Tyreke at SF - the New Starting Lineup?

A

alpinegroove

Prospect
The Sacramento Bee hints that we might see a new lineup tonight with Udrih as PG, Garcia as SG, and Evans as SF. The Israeli media is also reporting that this is expected to happen, of course focusing on the fact that Casspi will be sent to the bench and will become the sub of the player who plays the largest number of minutes for the Kings (when he isn't in foul trouble). So it looks like Casspi might be losing the starting position as well as a lot of playing time.
In any case, what do you think about the Tyreke as SF idea?

http://blogs.sacbee.com/sports/kings/archives/2010/11/why-not-cisco-i.html
 
alpinegroove said:
The Sacramento Bee hints that we might see a new lineup tonight with Udrih as PG, Garcia as SG, and Evans as SF. The Israeli media is also reporting that this is expected to happen, of course focusing on the fact that Casspi will be sent to the bench and will become the sub of the player who plays the largest number of minutes for the Kings (when he isn't in foul trouble). So it looks like Casspi might be losing the starting position as well as a lot of playing time.
In any case, what do you think about the Tyreke as SF idea?

http://blogs.sacbee.com/sports/kings/archives/2010/11/why-not-cisco-i.html
Click to expand...

I would think its idiotic and immediately go join the Fire Westphal thread as the massive team we constructed int eh offseason would now be reduced to a tiny group of smallballers.

However, and this is a big HOWEVER, you are citing Ailene Voison as your source. And while you have no reason to know this, you need to understand that Voison both writes with an agenda (in this case, Tyreke is not a PG, but her wet fantasy boy Rubio is), and inserts her own wishes/desires into her articles as if they were fact.

Note this key passage in that article:
He wouldn't offer any hints even when pressed, but after crunching some numbers, watching tapes of recent games, and chatting with a couple of NBA lifers, it wouldn't surprise me if Westphal experimented with Francisco Garcia and Beno Udrih in the backcourt, with Tyreke Evans at small forward.
Click to expand...

Notice what she did there? She then proceeds to reel off 8 paragraphs on her little smallball fantasy treating it as if Westphal actually said that was what he was going to do. She does this all the time.

Could it be true? Who knows. In particular against the Knicks, who smallball themselves. But Ailene saying it might be so, because she thinks it would be a good idea, means very little. Note as well that if Cisco, a SG/SF. arrives in the starting lineup how/why does Tyreke end up at SF? Because Ailene does not like him in the backcourt, that's why. If Cisco starts, that's the guy Casspi would be behind, not Reke.
 
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alpinegroove said:
The Sacramento Bee hints that we might see a new lineup tonight with Udrih as PG, Garcia as SG, and Evans as SF. The Israeli media is also reporting that this is expected to happen, of course focusing on the fact that Casspi will be sent to the bench and will become the sub of the player who plays the largest number of minutes for the Kings (when he isn't in foul trouble). So it looks like Casspi might be losing the starting position as well as a lot of playing time.
In any case, what do you think about the Tyreke as SF idea?

http://blogs.sacbee.com/sports/kings/archives/2010/11/why-not-cisco-i.html
Click to expand...

Moving Garcia into the backcourt - and empowering Udrih to direct the offense - seems worth a try, for a few reasons:
* The Kings simply have to play faster. They would be unbearable to watch if the 24-second clock didn't exist. Their poor shooting percentage (45 percent) is at least somewhat attributable to an inordinate number of contested shots, to the habit of creating everything off the dribble, and to the fact they rarely utilize their quickness and athleticism for fastbreak opportunities. (It's ok. Throw ahead!) Unless Tyreke grabs the rebound and breaks downcourt for one of his muscular scoring drives, his pacing with the ball is tentative, even laborious, and his passes too seldom catch teammates in rhythm.
Click to expand...

You've got to be kidding me. We have to play faster???? I swear half our shots are taken with more than half the shot clock left (Carl Landry jumpshot anyone? Tyreke 3? Luther Head pull up? Omri 3?) If anything we have to be more patient IMO and move the ball around more.

What do I think about the Tyreke as SF idea .... I think ... that our coaching staff is just not doing a good job communicating to our players. I think consistently changing guys positions and thus roles will not allow even the best players to excel and grow. It seems Westphal prefers to just change lineups instead of working on our execution. Seriously, does any other coach in the league use lineups as an excuse this often? Westphal is always saying how he felt these matchups were good, bla bla bla bla. If the team was good, then the regular rotation would be able to compete more or less with whatever the other team throws at us. Changing a few things here and there is fine, but every game? This is getting frustrating.

