Big Cuz 15
All-Star
it was either kawhi leonard or jimmer that i wanted in the draft. well, we know how jimmer turned out lol.
Worst case scenario is Drummond.... Right ?
- Thread starter Anthony1
- Start date
it was either kawhi leonard or jimmer that i wanted in the draft. well, we know how jimmer turned out lol.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Given everything you give up, nobody makes that bargain just for a little shooting. You can't play him big minutes, and in little minutes the only guy he even theoretically fits next to is Reke, and that's only because Reke can cover for so many deficiencies with his size and skillset (actually TWill cna cover the same way).
He's either got to progress to the level he can handle the ball like an NBA point. Even just a Matt Maloney point, or there's no way for a coach to make him an overall positive to the team.
Big Cuz 15
All-Star
to be honest, i didn't think he would stink like he did.
ParniValjak
All-Star
The more I think about it, the more I am convinced that a team picking 2.4 will take a chance on Drummond.
These tall athletic big man always get picked early as teams take a punt on their size and potential...Oden, Thabeet, Sene, Bynum (big reach at the time), Darko, etc...the history is full of teams taking a punt on these guys with a pick earlier than they should be.
I would be surprised if Drummond is still there with pick 5. As long as we don't got for another SG or a player that is just a horrible fit, I am happy.
I would love MKG, would be OK with Drummond or Barnes but would rather trade the pick for a veteran that fills the position of need for us.
How about pick 5 and Hayes for Lowry and Dalembert.
Then do a sign and trade with Portland (MT for Batum)
Cousins
Dalembert
Batum
Evans
Lowry
JT
T-Will
IT
Not a bad rotation provided our coach would develop an overnight hate for the the midget ball. That 8 man rotation would be great offensively and defensively. We instantly get better without actually spending too much money in the process. Maloofs would love it!
These tall athletic big man always get picked early as teams take a punt on their size and potential...Oden, Thabeet, Sene, Bynum (big reach at the time), Darko, etc...the history is full of teams taking a punt on these guys with a pick earlier than they should be.
I would be surprised if Drummond is still there with pick 5. As long as we don't got for another SG or a player that is just a horrible fit, I am happy.
I would love MKG, would be OK with Drummond or Barnes but would rather trade the pick for a veteran that fills the position of need for us.
How about pick 5 and Hayes for Lowry and Dalembert.
Then do a sign and trade with Portland (MT for Batum)
Cousins
Dalembert
Batum
Evans
Lowry
JT
T-Will
IT
Not a bad rotation provided our coach would develop an overnight hate for the the midget ball. That 8 man rotation would be great offensively and defensively. We instantly get better without actually spending too much money in the process. Maloofs would love it!
Big Cuz 15
All-Star
The more I think about it, the more I am convinced that a team picking 2.4 will take a chance on Drummond.
These tall athletic big man always get picked early as teams take a punt on their size and potential...Oden, Thabeet, Sene, Bynum (big reach at the time), Darko, etc...the history is full of teams taking a punt on these guys with a pick earlier than they should be.
I would be surprised if Drummond is still there with pick 5. As long as we don't got for another SG or a player that is just a horrible fit, I am happy.
I would love MKG, would be OK with Drummond or Barnes but would rather trade the pick for a veteran that fills the position of need for us.
How about pick 5 and Hayes for Lowry and Dalembert.
Then do a sign and trade with Portland (MT for Batum)
Cousins
Dalembert
Batum
Evans
Lowry
JT
T-Will
IT
Not a bad rotation provided our coach would develop an overnight hate for the the midget ball. That 8 man rotation would be great offensively and defensively. We instantly get better without actually spending too much money in the process. Maloofs would love it!
seriously? #5 for lowry essentially? really? no offense but they'd have to swallow salmons contract for us to give up the #5.
you don't think other teams would give us a player of value for the #5 pick in a deep draft? anybody trading for lowry has leverage because he publicly said he wants out.
Dreadnought
Bench
I'd be very happy with MKG, Drummond, or Beal. Any of those three and I'm a happy fan. I think I like the idea of Beal because he could turn into Dwyane Wade, and I like the idea of Drummond because he could be Dwight Howard.
Gary
All-Star
Barnes >>>>>>> Drummond if they both were available at #5
Drummond cannot do anything except slam dunk. Well I take that back.. He can play some D and he does run the floor well for a big guy, and it would be scary to have two monsters on the front line, and he COULD compliment Cousins skills... But his downside far outweighs his upside in my opinion. He really can't do much more offensively except putbacks and dunks.
