All about Bosh (merged)

[The Astronaut]

Problem is, Bosh isn't "great". When you find that guy, let me know...

Chris Webber BEFORE coming to the Kings:
21.9 PTS
9.5 REB
3.8 AST
1.6 STEALS
1.6 BLKS
.589 FT%
.482 FG %

Chris Bosh current stats
23.8 PTS
11.0 REB
1.9 AST
.5 STEALS
1.0 BLKS
.770 FT%
.489 FG %

I don't know about "Great" but I would love to have Bosh on this team and do think we become relevant the day he steps onto the court at Arco both in the standings and attendance.

 

[reid1boys]

I don't know about "Great" but I would love to have Bosh on this team and do think we become relevant the day he steps onto the court at Arco both in the standings and attendance.

Without a doubt, if Bosh were added to the Kings, they become relevant and butts are in seats in Arco.

I think people are minimizing what Bosh is doing by saying he is soft,

I do not know too many players that avg 11 boards a game that are just flat out soft. Rebounds (11 a game) dont drop in the hands of soft players.

I still say the Raprtor are going to lose Bosh no mater what at the end of the season. Offer 2 numbers ones and KT and SErgio or Beno and keep the nucleus intact.

Maybe they laugh, but no matter what, we need a big inside player that can score and those players arent available very often. I would be ok for Omeka, he is physical and a presence inside.

But we need somebody, and not from the draft, we need a proven player now so this team can make a run.

And when I say now, the off season is included in now, I dont mean this season.

 

[Bricklayer]

I don't know about "Great" but I would love to have Bosh on this team and do think we become relevant the day he steps onto the court at Arco both in the standings and attendance.

Without a doubt, if Bosh were added to the Kings, they become relevant and butts are in seats in Arco.

I think people are minimizing what Bosh is doing by saying he is soft,

I do not know too many players that avg 11 boards a game that are just flat out soft. Rebounds (11 a game) dont drop in the hands of soft players.

I still say the Raprtor are going to lose Bosh no mater what at the end of the season. Offer 2 numbers ones and KT and SErgio or Beno and keep the nucleus intact.

Maybe they laugh, but no matter what, we need a big inside player that can score and those players arent available very often. I would be ok for Omeka, he is physical and a presence inside.

But we need somebody, and not from the draft, we need a proven player now so this team can make a run.

And when I say now, the off season is included in now, I dont mean this season.

For the very reason that Bosh IS that good that's just not going to be the going rate. Bosh will cost us. Almost surely Kevin, maybe Spencer or JT. And yes, that will still be worth it to create the great big/great little combo. You can't just sit around and wait for years and years until jsut that perfect HOF big just hapens to enter the league and we jsut happen to somehow convince the team that has him to give him to us. You take what is out there. And what is out there is really good. If we needed hm to be the franchise guy, maybe he is not quite at that level -- he is not as good as Webb was. But we don't need the franchise guy. We need the wingman. We need Pau to Reke's Kobe. And Bosh is obviously at that level. He's a Top 5 PF. He's probably a Top 3 PF. Just use as few pieces from the current success as possible and make it happen. If you can keep the entire core of a team that has gone 11-10 since we lost Kevin, and then add a 23-11 PF to it...holy 1 year rebuilds batman.

 

[reid1boys]

You can't just sit around and wait for years and years until jsut that perfect HOF big just hapens to enter the league and we just happen to somehow convince the team that has him to give him to us.





This is it in a nutshell. We LUCKED out when we got Webber. The situation in Washington was not good and that is why Webber was even available, and look at what happened over the next several seasons.


I agree with you in that the situation has at the minimum at least presented the Kings with a viable legit star at the PF position that just does not come around very often. If the Kings want to seriously be back in title contention, we need another big time star......... make no mistake, Bosh is a star. Imagine if he were in LA or Boston what kind of pub he would get.


But I just dont think we need to give up Martin or JT to get him since the Raptors are going to lose him at the end of the season regardless.
In any event, none of us know exactly what it would take to get him. How much did Boston give up for KG?

Only way to know for sure is if you pick up the phone and find out. I wonder if Bosh is even on the Kings radar, or are we just content to be where we are, which is a team clearly in the upswing.

