Would Miami Trade the # 2 pick?

J

Jniz209

Prospect
#1
#1
Im not sure if Miami is the type pf team that would build through the draft

Could we offer Ron and the # 12 for # 2 (beasly or rose)

Miami would have to through in Blount or another contract for salary purposes

Kings Line-up

Beno (assuming he stays)
K-mart
Salmons
Beasly
Miller

Miami

Augustine (in the draft)
D-wade
Artest
Matrix
Haslem


What do you think?
 
Dime Dropper

Dime Dropper

All-Star
#3
#3
Nope, we have no shot at the 2nd pick. Their are going to be alot of teams looking to trade for that pick, and Miami are likely only going to trade down a couple spots, if at all, so they can get Mayo and something extra.
 
S

Smills91

Starter
#5
#5
I think if we offered:

Brad Miller
Ron Artest
Rights to #12

for

Mark Blount
Udonis Haslem
Marcus Banks
#2

is reasonable if Miami is looking to add veteran talent NOW to play with Wade.
 
SacKings7

SacKings7

Starter
#6
#6
Smills91 said:
I think if we offered:

Brad Miller
Ron Artest
Rights to #12

for

Mark Blount
Udonis Haslem
Marcus Banks
#2

is reasonable if Miami is looking to add veteran talent NOW to play with Wade.
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Interesting trade. We give them a starting C and SF to play with Wade and Marion, plus our pick for their bad contracts and their pick. If we were trading with Miami, this would be the trade. Does it work in the trade checker?
 
Entity

Entity

Hall of Famer
#7
#7
It works on the trade checker. I like as we get a backup pg decent PF and C but, most of all we get the #2 pick Rose or Beasley. If we get Rose say bye bye to Beno.

bad part is those 3 we get back have KT like contracts for 2 or 3 more seasons. lineups


Rose/Banks
Martin/Garcia/Douby
Salmons/Garcia
Haslem/Moore/Williams
Hawes/Blount/Moore

or

Beno/Banks
Martin/Garcia/Douby
Salmons/Garcia
Beasley/Haslem/Moore/Williams
Hawes/Blount/Moore
 
O

ovrush

Bench
#8
#8
just to reiterate, we don't have enough on our roster to get the #2 pick. Probly not even if we include KMart. There's a solid chance the #2 pick in the draft will be a franchise changing player and that's more valuable than what we have.
 
SacKings7

SacKings7

Starter
#9
#9
ovrush said:
just to reiterate, we don't have enough on our roster to get the #2 pick. Probly not even if we include KMart. There's a solid chance the #2 pick in the draft will be a franchise changing player and that's more valuable than what we have.
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I think this could work if Miami is looking for a quick fix. Seattle got the 5th pick and all they gave up was Ray Allen (who is overrated at this stage of his career imo)
 
O

ovrush

Bench
#10
#10
SacKings7 said:
I think this could work if Miami is looking for a quick fix. Seattle got the 5th pick and all they gave up was Ray Allen (who is overrated at this stage of his career imo)
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Here's the difference: last year there were two franchise changing superstar talents in the draft. After that the value of the picks dropped significantly. This year it is the same exact thing. The top top picks could and probably will be superstars. I might be being harsh saying we don't have the ammo to move up in the draft. We very well MIGHT be able to move back into the lottery, but I'm pretty certain we don't have anyone on our team that someone would give up a high chance of landing a superstar for.
 
S

Smills91

Starter
#11
#11
ovrush said:
just to reiterate, we don't have enough on our roster to get the #2 pick. Probly not even if we include KMart. There's a solid chance the #2 pick in the draft will be a franchise changing player and that's more valuable than what we have.
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I don't buy that AT ALL. Most people would say Martin's worth more than the #3 pick in this draft but not as much as the #2 pick in the draft by himself ALONE.

