ESPN: Artest Requesting Trade, Representing Himself

[Kingzrool]

It is amazing to me everytime an uproar comes up around something stupid Bill says to the press. Hello, he has been here long enough for us to know to ingore any statements that Bill makes to the press. Get it, got it, good.

The more that Artest lowers his value, the less likely GP is going to be to trade him. He will be in a contract year, so he cannot screw himself by refusing to showcase his tallent. He is still underpaid for his on-court contribution. I say keep him and look into a trade around All-Stars break when desperate GM's are looking to make a playoff push and he hopefully none of this will be fresh in their minds. Or just keep him as an expiring. GP will not be part of a firesale, bookmark it.

The way the tone of this board is, you'd think the guy was a bottom level player.

The only time that I will ever laugh when the Lakers win a title would be if they do it w/ Bill next season. Odom will be the focus of haters here and Artest will have his title if this stupid LA trade goes down. It will be hard, but I will be happy for Bill.

 

[bajaden]

It is amazing to me everytime an uproar comes up around something stupid Bill says to the press. Hello, he has been here long enough for us to know to ingore any statements that Bill makes to the press. Get it, got it, good.

The more that Artest lowers his value, the less likely GP is going to be to trade him. He will be in a contract year, so he cannot screw himself by refusing to showcase his tallent. He is still underpaid for his on-court contribution. I say keep him and look into a trade around All-Stars break when desperate GM's are looking to make a playoff push and he hopefully none of this will be fresh in their minds. Or just keep him as an expiring. GP will not be part of a firesale, bookmark it.

The way the tone of this board is, you'd think the guy was a bottom level player.

The only time that I will ever laugh when the Lakers win a title would be if they do it w/ Bill next season. Odom will be the focus of haters here and Artest will have his title if this stupid LA trade goes down. It will be hard, but I will be happy for Bill.

I think the best case senario is to move him as soon as possible. Why waste half a season or a whole season letting someone who is not going to be here play, instead of trying to build some continuity on whats going to be a young team.

As far as being happy for Artest getting his ring. I can think of alot of other players that have busted thier butts in the league for years, been the model of decorum and never gotten a ring. So as far as I'm concerned, he can get in the bottom of a long line of deserving players before I have any sympathy for him.

As an aside. I don't hate Artest. As a matter of fact, I think people are a little too loose with the word hate. I think it should be reserved for people like Hitler etc. I don't even dislike Artest. I think he's a child in a man's body. He acts like a child, throws little tantrums like a child. I just prefer that he be someone else's child. I prefer a team made up of adults. Hopefuly, talented adults..

 

[Carpe diem]

Question remains, can the Kings pull a deal from another team better than Lamar Odom? I highly doubt it. Thats why it seems silly for the Kings to be holding out on the premise of dumping KT's contract. Maloofs just don't want to trade with Lakers because they still think it's 2001.

 

[Spike]

Bill:Ron

Smeagal:Gollum

Or is it the other way around? It's so hard to tell these days. Every time he opens his mouth, he's making it more and more difficult for Petrie to trade him for "fair value", whatever that is. He must go before the season starts, but he (Artest) isn't helping his own cause. Anyone else think that this offseason was going to be boring?

 

[Big Cuz 15]

The most beautiful sight outta all of this. Lakers in the 4th quarter down 2. They are swinging the ball through the triangle, Artest gets it. Kobe comes off a screen calling for the ball. Artest completely ignores him as he proceeds to do his whacky little crossover repeatedly for a 12 count on the shot clock. He finishes by jacking a fadeaway jumper over two guys which he misses. Kobe does his "I'm a great teammate" thing and gets in Artests mug and starts yelling at thim like he is Sasha Vujab****. Ron gets mad and punches Kobe in the face. Nobody can tell if Pau Gasol looks surprised or disgusted because he always has a combination of both looks on his face anyway. Andrew Bynum looks awkward, but not because of the situation. Its because he knows he looks like a teenage mutant ninja turtle and he doesn't want anybody to notice (its the reason he never stands next to Al Harrington.) Turiaf, even though he is on the Warriors (the team the fakers are playing at the time) trys to come to Kobe's aid but Artest punks him too. Phil Jackson just sits there with his patented facepalm, and the league suspends the Lakers franchise from the NBA for 10 years. And they call a foul on Kobe's nose for hurting Ron's fist and a technical on Derek Fisher for flopping.


Its gonna happen, I can feel it.

LOL @ teenage mutant ninja turtles

 

[Vlade4GM]

And Petrie knows what he wants for Artest. I don't see the Lakers as in the driver's set on this, at all. They called the Kings, not the other way around. I'm sure GP wishes that Ron would just keep his mouth shut and quit being a whiny annoyance, but that doesn't mean GP is suddenly desperate to get rid of Ron for a lot less than he wants. Some Kings fans wish Petrie wasn't quite so patient, but a patient man he definitely is and one who knows what he wants.

