Hasheem Thabeet
- Thread starter OptimusRhyme
- Start date
migibizzle
G-League
Camby has atleticism, Noah does not. Im a gambling man id rather risk it all on potential then draft a for sure role player and a weak one at that. The choice is Hibbert and Thabeet. The thing about Thatbeet that i agree with all o you is his rawness but a guy that size with that length ant athletic ability would at least give you a wall in the post where no driver would dare to enter. Thats more then Noah will give you. Now add some time with professional caliber trainers he can become WILL become a board and block king, which is more then 90 percent of the Centers will be. Im not saying he will be Duncan im saying he can be a 7'3 Ben Wallace. Look at his frame he can add another 30-40 pounds easy without diminishing his mobility and leaping ability. Thats a 7'3 310 pound center more mobile and athletic then most 6'11 250 pound centers. One just has to mold the player to what suits his game. In his case he has not been plaiying long so focus on the things that do not require skill/talent but hard work, determination, athleticism and length. Shot Blocking and Rebounding.
The guy has big time upside much more then anyguy after Jilian in this draft.
The guy has big time upside much more then anyguy after Jilian in this draft.
Last edited:
I don't think the only choices are Hibbert, Noah or Thabeet.
Per the latest mock drafts, Hibbert is a favorite to go at #5, so we can probably cross him off our wish list. Noah is expected to go at 6 or 7, and Jianlian at about 9, Hawes and Splitter slightly later. Guesses for Thabeet range from #14 to not entering the draft at all this year.
Hawes may not meet the NBA definition of "athletic," but those other guys do. Jianlian has the risk of being a bust, and people worry that he is older then claimed, but he might be very good. Splitter has had some injury problems, but otherwise he seems like a pretty safe bet. Thabeet may be excellent when he's 26, but has to be viewed a very big gamble, bigger even than Jianlian.
As of right now, we have one pick. Knowing GP's usual pattern, he is not going to get anyone who he thinks is a big risk of being a bust, he's going to make a "safe" pick. I don't care much for Hawes myself, but can imagine Petrie picking him or Splitter. Jianlian, I suspect, will not happen, and I would give 20-1 odds that he won't take Thabeet, I think he'd get us some promising 6'7"-6'8" guy before he'd do that.
I like Thabeet, and really wish we could get a second pick, but without one, I just can't see it happening.
Per the latest mock drafts, Hibbert is a favorite to go at #5, so we can probably cross him off our wish list. Noah is expected to go at 6 or 7, and Jianlian at about 9, Hawes and Splitter slightly later. Guesses for Thabeet range from #14 to not entering the draft at all this year.
Hawes may not meet the NBA definition of "athletic," but those other guys do. Jianlian has the risk of being a bust, and people worry that he is older then claimed, but he might be very good. Splitter has had some injury problems, but otherwise he seems like a pretty safe bet. Thabeet may be excellent when he's 26, but has to be viewed a very big gamble, bigger even than Jianlian.
As of right now, we have one pick. Knowing GP's usual pattern, he is not going to get anyone who he thinks is a big risk of being a bust, he's going to make a "safe" pick. I don't care much for Hawes myself, but can imagine Petrie picking him or Splitter. Jianlian, I suspect, will not happen, and I would give 20-1 odds that he won't take Thabeet, I think he'd get us some promising 6'7"-6'8" guy before he'd do that.
I like Thabeet, and really wish we could get a second pick, but without one, I just can't see it happening.
Vlade4GM
All-Star
How do you expect him to reach that potential sitting on the bench or playing in the NBDL?
migibizzle
G-League
Playing behind Brad Miller and are other pathetic Big Men wont make the idea of getting some PT here that far fetched.
Vlade4GM
All-Star
Still who's going to teach him how to play? Is he just going to learn how himself? It's not like with Bynum having Kareem teaching him. He should really return to school, Calhoun is a great big man coach. It's the only place where he can truly develop. Right now all he's going to be is a decent shot blocker.
migibizzle
G-League
Agreed. As far as his development the best he can do is stay in school. But all inclination shows that he will be declaring this year. If the kings were serious they could hire one of the many big greats as an assistant. I just see vast potential there id rather risk it to get a potential stud then another 2 guard tweener.
Vlade4GM
All-Star
You make it sound like great big men who can coach well are coming off an assembly line or something. It's not that easy.
Well since we'll be picking in the lottery I'd rather take someone who at least knows how to play basketball. Projects like Thabeet are for teams with two picks in the first or teams in the mid to late first with an already talented team and can afford to take a risk. We however can't afford a bust. His potential is nice but it gets severely limited leaving college.
nbrans
All-Star
See, I would rather take someone with potential. Barring a miraculous offseason (chance of happening: 0.1%), the Kings are still going to be bad next year. What's the point of drafting a play-now type of player when they need a star?
