NFL -- a reality.
"They're treating the Bay Area fans like they're stupid, unsophisticated," the former player said. "In actuality, it's the most sophisticated market.
"People aren't going to stand for it anymore. They're cheap, they've had bad drafts and they've made excuses. ... We've had this same plan for seven years. What's changed? Nothing. It's all just .... I don't know what it is. It's disinformation. I guess they think the Bay Area people are stupid."
Donahue countered that York isn't cheap, pointing to the nearly $27 million he spent to re-sign free agents this year. Donahue, though, also said that York is at a financial disadvantage because the 49ers play in one of the NFL's oldest stadiums and lack the revenue streams that teams with new stadiums enjoy.
"We don't have a stadium that allows us to be in a consistently profitable situation as an organization," Donahue said. "We have to get a stadium deal done in order to do the things financially we need to get done.
"In the meantime, we've got to do a great job of drafting. We have to do an outstanding job of coaching. We've got to get some (affordable) free agents that can come in and be productive, like a Travis Kirschke."
Former New Orleans Saints general manager Randy Mueller said teams with "very frugal" owners can succeed. He cited the Rooney family in Pittsburgh and Tennessee Titans owner Bud Adams as two examples.
"You can't say that formula doesn't work," Mueller said. "Others have proved that it has. You just have to make sure you're acquiring talent along the way."
That's the rub, one veteran NFC scout said, speaking on condition of anonymity.
He said the 49ers' problems go beyond salary cap constraints. He pointed to mediocre drafts and bad personnel decisions. He also pointed a finger at Donahue, a former UCLA coach.
"He's a coach and has no (personnel) background," the scout said. "They have nobody who grinds the country and can find the gems.
"I think Donahue is getting a free pass. It's salary cap this, salary cap that. He's a coach. He's not a personnel guy. ... In this business, I just look at who the personnel people are. People like me out on the road, we know who knows talent."
Donahue spent 20 seasons as UCLA's head coach and three years with CBS as a college football analyst before becoming the 49ers' director of player personnel in 1999 under Walsh. Donahue replaced Walsh as general manager in May 2001.
"Certainly I have more years in coaching than in personnel, but I've been in the NFL in personnel for six years," Donahue said. "The reality of it is, when you're in coaching, you're also working in personnel, directly or indirectly. The two are different, but you have to classify them as first cousins."
Donahue has made the 49ers' draft-day calls since 2002. The results are mixed at best.
Only four of 10 picks from the 2002 draft remain on the 49ers' roster: cornerback Mike Rumph (first round), linebacker Saleem Rasheed (third), guard Eric Heitmann (seventh) and tackle/guard Kyle Kosier (seventh). Rumph was starting before suffering a season-ending injury. Kosier and Heitmann are starters.
Two members of the 49ers' 2003 draft class are starting: defensive tackle Anthony Adams and wide receiver Brandon Lloyd. But top pick Kwame Harris lost his starting job at left tackle because of injuries and poor play.
=======================
To be continued on next post..
===================
49ers brass blame the team's decline on cap woes and injuries, but others disagree
[size=-1]By Eric Gilmore[/size]
[size=-1]CONTRA COSTA TIMES[/size]
The clock was winding down late in the fourth quarter of the 49ers' 42-27 loss last Sunday to the Seattle Seahawks, and fans were streaming out of Monster Park.
One man heading toward the exit asked his friend the question that must be on the minds of most 49ers fans about their 1-7 team.
Why did the 49ers get so bad so quickly?
Team owner John York and general manager Terry Donahue have blamed the 49ers' nose dive largely on salary cap woes and injuries.
Donahue, who received a four-year contract extension in September, said he has a plan to escape "this salary cap hell" by 2006. It's a plan that includes taking some nasty-tasting medicine now in terms of cutting high-priced veterans and building with affordable youth.
That's the 49ers' story, and they're sticking to it.
Of course there are other views. A handful of NFL executives and scouts and former 49ers weighed in on the struggles of a team that was in the playoffs just two years ago.
Where to begin?
Well, the 49ers went through so-called salary cap hell in 1999 and 2000 after a run that included the team's fifth Super Bowl championship in 1994 and 15 playoff appearances in 16 seasons.