That is of course, if it really turns out to be so. But regardless of the accuracy of this report I feel Westphal should depend on our players to win ball games instead of always using "advantageous match ups". It's funny, how Westphal talks about how he likes the match ups, but when Cousins has some random 3rd tier center defending him we don't throw him the ball.
 
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seriously?

1636-2partyfail2.jpg
 
I would be willing to try anything at this point. The fact of the matter is it's starting to become somewhat apparent that Tyreke is not a natural PG and probably shouldn't be facilitating the offense. I think he'll end up more like a Lebron/DWade kind of guard who will get a lot of assists but won't necessarily be a PG.

It couldn't hurt to try this for a few games and see what happens.
 
LWP777 said:
I would be willing to try anything at this point. The fact of the matter is it's starting to become somewhat apparent that Tyreke is not a natural PG and probably shouldn't be facilitating the offense. I think he'll end up more like a Lebron/DWade kind of guard who will get a lot of assists but won't necessarily be a PG.

It couldn't hurt to try this for a few games and see what happens.
Click to expand...


Tyreke is a LeBron/Wade kind of guard. To me it doesn't matter if he is at the 1 or 2 as long as the opposite guard can dribble and hit 3s
 
If tyreke is going to slow the play down to a crawl as seems to be his style of coming up the court he needs to just be more selfish.

i watched the Hornets the other night and Chris Paul took almost every shot; and any time he didn't shoot it was usually a strong drive to the bucket and then a pass to the wing giving him an assist; the whole thing revolves around him making every play.

im not comparing paul and reke but what i hate seeing is reke coming up the court one pass to someone who jacks a three.
 
The Tyreke, Beno, Garcia trio is better than any lineup with Casspi (or Greene). Whoever defends the 3, plays the 3, so sometimes I can see Tyreke defending the 3 and sometimes Garcia the 3. Doesn't mean that the offense has to change any. This kind of lineup (sans Casspi) makes sense against NY. They are going to have to score much more than they have been in order to compete with NY, and unless Casspi has an incredibly hot shooting streak, they need that trio to lead the way. It would also be nice to spread the floor and get Cousins down low against Amare & Co., but I'm not holding my breath yet on that. Look, if you're Westphal, and you look at how horrible the Kings have been shooting, you've got to be very anxious coming into this game.
 
UK_King said:
im not comparing paul and reke but what i hate seeing is reke coming up the court one pass to someone who jacks a three.
Click to expand...
I totally agree. That to me is the most annoying thing. I wish they would learn to pass the ball from side to side. Or at least pass the ball 2 or 3 times before someone shots.
 
HaHa. My favorite journalist is up to it again. I read the article, and would love to have Voison fired after her prediction proves to be false.

Jason Jones hinted at a lineup change tonight, and Westphal said he would announce it today, closer t game time. My guess would be Cisco replacing Beno in the backcourt because of Beno's lack of defense. Or, Cousins in for Landry at the 4.

You wouldn't think it would make sense until Westphal said he would put Dally on Amare, leaving Carl on Mozgov(russian center)? I could definitely see Cousins in the starting lineup tonight with a Mozgov/Amare frontcourt to defend. Carl can't guard Amare, and he certainly can't guard the 7'1" russian center.

My prediction for tonight:
Tyreke
Beno
Casspi
Cousins!
Dally


Looking forward to seeing if I am better at predicting lineup changes than someone who covers the team and has access to the practice facility and coaches/staff. We shall find out!
 
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Im not going to get too worked up over this, but of ALL possible changes to our lineup.. THIS is the one Westphal comes up with?

I just dont get him.

If we decided to play Cisco and Reke with Beno on the bench, Im all for that one. Thats why Landry should get on the bench too. If you cant play defense, you come in later as a scorer when your lack of defense wont hurt as much.
 
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Our present starting lineup hasn't been winning or looking anything but bad (team play). Our most accomplished non starter is Cisco, with Thompson next and trailing. Jeter, Head, Wright, Greene, Jackson, Cousins, and Whiteside are not ready for prime time. Not a helluva lot of choice for the coaches. We are now looking for a win, not development of players. Hopefully, there will be time for that later. I wish the coaches and the players well, and have a little luck.
 