I mean, the worst case scenario is that Hasheem Thabeet is a super-athletic 7'3" inch behemoth who fouls a lot and is raw offensively. Darn.
With where we are drafting, we could land a star caliber player...maybe not a hall of famer, but a player who could make multiple all-star games...no need to take an UNNECESSARY risk on a player like Thabeet.
nbrans
All-Star
How do you know Thabeet isn't going to make an All Star game someday? And how do you know any player other than Durant and Oden definitely IS going to make an All Star game? There are no sure things in the draft, and I'm sorry, I'd much rather take guys who are starting with size and athleticism -- extremely rare -- over guys who are starting with "skills".
And seriously, take Justin Williams' athleticism and give him a 7'3" frame and much better hands. That's Thabeet. Raw, yes, but when was the last time there was a 7'3" guy with lots of athleticism and good hands in the draft? Maybe Ralph Sampson pre-injuries??
Brad Miller is the cieling for guys with skills and no athleticism. I'd rather gamble on someone who has the size and athleticism to be better. Give me Horford, Noah, Jianlian, Thabeet and Hibbert over Hawes, Fazekas, Wright and Green. Size and athleticism. This team needs it.
I'm saying why take the EXTREME RISK that he MIGHT be an all-star when you could take a much more minimal risk that someone like Acie Law or Corey Brewer will become all-stars. there's always risks in the draft, but you're shooting for the 50,000-1 odds, whereas I'm thinking about the 50-1 odds. The Maloofs are gamblers, but taking Thabeet with a lottery pick is very unlikely to pan out.
nbrans
All-Star
What I'm saying is that it's much less of a risk to take a guy like Thabeet, who is 7'3" and very athletic with good hands, than it is to take a guy who is a more run-of-the-mill player. I mean, as good a player as Acie Law is, there are tons of guys like him in the league and plenty guys like him who have bounced out. He's a dime a dozen.
The worst case scenario with Thabeet? Oh shucks, a 7'3" athletic center who is raw offensively. I don't see the risk. Look at the shelf life of athletic centers -- Chandler, Dalembert, heck, Mikki Moore. I'd take all of those "raw" but athletic players over the "skilled" Kamans and Przybillas and Doleacs any day.
Raw doesn't always = risk. In my opinion it's way more risky to take an unathletic and "skilled" and supposedly "polished" player and hope he can compensate for his lack of athleticism by developing more skills, than a guy who is already starting with tons of size and athleticism.
Last edited:
Vlade4GM
All-Star
It has nothing to do with the timetable, the problem is will he develop? Right now all you have is a shot blocker, how good of one we still don't even know. He's not a great rebounder and so far he's not much of a defender outside his shot blocking. You say we need size and athleticism, I say we need a very good player that isn't a SG. I say we can't draft a bust or we're screwed. I say you can't just throw away lottery picks on a shot in the dark.
Vlade4GM
All-Star
I don't know which Wright you're talking about but they're both very athletic. Why does it have to be one extreme or the other? This team needs quality players that are not SG's, what type of players who the hell knows, we haven't even decided on what kind of team we want. Also, I don't know why you're knocking Hawes size. Obviously he's not Roy Hibbert but 7-0 250 isn't bad either, also he's very skilled and can run the court well. He's NOT Brad Miller, I'm freaking pissed that nbadraft.net has that as a comparison and everybody gets the wrong impression. Hawes plays mostly back to the basket using post moves, he also has a face up game where he uses the jumper and his very good handles, but he's not limited to that like Miller is/was. Yes he's like Miller in that he's not very athletic, he can pass, and he's not much of a factor on the defensive end (although he's not horrible though) but it's still not a good comparison. Also why is Hibbert in the athletic category? because he's certainly not athletic. He has size, but not size AND athleticism.
nbrans
All-Star
I was talking about Julian Wright, who doesn't have the size to play PF. I like Brandan Wright fine.
Hawes isn't athletic, and when you consider shooting and passing skill (basically the only things you can do on offense when you're not athletic), Brad Miller is the cieling, hence the comparison. Skills are fine and good and they're great for college, but the NBA is different. In the NBA you need athleticism. It's not the same game. And besides, you can learn skills, you can't learn athleticism.
I think Hibbert is knocked a tad unfairly for his athleticism, but anyway, he has the size and length to make up for the athleticism he lacks, sort of like your man Vlade.
I agree with you that the team needs good players at all positions, but for the love of god this team does not need any slow players. This team needs athletes. The NBA is only getting more athletic, and this team has been putting a premium on skills way too long.