Barnes is an excellent SF prospect, and he played VERY well for a big school. He does NEED a PG as we all saw in the tourney in order to make him look good but I feel that IT would play the role well. I don't think we should take Barnes though if we plan on starting Evans at PG because Barnes wouldn't benefit from playing with Evans.
EDIT: and by the way, watch the measurements. Robinson is 6'10 with shoes, he's not undersized by any stretch of the imagination. I have no idea where people get their info.
Drummond cannot do anything except slam dunk. Well I take that back.. He can play some D and he does run the floor well for a big guy, and it would be scary to have two monsters on the front line, and he COULD compliment Cousins skills... But his downside far outweighs his upside in my opinion. He really can't do much more offensively except putbacks and dunks.
Barnes is an excellent SF prospect, and he played VERY well for a big school. He does NEED a PG as we all saw in the tourney in order to make him look good but I feel that IT would play the role well. I don't think we should take Barnes though if we plan on starting Evans at PG because Barnes wouldn't benefit from playing with Evans.
EDIT: and by the way, watch the measurements. Robinson is 6'10 with shoes, he's not undersized by any stretch of the imagination. I have no idea where people get their info.
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Big Cuz 15
All-Star
isn't that what dalembert did for cousins? daly couldn't do much except putback,s dunks & play d. i didn't see him post up, drop step on any players.
barnes scares the hell out of me. he is a great shooter but thats about it. he can't create off the dribble and is mainly a catch/shoot type player. i hope he is not the one we pick on draft night.
i think barnes would benefit greatly from playing with a reke. he doesn't have to do much except come off curls, sit pretty beyond the stripe and watch for the pass.
Gary
All-Star
Barnes can catch and dribble a couple times and shoot. Not the same as creating, but it's a start. He has played a while with Marshall so I figured he looked best with a pure PG. When Marshall got injured Barnes looked kinda crappy. I wouldn't want to pair him with a SG playing PG. Just don't think it would work.
Do we really want to spend a high pick on a guy that needs a pure point and offense set up for him to be effective? Drummond scares the he'll out of me but at least there is a need/upside to consider the risk.
Big Cuz 15
All-Star
thats why he scares the **** out of me. if we're picking later in the lottery, sure he'd be bpa. do we really need to readjust our line up just to fit this type of player. if beal or drummond is available at our pick, pull the trigger
Gary
All-Star
I don't know if he NEEDS one, but I would rather he paired with someone who can hit him when he's open. Drummond on the other hand will not really give us much in the way of anything Thompson can't give us except for a block here and there and a bigger belly. I would pass on him =/
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
I say take the chance on Drummond if he's there.
Anthony1
Bench
This is the first time since the Tyreke draft, that I'm pretty much at ease, because we are guaranteed a big time guy. Sure, anybody could turn into a bust, but I think at No.5 we simply take whoever falls to us. There are 5 truly elite players imo, and we are guaranteed one of those guys. Barnes and PJ3 barely miss the cutoff for me. I think both of those guys could be very solid players, but I don't see All-Star games in their future. Beal could easily be one of the best SG's to come along in quite some time. I know SG is the easiest position to fill (plus we already have Thornton and Jimmer), but I just think he might be like top 3 or top 4 talent, and you can't pass a guy like that up just because you're already covered at that position. If you have to trade somebody, you trade somebody. (Evans, Thornton or Jimmer).
As for Thomas Robinson, dude might be undersized, but if we end up stuck with him, I don't think it's such a bad thing. I mean the guy has the body of a NBA veteran. I can see him come into the league, and adapt very quickly. If MKG falls to five, it would be like mana from heaven. He would be the perfect ingredient to our current roster. (if only he could stroke 3's) Drummond and Robinson are really the two guys that are kinda iffy, for very different reasons, but if we end up stuck with either dude, I'm perfectly cool with it. I'm not going to be stressed out at all waiting for draft day. Petrie just needs to take the guy that falls to him. Don't get cute and draft Henson or PJ3 or Barnes or Marshall. Stick to the strip and take one of the top 5 guys that could one day be All-Stars...
Yeah, I guess my only worry is Petrie.
As for Thomas Robinson, dude might be undersized, but if we end up stuck with him, I don't think it's such a bad thing. I mean the guy has the body of a NBA veteran. I can see him come into the league, and adapt very quickly. If MKG falls to five, it would be like mana from heaven. He would be the perfect ingredient to our current roster. (if only he could stroke 3's) Drummond and Robinson are really the two guys that are kinda iffy, for very different reasons, but if we end up stuck with either dude, I'm perfectly cool with it. I'm not going to be stressed out at all waiting for draft day. Petrie just needs to take the guy that falls to him. Don't get cute and draft Henson or PJ3 or Barnes or Marshall. Stick to the strip and take one of the top 5 guys that could one day be All-Stars...