Well newsflash, Ron Artest is still this teams best player and I understand his circumstances, you add Brad Miller, #12 pick, and contract dumps to boot and you got yourself a legitimate solid deal to land the #2 pick for a team looking to win now with its superstar in his prime.
 
O

ovrush

Bench
#12
#12
Smills91 said:
I don't buy that AT ALL. Most people would say Martin's worth more than the #3 pick in this draft but not as much as the #2 pick in the draft by himself ALONE.

Well newsflash, Ron Artest is still this teams best player and I understand his circumstances, you add Brad Miller, #12 pick, and contract dumps to boot and you got yourself a legitimate solid deal to land the #2 pick for a team looking to win now with its superstar in his prime.
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there's no way. I love Artest and he's super talented, but there's a reason people weren't beating down our doors to land him last year when he was on the market. As for Miller, just because he had a solid bounceback year on a bad team on which he was the only legitimate frontcourt talent doesn't erase the fact that he's pretty old, and has a huge and long contract.
 
Kingster

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#13
#13
Smills91 said:
I don't buy that AT ALL. Most people would say Martin's worth more than the #3 pick in this draft but not as much as the #2 pick in the draft by himself ALONE.

Well newsflash, Ron Artest is still this teams best player and I understand his circumstances, you add Brad Miller, #12 pick, and contract dumps to boot and you got yourself a legitimate solid deal to land the #2 pick for a team looking to win now with its superstar in his prime.
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I'm not sure about that Martin angle. If you're a GM you would be getting a proven up and coming star in the NBA in Martin. Also, Martin can play TODAY; he's gone through much of his growing pains. And he's just on the cusp of entering into his prime. With the draftees, you have much more risk - you don't know how much they are going to work, how much they will improve, whether they will get themsleves in trouble off the court, etc. I'd say a Martin trade would be just about right for either of the top 2.

With regard to Artest, he is the "best", but he doesn't have the most market value (see Denver offer).
 
Dime Dropper

Dime Dropper

All-Star
#14
#14
Smills91 said:
I don't buy that AT ALL. Most people would say Martin's worth more than the #3 pick in this draft but not as much as the #2 pick in the draft by himself ALONE.

Well newsflash, Ron Artest is still this teams best player and I understand his circumstances, you add Brad Miller, #12 pick, and contract dumps to boot and you got yourself a legitimate solid deal to land the #2 pick for a team looking to win now with its superstar in his prime.
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I strongly disagree. No matter how much you over-rate our players, no team in their right mind would give up Rose or Beasley for Artest (headcase, possible year rental), Miller (solid center, old, huge contract) and the 12th pick (generally don't find stars here, in fact this is the area largely filled with busts). Even including Martin, is it worth it? If I'm Miami, I can get far, far better deals than this one. Therefore, we do not have a realistic shot at landing the 2nd pick.
 
S

Smills91

Starter
#15
#15
dime dropper said:
I strongly disagree. No matter how much you over-rate our players, no team in their right mind would give up Rose or Beasley for Artest (headcase, possible year rental), Miller (solid center, old, huge contract) and the 12th pick (generally don't find stars here, in fact this is the area largely filled with busts). Even including Martin, is it worth it? If I'm Miami, I can get far, far better deals than this one. Therefore, we do not have a realistic shot at landing the 2nd pick.
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Oh really, I'd love to hear these examples of FAR better deals. Anything FAR better and it's not worth it. I don't see Portland giving up either Roy or Oden, these type of deals just aren't out there. 2 stars at their positions to dump bad deadweight contracts to only drop 10 spots in the draft? Are you kidding me?
 
bajaden

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#16
#16
Smills91 said:
Oh really, I'd love to hear these examples of FAR better deals. Anything FAR better and it's not worth it. I don't see Portland giving up either Roy or Oden, these type of deals just aren't out there. 2 stars at their positions to dump bad deadweight contracts to only drop 10 spots in the draft? Are you kidding me?
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I afraid I have to agree with you on this one Smills. It amazes me how people overrate other teams players and underrate their own. We couldn't do this deal with Artest involved until after the draft anyway, and I doubt Petrie would do the deal for just Artest alone straight up. I would, but my gut tells me he's going to be around for a while.
 