 

[bajaden]

You can't just sit around and wait for years and years until jsut that perfect HOF big just hapens to enter the league and we just happen to somehow convince the team that has him to give him to us.





This is it in a nutshell. We LUCKED out when we got Webber. The situation in Washington was not good and that is why Webber was even available, and look at what happened over the next several seasons.


I agree with you in that the situation has at the minimum at least presented the Kings with a viable legit star at the PF position that just does not come around very often. If the Kings want to seriously be back in title contention, we need another big time star......... make no mistake, Bosh is a star. Imagine if he were in LA or Boston what kind of pub he would get.


But I just dont think we need to give up Martin or JT to get him since the Raptors are going to lose him at the end of the season regardless.
In any event, none of us know exactly what it would take to get him. How much did Boston give up for KG?

Only way to know for sure is if you pick up the phone and find out. I wonder if Bosh is even on the Kings radar, or are we just content to be where we are, which is a team clearly in the upswing.

I agree that I would love to have Bosh. And I agree that I wouldn't want to give up Martin or JT to get him. However, Bosh and Webber are two different senario's. Webb was dragging a line of baggage a mile long behind him. So we were able to get him by trading a marquee name with little else left to get him.

The situation with Bosh is different. He is in demand around the league. So I think the price will be higher. How high is anyone's guess. I would certainly try to low ball them as much as possible. But I wouldn't give up the bank to get him. He's not going to help our defensive woes, and he hasn't been that much of a post player up until this year. I will stick to my guns on not wanting to exchange Thompson for Bosh. Two entirely different type of players. Bosh is the slick sports car. Thompson is the four wheel drive pickup truck with mud on it. You need both those type of players. Not one at the exclusion of the other

There's a saying in mexico. " Look good, no work, almost free "

 

[OptimusRhyme]

Theres no way Im trading JT right now. Hes great friends with Tyreke and Donte.. JT and Reke seem to be gaining alot of confidence/chemistry in each other and seem to be learning each others games very well.

We do need a big but we need a big that can stop other Bigs and driving littles. This is something Bosh does not do. He is an Offensive Big not a Defensive Big(hence raptors one of the worst defensive teams).

Bosh' Offensive game is pretty much the same as JTs. They both shoot the midrange jumper alot and they both use their quickness to get by people.
Only Bosh gets to the line way more then JT.

I dont see the fascination with Bosh that everybody else does.

We need a goalie.

 

[Bricklayer]

Theres no way Im trading JT right now. Hes great friends with Tyreke and Donte.. JT and Reke seem to be gaining alot of confidence/chemistry in each other and seem to be learning each others games very well.

We do need a big but we need a big that can stop other Bigs and driving littles. This is something Bosh does not do. He is an Offensive Big not a Defensive Big(hence raptors one of the worst defensive teams).

Bosh' Offensive game is pretty much the same as JTs. They both shoot the midrange jumper alot and they both use their quickness to get by people.
Only Bosh gets to the line way more then JT.

I dont see the fascination with Bosh that everybody else does.

We need a goalie.

Comparing Bosh and JTs offensive game is a very bad joke seen through some very purple glasses.

In other news Kyle Lowry's offensive game is pretty much the same as Tyreke's. They both like to power inside and overpower weaker PGs.

 

[reid1boys]

JT has improved 100% over last season IMO. He actually is using his left hand and doing baby hooks inside, something he rarely did last year. Actually I dont think he ever used his left to attempt shots last season.

But Id like to keep him and Get Bosh without giving up him or Martin.

 

[ParniValjak]

JT has improved 100% over last season IMO. He actually is using his left hand and doing baby hooks inside, something he rarely did last year. Actually I dont think he ever used his left to attempt shots last season.

But Id like to keep him and Get Bosh without giving up him or Martin.

Good luck with that one!

Getting Bosh without parting ways with at least Martin plus something/someone else is just pure fantasy.

As Brick said at the very least it would cost Martin & Hawes and it wouldn't surprise if its in the Martin and JT ball park

 

[Bballkingsrock]

Only problem is resigning him if we get him this year. If we can get an extension for him, that would be something different.