Former 49ers president Carmen Policy and general manager Dwight Clark took most of the blame for that cap crisis and fall to 4-12 in '99 and 6-10 in 2000. The 49ers called on Bill Walsh, the architect of their dynasty, to help them get back on financial track and do the dirty work as general manager, cutting players such as wide receiver Jerry Rice.
In 2001, the 49ers went 12-4 and returned to the playoffs. Problem solved? Not exactly.
"I think the most frustrating thing for people out there that I talk to is I don't think people understand or ever had it explained to them why they're suddenly in this terrible situation again," said former 49ers center Randy Cross, now an NFL analyst for CBS.
"This was such an atrocity that Carmen and Dwight perpetrated upon the 49er kingdom, and it would never happen again. The interesting thing is, it's nobody's fault there. To me it's nothing more than really, really sad."
ESPN's Chris Mortensen may have shed some light on the 49ers' plight last Sunday when he said they had a "shoestring budget disguised as salary cap woes," a charge Donahue vehemently denied.
Donahue, however, often talks about the $28 million in cap space that goes to "dead money" this year for players no longer with the team. That's $28 million out of the $80.6 million limit.
So-called dead money appears when a team cuts or trades a player before his contract expires. The rest of that player's prorated signing bonus immediately counts against the salary cap.
"What people seem to forget is we're not talking about cash, we're talking about an accounting system," said one former NFL executive, speaking on condition of anonymity. "Even though you have dead money, you don't pay them their salaries, which could amount to God knows how much.
"You might have some dead money, but you don't have any cash out of pocket. You've already paid the signing bonuses."
When the 49ers cut quarterback Jeff Garcia after the 2003 season, for example, they took a salary cap hit of $10.3 million. But his $10 million salary for 2004 disappeared, too, saving York big bucks.
York spent $26.9 million in signing bonuses after last season on players such as cornerback Ahmed Plummer, running back Kevan Barlow and tight end Eric Johnson.
But the only 49er receiving a seven-figure base salary this year, according to the NFL Players Association's Web site, is injured linebacker Julian Peterson, the team's designated exclusive franchise player.
How does that compare with the rest of the NFC West teams? The Seattle Seahawks have 17 players receiving seven-figure base salaries this year. The Arizona Cardinals have 15. The St. Louis Rams have six.
"The last two years we've had the lowest player (compensation) in the league," Donahue said. "Because we had the highest for so long. The old saying, what goes up, must come down.
"We'll come out of that as soon as we get our cap in order. We're almost out of it now. Although it's been a very painful process, we're almost out of it."
According to Donahue, the 49ers spent $69 million over the salary cap from 1994-2002, thanks to various bonuses. The last two years they've spent "roughly $30 million" under the cap figure in actual cash.
"Next year we have to be under the cap again, (but) it won't be like this," Donahue said.
One former 49er, speaking on condition of anonymity, said the team's problems start with York and his wife, Denise DeBartolo York. He criticized them for their frugal ways and their inability to make the team's dream of a new stadium -- the key to earning much-needed extra revenue for signing free agents in the NFL -- a reality.
"They're treating the Bay Area fans like they're stupid, unsophisticated," the former player said. "In actuality, it's the most sophisticated market.
"People aren't going to stand for it anymore. They're cheap, they've had bad drafts and they've made excuses. ... We've had this same plan for seven years. What's changed? Nothing. It's all just .... I don't know what it is. It's disinformation. I guess they think the Bay Area people are stupid."
Donahue countered that York isn't cheap, pointing to the nearly $27 million he spent to re-sign free agents this year. Donahue, though, also said that York is at a financial disadvantage because the 49ers play in one of the NFL's oldest stadiums and lack the revenue streams that teams with new stadiums enjoy.
"We don't have a stadium that allows us to be in a consistently profitable situation as an organization," Donahue said. "We have to get a stadium deal done in order to do the things financially we need to get done.
"In the meantime, we've got to do a great job of drafting. We have to do an outstanding job of coaching. We've got to get some (affordable) free agents that can come in and be productive, like a Travis Kirschke."
Former New Orleans Saints general manager Randy Mueller said teams with "very frugal" owners can succeed. He cited the Rooney family in Pittsburgh and Tennessee Titans owner Bud Adams as two examples.
"You can't say that formula doesn't work," Mueller said. "Others have proved that it has. You just have to make sure you're acquiring talent along the way."