Vlade4GM

Vlade4GM

All-Star
#17
#17
bajaden said:
I afraid I have to agree with you on this one Smills. It amazes me how people overrate other teams players and underrate their own. We couldn't do this deal with Artest involved until after the draft anyway, and I doubt Petrie would do the deal for just Artest alone straight up. I would, but my gut tells me he's going to be around for a while.
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LOL, wow. If that's the case go to a Miami message board and see how they feel about this deal.

This deal isn't enough to get Beasley and Miami is not going to give it up for a player that isn't that much better than Marion if at all, a center on his last legs, and a 12th pick. I don't know where people got the idea that Miami is so desperate to dump the 2nd pick, they're not, they're willing to trade it for a star player. They likely won't get enough so they'll either keep the pick or trade down a spot or two along with some future first rounders. They definitely want to compete next year but Riley isn't stupid enough to do it at the expense of youth and cap space. I'm sure he wants an Amare or Bosh type for a package around the no.2 pick.
 
Dime Dropper

Dime Dropper

All-Star
#18
#18
Smills91 said:
Oh really, I'd love to hear these examples of FAR better deals. Anything FAR better and it's not worth it. I don't see Portland giving up either Roy or Oden, these type of deals just aren't out there. 2 stars at their positions to dump bad deadweight contracts to only drop 10 spots in the draft? Are you kidding me?
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Minny, Seattle, Memphis and NY could all offer better deals if Mayo is still around. The only way the Heat trade the 2nd pick in this draft is if they can get Mayo a few picks later. Mayo won't have a chance of being around at 12. As far as I'm concerned, that's a far, FAR better deal for Miami, considering they would be dumping contracts and/or getting other pieces in return. How wouldn't it be worth it? I think Rose will be a HOF'er, the Heat don't (presumably). Teams with top 6 picks may also think the same about Rose, and therefore not mind giving up a (lower) pick and something to make it worthwhile for the Heat. I never mentioned Portland, or Oden or Roy.

To "only drop 10 spots in the draft", haha, that one made me laugh. I ask you back, are you kidding me? You really think the difference between Rose/Beasley and Speights/McGee isn't that great? Wow. Once again you vastly overestimate our players and try to make yourself believe what's highly unlikely.



I afraid I have to agree with you on this one Smills. It amazes me how people overrate other teams players and underrate their own. We couldn't do this deal with Artest involved until after the draft anyway, and I doubt Petrie would do the deal for just Artest alone straight up. I would, but my gut tells me he's going to be around for a while.
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Who has over-rated other teams players? I haven't. There are far better deals out there, whether you want to admit to it or not. The Kings don't have many trading pieces, and that packaged along with almost a mid first rounder just isn't very good. Teams with picks 3-7 could all offer more because Mayo might be around through those particular picks. Miami will not be trading the 2nd pick unless they get a pick where they can take Mayo.
And contrary to what you say, this board vastly over-rates our players, not the other way round. There's a reason we have a mediocre record when we're playing our absloute best and trying to win meaningless games at the end of the season.

You honestly think Geoff wouldn't trade Ron for the 2nd pick straight up if he could? Wow, I can't believe you actually think that. Geoff is not stupid, that would be the most lopsided trade in NBA history, yes - topping the LA - Mem trade.
 
Dime Dropper

Dime Dropper

All-Star
#19
#19
Vlade4GM said:
LOL, wow. If that's the case go to a Miami message board and see how they feel about this deal.