Yeah, I guess my only worry is Petrie.
OptimusRhyme
Jive Turkey
Yin To Cousins Yang...
I say screw it and PICK Drummond if he's there. Yes the guy has no post skills, but who cares? we have Cuz and JT who can score in the post. All Drummond would have to focus on is rebounding, defense, rim protection, boxing out, bruising and giving hard fouls.
It takes alot of pressure off Drummond having Cousins and JT as bigman offensive weapons. Its not like we will ABSOLUTELY need Drumm to be a double digit scorer.. 6-8 PPG (Dunks, Putbacks), 10 RPG, 2.5 BPG 1.5 SPG and 6 Hard fouls is more then cool with me.
The main thing here is Drumm takes pressure off Cousins on the defensive end because he will be guarding the best big on the other team. This gives Cousins more energy to focus on offense and other things.
We need our Perkins, D. Jordan, Splitter, J Anthony... All good playoff teams have a player like what Drummond could potentially become.
Bottom line is we need defense around the rim, If we draft Drummond and he fails, all hope isnt lost because we still have the young padawan Whiteside..
I think taking the chance on Drummond is worth it (especially with the other players we could potentially select which im not too pumped about). A bigman partner for Cousins should be our top priority. And this guy could be the yin to cousins yang.
I say screw it and PICK Drummond if he's there. Yes the guy has no post skills, but who cares? we have Cuz and JT who can score in the post. All Drummond would have to focus on is rebounding, defense, rim protection, boxing out, bruising and giving hard fouls.
It takes alot of pressure off Drummond having Cousins and JT as bigman offensive weapons. Its not like we will ABSOLUTELY need Drumm to be a double digit scorer.. 6-8 PPG (Dunks, Putbacks), 10 RPG, 2.5 BPG 1.5 SPG and 6 Hard fouls is more then cool with me.
The main thing here is Drumm takes pressure off Cousins on the defensive end because he will be guarding the best big on the other team. This gives Cousins more energy to focus on offense and other things.
We need our Perkins, D. Jordan, Splitter, J Anthony... All good playoff teams have a player like what Drummond could potentially become.
Bottom line is we need defense around the rim, If we draft Drummond and he fails, all hope isnt lost because we still have the young padawan Whiteside..
I think taking the chance on Drummond is worth it (especially with the other players we could potentially select which im not too pumped about). A bigman partner for Cousins should be our top priority. And this guy could be the yin to cousins yang.
Anthony1
Bench
I'm slightly surprised that so many people are bringing up Barnes. Barnes is a small forward, and he can hit the 3, but I just think that at no.5 overall, you want to come out of there with a future all-star. I'm of the opinion that there are 5 elite guys, and Barnes isn't one of them. Is he close? Yeah... relatively. But you have to sit back and think about Barnes and all the other guys that could be considered:
Barnes
Sullinger
Lamb
Henson
Lillard
Marshall
P.Jones 3
Rivers
T.Jones
T.Ross
Is Barnes really that much better than those other guys? Yet, we're going to take him at No.5 overall ? Again, if I'm at No.6 overall, and I can't trade back, then yeah, I guess Barnes would be as good a choice as any but at No.5 when you are going to be passing on Drummond, Robinson or Beal ? If you don't want one of those 3 guys (whichever one falls to us), then trade back. If Drummond is there, and you know that Portland wants Drummond, and for whatever reason, Petrie decides that he doesn't want Drummond, then package Drummond along with something else for #6 and #11. We get Barnes at 6, and then snag P.Jones, Henson or Sullinger at 11.
Barnes
Sullinger
Lamb
Henson
Lillard
Marshall
P.Jones 3
Rivers
T.Jones
T.Ross
Is Barnes really that much better than those other guys? Yet, we're going to take him at No.5 overall ? Again, if I'm at No.6 overall, and I can't trade back, then yeah, I guess Barnes would be as good a choice as any but at No.5 when you are going to be passing on Drummond, Robinson or Beal ? If you don't want one of those 3 guys (whichever one falls to us), then trade back. If Drummond is there, and you know that Portland wants Drummond, and for whatever reason, Petrie decides that he doesn't want Drummond, then package Drummond along with something else for #6 and #11. We get Barnes at 6, and then snag P.Jones, Henson or Sullinger at 11.