That's the rub, one veteran NFC scout said, speaking on condition of anonymity.
He said the 49ers' problems go beyond salary cap constraints. He pointed to mediocre drafts and bad personnel decisions. He also pointed a finger at Donahue, a former UCLA coach.
"He's a coach and has no (personnel) background," the scout said. "They have nobody who grinds the country and can find the gems.
"I think Donahue is getting a free pass. It's salary cap this, salary cap that. He's a coach. He's not a personnel guy. ... In this business, I just look at who the personnel people are. People like me out on the road, we know who knows talent."
Donahue spent 20 seasons as UCLA's head coach and three years with CBS as a college football analyst before becoming the 49ers' director of player personnel in 1999 under Walsh. Donahue replaced Walsh as general manager in May 2001.
"Certainly I have more years in coaching than in personnel, but I've been in the NFL in personnel for six years," Donahue said. "The reality of it is, when you're in coaching, you're also working in personnel, directly or indirectly. The two are different, but you have to classify them as first cousins."
Donahue has made the 49ers' draft-day calls since 2002. The results are mixed at best.
Only four of 10 picks from the 2002 draft remain on the 49ers' roster: cornerback Mike Rumph (first round), linebacker Saleem Rasheed (third), guard Eric Heitmann (seventh) and tackle/guard Kyle Kosier (seventh). Rumph was starting before suffering a season-ending injury. Kosier and Heitmann are starters.
Two members of the 49ers' 2003 draft class are starting: defensive tackle Anthony Adams and wide receiver Brandon Lloyd. But top pick Kwame Harris lost his starting job at left tackle because of injuries and poor play.
=======================
To be continued on next post..
slugking50
All-Star
Continud from previous post
==========
Guard Justin Smiley and cornerback Shawntae Spencer, a pair of 2004 second-rounders, are starting -- Spencer is an emergency fill-in. Rookie Andy Lee, a sixth-round pick, is the 49ers' punter.
But wide receiver Rashaun Woods, the team's No. 1 pick, has barely played.
Donahue, though, does have his supporters in the league. Tennessee Titans general manager Floyd Reese said Donahue has the 49ers headed "in the right direction" in terms of rebuilding the team.
"Are they where they want to be?" Reese asked. "No, not yet. I think Terry is the style of guy, he knows how to do it. He knows it's going to take time. He's in it for the long haul. It will end up working."
Little has worked out well for the 49ers this season. They've been devastated by injuries to players such as Peterson, Rumph, center Jeremy Newberry, Plummer and quarterback Tim Rattay. Add that to the mass exodus of high-priced veterans, including Garcia, wide receiver Terrell Owens and left tackle Derrick Deese, and it's easy to understand the 1-7 record.
"It's not Camelot anymore," one AFC general manager said, speaking on condition of anonymity. "You have a rookie quarterback for all intents and purposes. Now, over time, he can get better.
"That's where it all starts. But there's your problem with Camelot. Who are you going to compare him to? The last three (quarterbacks) were multiple Pro Bowlers and two reside in Canton."
Actually, Joe Montana is in the Pro Football Hall of Fame and Steve Young is expected to join him in Canton next year. Garcia made three NFC Pro Bowl teams.
According to Cross, the level of talent on the team is "probably decent" if every player is 100 percent healthy. The former NFL executive called the 49ers a .500 team if completely healthy.
"They just don't have any flash now," the NFC scout said. "This thing has gone down so fast. I don't know what York's thinking."
About the only constant for the 49ers recently has been change, another reason for their free fall.
York fired coach Steve Mariucci after the 2002 season even though he led the 49ers to back-to-back playoff berths. The 49ers hired Dennis Erickson, a coach with no connection to the Walsh coaching tree.
This year, the 49ers parted ways with their two biggest offensive weapons, Garcia and Owens and a long list of veterans. In the 49ers' defense, the volatile Owens had become a locker room cancer. Keeping him was not a realistic option.
"This system is all about acquiring players and making those investments pay in the long haul," Mueller said. "When you change course in midstream on a contract, there are ramifications."
Some teams, apparently, deal with salary cap rules better than others. The 49ers appeared to be getting their financial house in order after purging high-priced players in 1999 and 2000. Now they're complaining about salary cap hell again.
