Has Natt had enough?

[Jkbiker]

mmmmmmm the heck with veggies gimmie those ho-hos!!!!

Hmmm lets see gooey, soft, fluffy white stuff covered in Chocolate

Yep that fits

Now its Kevin 'ho-hos" Martin

 

[Jkbiker]

okay okay maybe thats a little harsh

but really last tuesday I had a front row seat to Mr Softie himself

I swear I saw Kevin under the basket just to the right and when I saw the pacer break down the middle of the lane for an easy layup Kevin saw it coming and I could see him looking at the player starting his break to the basket as he backed up further away from the basket, watched the dunk,
then looked around as to say " you mean you want ME to get in front of that guy and defend? - I dont think so "

I guess he thinks he takes all his punishment driving to basket, taking all the contact so he can keep getting his 20 plus points by getting to the foul line since his shot isnt dropping tonight

Kev - love your 3 point shots and free throws, but mr clutch scorer, sorry no, team defender heck no. Time to round out your game dude you need to become a complete player.Yeah I dont expect you to be Doug Christie, but at least show some effort!!!

 

[N0M0R3]

Well I suppose it is compared to standing around and giving up layups... at least if you gamble for steals you have a chance of stopping the offense. So perhaps it is effort on the current Kings team but anywhere decent in the league it wouldn't count

gambling for steals breaks down the defense, players need to rotate to the open man leaving one man open if the steal is not collected, this is not defense its gambling on defense

 

[Kingster]

If you watch Martin, he doesn't put out the effort. It's not ability, it's effort. He's all talk. It's incredible that he even can look himself in the mirror. His help defense is beyond pathetic. He doesn't help. PERIOD. He watches, he sees a teamate get beat on the dribble, he waits, he takes not one step to help. It's a disgrace. His defensive effort is so bad that he deserves a place on the Clippers.

Natt has nothing to lose, but at the end of the day it's the Maloofs who have to man-up and defend the coach if he plays Martin fewer minutes because of his defense. If Natt plays Martin fewer minutes because of his D, Martin will whine to his agent and his agent will contact the Maloofs and then it will be up to the Maloofs whether they back up Natt. It all starts with the owners. If they are wusses, then our team will continue to be wusses.

 

[Kingster]

Okay, now I have highlighted Kevin's defense on many an occasion -- almost anything bad you want to say about it I would agree with. I'll even trump the bad and say that Kevin Martin often appears to be an essentially selfish basketball player, only interested in his scoring numbers, who considers himself above giving an effort on defense because he feels no responsibility to his teammates. That's a hell of a charge to level at a plyer, because it says that he is somebody that no self-respecting hard working team player would ever want to have as a teammate, let alone could ever respect as a leader.

And yet even so, I am here to say that benching Kevin for lack of defense is a very dangerous ploy. Its unclear to me how deeply Kevin's claws are sunk into this franchise, as opposed to merely how deeply he thinks they are. We were foolish enough to give him some sort of downtown parade or whatever, and then hire his agent (his freakin' agent!) to be part of the front office. But after a 13-49 season is the front office really sitting aouond making excuses for him and blaming it on everybody else but Kevin? Don't know. What I do know is that IF Kevin's claws are sunk too deeply into the franchise, then you cannot lose him. And by lose him I mean lose his loyalty, his interest -- if this is a player already teetering on a selfish shelf, and you bench/embarass him, he might just check out on you entirely. Reading his body language he often looks like he's half a step away from it already. Slouching around, looking disgusted, half assing it. And IF he is defintely going to be here long term, then burning that bridge through a public dressing down, no mater how deserved, is dangerous and could have lingering long term effects. Even if you are planning on trading him it has consequences -- 20 games before the beginning of the offseason when you might trade him you decide to publicly brand your trade asset as a horrible defender? Even if every team knows it already to actually bench the guy over the issue would have to raise red flags.