I never said Petrie was desperate, I just said the lakers weren't. The lakers are in the driver's seat because they can not get Artest and be totally fine; however we have to trade him, to suggest otherwise is a dirty fib.

 

[Kingster]

There seems to be a lot of sentiment on this board that we could really be getting Odom or better. Why? The last trade offer was Denver's, which wasn't close to Odom or better. Now Artest is publicly asking for a trade. That doesn't increase his value to us, it decreases our value to us. So, is Odom or better wishful thinking, or is it really based on Artest's newly perceived value around the league?

 

[=LarryLegend=]

There seems to be a lot of sentiment on this board that we could really be getting Odom or better. Why? The last trade offer was Denver's, which wasn't close to Odom or better. Now Artest is publicly asking for a trade. That doesn't increase his value to us, it decreases our value to us. So, is Odom or better wishful thinking, or is it really based on Artest's newly perceived value around the league?

He was traded for a 3 time allstar, two time 3 point champ.

 

[Kingster]

He was traded for a 3 time allstar, two time 3 point champ.

Ahh, the greater fool theory. We were fools then, so now we're looking for another fool. Is that it? Last year the only team that wanted to give us anything was Denver, and that was the whey. So why all the hope now that we're going to get cream now? What has changed?

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Question remains, can the Kings pull a deal from another team better than Lamar Odom? I highly doubt it. Thats why it seems silly for the Kings to be holding out on the premise of dumping KT's contract. Maloofs just don't want to trade with Lakers because they still think it's 2001.

The recent quote from one of the Maloofs (Joe, I think) was that the Kings will make a trade if they feel it betters the team whether it's with the Lakers or not. So there's no reason to try to push such a sentiment onto the front office - they've already denied it exists.

As far as Odom goes, reports have it that the Lakers are reluctant to include Odom, not that the Kings are trying to hold out for more than that. If you look at the salaries, we'd have to include something besides Artest under the salary cap - KT or Shareef work, and we're not likely to bleed any "talent" to dump Artest, especially when we're receiving an expiring player in return who we're not incredibly likely to resign.

Point being: A Lakers deal such as Artest+KT for Odom is not being held up because a) The Maloofs don't want to deal with the Lakers or b) because they insist on dumping KT. If such a deal doesn't happen, it's because the Lakers are unwilling to part with Odom. But the Lakers are smart enough to know that they aren't going to get Artest for spare parts like Walton or Mihm or Radmanovic (as Petrie established at the deadline last year with his dealings with the Nuggets - you either meet the requirements or a trade doesn't happen, however "desperate" we might seem) so if they truly want him, they'll send Odom back. If not, Artest will almost certainly find a home elsewhere, possibly with a team that can actually offer us a meaningful draft pick (or two?) in return.

 

[crutonimo]

Ahh, the greater fool theory. We were fools then, so now we're looking for another fool. Is that it? Last year the only team that wanted to give us anything was Denver, and that was the whey. So why all the hope now that we're going to get cream now? What has changed?

Well....Ron is under contract for the whole year...not just a half a year with an impending free agency decision looming...That 'stablitlity' has to be considered a positive.

 

[=LarryLegend=]

Plus he avg 20pts for the first time, and his defense was back to his good ol days.

 

[Kingzrool]

Ahh, the greater fool theory. We were fools then, so now we're looking for another fool. Is that it? Last year the only team that wanted to give us anything was Denver, and that was the whey. So why all the hope now that we're going to get cream now? What has changed?

So you think the Artest/Peja trade was a bad idea?

 

[VF21]

The recent quote from one of the Maloofs (Joe, I think) was that the Kings will make a trade if they feel it betters the team whether it's with the Lakers or not. So there's no reason to try to push such a sentiment onto the front office - they've already denied it exists.

As far as Odom goes, reports have it that the Lakers are reluctant to include Odom, not that the Kings are trying to hold out for more than that. If you look at the salaries, we'd have to include something besides Artest under the salary cap - KT or Shareef work, and we're not likely to bleed any "talent" to dump Artest, especially when we're receiving an expiring player in return who we're not incredibly likely to resign.

Point being: A Lakers deal such as Artest+KT for Odom is not being held up because a) The Maloofs don't want to deal with the Lakers or b) because they insist on dumping KT. If such a deal doesn't happen, it's because the Lakers are unwilling to part with Odom. But the Lakers are smart enough to know that they aren't going to get Artest for spare parts like Walton or Mihm or Radmanovic (as Petrie established at the deadline last year with his dealings with the Nuggets - you either meet the requirements or a trade doesn't happen, however "desperate" we might seem) so if they truly want him, they'll send Odom back. If not, Artest will almost certainly find a home elsewhere, possibly with a team that can actually offer us a meaningful draft pick (or two?) in return.