This deal isn't enough to get Beasley and Miami is not going to give it up for a player that isn't that much better than Marion if at all, a center on his last legs, and a 12th pick. I don't know where people got the idea that Miami is so desperate to dump the 2nd pick, they're not, they're willing to trade it for a star player. They likely won't get enough so they'll either keep the pick or trade down a spot or two along with some future first rounders. They definitely want to compete next year but Riley isn't stupid enough to do it at the expense of youth and cap space. I'm sure he wants an Amare or Bosh type for a package around the no.2 pick.
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All true. I can't believe the naieve view held by some regarding the 2nd pick, which would land BEASLEY or ROSE! If the position was reversed and we had the second pick, would we be willing to trade it for Miller, Artest and the 12th? Not a chance in hell!
 
bloom

bloom

Starter
#20
#20
I can see Pat giving up the pick for some players that can blend well with Dwyane. Pat Riley doesn't seem like the type of guy to rebuild through the draft or wait for the young players to mature. He wants ripe players who already know the game and are experienced...If Ron agrees not to opt out of his contract, I can see Pat taking a chance and try to get him. I can imagine Wade, Marion and Artest on the same team. But we need to throw in other things for Miami to even look at this deal: our #12 pick and some other players like John, but I'm not sure John is Pat's type of guy. I can't see Miami taking Brad at all, Brad's got tallent but he's older and not as physical and athletic.

Of course there's other teams that probably really want Miami's pick and they probably have more to offer, but after seeing how L.A gave away Kwame Brown for Pau, anything can happen.
 
Vlade4GM

Vlade4GM

All-Star
#21
#21
bloom said:
I can see Pat giving up the pick for some players that can blend well with Dwyane. Pat Riley doesn't seem like the type of guy to rebuild through the draft or wait for the young players to mature. He wants ripe players who already know the game and are experienced...If Ron agrees not to opt out of his contract, I can see Pat taking a chance and try to get him. I can imagine Wade, Marion and Artest on the same team. But we need to throw in other things for Miami to even look at this deal: our #12 pick and some other players like John, but I'm not sure John is Pat's type of guy. I can't see Miami taking Brad at all, Brad's got tallent but he's older and not as physical and athletic.

Of course there's other teams that probably really want Miami's pick and they probably have more to offer, but after seeing how L.A gave away Kwame Brown for Pau, anything can happen.
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Riley isn't an idiot. In fact he's far from it, he knows Beasley/Rose dwarfs Artest and the 12th in value. The most we could get at the deadline for Artest was J.R. Smith and a late first round pick.
 
SacKings7

SacKings7

Starter
#22
#22
dime dropper said:
Minny, Seattle, Memphis and NY could all offer better deals if Mayo is still around. The only way the Heat trade the 2nd pick in this draft is if they can get Mayo a few picks later. Mayo won't have a chance of being around at 12. As far as I'm concerned, that's a far, FAR better deal for Miami, considering they would be dumping contracts and/or getting other pieces in return. How wouldn't it be worth it? I think Rose will be a HOF'er, the Heat don't (presumably). Teams with top 6 picks may also think the same about Rose, and therefore not mind giving up a (lower) pick and something to make it worthwhile for the Heat. I never mentioned Portland, or Oden or Roy.

To "only drop 10 spots in the draft", haha, that one made me laugh. I ask you back, are you kidding me? You really think the difference between Rose/Beasley and Speights/McGee isn't that great? Wow. Once again you vastly overestimate our players and try to make yourself believe what's highly unlikely.





Who has over-rated other teams players? I haven't. There are far better deals out there, whether you want to admit to it or not. The Kings don't have many trading pieces, and that packaged along with almost a mid first rounder just isn't very good. Teams with picks 3-7 could all offer more because Mayo might be around through those particular picks. Miami will not be trading the 2nd pick unless they get a pick where they can take Mayo.
And contrary to what you say, this board vastly over-rates our players, not the other way round. There's a reason we have a mediocre record when we're playing our absloute best and trying to win meaningless games at the end of the season.