So yes, as I have raised the possibility that Kevin's defensive attitude could be at the heart of our incredible defensive issues this year -- not that he is the only one, just that if your team's best player doesn't give a damn it enables others to join him, and makes the few that would otherwise play hard wonder why they bother. So given that, it would be hypocritical of me to say that Kevin should be off limits in any sort of get tough strategy. But you have to be careful. He's too important a piece, either of the franchise going forward, or as a trade asset, to be publicly humilitating him. You can't just bench him for whole games, or start guys over him or whatever without just asking for trouble -- Kevin's too major of a player, with too big of an ego, and too much of a contract to accept that and just say "thank you sir, may I have another".

I do think you could get away with benching for a few minutes here or a few minutes there when he does something particularly pathetic -- would get most of the message across while still leaving open the possibility of reconcilliation. But much as making an example of Kevin would be the best and clearest way to get everybody else's attention -- if we are willing to bench the star, then you damn well better know we will bench you -- the potential consequences outweigh the upside, particularly in the last few games of a lost season. You are eventually going to need some way to recruit Kevin as an ally, and you can't do that if he is over on the end of the bench resenting the way he has been treated.

Yeah, why don't the Maloofs mow Kevin's lawn if he plays defense? Why don't they give him a month in Vegas free? Maybe they can appease him, mollify him, buy him, by somehow sucking up to him more than they do already. The whole thing makes me sick. The Maloofs have shown themselves to be weak-kneed wobblers with spines of a paramecium. Their team is the embodiment of THEM. Until they Man-Up they will continue to have a pathetic defensive team. It all flows from the top. They say they want a defensive team. But up to this point, they back down when a Martin complains to his agent that too much is asked of him, that they're actually asking him to play defense. If a player doesn't play defense, then they should back the coach when the coach limits the minutes accordingly. And if the player is sooo incredibly spoiled and weak and self-absorbed that the player thinks he is soooo good that he doesn't have to play defense, then have some freaking self-respect and show him the door. Otherwise, nobody will respect them, and rightfully so.

 

[Kingsroots]

If you watch Martin, he doesn't put out the effort. It's not ability, it's effort. He's all talk. It's incredible that he even can look himself in the mirror. His help defense is beyond pathetic. He doesn't help. PERIOD. He watches, he sees a teamate get beat on the dribble, he waits, he takes not one step to help. It's a disgrace. His defensive effort is so bad that he deserves a place on the Clippers.

Natt has nothing to lose, but at the end of the day it's the Maloofs who have to man-up and defend the coach if he plays Martin fewer minutes because of his defense. If Natt plays Martin fewer minutes because of his D, Martin will whine to his agent and his agent will contact the Maloofs and then it will be up to the Maloofs whether they back up Natt. It all starts with the owners. If they are wusses, then our team will continue to be wusses.

I agree completely. I sort of turned a blind eye to it over the years. I do understand that his defensive flaws are in the spotlight this year especially because of the teams record but... I no longer will hide behind the excuse that his offense is good. His defense is absolutely awful. All the way around. Individual and team. Even his overall demeanor and look on his face when he or the team lets a guy drive all the way to the hoop untouched. He just plain looks like he doesn't care. Offensively he could be close to a Dwayne Wade, but Wade is a fantastic defender. He gives all his energy on both sides of the floor. I think the problem is that he is not a leader, period. Never will be, and until management brings in defensive players and coaches that can and will call him out for his lack of defense he is not going to change. Is it too late?

 

[Emma]

It's never too late. Look at what Kevin Garnett has done to the celtics. All those guys are pretty old, and was Rondo considered an excellent defender coming out of college? (maybe I don't know).You find someone so defensively fiery and it spreads all over the place.

 

[steelevt]

its easy to say bench our best player when we're in last place. kevin is our best scorer and one of our core players. if we were in playoff contention, or fighting for position in the playoffs, i believe the poll results would be different. our poor defense doesnt fall on one player. our whole team is at fault when we are at the bottom of the league in defense. benching martin would be sending a message that our record is his fault, when its the management that didnt bring in more defensive minded players to balance out his lack of defensive ability, or the coaching staff that doesnt focus more on defense.