"All it really takes nowadays is one or two bad deals," Cross said. "It doesn't take too many airballs to put you in a hell of a hole."
The 49ers' quick return to the playoffs helped create more salary cap problems, the former NFL executive said.
"Now all of a sudden some of those young guys want to have contract extensions for big, big bucks," he said.
In 2001, Donahue signed Garcia to a six-year, $36 million deal.
According to Donahue, the 49ers never completely escaped their salary cap problems before their two-year resurgence.
"We began taking our medicine a little bit ... but what happened to us is that Jeff Garcia emerged as a Pro Bowl quarterback," Donahue said.
"We went 12-4 and 10-6. We decided to go for it again. We decided we're close. We gave Garcia a big contract. We extended guys like (Fred) Beasley, Newberry, Garrison Hearst. We went out and got Ron Stone. We went for it again. We didn't make it, but once we went for it again, the ship was about to sink."
Donahue's so-called new plan to fix the 49ers' salary cap problems is "almost identical" to the old plan the team unveiled in 1999, the former NFL executive said.
The 49ers started cutting high-priced veterans and adding affordable young players in '99.
"Mariucci and his staff put a smile on their faces and coached up a lot of young (players)," he said. "The next year they were a little better. The next year they got in the playoffs."
In other words, it's deja vu all over again.
"You make decisions along the way that put you in these predicaments," Mueller said. "The difference in this case is that (when this happened) before they had a Super Bowl or two and you could say, 'This is what it cost us.' It was easier to sell.
==========
Guard Justin Smiley and cornerback Shawntae Spencer, a pair of 2004 second-rounders, are starting -- Spencer is an emergency fill-in. Rookie Andy Lee, a sixth-round pick, is the 49ers' punter.
But wide receiver Rashaun Woods, the team's No. 1 pick, has barely played.
Donahue, though, does have his supporters in the league. Tennessee Titans general manager Floyd Reese said Donahue has the 49ers headed "in the right direction" in terms of rebuilding the team.
"Are they where they want to be?" Reese asked. "No, not yet. I think Terry is the style of guy, he knows how to do it. He knows it's going to take time. He's in it for the long haul. It will end up working."
Little has worked out well for the 49ers this season. They've been devastated by injuries to players such as Peterson, Rumph, center Jeremy Newberry, Plummer and quarterback Tim Rattay. Add that to the mass exodus of high-priced veterans, including Garcia, wide receiver Terrell Owens and left tackle Derrick Deese, and it's easy to understand the 1-7 record.
"It's not Camelot anymore," one AFC general manager said, speaking on condition of anonymity. "You have a rookie quarterback for all intents and purposes. Now, over time, he can get better.
"That's where it all starts. But there's your problem with Camelot. Who are you going to compare him to? The last three (quarterbacks) were multiple Pro Bowlers and two reside in Canton."
Actually, Joe Montana is in the Pro Football Hall of Fame and Steve Young is expected to join him in Canton next year. Garcia made three NFC Pro Bowl teams.
According to Cross, the level of talent on the team is "probably decent" if every player is 100 percent healthy. The former NFL executive called the 49ers a .500 team if completely healthy.
"They just don't have any flash now," the NFC scout said. "This thing has gone down so fast. I don't know what York's thinking."
About the only constant for the 49ers recently has been change, another reason for their free fall.
York fired coach Steve Mariucci after the 2002 season even though he led the 49ers to back-to-back playoff berths. The 49ers hired Dennis Erickson, a coach with no connection to the Walsh coaching tree.
This year, the 49ers parted ways with their two biggest offensive weapons, Garcia and Owens and a long list of veterans. In the 49ers' defense, the volatile Owens had become a locker room cancer. Keeping him was not a realistic option.
"This system is all about acquiring players and making those investments pay in the long haul," Mueller said. "When you change course in midstream on a contract, there are ramifications."
Some teams, apparently, deal with salary cap rules better than others. The 49ers appeared to be getting their financial house in order after purging high-priced players in 1999 and 2000. Now they're complaining about salary cap hell again.
"All it really takes nowadays is one or two bad deals," Cross said. "It doesn't take too many airballs to put you in a hell of a hole."
The 49ers' quick return to the playoffs helped create more salary cap problems, the former NFL executive said.
"Now all of a sudden some of those young guys want to have contract extensions for big, big bucks," he said.