Gary
All-Star
Robinson is not undersized.... He's 6'10 in shoes. I remember back a couple years ago when people were saying Love is undersized blah blah blah.. Turns out he measured much better.. Robinson was measured already at 6'10 in shoes at the LeBron James thing.. I don't think that will change come the combine.
OptimusRhyme
Jive Turkey
Drummond is more athletic/mobile then Perkins though, He has the tools too guard strong post players but also the quickness too guard quick powerforwards..
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
It is absolutely everything we need that player to do offenisvely. It would be nice if he could hit a facing jumper too. But Cousins is one of the best jumpshooting bigs himself, and plenty of time for a guy like Drummond to develop it.
Peeps, THERE ARE NO SHOTS. Far from it in fact. We actualy have negative shots in truth -- we already had more players demanding shots than could take them.
You bring in Barnes who's contribution of note is again shooting...the only way to make it fly is to dump one of Reke/Thornton/IT. And frankly two of those guys are going to be needed to keep poor little fragile Harrison in his perfect shooting spots and form. That means moving Thornton. Except Barnes, despite being a poor man's Glen Robinson type, has yet to show any real range on his shot, and so you are going backwards in three point shooting, which is something you need, and still have the big hole at shotblocking PF.
Combining two rumors, here is how Barnes works as the pick:
1) draft Harrison Barnes at #5
2) trade Marcus Thornton, Chuck Hayes and Jimmer Fredette for Kyle Lowry and Samuel Dalembert
3) resign Jaosn Thompson and Terrence Williams
C- Cousins
PF- Dalembert
SF- Barnes
SG- Evans
PG- Lowry
PG- Isaiah Thomas
SG/SF- Terrence Williams
PF/C- Jason Thompson
SG/SF - Francisco Garcia
PF/C - Hassan Whiteside
SF - Tyler Honeycutt
amnesty and dump as much of the other junk as you can.
Its cost effective. It replaces the lost 3pt shooting of Thornton with Lowry. It brings back our rim protector. It means there are always multiple creative guards on the floor to set poor little Harrison up for his perfect shots. It cleans up roles and should be a much better defensive team. In short it makes too much sense for us to do (even if Houston would take the trade).
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Gary
All-Star
But the guy cannot rebound on the defensive end to save his life. On the offensive boards he does well because he's bigger and more athletic than most and he's already down low because he can't shoot. It's not going to happen in the NBA. He might just end up as that guy off the bench that gives you 5ppg 4rpg and a block maybe in 15mins or so. I don't think he would give the Kings much more than that next year. His potential is way further up, but I hate drafting on potential because most of the time it fails.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Barnes is the exact type of SF this team needs so he'd be a great pick. He'll probably climb the boards, NBADraft.net already has him at #2. Kidd-Gilchrist if overrated and overhyped. The question is does Portland want Drummond? You'll often times see colleges recruit a carbon copy of the player they are trying to replace and Drummond looks a lot like Thabeet. That's going to scare teams. Super hyped supposed dominant bigs that get a whopping 10 ppg and 7 rpg tend to scare off teams in desperate need of talent. If Drummond is there at 5 he might have a ways to go down the board yet, but the Kings have enough young talent so it might be worth the gamble IMO.
Glenn
Hall of Famer
Drummond just lost 20 pounds because he knew he'd be a PF. That's the first sign of basketball related motivation I've seen from him that required persistant effort. I don't know what to make of it. Hope it means he's waking up. He's an enigma.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Just have to really hope that team doesn't run up against the Spurs, Heat, or any team half decent in the pick and roll. That teams going to struggle to spread the floor and these playoffs are proving that you're going to either have to combat one, or be really good at the other, and realistically both to have a shot.
DesertFox
Starter
That actually looks really good. Works out well for both sides too.
The Rockets will have some long term security with Thornton since Lee/Martin are on their last years, and with Budinger they can afford a lesser passer like Thornton at the 2.
The Kings roster is not any more talented after the trade, but looks much cleaner and fits so much better. THey will get that mobile shot blocker who can hit open jumpers and complement both JT and Cuz. I can actually see some use for Outlaw and Garcia in end of roation minutes as shooters too.
My hope is Barnes range translates to the NBA 3 pointer too, and he doesn't become a long 2's guy like Marvin Williams' first couple years.
OptimusRhyme
Jive Turkey
The kids 19 years old.. he has lots of time too learn the fundamentals of defensive rebounding. He'd be playing with one of the best rebounders in the league. Im sure Cousins could teach him a thing or two about defensive rebounding.. And if we dont take him who do we select?
