Tyreke this preseason

[Bibbilicious]

Hey guys, I was just wondering what some of the opinions on this board are regarding Tyreke's performance this offseason. I know he is putting up average numbers and normally I would just say hes not quite playing up to his potential. However, after watching some games I really think a lot of it is the way Coach Smart is playing him. It seems like he is barely utilized at all. I really really hope he finds his groove because I was excited to hear about his work in the offseason.

What do you guys think? Would you say its a lack of ability or poor coaching?

 

[jcwkings]

He is obviously much better with the ball in his hands and when the game is up and down basketball. I would say his defense has been the best thing about him this pre season. If he commits to becoming a stopper, him and JJ along with Isaiah at Pg could be a very scary defensive trio. I have noticed that penetration hasn't been as big an issue as it has been in the past. I chalk it up to Isaiah, Tyreke and JJ all being able to stay in front of their guys most of the time.

 

[Bibbilicious]

Yeah I agree. I do wonder how many minutes he will be getting in games though. It seems he has been sitting for second half of the last few games. Of course I know the preseason is hardly an indicator of minutes but it looks like Coach Smart doesnt quite know what he wants to do at the guard position yet.

 

[Sac.1989]

seemed to play more of the PG role against the lakers with IT taking on more scoring responsibility. Seems to be our only way to get decent production out of him

 

[King Baller]

You guys must only focus on the offensive part of the game. Tyreke has been kicking A on defense.

KB

 

[Gary]

Hopefully they keep Evans at SG for most of his time on the floor like I had recommended 3 and a half years ago..... Seems like Smart was the only coach to figure it out.

Evans has been doing pretty well defensively. Sometimes he screws up but overall he's got the defensive instinct which imo cannot be taught very easily. I could see Evans putting up 12/5/3 and actually having the best year of his career. That says a lot.

 

[Sac.1989]

if that gets us more Wins then thats all that matters really. Long term however i wonder what his own feelings would be about his decline in statistical production

 

[Bricklayer]

seemed to play more of the PG role against the lakers with IT taking on more scoring responsibility. Seems to be our only way to get decent production out of him

This will remian the key. 2nd best player. Ball in hands. that simple.

 

[mac]

Hopefully they keep Evans at SG for most of his time on the floor like I had recommended 3 and a half years ago..... Seems like Smart was the only coach to figure it out.

Evans has been doing pretty well defensively. Sometimes he screws up but overall he's got the defensive instinct which imo cannot be taught very easily. I could see Evans putting up 12/5/3 and actually having the best year of his career. That says a lot.

He's best at SG, but not the same way that a Marcus Thornton or Kyle Korver or Garcia would be. He has to have the ball in his hands in order to be most effective. He has improved a little bit off the ball, but we should be using him primarily on offense by giving him the ball and letting guys play off of him. So far it's proven to be a good strategy especially once Cuz goes out.

 

[rainmaker]

Hopefully they keep Evans at SG for most of his time on the floor like I had recommended 3 and a half years ago..... Seems like Smart was the only coach to figure it out.

Evans has been doing pretty well defensively. Sometimes he screws up but overall he's got the defensive instinct which imo cannot be taught very easily. I could see Evans putting up 12/5/3 and actually having the best year of his career. That says a lot.

You don't take a talent like Reke and make him the 4th or 5th option on this team, which is waht 12/5/3 suggests. That suggests about 8 shots per game, hits a few of them and gets a couple free throws. Three assists also suggests he's not involved in the offense and isn't handling the ball. There's nothing to suggest Reke isn't the 2nd option on this team. There's players who play off others, and players who create for themselves and other. What you suggested means IT/Brooks/MT, who play off others, would be the creators and Reke would be playing off them. Won't work. You don't set an offense around roles players. Role players play off the guys who command attention and create. I still have yet to see any of IT/Brooks/MT draw a double team or command the attention of defenses. The players who do you play off.

If we do what you suggest, we're worse, and Reke is gone.

 

[Gary]

You don't take a talent like Reke and make him the 4th or 5th option on this team, which is waht 12/5/3 suggests. That suggests about 8 shots per game, hits a few of them and gets a couple free throws. Three assists also suggests he's not involved in the offense and isn't handling the ball. There's nothing to suggest Reke isn't the 2nd option on this team. There's players who play off others, and players who create for themselves and other. What you suggested means IT/Brooks/MT, who play off others, would be the creators and Reke would be playing off them. Won't work. You don't set an offense around roles players. Role players play off the guys who command attention and create. I still have yet to see any of IT/Brooks/MT draw a double team or command the attention of defenses. The players who do you play off.

If we do what you suggest, we're worse, and Reke is gone.