For FA, we probably have the money to get him, but with a Kevin, Tyreke, and Bosh comboination going, that would be too difficult cause there is only one ball in the game of basketball. Unless we trade Kevin for a bunch of really good roleplayers like a Battier, Posey, Landry, ....those types of players

 

[ParniValjak]

Only problem is resigning him if we get him this year. If we can get an extension for him, that would be something different.

For FA, we probably have the money to get him, but with a Kevin, Tyreke, and Bosh comboination going, that would be too difficult cause there is only one ball in the game of basketball. Unless we trade Kevin for a bunch of really good roleplayers like a Battier, Posey, Landry, ....those types of players

The thing is, we would have an infinitely better chance of re-signing him than we would to sign him up as a FA.

As a FA we would be fighting against every other team with caproom from the same position. If you get him in the trade you have his bird rights and you can offer him more money than any other team out there. He is not going to walk away from some $30 odd million in salary difference. Every team will drop a max contract on him but only one team can offer him more money and thats the team with his bird rights.

Also, the list of "franchise" players that have left their team via FA is minimal in the last decade despite the big market attraction.

This also doesn't include the "momentum" that Bosh and the team would get if we got him via trade. He would settle in, play good ball and the team will start winning. He would have a great player alongside him in Reke would be a major player in a young up and coming team that could contend for the rest of his career.

Players don't leave a good thing especially if you can offer him more money than anybody else.

 

[Emma]

But I don't think Bosh is a max contract player. 15 mil a year tops, that's it. If he were a max player there would be no holes in his game to speak of.

 

[reid1boys]

Plenty of players that got max deals out there that didnt exactly have zero holes in their game.

And again, we will disagree on what it will take to get Bosh. Toronto has no bargaining position since he is going to be leaving anyways.

Kings would likely be one of the most attractive spots for a free agent next year as it is clear the Kings are on the way up.

Most teams that have cap room needed to sign a big time player suck.... thats why they have all that cap room.

Doubt the Lakers, Boston, Orlando, and the likes will have room for a max free agent now will they?

 

[ParniValjak]

But I don't think Bosh is a max contract player. 15 mil a year tops, that's it. If he were a max player there would be no holes in his game to speak of.

Well you would be wrong there because there isn't a team out there that doesn't consider him to be a max player.

Every team in the league would drop a maximum contract on him without thinking twice. Every player has holes in their game, even LeBron James!

I am not saying that Bosh is as good as Bosh but just saying that every player in the league has holes in their games, not one player is perfect.

 

[ParniValjak]

Plenty of players that got max deals out there that didnt exactly have zero holes in their game.

And again, we will disagree on what it will take to get Bosh. Toronto has no bargaining position since he is going to be leaving anyways.

Kings would likely be one of the most attractive spots for a free agent next year as it is clear the Kings are on the way up.

Most teams that have cap room needed to sign a big time player suck.... thats why they have all that cap room.

Doubt the Lakers, Boston, Orlando, and the likes will have room for a max free agent now will they?

But that line of thinking is flawed because it wrongly assumes that Bosh would walk away from some $30 odd million for the duration of his contract. He simply won't.

No other team can offer him anywhere near as much per year as Toronto and they also can offer him the longest deal in terms of years so when you add all that up, its a LOT of money to walk away from to sign somewhere else.

Then of course we can talk about sign and trades for Bosh at which point we are back to the same scenario, Raptors woudl need to get something really good for them to agree on a sign and trade. After all why would they agree to assist a player that is walking away from them and pick up an unwanted salary in the process?!

With the current system, the franchise player will not walk away from their team as a FA regardless of how ****ty that team might be simply because $30+ million is a lot of money to walk away from. Simple as that.

While this bargaining agreement has been in place, not one franchise player has walked out of his team as a FA and signed for less money somewhere else. It just does not happen.

The best way to get a star to pair with Tyreke is to trade for them and gain their bird rights. That gives you a HUGE upper hand in negotiations on extension.

You can bookmark this statement: "If none of the big name 2010 FA don't get traded by the deadline, they will ALL remain with their current team. They will not sign with anyone else in free agency."

 

[Emma]

Plenty of players that got max deals out there that didnt exactly have zero holes in their game.

I'm well aware. My value system is different: If you're not damn near flawless, you don't deserve max money. Bosh = defensive liability, not max contract worthy.

