Tyreke, G.O.A.T.?

[Lockehead]

Do any other kings fans out there think that Tyreke has potential to be one of the greatest guards in the NBA?

I was just watching some highlights on youtube, and came across this clip of Tyreke having a career night against the Bobcats. I know Jordan is owner of the Bobcats, so i started wondering if Jordan has ever seen Tyreke play at their Arena. Tyreke scores 34 pts on 13/20 shooting %, 4 boards, 2 steals, and 3blocks. I also couldnt help but notice some similarities between Tyreke and Jordan. Physically, theyre both about 6'6 220, and well muscled. Jordan of course is more athletic and explosive. But If you watch the clip, youd notice that same instinct that Jordan has.

I dont know how to embed vids but heres the link.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XxMBxyuQuw

 

[Bricklayer]

I think most Kings fans think Tyreke has the potential to be one of the greatest guards in the NBA. In fact I think there is a significant minority of us who think he has a chance to one day be THE greatest guard in the NBA. Now G.O.A.T. however stands for "Greatest of All Time", and now you are talking Jordan and Wilt and Russel and people and...well, have to get back to you on that one.

 

[bajaden]

If the question is all about potential, well then, yes. But one year does not a career make. No one knows what the future holds. It takes a lot of work and determination, plus superior talent to just be a great player in the NBA. To be the greatest of all time? Well first off, its subjective, and has to pass the taste test of every fan. I'll admit to being a huge Oscar Robertson fan, and it would be hard for anyone to surpass him in my mind. But then, I got to watch him play. Everyone has their own opinion, which makes it hard to have a consensus. But to be included in that group of players is certainly a possibility for Tyreke. This is a subject we'll need to revisit in a few years. He has a long way to go..

 

[Telemachus]

I would also point out that it also take a little bit of luck. Not only does he have to put in the hard work (along with have the talent), but has to have a long career staying relatively heathly. As an example, take a look at Labron and Wade. Both have the talent to get on that list by the end of their careers (some put Labron on it now), but what would happen if either (or both) had a major injury next season? If they suddenly couldn't play anywhere near their current level the rest of their careers they would fall off that list in a hurry. That is pretty much what happened to both Penny hardaway and Tracey McGrady.

 

[fnordius]

I'll admit to being a huge Oscar Robertson fan, and it would be hard for anyone to surpass him in my mind.

Same here. To even be the franchise's G.O.A.T., he'd have to top a guy who averaged a triple double. And elsewhere, there were those who had 100-point games, or who led their team to half a dozen championships. In some cases, the NBA even changed rules to limit a particular player's ability to dominate the league.

I'm not saying that it can't happen, but I sure won't be worrying about it while Tyreke's on his rookie contract.

 

[kingsboi]

It's just WAY too early to tell right now. Plus, he doesn't need to be the GOAT of all guards or what not, we just need him to be GREAT for our team in general if we want to get to the promised land, I don't really care much for anything else. Hard work, determination & constant improvements in his game and skys the limit.

 

[eflat]

Same here. To even be the franchise's G.O.A.T., he'd have to top a guy who averaged a triple double. And elsewhere, there were those who had 100-point games, or who led their team to half a dozen championships. In some cases, the NBA even changed rules to limit a particular player's ability to dominate the league.

I'm not saying that it can't happen, but I sure won't be worrying about it while Tyreke's on his rookie contract.

So if he brought home, say, a three-peat and a finals mvp or 2, that would still be less than averaging a triple-double? While we're purely speculating, that is...

 

[captain bill]

one step at a time...i'd be ecstatic if he brought a single championship to sacramento, and even that's too far away to legitimately entertain. come back when he's led us to the playoffs.

 

[Bricklayer]

So if he brought home, say, a three-peat and a finals mvp or 2, that would still be less than averaging a triple-double? While we're purely speculating, that is...

would still be less.

Basically there are two guards in history who anybody but Kobe jockers put above Oscar, and 1 of them (Magic) is sometimes ranked above, sometimes below. 1 has 6 titles and 5 MVPs, the other 5 titles and 3 MVPs. I am convinced of Reke's future greatness, will go so far as to say that he has taken an excellent first step on a potential HOF career. Still not quite ready to say he's a legendary Top 5 all time player without significantly more evidence.

 

[Lockehead]

Maybe the GOAT thing was a bit too far heh. It is too early to tell, but after seeing how he did in his 1st year, i would not be surprised if he becomes a star in the likes of lebron, wade, and kobe some time down the stretch. I just hope hes able to stay healthy.. we all saw how much of a bruising he took last season. But again, his style of play is very physical and punishing. Like i said, it kind of reminds me of jordan because both of them are willing to attack the basket, and sacrifice their bodies, even against multiple defenders.

 

[Kingsguy881]

Maybe the GOAT thing was a bit too far heh. It is too early to tell, but after seeing how he did in his 1st year, i would not be surprised if he becomes a star in the likes of lebron, wade, and kobe some time down the stretch. I just hope hes able to stay healthy.. we all saw how much of a bruising he took last season. But again, his style of play is very physical and punishing. Like i said, it kind of reminds me of jordan because both of them are willing to attack the basket, and sacrifice their bodies, even against multiple defenders.

Kind of reminds you of Jordan? In what way exactly? There are tons of guards who attacked the basket, Tyreke and Jordan did/do it in completely different fashion, Tyreke uses his shiftyness and quick change of direction to get to the rim, Jordan used his hang time, leaping ability, and body control to attack the rim.

GOAT, after one year, complete and utter ridiculousness. Let the man have a freaking career before labeling him, geez.