Robinson who is the same as Thompson only shorter ? Barnes who is a shooter? Beal who is an undersized SG? We need defensive role players.. This years playoffs have proven that. I'd like too see Petrie show some balls and go for a defensive player for once, even if its high risk high reward... It's the direction the franchise needs too take. No more of these non defensive scorers that demand shots. At some point we are going too need to get someone like Dummond.
Its easy to find players like Barnes,Beal,Robinson.. Its a little tougher to find an Athletic/Quick/Physical/Mobile Center like Andre.
I really dont see that. At sf, they need a defensive role player type that can ideally hit open 3's. That isnt really his game at all. He's not a bad defender but not a great one. He isnt a terrific shooter from deep. I think mkg may be a little overhyped right now but he's hyped for all the things the kings need, with the exception of outside shooting.
They are in a tough spot right now since there is clearly 5 top guys but the two most likely to drop (beal and drummond) both have issues.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Barnes does not work with Cousins, Reke, Thornton and IT. No shots. Somebody would have to go, or we have to trade the pick.
BTW, Drummond was a frosh last year. Some frosh numbers:
Drummond: 28.4min 10.0pts (.538) 7.6reb 2.7blk
Duncan: 30.4min 9.8pts (.545) 9.6reb 3.8blk
Camby 21.4min 10.2pts (.494) 6.4reb 3.6blk
Ewing 28.8min 12.7pts (.631) 7.5reb 3.2blk
Noah 9.4min 3.7pts (.600) 2.5reb 0.7blk
Hibbert 15.8min 5.1pts (.469) 3.5reb 1.3blk
etc.
There is a reason they say big men take the longest to develop. Whatever the reasons to not take Drummond "only" averaging 10pts 7.6reb as a frosh center is not one of them. Lot of players who have anchored a lot of great teams have been no better, or worse.
KingsCitizen
Starter
I could easily see 5 guys in this draft that could work for us. That's Davis, MKG, Barnes, Robinson, and Drummond. And since we pick in the top 5, I'm already a happy camper. Any of those guys falling to us will tremendously move this team forward.
Here's my take on each player except Davis.
1.) MKG - MKG and Evans is already hell of a bully backcourt. You can add a spot-up PG (like Jimmer if he learns to improve his defense) or a spot-up SF (even a Mike Miller type) if you make Evans the PG and MKG a SG.
2.) Barnes - A legit spot-up SF that would keep double teams away from Reke and Boogie. Somehow an Evans-Thornton-Barnes combo could work, especially if Thornton learns to share.
3.) Robinson - Undersized or not still a very good option to pair with Cuz to add another active low-post presence. This kid will stabilize our big rotation since both JT and Hayes aren't really offensively aggressive.
4.) Drummond - We either get an Amare version 2 playing next to DMC in 2 years or a DeAndre Jordan for the rest of his career. That ain't too shabby.
Here's my take on each player except Davis.
1.) MKG - MKG and Evans is already hell of a bully backcourt. You can add a spot-up PG (like Jimmer if he learns to improve his defense) or a spot-up SF (even a Mike Miller type) if you make Evans the PG and MKG a SG.
2.) Barnes - A legit spot-up SF that would keep double teams away from Reke and Boogie. Somehow an Evans-Thornton-Barnes combo could work, especially if Thornton learns to share.
3.) Robinson - Undersized or not still a very good option to pair with Cuz to add another active low-post presence. This kid will stabilize our big rotation since both JT and Hayes aren't really offensively aggressive.
4.) Drummond - We either get an Amare version 2 playing next to DMC in 2 years or a DeAndre Jordan for the rest of his career. That ain't too shabby.
Gary
All-Star
Saw a lot of the guy because I love to hate on UCONN Basketball. Have for a long time... Anyhow, You know what the m.o. on Drummond was? Every single game I watch I expected Drummond to get outclassed on the defensive end rebounding the ball. He's basically out of position most of the time, or trying to break out. OptimusRhyme, from my experience watching college ball you either got it or you don't in regards to rebounding. It's actually a very hard skill to learn knowing where the ball will bounce. He was certainly big enough to get position but for some reason he just wasn't good at it.
Offensive rebounding he was good at.. Why? Because since he had no outside game he was told to stay near the rim, and when other players miss he used his athleticism for putbacks. God forbid he learn a jumpshot, we wouldn't even see many offensive rebounds from him if he did. He scares the hell out of my as a prospect. Not to mention it seems that UCONN rarely has decent players in the draft. It always seems they are overhyped and then fail to produce. Is it because of the teachings at UCONN? Don't know.