In 2001, Donahue signed Garcia to a six-year, $36 million deal.
According to Donahue, the 49ers never completely escaped their salary cap problems before their two-year resurgence.
"We began taking our medicine a little bit ... but what happened to us is that Jeff Garcia emerged as a Pro Bowl quarterback," Donahue said.
"We went 12-4 and 10-6. We decided to go for it again. We decided we're close. We gave Garcia a big contract. We extended guys like (Fred) Beasley, Newberry, Garrison Hearst. We went out and got Ron Stone. We went for it again. We didn't make it, but once we went for it again, the ship was about to sink."
Donahue's so-called new plan to fix the 49ers' salary cap problems is "almost identical" to the old plan the team unveiled in 1999, the former NFL executive said.
The 49ers started cutting high-priced veterans and adding affordable young players in '99.
"Mariucci and his staff put a smile on their faces and coached up a lot of young (players)," he said. "The next year they were a little better. The next year they got in the playoffs."
In other words, it's deja vu all over again.
"You make decisions along the way that put you in these predicaments," Mueller said. "The difference in this case is that (when this happened) before they had a Super Bowl or two and you could say, 'This is what it cost us.' It was easier to sell.
http://www.sacbee.com/content/sports/football/sf_49ers/story/11459781p-12373794c.html
Deese tears 49ers apart
Their former lineman blames Donahue, York for the demise.
By Matthew Barrows -- Bee Staff Writer
Published 2:15 am PST Thursday, November 18, 2004
SANTA CLARA - Derrick Deese may have spent 12 years blocking for the 49ers, but he went out of his way Wednesday to sack the club's two most prominent employees.
Now a Tampa Bay Buccaneer, the player nicknamed "The Diesel" took aim at 49ers owner John York and general manager Terry Donahue, saying coaches, players and fans are paying the price for the duo's lousy off-season decisions
"The bottom line is really, if you are going to release players, you can release two or three a year and you might be able to recover from that," Deese said during a conference call. "But if you are going to release seven, eight or nine starters from one year - come on! Who are you fooling? You aren't playing for next year. You're playing for four years down the line."
An undrafted free agent with the 49ers in 1992, the undersized and underappreciated Deese built himself into one of the NFL's better offensive linemen. He started at right guard during the team's Super Bowl season in 1994, then three years later made the switch to left tackle, the most important position on the line.
Throughout the 2003 season, the 49ers trumpeted Deese's sackless streak, which reached 34 games. Despite those accolades, Deese, 34, said he was called into Donahue's office after the season and was surprised when the GM asked whether he would retire.
Deese replied that he wanted to play a few more years.
"He seemed shocked by that answer and he left it with, 'We're going to get this done quickly,' " Deese recalled. "And so I didn't hear from him again until four days before free agency, when he released me."
Donahue remembers the encounter a little differently, saying he asked Deese whether he wanted to finish his career with the 49ers, and if he was willing to be a backup to second-year player Kwame Harris.
"Derrick's played 12 years in the league, and during that time he's had some concussions and things like that," Donahue said. "I don't think his memory is all that good. I wasn't at all shocked."
Donahue said the team wanted Deese to assume a utility role similar to the one Matt Willig played in 2002, and offered him $1 million to stay in San Francisco. Deese, however, wasn't ready to give up his starting position.
"I'm not going to disparage Derrick Deese," Donahue said. "But we had a choice at his particular position to choose a 12-year veteran or a second-year player that we had invested a first-round pick in and a lot of money. The reality of it is, we went with the younger player. I wasn't telling (Deese) he couldn't start in the league. I was just telling him he couldn't start on this team."
Deese said it was too early to give the starting job to Harris, who is only 22. Early on, at least, it appears the veteran is right.
Knee and ankle injuries knocked Harris out of action early this season, and he has been slow to reclaim his job from Kyle Kosier, a seventh-round draft pick. Poor pass blocking also has led to critical sacks during the brief periods Harris has been in the game.
But Deese hasn't fared much better with the Buccaneers, whom the 49ers visit Sunday. A foot injury hampered him during training camp, and his sackless streak ended just a few plays into the Buccaneers' season.
Still, he said he and other longtime 49ers who were part of the offseason exodus - including Jeff Garcia, Garrison Hearst and Terrell Owens - often discuss how the squad might have been.