 

[AleksandarN]

Okay, now I have highlighted Kevin's defense on many an occasion -- almost anything bad you want to say about it I would agree with. I'll even trump the bad and say that Kevin Martin often appears to be an essentially selfish basketball player, only interested in his scoring numbers, who considers himself above giving an effort on defense because he feels no responsibility to his teammates. That's a hell of a charge to level at a plyer, because it says that he is somebody that no self-respecting hard working team player would ever want to have as a teammate, let alone could ever respect as a leader.

And yet even so, I am here to say that benching Kevin for lack of defense is a very dangerous ploy. Its unclear to me how deeply Kevin's claws are sunk into this franchise, as opposed to merely how deeply he thinks they are. We were foolish enough to give him some sort of downtown parade or whatever, and then hire his agent (his freakin' agent!) to be part of the front office. But after a 13-49 season is the front office really sitting aouond making excuses for him and blaming it on everybody else but Kevin? Don't know. What I do know is that IF Kevin's claws are sunk too deeply into the franchise, then you cannot lose him. And by lose him I mean lose his loyalty, his interest -- if this is a player already teetering on a selfish shelf, and you bench/embarass him, he might just check out on you entirely. Reading his body language he often looks like he's half a step away from it already. Slouching around, looking disgusted, half assing it. And IF he is defintely going to be here long term, then burning that bridge through a public dressing down, no mater how deserved, is dangerous and could have lingering long term effects. Even if you are planning on trading him it has consequences -- 20 games before the beginning of the offseason when you might trade him you decide to publicly brand your trade asset as a horrible defender? Even if every team knows it already to actually bench the guy over the issue would have to raise red flags.

So yes, as I have raised the possibility that Kevin's defensive attitude could be at the heart of our incredible defensive issues this year -- not that he is the only one, just that if your team's best player doesn't give a damn it enables others to join him, and makes the few that would otherwise play hard wonder why they bother. So given that, it would be hypocritical of me to say that Kevin should be off limits in any sort of get tough strategy. But you have to be careful. He's too important a piece, either of the franchise going forward, or as a trade asset, to be publicly humilitating him. You can't just bench him for whole games, or start guys over him or whatever without just asking for trouble -- Kevin's too major of a player, with too big of an ego, and too much of a contract to accept that and just say "thank you sir, may I have another".

I do think you could get away with benching for a few minutes here or a few minutes there when he does something particularly pathetic -- would get most of the message across while still leaving open the possibility of reconcilliation. But much as making an example of Kevin would be the best and clearest way to get everybody else's attention -- if we are willing to bench the star, then you damn well better know we will bench you -- the potential consequences outweigh the upside, particularly in the last few games of a lost season. You are eventually going to need some way to recruit Kevin as an ally, and you can't do that if he is over on the end of the bench resenting the way he has been treated.

If he is indeed going down the path of selfishness then we(I mean the Kings of course) has to try and curb those tenancies or trade him. We do not need a rotten apple spoiling other apples in the box.

 

[Bricklayer]

It's never too late. Look at what Kevin Garnett has done to the celtics. All those guys are pretty old, and was Rondo considered an excellent defender coming out of college? (maybe I don't know).You find someone so defensively fiery and it spreads all over the place.

Rondo was an excellent defender in college -- one of his calling cards. Perkins was a defensive specialist too -- they knew what they were doing in the players they held over to surround the Big Three with. Its amazing how much defensive personnel help your defense. But you need to have a leader too. A captain/anchor who makes the softies like Kevin go beyond what they would normally give you. We've got a few willing guys, but no real good defenders, and no captain. Makes it all too easy for the don't want to break a nail contingent to just drift along.

 

[Fear the Putin]

Martin is extremely quick and fast in the open floor.

If you have those capabilities, then you CAN play defense if you want to.

Yes on benching Martin if he doesnt play defense.

 

[VF21]

If you watch Martin, he doesn't put out the effort. It's not ability, it's effort. He's all talk. It's incredible that he even can look himself in the mirror. His help defense is beyond pathetic. He doesn't help. PERIOD. He watches, he sees a teamate get beat on the dribble, he waits, he takes not one step to help. It's a disgrace. His defensive effort is so bad that he deserves a place on the Clippers.