12ppg wouldn't be 4th or 5th. As long as a lot of the offense runs through him. Think abotu it like the Kings of Old. For a year or two Peja was the top scorer over Vlade, and Webb but Webb was our first option and Vlade was our second (in the terms of who has the ball).

Evans could still have the ball and be a 2nd or 3rd option and still score 12ppg and it would be perfectly fine as long as he's doing the other things needed to win.

I am going to try my best to NOT judge Evans by his scoring or lack there of. As long as he looks good in the offense, and it flows through him as well as IT (and the team shows improvement) then we found a winning combination that I wouldn't mind having for years to come..

Basically I am saying PPG does not mean everything in the case of Evans when he can do other things that some players cant.

EDIT: I tend to ramble and go from topic to topic. Writing isn't my strong suit lol.

 

[UK_King]

He has the ability to take his man every time and be ultra aggressive a la Lebron/Rose the difference is Lebron will get a foul call every time he goes to the hole and reke won't. That results in a lot of empty trips on missed layups with contact, well it did last year anyway.

 

[Gilles]

if that gets us more Wins then thats all that matters really. Long term however i wonder what his own feelings would be about his decline in statistical production

If understand correctly you mean if "IT as a PG" gets us more Wins, right? There's nothing in the history that suggests that a team with Isiah as PG gets you more wins. It gets you more assists, sure, but wins? I would like some evidence.

 

[bajaden]

If understand correctly you mean if "IT as a PG" gets us more Wins, right? There's nothing in the history that suggests that a team with Isiah as PG gets you more wins. It gets you more assists, sure, but wins? I would like some evidence.

Well, not to quibble, but you would have to admit that more assists is a step in the right direction. I used to do a little game with boxscores. Without looking at the score of any given game, I'd look at which team had the most rebounds and assists along with fewest turnovers, and I could predict the winner around 90% of the time. In general, if you out rebound the other team and have 20 plus assists and fewer than 14 turnovers, you'll win most of your games.

Obviously there are exceptions, as when you give the other team too many second chance points on putbacks etc., and a PG is only relevant, when his teammates have the ability to make shots. I've always felt they ought to give a PG a half an assist when he gets the ball to a wide open man and he misses the shot or layup.

 

[Kingster]

You guys must only focus on the offensive part of the game. Tyreke has been kicking A on defense.

KB

Not in the second to the last Laker game he didn't. Actually did a pretty poor job in that game. Maybe that game was his one poor defensive game in the preseason. I dunno. Just from the radio call of the last game it sounded like he brought his A defensive game. The key with Tyreke is going to be how consistently he brings the defensive effort. He's got to bring it game in game out, not once every few games.

 

[Kingster]

If understand correctly you mean if "IT as a PG" gets us more Wins, right? There's nothing in the history that suggests that a team with Isiah as PG gets you more wins. It gets you more assists, sure, but wins? I would like some evidence.

By the same logic, there's nothing in history either that suggests Cousins gets you more wins. I don't know what that kind of logic tells you about whether you like a player to build around or not.

 

[Gilles]

We have limited sample size that showed Evans-Thornton pairing is much more successful than Thomas-Evans or Thomas-Thornton.

..I'd look at which team had the most rebounds and assists along with fewest turnovers, and I could predict the winner around 90% of the time. In general, if you out rebound the other team and have 20 plus assists and fewer than 14 turnovers, you'll win most of your games...

I'm sorry but this really reminds great Collins' quote about correlation between scoring 100 points along with holding your opponents to less and winning.
I never said anything about rebounds and two best NBA teams have negative or barely positive assist differential so assists is not the best indicator for success.
Under Smart Kings played 22 games with Evans as a PG. I took first 24 games with Isiah as starting PG. (I'm lazy and it felt that Kings started really tanking towards the end and I just stopped at some point)
ast and ast/to really soared from 17.5 to 21.5 and 1.20 to 1.59 respectively.
Rebounds obviously fell but Kings seem to play bigger these days so it's not that big of a concern.
What really plummeted was FT/FG - from .283 to .247. That's 14.5%. Top-6 of last regular season are in top-10 in FT differential.
BTW Kings were 10-4 last season when Tyreke shot 7 or more FTs.

 

[Gary]

We have limited sample size that showed Evans-Thornton pairing is much more successful than Thomas-Evans or Thomas-Thornton.