"Everyone is saying now that if they had these guys, it would be a lot different," Deese said. "Well, it's easy to see in hindsight that you probably wouldn't get rid of us again."
But Donahue said he doesn't regret his offseason moves.
"It certainly is not the way you would normally want to do things," he said of releasing or trading eight starters from last year's team. "But again, we were faced with decisions we don't normally have to encounter."
With the exception of Owens, who was demanding a salary the 49ers could not afford, Donahue said that for every player let go, there was a younger player ready to take their place.
"We just didn't have a fire sale," he said. "We had guys at those positions we felt could help the organization."
York didn't escape Deese's wrath, either. He said the 49ers' nosedive began as soon as York took over in the winter of 1999.
"Let's just say this," Deese said. "When Eddie DeBartolo had the team, it was always 'players first.' Whatever he could do for the players is what mattered. Everyone else was second. Obviously that has changed."
Asked what the York regime holds most dear, Deese replied: "His pocketbook."
Said Donahue with a chuckle: "Derrick - he'd criticize the president or the pope or the owner or general manager or anybody. That's his character. That's why you've got to like him."
The Bee's Matthew Barrows can be reached at [email="mbarrows@sacbee.com."]mbarrows@sacbee.com.[/email]
Deese tears 49ers apart
Their former lineman blames Donahue, York for the demise.
By Matthew Barrows -- Bee Staff Writer
Published 2:15 am PST Thursday, November 18, 2004
SANTA CLARA - Derrick Deese may have spent 12 years blocking for the 49ers, but he went out of his way Wednesday to sack the club's two most prominent employees.
Now a Tampa Bay Buccaneer, the player nicknamed "The Diesel" took aim at 49ers owner John York and general manager Terry Donahue, saying coaches, players and fans are paying the price for the duo's lousy off-season decisions
"The bottom line is really, if you are going to release players, you can release two or three a year and you might be able to recover from that," Deese said during a conference call. "But if you are going to release seven, eight or nine starters from one year - come on! Who are you fooling? You aren't playing for next year. You're playing for four years down the line."
An undrafted free agent with the 49ers in 1992, the undersized and underappreciated Deese built himself into one of the NFL's better offensive linemen. He started at right guard during the team's Super Bowl season in 1994, then three years later made the switch to left tackle, the most important position on the line.
Throughout the 2003 season, the 49ers trumpeted Deese's sackless streak, which reached 34 games. Despite those accolades, Deese, 34, said he was called into Donahue's office after the season and was surprised when the GM asked whether he would retire.
Deese replied that he wanted to play a few more years.
"He seemed shocked by that answer and he left it with, 'We're going to get this done quickly,' " Deese recalled. "And so I didn't hear from him again until four days before free agency, when he released me."
Donahue remembers the encounter a little differently, saying he asked Deese whether he wanted to finish his career with the 49ers, and if he was willing to be a backup to second-year player Kwame Harris.
"Derrick's played 12 years in the league, and during that time he's had some concussions and things like that," Donahue said. "I don't think his memory is all that good. I wasn't at all shocked."
Donahue said the team wanted Deese to assume a utility role similar to the one Matt Willig played in 2002, and offered him $1 million to stay in San Francisco. Deese, however, wasn't ready to give up his starting position.
"I'm not going to disparage Derrick Deese," Donahue said. "But we had a choice at his particular position to choose a 12-year veteran or a second-year player that we had invested a first-round pick in and a lot of money. The reality of it is, we went with the younger player. I wasn't telling (Deese) he couldn't start in the league. I was just telling him he couldn't start on this team."
Deese said it was too early to give the starting job to Harris, who is only 22. Early on, at least, it appears the veteran is right.
Knee and ankle injuries knocked Harris out of action early this season, and he has been slow to reclaim his job from Kyle Kosier, a seventh-round draft pick. Poor pass blocking also has led to critical sacks during the brief periods Harris has been in the game.
But Deese hasn't fared much better with the Buccaneers, whom the 49ers visit Sunday. A foot injury hampered him during training camp, and his sackless streak ended just a few plays into the Buccaneers' season.
Still, he said he and other longtime 49ers who were part of the offseason exodus - including Jeff Garcia, Garrison Hearst and Terrell Owens - often discuss how the squad might have been.