You think Brad Miller is/was better than Vlade Divac or Arvydas Sabonis?
nbrans
All-Star
Those guys were taller than 7'0", which makes a world of difference. I'm talking about the cieling for 6'11"/7'0" guys.
Vlade4GM
All-Star
Hawes is not slow, he compares a lot to Andrew Bogut. While bogut lacks a certain amount of athleticism, he's still succeeding in the NBA. 12-9-3apg who is a high-low post threat is not bad at all for a starting center. There is a lot more value for a guy who is a solid starting center than a big bodied shot blocker off the bench. You can't simply write off skills, basketball IQ, and maturity. These are important aspects in the development of a player. Who do you think can teach Thabeet these things? He's going to need a lot of personal attention and PT. You have to take into account all aspects of the game.
I don't see how you can still be a fan of Hibbert and say we "need" athletes, Hibbert is slow and unconditioned. He's a half court player. I still have no idea why you're putting so much emphasis on specific needs of a team that hasn't even been established yet (maybe it never will). All we know is the Kevin Martin is likely part of that team.
Simply put, if we pick Thabeet we're throwing away our lottery pick. We'd be better off trading down if we really wanted him so bad.
To detach this from the Thabeet topic a little, and turn it into an abstract generality, I tend to agree. We have a couple of very athletic starters carrying the team, and a couple of very athletic kids who everyone loves to see on the court. And that's most of what we have going for us anymore. That's not to say that I endorse any and every athletic draft candidate, no matter how unskilled -- some guys will never be very skilled ballplayers, no matter how much they're trained, or every vet in the NBA would be a 90% FT shooter. But I think that the balance of the team is skewed, and we don't need immediate results from our pick, so I very much favor athleticism over skills right now. Barring the hiring of a brilliant new coach, we're probably headed for the lottery next year anyway, so we may as well embrace and exploit suckage while it's what we do best. A highly skilled lottery pick who squeaks us into 42 wins next year would be the worst of both worlds. I'd almost rather have the next Yinka Dare than to have that.
nbrans
All-Star
I'm supposed to be excited that Hawes might be like Bogut? I think that speaks for itself right there. Who would you rather have right now? Bogut or Tyson Chandler? I know I'd take Chandler.
Hibbert is more athletic than people give him credit for, and I've said this several times and I'll say it several more times: there's something to be said for guys over 7'0". Look at guys like Divac, Mutumbo, Big Z, Rik Smits, Sabonis... those extra couple of inches make a difference. To be sure there are still stiffs like Podzkolzin and Ha, but I think Hibbert will do fine in the NBA with his size and (relative) athleticism.
Vlade with that extra inch. However, I'd prefer to draft Hibbert at 7'2 than go after Thabeet. Funny you didn't mention Shawn Bradley, Manute Bol, lol
Last edited:
Probably because "Shawn Bradley" and "athleticism" don't even belong on the same page together.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEi-Wm0OFII
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEi-Wm0OFII
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Vlade was MUCH longer than Brad. Much. 2 extra inches (7'1"), longer arms. No comparison. people forget that there was a time in his youth when Vlade Divac was a 2 block a game guy in there. Also had the post game, and wiht his size could see over people and get off his little flips and hooks without, for example, the other team's 6'6" OG blocking his shot.
migibizzle
G-League
I agree with Fnordious. The fact is that next year we wont be any better. A guy like Thabeet sitting on the bench but developing behind the scenes (They do practice you know) is better then just about every pick we can realistically get our hands on. The kid has only been playing basket ball for 4 years. He has already learned patience at shot blocking. Learning to box out and swollow rebounds is the easiest thing to do. After learning what you need to do the rest is up to the players desire. Brad Miller could desire to jump 2 feet over the rim all he wants, it aint gonna happen. Noah can desire to dominate in the post, it aint gonna happen. He has no Athleticism and the smallest frame a man could have. Gaining any weight for him would reduce his already weak athelicism to a point that he would be useless in the nba. Too slow to be a SF and not strong and athletic enough to be a PF. If you want to waist a pick get Noah. Thats waisting a pick. He is a good college player but the NBA and its superioir atheletes will dominate him.
Thabeet would IMO require dropping DOWN in the draft...spending a top 10 pick on him is a waste.
migibizzle
G-League
Dont doubt the sheer lack of desperation of NBA teams trying to acquire a real center. He still might go in the top 12.
Let em reach...that just means a better talent drops down further.
Vlade4GM
All-Star
I don't think people understand how unbelievably raw this kid is. He's not going to learn what he needs to in practice or playing in the NBDL. He's just simply not mature enough for the NBA yet, it could totally dwarf his potential. Of course we can afford to wait, but we can't afford to wait for nothing.