Well you would be wrong there because there isn't a team out there that doesn't consider him to be a max player.

James >>>> Bosh. James = max player.
kobe >>>> Bosh. kobe = max player.
Wade >>> Bosh. Wade = max player.
Hell, Anthony > Bosh. Anthony = not quite a max player (maybe after this year).

Let's look at big men:

Howard >>> Bosh. Howard = max player.
Duncan >> Bosh. Duncan = slowly fading max player.
Garnett > =? Bosh. Garnett = used to be a max player.

I'm drawing blanks, but I'm sure there are more.

There aren't many superstar bigs left in the league, and I can understand the logic of paying the max just to have one. Unfortunately, you'd be getting ripped off. Would you shell out a max contract to Bosh, knowing that you would be paying him more than Dwight Howard gets paid? The thought makes me sick. No intelligent GM should expect to do so.

 

[ParniValjak]

I'm well aware. My value system is different: If you're not damn near flawless, you don't deserve max money. Bosh = defensive liability, not max contract worthy.



James >>>> Bosh. James = max player.
kobe >>>> Bosh. kobe = max player.
Wade >>> Bosh. Wade = max player.
Hell, Anthony > Bosh. Anthony = not quite a max player (maybe after this year).

Let's look at big men:

Howard >>> Bosh. Howard = max player.
Duncan >> Bosh. Duncan = slowly fading max player.
Garnett > =? Bosh. Garnett = used to be a max player.

I'm drawing blanks, but I'm sure there are more.

There aren't many superstar bigs left in the league, and I can understand the logic of paying the max just to have one. Unfortunately, you'd be getting ripped off. Would you shell out a max contract to Bosh, knowing that you would be paying him more than Dwight Howard gets paid? The thought makes me sick. No intelligent GM should expect to do so.

Err....I am not sure what your post is implying here to the quoted part of my past. I stated that there wouldn't be a team in the league that wouldn't consider Bosh a max player and you came up with some LeBron > Bosh scenario to dispute that?!

Take a look around the league and there are many max players, many of whom are not as good as Bosh. Bosh will most cetainly get a max deal and every team that is going to be in the Chris Bosh sweepstakes will offer him a max deal.

 

[Bricklayer]

I'm well aware. My value system is different: If you're not damn near flawless, you don't deserve max money. Bosh = defensive liability, not max contract worthy.



James >>>> Bosh. James = max player.
kobe >>>> Bosh. kobe = max player.
Wade >>> Bosh. Wade = max player.
Hell, Anthony > Bosh. Anthony = not quite a max player (maybe after this year).

Let's look at big men:

Howard >>> Bosh. Howard = max player.
Duncan >> Bosh. Duncan = slowly fading max player.
Garnett > Bosh. Garnett = used to be a max player.

I'm drawing blanks, but I'm sure there are more.

There aren't many superstar bigs left in the league, and I can understand the logic of paying max just to have one. Unfortunately, you'd be getting ripped off. Would you shell out a max contract to Bosh, knowing that you would be paying him more than Dwight Howard gets paid? The thought makes me sick. No intelligent GM should expect to do so.

That's just drawing your own imaginary lines on max players. The entire "max player" rule automatically creates a system whereby players of different talent levels are all going to get lumped at max -- that was the idea. Lebron is a $30mil a year talent. He just can't earn it. Meanwhile every team in the elague has been trying to clear up max money, and its not just for LeBron. Its for Wade, Amare, Bosh, heck even Joe Johnson is going to make a run at it, knowing how much guys like Peja and Rashard got paid. I have said before when people get squeamish about contracts, it is the cost of doing business and accumulating talents like that. Your choices are to either not acquire talents at that level, and accordingly not win, or to "overpay" for them, but have a chance to win. I, and most rational people, choose B. There are considerably more than half a dozen guys in this league who are going to get paid max money.

Here is a list of the Top 30 salaries in the NBA this season.

http://hoopshype.com/salaries.htm

Bosh is already oin that list tied for #20-#22. That's about where he'll be next year too. He is certainly worth far mroe than at least half those players. Chris Bosh earning that much money puts him right amonsgt his near superstar peers. Bosh is a Top 20 talent, earning a Top 20 salary is about spot on. Kenyon Martin, Larry Hughes, Peja Stojakovic, Elton Brand, Richard Jefferson, Andrei Kirilenko etc....now those are the guys who don't belong.