I tend to agree with this assessment and I think we're going to keep guessing right up until Petrie pulls the trigger on whatever deal he feels is best for the organization. I do not think, however, that this is going to drag out much longer.

 

[VF21]

So you think the Artest/Peja trade was a bad idea?

Define "bad idea"...

Seriously, this kind of discussion would probably be best put into a different thread. Oh wait. We had those discussions. Look in the archives ... from early 2006.

 

[piksi]

So you think the Artest/Peja trade was a bad idea?

absolutely

do You need any more evidence ?

Trading Pedja was the right move but geting back Atrest for him was retarded. Even if we let Pedja walk for nothing would have been better because the rebuilding process would have been sped up. This way - we just wasted 2 seasons for absolutely nothing. Is there really anyone who thought that there was even 1% chance that Ron's contract would have actually been extended ?

 

[uolj]

Define "bad idea"...

Seriously, this kind of discussion would probably be best put into a different thread. Oh wait. We had those discussions. Look in the archives ... from early 2006.

I think it's an interesting topic right now with this new information whether it's split into its own thread or not.

absolutely

do You need any more evidence ?

Trading Pedja was the right move but geting back Atrest for him was retarded. Even if we let Pedja walk for nothing would have been better because the rebuilding process would have been sped up. This way - we just wasted 2 seasons for absolutely nothing. Is there really anyone who thought that there was even 1% chance that Ron's contract would have actually been extended ?

I disagree. It was a risk at the time. It didn't pay off, but it was worth the risk. If it turns out Artest cannot be moved or the Kings receive garbage in return, then maybe it's not worth it. But the Kings weren't going anywhere these last two years anyway, and so Artest's extra drama didn't spoil anything.

 

[Vlade4GM]

I think it's an interesting topic right now with this new information whether it's split into its own thread or not.


I disagree. It was a risk at the time. It didn't pay off, but it was worth the risk. If it turns out Artest cannot be moved or the Kings receive garbage in return, then maybe it's not worth it. But the Kings weren't going anywhere these last two years anyway, and so Artest's extra drama didn't spoil anything.

It spoiled our draft position.

 

[bibbyweb]

absolutely

do You need any more evidence ?

Trading Pedja was the right move but geting back Atrest for him was retarded. Even if we let Pedja walk for nothing would have been better because the rebuilding process would have been sped up. This way - we just wasted 2 seasons for absolutely nothing. Is there really anyone who thought that there was even 1% chance that Ron's contract would have actually been extended ?

This is not entirely correct. With Artest, we actually did pretty well. We reached the playoffs as he promised (people called him crazy at that time too). We gave Spurs a tough time. The Bonzi signing got messed up and we took a step back. And the Adelman firing and Webber trade and a slew of other mistakes including meaningless MLE signings is what got us here.

In short, Artest did provide us a solid piece, it was just that we were not able to capitalize on it.

But I agree that under the current circumstances, there is no way that Kings extend Artest's contract.

 

[Vlade4GM]

This is not entirely correct. With Artest, we actually did pretty well. We reached the playoffs as he promised (people called him crazy at that time too). We gave Spurs a tough time. The Bonzi signing got messed up and we took a step back. And the Adelman firing and Webber trade and a slew of other mistakes including meaningless MLE signings is what got us here.

In short, Artest did provide us a solid piece, it was just that we were not able to capitalize on it.

We were never going to capitalize on it.

 

[uolj]

It spoiled our draft position.

Perhaps, but given the way these last two years have gone I'm not entirely convinced that a full rebuild would have occurred anyway.

The interesting thing to me, though, is that the argument is that it was a bad trade because Artest helped the team win too much (as opposed to his behavior being the reason the trade was not worth it).

We were never going to capitalize on it.

This argument makes little sense. It's just too easy to say in hindsight that something that didn't happen wasn't ever going to happen.

 

[Warhawk]

The interesting thing to me, though, is that the argument is that it was a bad trade because Artest helped the team win too much (as opposed to his behavior being the reason the trade was ot worth it).

It was a short-term boost. Had some of the other changes not taken place, maybe some of that could have been sustained. But with the loss of Bonzi (not our choice or decision - he screwed up) and Rick, it went downhill.

 

[Vlade4GM]

Perhaps, but given the way these last two years have gone I'm not entirely convinced that a full rebuild would have occurred anyway.

The interesting thing to me, though, is that the argument is that it was a bad trade because Artest helped the team win too much (as opposed to his behavior being the reason the trade was not worth it).

This argument makes little sense. It's just too easy to say in hindsight that something that didn't happen wasn't ever going to happen.

It can't be that he was both a headache and helped the team be mediocre? Why?