I'm sorry but this really reminds great Collins' quote about correlation between scoring 100 points along with holding your opponents to less and winning.
I never said anything about rebounds and two best NBA teams have negative or barely positive assist differential so assists is not the best indicator for success.
Under Smart Kings played 22 games with Evans as a PG. I took first 24 games with Isiah as starting PG. (I'm lazy and it felt that Kings started really tanking towards the end and I just stopped at some point)
ast and ast/to really soared from 17.5 to 21.5 and 1.20 to 1.59 respectively.
Rebounds obviously fell but Kings seem to play bigger these days so it's not that big of a concern.
What really plummeted was FT/FG - from .283 to .247. That's 14.5%. Top-6 of last regular season are in top-10 in FT differential.
BTW Kings were 10-4 last season when Tyreke shot 7 or more FTs.

I am not getting that last part.

I am just using pre-post all star numbers but the Kings went from 41%FG to 46% (dead last to 9th in the league). No other team has as much of a change as we did.

3pt% went from 31% to 32% which is still crappy, but there was a tad bit of improvement.

FT% went from 74% to 72%. Not a huge drop off but a drop none the less. We also shot 3 less FTs a game post all star break than pre.

I believe the Kings and the Spurs were the only two teams that gained 9+ PPG in team scoring from pre to post break. If you look at the pre/post team scoring stats The Kings were the only team that went from near the bottom to near the top. The Spurs were already near the top with 99ppg, then they went all the way up with 108ppg after the break.

 

[Gilles]

Kings stopped getting to the line as much after Isiah got the reins to the team and top-6 teams of last season were in top-10 in FT differential. Actually every year from 6 to 8 of top-10 in regular season are also in top-10 in FT differential.

 

[Gary]

Kings stopped getting to the line as much after Isiah got the reins to the team and top-6 teams of last season were in top-10 in FT differential. Actually every year from 6 to 8 of top-10 in regular season are also in top-10 in FT differential.

Well yah, I had mentioned that. Only by 3 FTs though, and we shot at 2% less. It wasn't as glaring of a disappointment because the positives outweighed the negative (offensively speaking). As for defense you couldn't go down any further when you were last in the league but the Kings somehow did..

 

[Gilles]

It wasn't just 3FT, because possessions rised as well FTs were 14,5% less frequent, which is much more serious than 2% drop in making. Dunks are more efficient scoring opportunities but then FTs are by far better than the next group of shots. And FTs move opponent's players to the bench as well.

 

[ESP47]

Is it just me or does Tyreke fading away look even worse this year? Even when he's wide open he's falling way back. I noticed it on the Kings/Lakers replay last night when he came up short on a couple shots.

 

[UK_King]

For me he still fades back badly when he's contested but when he had little or no pressure his shot was more "conventional"

I would go back and have a proper look but League Pass took down all the pre season games for some reason.

 

[Gilles]

I wouldn't say it's worse but he falls back to old habit from time to time.

 

[Uk kings fan]

Alright guys had a long break from the site (how long is the offseason -_-) and missed all the preseason games.. this seemed like the right place to ask (sorry if not) how did we actally play i know we won but that means nothing realy...??

 

[HereWeBoogie]

Alright guys had a long break from the site (how long is the offseason -_-) and missed all the preseason games.. this seemed like the right place to ask (sorry if not) how did we actally play i know we won but that means nothing realy...??

well of course the rotations were crazy because its preseason and because we have coach Smart. but i think we saw some things from the potential starting 5 (Thomas,Evans,Johnson,JT,DMC) that we really liked. when they were all on the floor together the team looked amazing, and in the last preseason game that lineup really took it to the LA lakers starting 5. the team seems to be playing much harder and better on the defensive end, especially when James Johnson and Tyreke are on the floor together. we now also have a very good second unit. if the starting lineup ends up what it should be, the kings will have Thornton, Aaron Brooks, t Rob, and some other role players on the bench, in my opinion if Smart manages the rotations right, the kings second unit should dominate most other second units in the league

Robinson looks like he will be able to contribute to the team right away, just needs to take better shots.

Thornton is hitting shots like always

DeMarcus lost weight, looks quicker than ever, and should be an All-star this year

Dont really know what to expect from Tyreke yet for a number of reasons. he looked like last year at certain times in the preseason. but then there was times where he was taking over games and doing a little bit of everything, especially the final game of preseason. and he did make a couple of spot up 3's. then there is the fact that not even Tyreke knows what to expect yet, according to his own comments the other day, he has no idea what position he will play this year -_-



all in all i think that most of us see improvement in the team, and if Coach Smart can get the rotations/sub patterns correct, this team can surprise a lot of people

 

[Uk kings fan]

cool all souning good will watch a playoff game now.... anyone know which of the preseason games was the best for us??? the last one???

also how is jimmer doing???

 

[HereWeBoogie]

Jimmer still looks like last year and should never be running the offense and probably never play much now that we have Brooks and Thomas.

the last preseason game (vs Lakers in San Diego) was probably the best because we got to see a lot of the lineup everyone has wanted to see. and we got to see them head to head with the LA starters