 

[Emma]

Err....I am not sure what your post is implying here to the quoted part of my past. I stated that there wouldn't be a team in the league that wouldn't consider Bosh a max player and you came up with some LeBron > Bosh scenario to dispute that?!

Take a look around the league and there are many max players, many of whom are not as good as Bosh. Bosh will most cetainly get a max deal and every team that is going to be in the Chris Bosh sweepstakes will offer him a max deal.

Okay, let me re-try:

I would never offer Bosh a max contract because I don't think he is as good as a max player should be. They need to be HOF material. Bosh isn't HOF material yet. There may be other players getting max contracts whom are not as good as Bosh, but you can bet the teams cutting the check hate every second they look down at the ledger.

This is my argument against retaining / acquiring him at almost any cost.

 

[Emma]

(snip) I, and most rational people, choose B. There are considerably more than half a dozen guys in this league who are going to get paid max money.

Here is a list of the Top 30 salaries in the NBA this season.

http://hoopshype.com/salaries.htm

Bosh is already oin that list tied for #20-#22. That's about where he'll be next year too. He is certainly worth far mroe than at least half those players. Chris Bosh earning that much money puts him right amonsgt his near superstar peers. Bosh is a Top 20 talent, earning a Top 20 salary is about spot on. Kenyon Martin, Larry Hughes, Peja Stojakovic, Elton Brand, Richard Jefferson, Andrei Kirilenko etc....now those are the guys who don't belong.

Hmmm... Mulling, mulling, mulling. So what you're saying is: no matter what someone ponies up for Bosh, he will land in the #20 range again? That he will be overpaid, but he will be exactly where he belongs salary wise?

Edit (I inferred more; possibly what you meant for me to infer, but my head kinda hurts and I'm having trouble trying to convey)

I just can't see the Kings doing it, not with the low attendance, business struggles, and arena issues to deal with. I'm just trying to think like it was my pocket book.









Edit pt 2: I am admittedly not a great armchair GM and may be unclear on something: What do you all call a max contract? I instantly refer to 5 years 100 million. Is this not the accurate definition?

 

[Capt. Factorial]

I am admittedly not a great armchair GM and may be unclear on something: What do you all call a max contract? I instantly refer to 5 years 100 million. Is this not the accurate definition?

The value of a max contract depends on quite a few things. There is a defined maximum contract for players (the maximum applies to the first year of the contract only) that is dependent on the number of years a player has been in the league. However, a player is always entitled to a 5% raise off of the last year of his previous contract even if it exceeds the maximum. The latter is the case for Bosh (though the difference is only a few hundred thousand dollars).

Players signing a free agent contract using Bird Rights can sign for 6 years with annual raises of up to 10.5% of the first year value, while players signing without Bird Rights can sign for 5 years with annual raises of 8%.

For Bosh, the relevant numbers are (in millions of $):
Bird Rights - 16.569 18.309 20.048 21.788 23.528 25.268, average 20.92, total 125.51
Regular free agent - 16.569 17.894 19.22 20.545 21.871, average 19.22, total 96.1

Different players will have different max contract values based on years in the league and previous salary. I guess 5/100 (or 6/120 for Bird Rights) is a reasonable rule of thumb, as only players with 10+ years of service can get much more than that.

 

[The Hammer]

The thing is, we would have an infinitely better chance of re-signing him than we would to sign him up as a FA.

As a FA we would be fighting against every other team with caproom from the same position. If you get him in the trade you have his bird rights and you can offer him more money than any other team out there. He is not going to walk away from some $30 odd million in salary difference. Every team will drop a max contract on him but only one team can offer him more money and thats the team with his bird rights.

Also, the list of "franchise" players that have left their team via FA is minimal in the last decade despite the big market attraction.

This also doesn't include the "momentum" that Bosh and the team would get if we got him via trade. He would settle in, play good ball and the team will start winning. He would have a great player alongside him in Reke would be a major player in a young up and coming team that could contend for the rest of his career.