Natt has nothing to lose, but at the end of the day it's the Maloofs who have to man-up and defend the coach if he plays Martin fewer minutes because of his defense. If Natt plays Martin fewer minutes because of his D, Martin will whine to his agent and his agent will contact the Maloofs and then it will be up to the Maloofs whether they back up Natt. It all starts with the owners. If they are wusses, then our team will continue to be wusses.

You know, I expected at least a couple of hater posts when I started the thread so this doesn't surprise me in the least...

Most of the comments in this thread, however, seem to indicate a much more rational position. For the most part, we think Kev is capable of playing at least some D even if he may never be a top notch defender. I think he needs to understand that good D may not be fun, but it's something he needs to at least try. Set an example for all the kids coming to the team.

 

[Nikefutbolero]

There is absolutely no reason why Kevin Martin should have trouble playing defense. He has the athleticism there. He's NOT slow. For players like him, it's all about effort. He doesn't put in the effort on the defensive end and should be benched.

 

[rainmaker]

Kevin was a better on the ball defender his first 2 years in the league, so I really think it does come down to effort with him. But I wouldn't bench him untill we get a better coach in here. If Petrie brought in a defensive minded head coach with credibilty and experience, (Avery Johnson, Doug Collins, VanGundy type coaches) then I think Kevin would play better defense. I think Kevin should be defending with more effort, and reallisticly I don't see it improving much untill we get a coach he respects more than Natt or Theus.

 

[Arby's Roast Beef]

It's already been said many times on this board that Kevin was actually a pretty solid defender back when he entered in the league and had little primacy--he was able to rack up steals and stay with smaller players on speed matchups. But now that he's invested so much time on the offensive side of things it comes to no surprise that his intensity level has went from solid to fluctuating to poor--not to mention in this losing environment, it's really tough to sustain good defense when other members of your team (for the most part) can't play defense. I think the intensity level will ratchet up once again when he has to invest less energy on the offense and/or is part of a winning team, whether it be us or someone else's team, but until then, I think his mentality is deeply ingrained into offense as it is that he's virtually neglecting the defense. That combined with his one-dimensionality in terms of scoring...troublesome.

 

[Merdiesel]

If he's outright not playing defense then yeah.. but if he trying and just outright sucks on D, then no. Martin needs to understand how to work with what he has... He can use his quickness to get in front of guys to take the charge, we've seen it. Do that 2 or 3 times a game and I'm happy.

 

[vikinginferno]

For shooting guards, strength isn't as important in defense as other positions. A huge part is being able to stay in front of your defender and the rest is effort and teamwork. K-Mart does have great quickness so guys shouldn't be able to get by him very easily.

 

[Aenadin]

i'd give martin a break for now.. as ive seen he has been trying to play the passing game and i have seen a few games where in he got 4 to 5 assists per game... if he can translate into a 24ppg 4rpg 4apg player first then im good with that...

the defense it self ill need to see a better coach... HEY NATT!!! how do you expect to block shots and cover your man when you keep playing small ball

 

[kingsnation]

It's already been said many times on this board that Kevin was actually a pretty solid defender back when he entered in the league and had little primacy--he was able to rack up steals and stay with smaller players on speed matchups. But now that he's invested so much time on the offensive side of things it comes to no surprise that his intensity level has went from solid to fluctuating to poor--not to mention in this losing environment, it's really tough to sustain good defense when other members of your team (for the most part) can't play defense....

You have to remember also that Kevin had much better teammates back when he was a rookie compared to what he has around him now. That probably translated into more steal opportunities for him.

Secondly, you mention his investment into his offensive skills compared to defensive - and again I think this reflects the type of teammates that he has and had in the past. He IS our offense. Besides Salmons (and we won't go there), there hasn't been much consistent scoring support for him the past 2 years, which I think is no coincidence that that is when his defense really began to slide.