You honestly think Geoff wouldn't trade Ron for the 2nd pick straight up if he could? Wow, I can't believe you actually think that. Geoff is not stupid, that would be the most lopsided trade in NBA history, yes - topping the LA - Mem trade.
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You're calling Rose a HOF'er? :eek: As good as he is, he hasn't played in the NBA yet, and could even end up being a bust. Darko was a 2nd overall pick, Kwame was a 1st, as was Olowokandi. Sometimes they just don't pan out. I think Rose will have a very successful career, but I'm gonna wait a few years before I start calling anyone future HOF'ers
 
Dime Dropper

Dime Dropper

All-Star
#23
#23
SacKings7 said:
You're calling Rose a HOF'er? :eek: As good as he is, he hasn't played in the NBA yet, and could even end up being a bust. Darko was a 2nd overall pick, Kwame was a 1st, as was Olowokandi. Sometimes they just don't pan out. I think Rose will have a very successful career, but I'm gonna wait a few years before I start calling anyone future HOF'ers
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Hehe, bold statement I know, but that's how highly I rate Rose. I realise all the past busts etc., but it has no bearing on how I feel. I don't think he'll be a great player because of where he's drafted, I think he'll be a great player because of his talent. I think at the very least he will be a perennial all-star after a couple years, who knows, maybe sooner. He has everything. His outside shot is still developing.

He's very big and strong for a PG standing at 6'3'' (at least). He is insanely athletic, fast and strong. His body control and finishing at the basket are similar to Wades in that he can hold and pull off almost impossible shots. He is an elite passer. He has that vision that the LeBrons, the CP3s of the game have. He sees things before they happen. He is like Kidd with his rebounding and can often be seen skying above bigger players for the ball with his huge leap. He has excellent leadership skills and shows great maturity running the point. Perhaps he is not aggressive enough, but that will come with playing in the NBA. He wasn't rattled by pressure for Memphis at all. He has that unique ability to take over a game. He's the full package. His skills will translate and he'll be one of the best PGs in the NBA within a few years.

If he's a bust, I'll hold my hands up and say I'm wrong. But if I'm going to bet my house on someone being a star, it's going to be Rose every single time.

[/rant]
 
SacKings7

SacKings7

Starter
#24
#24
dime dropper said:
Hehe, bold statement I know, but that's how highly I rate Rose. I realise all the past busts etc., but it has no bearing on how I feel. I don't think he'll be a great player because of where he's drafted, I think he'll be a great player because of his talent. I think at the very least he will be a perennial all-star after a couple years, who knows, maybe sooner. He has everything. His outside shot is still developing.

He's very big and strong for a PG standing at 6'3'' (at least). He is insanely athletic, fast and strong. His body control and finishing at the basket are similar to Wades in that he can hold and pull off almost impossible shots. He is an elite passer. He has that vision that the LeBrons, the CP3s of the game have. He sees things before they happen. He is like Kidd with his rebounding and can often be seen skying above bigger players for the ball with his huge leap. He has excellent leadership skills and shows great maturity running the point. Perhaps he is not aggressive enough, but that will come with playing in the NBA. He wasn't rattled by pressure for Memphis at all. He has that unique ability to take over a game. He's the full package. His skills will translate and he'll be one of the best PGs in the NBA within a few years.

If he's a bust, I'll hold my hands up and say I'm wrong. But if I'm going to bet my house on someone being a star, it's going to be Rose every single time.

[/rant]
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Oh I agree, and I didn't say I think he's gonna be a bust. I just think saying someone is gonna be a Hall Of Famer is much more far stretched than calling someone a bust before they're even drafted
 
beb0p

beb0p

Starter
#25
#25
Hmmm, let me see... Miami needs the most help at frontcourt and PG.

They're sure to land either a superstar PG or an all-star PF in the draft.

But wait, they'd rather trade that pick for a package of SF/C/SG role players.

This trade makes them competitive for a couple of years before another inevitable rebuild.
Wade will be thrilled, I'm sure.
 
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