Players don't leave a good thing especially if you can offer him more money than anybody else.

Exactly. Well said, and I completely agree. My only contention at this point is... should we go after him? If we do, how do we get the interior defense problem fully addressed? Next year's draft?

 

[reid1boys]

I just can't see the Kings doing it, not with the low attendance, business struggles, and arena issues to deal with. I'm just trying to think like it was my pocket book.




You could be right, and by not going out and getting a big tim eplayer like Bosh, every one of the issues you mentioned above will continue to linger on for the Kings. Sign Bosh and the attendance and business issues go away in all probability. Arena issue still needs to be resolved.
Not to mention the Maloofs want to win. Go back and look at the teams that are in the hunt for a title, maybe 1-2 teams out of the top 10 in salaries have any shot at a title. The Kings are near the bottom in salary, and thus nowhere near contending.


So start naming some VIABLE names out there that could make the Kings a contender that are going ot be available bigs via trade or free agency. Take Bosh off your list and then lets begin. And dont mention LJ, cause he aint coming to Sac.

This is going to be a short list.

 

[Emma]

Sign Bosh and the attendance and business issues go away in all probability. Arena issue still needs to be resolved.
Not to mention the Maloofs want to win. Go back and look at the teams that are in the hunt for a title, maybe 1-2 teams out of the top 10 in salaries have any shot at a title. The Kings are near the bottom in salary, and thus nowhere near contending.

You're right, attendance issues may be solved. The business issues are not NBA related, and in all likelihood would still cause the Maloofs to pause before signing off on such an enormous contract. They have stated that they aren't afraid to spend money if it makes them a contender, this would be the litmus test.

So start naming some VIABLE names out there that could make the Kings a contender that are going ot be available bigs via trade or free agency. Take Bosh off your list and then lets begin. And dont mention LJ, cause he aint coming to Sac.

This is going to be a short list.

That's not what I was doing, I was comparing talent to potential salary. I know Bosh is the only guy on that list. So, I suppose I am willing to bend. 96 million over five years would be tough to swallow; but if they unload Kevin, I guess it's not all that big of a hit (only an increase of +/- 9 mil a year). Plus, it's not my money.

 

[sidney]

While this bargaining agreement has been in place, not one franchise player has walked out of his team as a FA and signed for less money somewhere else. It just does not happen.

Rashard Lewis leaving the Sonics for Orlando and Joe Johnson leaving the Suns for Atlanta come to mind, but if I remember right neither home team wanted to pay the max salary which is why they left? Also, I believe in both cases the star pushed for a sign and trade so they could get that extra year and higher yearly raises.

I think you are right that the team with bird rights has always ended up being able to get some value.

 

[reid1boys]

When Joe Johnson left Phoenix, he was not a max contract type player avg 17pts and 5 brds. So he is not even close to Bosh in that regard. And Rashard Lewis is a 6-10 jump shooter that avg 5 brds a game, I wouldnt put him as a max player either... but that is just me.


The thing that interests me about Bosh to go along with hsi pts is the fact he is avg 11 rebounds a game. Charles Barkeley who was one of the best rebounders of his generation was typically in the 12 brds per game area.



I also do not want to lose Kmart under almost any circumstances. Everyone is bashing on his defense so much, but it isnt an issue for me as much as our lack of defender in the middle.

Martin has never ben a player chucking up 20+ shots a game. He shoots at a VERY high percentage, his FT percentage is outstanding.

Our Ft shooting cost us possibly 3 straight games on the road a week ago. Bosh is in the mid 70% at the line, add that with Martin's high percentahe and I would LOVE to see that lineup together.


Trade Hawes, trade picks, trade expirings (KT)trade Beno , but in order for the Kings to really contend (IMO) they must be able to kep Tyreke, Kmart, and JT together, and build around that.

Adding Bosh puts us in ALMOST a perfect spot. Easier to find a non offensive center that plays d and rebounds then to find a player with Bosh's skills.

In any event, it is fun just talking about the Kings being a player away from being real contenders again.

 

[sidney]

When Joe Johnson left Phoenix, he was not a max contract type player avg 17pts and 5 brds. So he is not even close to Bosh in that regard. And Rashard Lewis is a 6-10 jump shooter that avg 5 brds a game, I wouldnt put him as a max player either... but that is just me.