 

[VF21]

It's already been said many times on this board that Kevin was actually a pretty solid defender back when he entered in the league and had little primacy--he was able to rack up steals and stay with smaller players on speed matchups. But now that he's invested so much time on the offensive side of things it comes to no surprise that his intensity level has went from solid to fluctuating to poor--not to mention in this losing environment, it's really tough to sustain good defense when other members of your team (for the most part) can't play defense. I think the intensity level will ratchet up once again when he has to invest less energy on the offense and/or is part of a winning team, whether it be us or someone else's team, but until then, I think his mentality is deeply ingrained into offense as it is that he's virtually neglecting the defense. That combined with his one-dimensionality in terms of scoring...troublesome.

I follow what you're saying, and I sincerely hope you're correct.

 

[Monty'sBiggestFan]

No no no and just, well NO! Don't blame one player for not playing defense? It's easy to say bench a non defending star when you're losing? Playing defense when the rest of the team sucks defensively can't be expected?

Really?

If your star says defense aint worth doing is cool getting lit up every night because there is no defense, then the "star" has to sit and/or go. If your star player is the one not willing to go with the program or set the tone, then it's not going to get set. Somebody has to police it. I agree that there needs to be a captain or vet to kick the star's butt and push him, but geezus...that bugs me. But I'll go along with that.

Why am I hearing Hawes say "This is where no defense happens" and getting red-faced about the fact that the team doesn't play defense? and people are willing to let Martin have a pass because of why I don't know. Somebody on this team at least has a pulse, add 10 more of those type of guys (and I bet even some of them can score too) and this team would not be losing every night, which apparently is why Martin doesn't feel like playing defense.

Its a vicious circle sure, but it can stop if the team gets onto one page and decides to make it stop. That should include the highest paid dude at the top of the food chain. Top of the food chain dude said once that he was tired of his team becoming a laughing stock of the league and that he was going to do something about it. I'd like to see him live up to that and set the tone. If he doesn't want to get embarassed by sitting on the bench, then give some defensive effort and that rule will never apply to him. Period. No. Excuses.

 

[bloom]

Natt’s been saying stuff for a long time and to me he’s never really acted upon it. And last time someone benched Kevin – which was Muss (I think against the Clipps) and then the Miami game with Reggie last year- I think we all saw the reaction from Kevin.

Brick basically said it all. We’ve given this team’s keys over to Kevin.

I don’t/never expected him to be a defensive juggernaut, but I do expect him to try…I think he’ll loose the team quickly if he doesn’t step up that part of his game. Talk is cheap and actions are stronger than words.

 

[Jespher]

No no no and just, well NO! Don't blame one player for not playing defense? It's easy to say bench a non defending star when you're losing? Playing defense when the rest of the team sucks defensively can't be expected?

Really?

If your star says defense aint worth doing is cool getting lit up every night because there is no defense, then the "star" has to sit and/or go. If your star player is the one not willing to go with the program or set the tone, then it's not going to get set. Somebody has to police it. I agree that there needs to be a captain or vet to kick the star's butt and push him, but geezus...that bugs me. But I'll go along with that.

Why am I hearing Hawes say "This is where no defense happens" and getting red-faced about the fact that the team doesn't play defense? and people are willing to let Martin have a pass because of why I don't know. Somebody on this team at least has a pulse, add 10 more of those type of guys (and I bet even some of them can score too) and this team would not be losing every night, which apparently is why Martin doesn't feel like playing defense.

Its a vicious circle sure, but it can stop if the team gets onto one page and decides to make it stop. That should include the highest paid dude at the top of the food chain. Top of the food chain dude said once that he was tired of his team becoming a laughing stock of the league and that he was going to do something about it. I'd like to see him live up to that and set the tone. If he doesn't want to get embarassed by sitting on the bench, then give some defensive effort and that rule will never apply to him. Period. No. Excuses.

"The NBA. Where tanking happens".

I'd be surprised if the Kings continue this lack of defensive intensity to start next season. It has already become a lost season, and the only reason to change at this point is pride. With the Kings stinking it up this badly, I think we passed the pride excuse several weeks ago, and they might be trying to improve their teammates next season by getting a better draft pick. Kevin got paid and should be around, barring trade, for the next several years. The core is here to stay and build upon, and the only people with something to prove are probably trying to prove themselves to other teams. Continuity at the coaching spot will help the execution, as well as a fresh start and getting a purpose to play for again. There is always next season, and I expect the Kings defensive intensity to improve markedly to begin next season. Let the TDOS begin...