"Everyone is saying now that if they had these guys, it would be a lot different," Deese said. "Well, it's easy to see in hindsight that you probably wouldn't get rid of us again."
But Donahue said he doesn't regret his offseason moves.
"It certainly is not the way you would normally want to do things," he said of releasing or trading eight starters from last year's team. "But again, we were faced with decisions we don't normally have to encounter."
With the exception of Owens, who was demanding a salary the 49ers could not afford, Donahue said that for every player let go, there was a younger player ready to take their place.
"We just didn't have a fire sale," he said. "We had guys at those positions we felt could help the organization."
York didn't escape Deese's wrath, either. He said the 49ers' nosedive began as soon as York took over in the winter of 1999.
"Let's just say this," Deese said. "When Eddie DeBartolo had the team, it was always 'players first.' Whatever he could do for the players is what mattered. Everyone else was second. Obviously that has changed."
Asked what the York regime holds most dear, Deese replied: "His pocketbook."
Said Donahue with a chuckle: "Derrick - he'd criticize the president or the pope or the owner or general manager or anybody. That's his character. That's why you've got to like him."
The Bee's Matthew Barrows can be reached at [email="mbarrows@sacbee.com."]mbarrows@sacbee.com.[/email]
Donahue is, along with York, right up there on the top of my JERK list. His attitude in responding to Deese's comments was sarcastic, demeaning and patronizing. And I think that's how he deals with most of the players.
Deese also hit the nail on the head, IMHO, with this comment:
BRING BACK EDDIE!!!
Insomniacal Fan
Starter
Ahh well, at least the Broncos are doing well, the Packers and the Raiders aren't. The NFL is nearly perfect.
hoops4kings
Bench
The 49ers are a shell of it's former greatness as an organization. Too bad Eddie D. has no desire to come back as an owner. Oh well.
Eddie had no choice. He was implicated in some shady dealings and had to turn over ownership of the team to his sister, Denise, and her jerk husband, John York.
Eddie loved the team and I think these last couple of years have probably broken his heart. He can't come back; I wish he could. Hence my somewhat ironic "BRING BACK EDDIE!"
Eddie loved the team and I think these last couple of years have probably broken his heart. He can't come back; I wish he could. Hence my somewhat ironic "BRING BACK EDDIE!"
hoops4kings
Bench
Actually I'm well aware of why Eddie had to give up ownership of the team. It's too bad that stuff transpired, but I've read a couple articles saying that he's concentrating on other business and has no desire to return as an owner to the 49ers or any NFL orginization if the opportunity happened. Who knows? Maybe the NFL would consider reinstating him (I heard that Jerry Jones is amoung owners who would welcome him back), but like I said he showed no interest.
I do hope York considers selling the team but something tells me he won't. Supposedly he wants to give it to his kids in the future so they can continue to wreck it.
I do hope York considers selling the team but something tells me he won't. Supposedly he wants to give it to his kids in the future so they can continue to wreck it.
My only problem with your comment is that you're relying on "a couple of articles" to determine how Eddie D. feels about returning to the 49ers...
I know people in SF who know people who know Eddie. Okay, tenuous but in this case I think it's enough. They've told me repeatedly that this whole thing nearly broke his heart. If he's asked by a reporter if he'd like to be reinstated so he could come back, I'm sure he's not going to publicly open those wounds. Much easier just to say he's concentrating on other business and has no real desire to return... That way, the media hound goes away and doesn't start following him around like they did with Pete Rose a while back.
Although John York makes all the public decisions, etc. I believe the team is still actually owned by Denise (although I could be wrong). If - in fact - Denise is still the owner maybe we should work on getting her to dump John.
I know people in SF who know people who know Eddie. Okay, tenuous but in this case I think it's enough. They've told me repeatedly that this whole thing nearly broke his heart. If he's asked by a reporter if he'd like to be reinstated so he could come back, I'm sure he's not going to publicly open those wounds. Much easier just to say he's concentrating on other business and has no real desire to return... That way, the media hound goes away and doesn't start following him around like they did with Pete Rose a while back.
Although John York makes all the public decisions, etc. I believe the team is still actually owned by Denise (although I could be wrong). If - in fact - Denise is still the owner maybe we should work on getting her to dump John.
You know, VF, if you could just will yourself not to care about football the way you do about baseball, you'll be much better off... 
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