It's not just you. Joe Johnson was overpaid at the time but probably played up to his value. He's a tough player.

Rashard I believe has the worst contract in the NBA the moment he signed it until the moment it expires. His value is closer to half what he makes.

Regardless, the trend is that you have to overpay in order to lure stars away from their teams. I think that is still true.

 

[OptimusRhyme]

Comparing Bosh and JTs offensive game is a very bad joke seen through some very purple glasses.

In other news Kyle Lowry's offensive game is pretty much the same as Tyreke's. They both like to power inside and overpower weaker PGs.

Obviously JT's offense isnt what Bosh' is right now.. but it is pretty much exactly the same numbers that Bosh put up in his second year. And yea Bosh is alot more polished on offense but their, jumpshooting/quickness off the dribble is very simalar.


Bosh 2nd year: 16.8 47% FG 37 MPG
JT 2nd year: 15.5 51% FG 34 MPG

JT'S offense is coming along just as well as Bosh' did. And I do think once JT matures more and settles down and Utilizes that elbow jumper like Webb did then he could be in the 17-20 PPG range on a team with two super scorers already in Tyreke and Martin. So getting Bosh is kinda pointless because we already have an efficient young "Scoring" PF. Also I think JT will be just as good of a rebounder as Bosh if not better in the long run

So really what are we getting Bosh for then? we dont need his offense? I guess you could argue he's a post presence, but hes not even that dominant down low.. hes more of a speedy draw fouls and get to the line type of guy.

I think were really looking in the wrong direction with Bosh..

We need a Stopper beside JT and Hawes... Noah would be great, B. Lopez would probably be the perfect fit.. but theres no way we are getting him.

 

[reid1boys]

I would take Noah in a heartbeat. What he brings as much as anything is PASSION and heart. he only plays one way, and that is balls out. He is cocky also, something i like in a big man. He would be a good fit for the Kings, I agree.

I also agree with your view on JT's offense. he could bean 18ppg scorer in another year or two. His offensive skills have already shown big improvement. No way I trade him in a Bosh deal...... or Martin.

I want Bosh, but not at the expense of martin, JT, or Evans.... hell, not even if a deal involves Caspi.

 

[bajaden]

Obviously JT's offense isnt what Bosh' is right now.. but it is pretty much exactly the same numbers that Bosh put up in his second year. And yea Bosh is alot more polished on offense but their, jumpshooting/quickness off the dribble is very simalar.


Bosh 2nd year: 16.8 47% FG 37 MPG
JT 2nd year: 15.5 51% FG 34 MPG

JT'S offense is coming along just as well as Bosh' did. And I do think once JT matures more and settles down and Utilizes that elbow jumper like Webb did then he could be in the 17-20 PPG range on a team with two super scorers already in Tyreke and Martin. So getting Bosh is kinda pointless because we already have an efficient young "Scoring" PF. Also I think JT will be just as good of a rebounder as Bosh if not better in the long run

So really what are we getting Bosh for then? we dont need his offense? I guess you could argue he's a post presence, but hes not even that dominant down low.. hes more of a speedy draw fouls and get to the line type of guy.

I think were really looking in the wrong direction with Bosh..

We need a Stopper beside JT and Hawes... Noah would be great, B. Lopez would probably be the perfect fit.. but theres no way we are getting him.

This is the same question I'm asking. Is it just the marquee value? Bosh averages 11.1 RPG. Thompson averages 9.3 RPG. Bosh is averaging 1.0 Blocks per game. Thompson is averaging 1.1 blocks per game. Thompson is only in his second year. The only dramatic stat difference between them is PPG. Where Bosh is at 23.8 PPG and Thompson is at 15.5 PPG.

So do you turn the team upside down to gain 1.7 RPG, because offense hasn't been the problem for the team. Defense has! And Bosh doesn't address that problem. If Bosh is such a difference maker, then whats wrong in Toronto. Why isn't he making a difference there? Its not as though their team is chopped liver. They have Hedo and a very good point guard in Calderon. Bargnani is playing well, and certainly looks better than Hawes right now. When you add in the uncertainty of resigning him, it doesn't make any sense to me.