 

[Packt]

too little too late. 13-49 with 20 or so games to go, it's silly to be having this talk. Not only are contract players like Martin, giggling with joy in their lazyboys at the thought of an early vacation, other organizations are laughing at this so called "hard line".

What does this accomplish? This is something you say at the beginning of the year, or in Natt's case, in December. He might not even be here next year. There is no moral victory, or no finish the year on a good note. Opponents will be sleepwalking through games with us, they won't bring their A game. The rest of the year is nothing but a prolonged scrimmage, a formality. If we couldn't make a difference when it mattered, why would things change now.

Bench Martin early in the season and lets see the reaction not only from him, but from fans. It's easy to sit him for lackluster defense when there is nothing left to play for other than the lottery... because his flopping offense might actually hurt us now.

The focus is on Martin but would the reaction be different if this was about Thompson or Hawes being benched?

 

[KingsCitizen]

I won't bench Martin for not playing defense at this time of the season. Plain and simple!

I'm not sure if Natt's intention was to really put the heat on Martin. It may just be some of those motivational lines that he can use instead of saying "I just don't know how to get through my players and actually motivate them to play defense at this time of season and with our current standing." Everyone already knows that our best to chance this season is to just suck full-time for the last 20 games left.

If Kenny Natt is looking at the future of this team, he better not hit on his star player. IMO its much better to just put some fake injury on Kevin Martin and shut him down for this season so we'll have a better evaluation to Donte and McCants who will surely get his minutes.

Martin is the longest tenured player on this team. He already knows there's no more playoff. What's there to play for? Play hard and get an injury that may extend over next season?

Maybe Natt just do something like Don Nelson's method of sitting some of his vets on some nights to get a better feel of the young guns. It may look like full tanking but we're not the only team doing that. He'll even Phoenix sits Shaq on back to backs.

This season is already over for us. A debate on playing defense should be of less priority. We'd rather have a discussion on how to give minutes to every player rather than this silly talks that may just result to souring of the team's chemistry.

 

[mac]

If Kenny Natt is looking at the future of this team, he better not hit on his star player. IMO its much better to just put some fake injury on Kevin Martin and shut him down for this season so we'll have a better evaluation to Donte and McCants who will surely get his minutes.

Martin is the longest tenured player on this team. He already knows there's no more playoff. What's there to play for? Play hard and get an injury that may extend over next season?

I don't think fans really care about playing defense to win games. It's more like the onus should be on Martin as the supposed leader of a young team to set a good example. He should be playing hard so that the young guys will play hard. And if you feel that a young team should only play hard if they're fighting for the playoffs then well I'll just have to disagree with you.

 

[Nighthawk1]

I won't bench Martin for not playing defense at this time of the season. Plain and simple!

I'm not sure if Natt's intention was to really put the heat on Martin. It may just be some of those motivational lines that he can use instead of saying "I just don't know how to get through my players and actually motivate them to play defense at this time of season and with our current standing." Everyone already knows that our best to chance this season is to just suck full-time for the last 20 games left.

If Kenny Natt is looking at the future of this team, he better not hit on his star player. IMO its much better to just put some fake injury on Kevin Martin and shut him down for this season so we'll have a better evaluation to Donte and McCants who will surely get his minutes.

Martin is the longest tenured player on this team. He already knows there's no more playoff. What's there to play for? Play hard and get an injury that may extend over next season?

Maybe Natt just do something like Don Nelson's method of sitting some of his vets on some nights to get a better feel of the young guns. It may look like full tanking but we're not the only team doing that. He'll even Phoenix sits Shaq on back to backs.

This season is already over for us. A debate on playing defense should be of less priority. We'd rather have a discussion on how to give minutes to every player rather than this silly talks that may just result to souring of the team's chemistry.