 

[Lockehead]

I wasnt serious about the GOAT. They have different moves and abilities, but they are similar in how the play. Physically, they are of the same size. Both are 6'6 ~220 lbs of muscle, theyre strong and big boned. Jordan had huge hands which allowed him to do amazing things with the ball. Tyreke from what ive seen appears to have huge hands also (several occasions it looked as if Tyreke is able to palm the ball in midair which i dont think kobe can do). Tyreke goes to the basket alot as his jumpshot isnt so refined at the moment, much like Jordan in his earlier years. Both are acrobatic and creative in finishing at the rim. Mentally, they are similar also. They have that instinct to attack the defense, challenging multiple defenders. Both are tough and gutsy. They hustle on defense, and are willing to share ball.

The combination of physical dominance and abilities make these two comparable.

Im not saying he is Jordan, in many ways he is not, but these are some of those characteristics that allowed Jordan to be dominant.

 

[Dreadnought]

If Tyreke brings home a single championship to Sacramento, he's done his part to me and that is all I ask of him. No need to get ahead of ourselves! Let's just hope he becomes the best King to ever play first.

 

[Bricklayer]

I wasnt serious about the GOAT. They have different moves and abilities, but they are similar in how the play. Physically, they are of the same size. Both are 6'6 ~220 lbs of muscle, theyre strong and big boned. Jordan had huge hands which allowed him to do amazing things with the ball. Tyreke from what ive seen appears to have huge hands also (several occasions it looked as if Tyreke is able to palm the ball in midair which i dont think kobe can do). Tyreke goes to the basket alot as his jumpshot isnt so refined at the moment, much like Jordan in his earlier years. Both are acrobatic and creative in finishing at the rim. Mentally, they are similar also. They have that instinct to attack the defense, challenging multiple defenders. Both are tough and gutsy. They hustle on defense, and are willing to share ball.

The combination of physical dominance and abilities make these two comparable.

Im not saying he is Jordan, in many ways he is not, but these are some of those characteristics that allowed Jordan to be dominant.

GOATness...that's just something you can't even talk about for years. But it is very much true that Reke comes from that same class of players. Guys who in recent years I have called "Kobe class" players, but who in earlier times would have been "Jordan class" players. The guys who fill up every corner of the statsheet. Kind of the sine qua non, the threshhold for them is exactly what Reke accomplished last year: 20+pts 5+rebs 5+ast, maybe not every year, but consistently close. Guys with fewer assists are mostly just scorers, and inherently less valuable since they aren't creating for others and you can't really run an offense through them so much as for them. Guys weaker in boards likely being PGs without the physical dominance. Guys without the scoring trending down toward roleplayers and second bananas and not being goto type guys (see Iguodala, Andre).

The 20-5-5 type wing guys though are elite guys. They are not all GOATs, but almost all of them will be All Stars at some point, and the highest end guys do become the all timers. They range from less talented varieties like Joe Johnson at one end, all the way up to Jordan on the other. A partial list might be:

Michael Jordan
Kobe Bryant
Dwayne Wade
Tracy McGrady
Paul Pierce
LeBron James
Grant Hill (pre injury)
Penny Hardaway (pre injury)
Steve Francis
Scottie Pippen
Joe Johnson
Brandon Roy
Vince Carter
Clyde Drexler
etc.

with a few guys approaching those kind of abilities in their priime like Manu Ginobili and Ray Allen. In earlier eras you could add in names like Jerry West, Oscar Robertson, John Havlicek, Rick Barry etc. In their own unique ways Bird and Magic both qualified too. So might have Chris Mulin. They are an elite class of player, full of All Stars and HOFs, and Reke absolutely belongs to the same tradition. Its just a question about how high up the ladder of those guys he's going to climb.

 

[Lockehead]

Great post Brick. We all know Tyreke is going to be a great player, we will just have to wait to see how great he can actually be.

 

[Superman]

A partial list might be:

...

Steve Francis

Good to see him get some love for a change. I feel robbed by how his career went, because he was incredibly fun to watch. I never mistook him for Kobe or Jordan, or even McGrady or Penny, but he was a go-to first banana kind of guy, if on the fringe, and I thought he had the potential to be really, really good, on historical levels. Too bad it didn't happen, for whatever reason.

 

[bajaden]

Good to see him get some love for a change. I feel robbed by how his career went, because he was incredibly fun to watch. I never mistook him for Kobe or Jordan, or even McGrady or Penny, but he was a go-to first banana kind of guy, if on the fringe, and I thought he had the potential to be really, really good, on historical levels. Too bad it didn't happen, for whatever reason.

Whereas were touching old bases, I thought I'd give a little love to one of my favorites. The orginal Skywalker, David Thompson. He only played 8 seasons due to a knee injury, but he was one of the best ever when he was healthy. They claimed he could take a quarter off the top of the backboard. When asked, he said he didn't have enough hangtime to do that, but that he could touch the top of the backboard. He reportedly had a 44 inch vertical, and he probably blocked more shots than any other 6'4" guard in basketball.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6OsKy1c5A0&feature=related

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

Whereas were touching old bases, I thought I'd give a little love to one of my favorites. The orginal Skywalker, David Thompson. He only played 8 seasons due to a knee injury, but he was one of the best ever when he was healthy. They claimed he could take a quarter off the top of the backboard. When asked, he said he didn't have enough hangtime to do that, but that he could touch the top of the backboard. He reportedly had a 44 inch vertical, and he probably blocked more shots than any other 6'4" guard in basketball.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6OsKy1c5A0&feature=related

Dwyane Wade?