I didn't think they were capable of contending for anything of value then and I still don't think they were. It has nothing to do with hindsight and everything to do with that team not being good enough on paper or on the court. People are making way too big of a deal about one f'n series against the spurs that we lost.

 

[uolj]

It can't be that he was both a headache and helped the team be mediocre? Why?

Who said it can't be both? For it to be a bad trade, he would have to have done damage to the team. I guess being a headache does some PR damage, but in my opinion not that much. Helping the team be mediocre might also have been some damage, but again I don't think the Kings would have been winning the lottery if the trade didn't go through. So basically we have minor damage versus the potential for him to help the team grow into a contender.

You apparently didn't think that was possible with Adelman, Bibby, Martin, Wells, Miller and Artest. Ok. I think even if there was a small chance it was worth it to see if that could happen when compared to the minor damage that has been caused. It would have even been more worth it if they had done the trade earlier.

(And this has nothing to do with the Spurs series for me at least. I didn't think the Kings were ever close to winning that.)

 

[PacerinIraq]

You know, we have a guard here that could probably help settle Ron down. His name is Tinsley. I think you should consider him.

 

[bajaden]

Bill:Ron

Smeagal:Gollum

Or is it the other way around? It's so hard to tell these days. Every time he opens his mouth, he's making it more and more difficult for Petrie to trade him for "fair value", whatever that is. He must go before the season starts, but he (Artest) isn't helping his own cause. Anyone else think that this offseason was going to be boring?

I think Smeagal came first. My precious. Please don't ask me about the chicken and the egg.

 

[bibbyweb]

We were never going to capitalize on it.

Hindsight is 20/20

 

[Bricklayer]

I thought it was a worthwhile risk at the time. But there was always a good chance of it not working. Which it did not. So, *shrug*. The trade was for a better, and younger (25 at the time) player who could be an impact defender. The risk was huge, but its the sort of risk that you could understandably take in a rebuild. You get more talent in return, you get a younger player in return. Thought it was a worthwhile risk to take when we took it. There was method to our madness, as opposed to something like the Webber abomination which was just fire the GM pee poor 0% chance of this EVER working out awful.

 

[bajaden]

The recent quote from one of the Maloofs (Joe, I think) was that the Kings will make a trade if they feel it betters the team whether it's with the Lakers or not. So there's no reason to try to push such a sentiment onto the front office - they've already denied it exists.

As far as Odom goes, reports have it that the Lakers are reluctant to include Odom, not that the Kings are trying to hold out for more than that. If you look at the salaries, we'd have to include something besides Artest under the salary cap - KT or Shareef work, and we're not likely to bleed any "talent" to dump Artest, especially when we're receiving an expiring player in return who we're not incredibly likely to resign.

Point being: A Lakers deal such as Artest+KT for Odom is not being held up because a) The Maloofs don't want to deal with the Lakers or b) because they insist on dumping KT. If such a deal doesn't happen, it's because the Lakers are unwilling to part with Odom. But the Lakers are smart enough to know that they aren't going to get Artest for spare parts like Walton or Mihm or Radmanovic (as Petrie established at the deadline last year with his dealings with the Nuggets - you either meet the requirements or a trade doesn't happen, however "desperate" we might seem) so if they truly want him, they'll send Odom back. If not, Artest will almost certainly find a home elsewhere, possibly with a team that can actually offer us a meaningful draft pick (or two?) in return.

A good logical post. Refreshing! One thing that I would add, is that there has only been one report that the Laker's are reluctant to part with Odom. Every other report states that their more than willing, but are balking at the K. Thomas inclusion. I still think that Turiaf is the barometer for whether the trade goes down. Until friday, the day they have to decide, I think its a stand-off between them and Petrie. After that, its put up or shut up and we move to the next suiter.

 

[bajaden]

It can't be that he was both a headache and helped the team be mediocre? Why?

I didn't think they were capable of contending for anything of value then and I still don't think they were. It has nothing to do with hindsight and everything to do with that team not being good enough on paper or on the court. People are making way too big of a deal about one f'n series against the spurs that we lost.

Hindsight is a 100% as they say, but I agree with you. The series with the Spurs was nothing more than a ripple in the large pond of the NBA. No one will remember 5 yrs from now. Maybe less.

Its true that Peja left and Artest made a big enough impact to jump start the team into the playoffs. Who's to say that another player couldn't have done the same time. Its all subjective and there is no sure answer. One thing is certain. Peja needed a change of scenery. He needed to go, and I must add that he was one of my favorite players. What if, we had traded him for a return of Hedo. How would have that worked out?

My point is, that you can what if yourself to death, and never get an answer. One thing is certain. The trade was made with the idea that the Kings could still contend, and that was the mistake. I felt so then, but I also felt that I could be wrong. The Kings could have traded for younger talent and possible future picks. In my opinion they made a mistake. But I wasn't as sure then as I'am now, so it was an easy mistake to make.