If that's really what you think and what he thinks then he definitely needs to be benched. He's not doing us any favors by risking himself if he won't play full speed and create a good example for your youngin's to follow... If anything it will create a negative effect. Just because he's been here a long time doesn't mean he should get a free pass. I hate that type of thought process - play hard and prove you want to be out there or sit on the bench because we have a roster full of guys who want some play time that want to play full speed!

And PHX sits shaq to keep him fresh, it's been working this year... When the man plays he plays at a pretty high level instead of being tired and worn out..

Playing defense should always be a priority for us because we've FAILED to do any as a team with the exception of a few players for the past few seasons. Better finally fixing it now instead of always putting it off until next year... Might be a lost cause next year so we should push it off until 2010 right?

 

[gunks]

I said yes.

Hasnt Martin been quoted as saying he wants to work on his D, and/or play D? Someone is welcome to correct me if I am wrong, but if he HAS gone to media outlets saying stuff like that...He needs to put his money where his mouth is.

Dude doesnt really have much strength, and he obviously doesnt have the instincts or mindset...But with his athleticism, with just a little effort he can at least hold his own out there instead of getting burned game in and game out. Nobody expects him to go all Ron Ron and be lockdown.

If he doesnt put forth the effort, bring on McCants. At least that dude has D'd up a bit in his stints.


I'll admit it....I'm kinda getting down on Martin. Sure he puts up points. But those are some EMPTY 24ppg. He does not take over. He scores, he flops, and he is a complete non factor in every other way. I'm not going to go as far as say I want him traded...But we need us a do it all 3 to play alongside him in the worst way...I wish we made a move for Anthony Randolph when there was all that GS drama. Greene seems to be just as one dimensional as Martin (besides the blocks).


...Oh no. I'm ranting.

 

[VF21]

I said yes.

Hasnt Martin been quoted as saying he wants to work on his D, and/or play D? Someone is welcome to correct me if I am wrong, but if he HAS gone to media outlets saying stuff like that...He needs to put his money where his mouth is.

Dude doesnt really have much strength, and he obviously doesnt have the instincts or mindset...But with his athleticism, with just a little effort he can at least hold his own out there instead of getting burned game in and game out. Nobody expects him to go all Ron Ron and be lockdown.

If he doesnt put forth the effort, bring on McCants. At least that dude has D'd up a bit in his stints.


I'll admit it....I'm kinda getting down on Martin. Sure he puts up points. But those are some EMPTY 24ppg. He does not take over. He scores, he flops, and he is a complete non factor in every other way. I'm not going to go as far as say I want him traded...But we need us a do it all 3 to play alongside him in the worst way...I wish we made a move for Anthony Randolph when there was all that GS drama. Greene seems to be just as one dimensional as Martin (besides the blocks).


...Oh no. I'm ranting.

ranting is okay, especially considering the circumstances. I think we're all frustrated at various things and trying to find ways to deal with it.

I highlighted one part of your post that makes a lot of sense to me. Kevin looked - and played - a lot better when he wasn't the sole focus of opposing teams AND our local media. (Of course, that isn't counting Voisin's bizarre piece on the misunderstood and maligned magnificence of Kenny Thomas in today's paper...)

 

[Oprostaj]

numerous posts above speak to not playing defense on purpose because this is a lost season. you do not turn defense on or off. you either know how you play it or you don't. you either have the mentality or you don't. this team will suck again in that department next year, and the year after that. why? because neither the front office or the coaching staff puts an emphasis on it. Kevin's tired because he scores 24 per game? cut down on his attempts and make him put more effort on D. we're not winning when he's scoring, if that's the argument. this is lunacy. the team has been gutted, there is NO direction. We are one year into the "rebuild" that should have been 3 years in the making at this point, and everybody is pointing fingers.

don't bench martin. instill a defensive mindset into the team as a whole. only then will you see who has the ability. not everyone can play D, even on a good team like the Cs. Martin's has been highlighted by the atrocious play of those around him. the team as a whole is a joke on the defensive end. it's not a hater saying this. it's a realist. i hope with all my heart they turn it around. history says it won't.