Bricklayer said:
Please read the following before responding to this thread:


Ailene Voison!
Click to expand...

Hah. So true.

Thing is, with Westphal as coach, I wouldnt be surprised at all if this goes down.

I'd rather see Cisco take Beno's spot in the starting lineup. I dont know what other changes I would like to see happen. Landry has picked his play up, so he should stay the starter, and I still like Cuz off the bench behind Dally. Omri is our best SF (which shows you how bad our SF rotation is), so he should keep the start.

I swear, with Wesphal here we should have a "guess the starting 5" poll in each gamethread.
 
Bricklayer said:
She then proceeds to reel off 8 paragraphs on her little smallball fantasy treating it as if Westphal actually said that was what he was going to do. She does this all the time.
Click to expand...

It doesn't read like a claim of what Westphal is actually going to do or said he would do. The part where she says "it wouldn't surprise me if Westphal experimented with Francisco Garcia and Beno Udrih in the backcourt, with Tyreke Evans at small forward" is a clear indicator that everything regarding Tyreke at the SF is just speculation on her part.
 
rainmaker said:
and would love to have Voison fired after her prediction proves to be false.
Click to expand...

A, making false predictions seems like an odd reason to fire a sports writer. There wouldn't be many sports writers left if we started firing them based on false predictions, lol. B, I'm not sure how anyone could interpret "it wouldn't surprise me" as a prediction anyways.
 
Well if we were going to vote on a possible lineup change my vote would go to rainmaker's prediction of teaming Cousins with Dally. It has to happen someday so why not tonight?
 
RookieOfTheDay said:
A, making false predictions seems like an odd reason to fire a sports writer. There wouldn't be many sports writers left if we started firing them based on false predictions, lol. B, I'm not sure how anyone could interpret "it wouldn't surprise me" as a prediction anyways.
Click to expand...


I wasn't familiar enough with her reputation, and the Israeli paper stated it pretty much as a fact, but my sense is that it just took her speculation/wish and made a headline out of it.
Just bad journalism and an inattentive reader (me).
 
RookieOfTheDay said:
A, making false predictions seems like an odd reason to fire a sports writer. There wouldn't be many sports writers left if we started firing them based on false predictions, lol. B, I'm not sure how anyone could interpret "it wouldn't surprise me" as a prediction anyways.
Click to expand...

Agree with you. Right now I don't think the Bee, Voison, Jones are the problem.
 
This is not PW saying he'll start Evans at SF, this is Voisin speculating and she made that clear in the article. I could easily say, "It wouldn't surprise me if Ron Artest quit basketball and go join a circus." In the end, it means absolutely nothing.

Even if Voisin's speculation comes true, all it means is PW swaps Casspi for Garcia; a very reasonable thing to do. It matters little what you call Evans' position, as long as he's in the game with Beno and a SF (Garcia/Beno) very little changes.

.
 
alpinegroove said:
I wasn't familiar enough with her reputation, and the Israeli paper stated it pretty much as a fact, but my sense is that it just took her speculation/wish and made a headline out of it.
Just bad journalism and an inattentive reader (me).
Click to expand...

I don't know where you read it stated as a fact, the word i see used in the title is "predicted", most likely they just saw Voison's article, that's it.
We all know in a few hours what the starting line up is, so there's no point in arguing if it's good or bad(yet), and in my opinion, playing Evans as SF with Garcia and Udrih is not a bad idea, as long as you replace Landry with Cousins so you'll have more size in the paint, who knows, maybe the second unit will be Casspi and Greene playing together off the bench as SF and PF? not bad I think.
 
It's just the stupid Israeli media not seeing into what was written in the article and comming off with headlines just for the heck of it.

I can't possibly see this happening... maybe Omri to the bench and Cisco at SF, but Evans at SF? thats just dumb considering our role for the SF.
 
I'd like to see;

Reke PG
Cisco SG
Omri SF
Cuz PF
Dali C

Landry has shown he can be productive off the bench... dang he was up for 6MOY wasn't he?

Beno is mr consistent, no worries off bench.

JT can do his thing at C or PF.

Give Whiteside some spot minutes even. As long as we aren't getting killed with him out there, he can give a big some rest.

What the heck Westphal... lets give Donte a spin dude!

Rest can fill in and also garbage time it....

Please PW, get a rotation going and let the guys figure it out!!! Just because Head or Darnell have a good couple minutes doesn't mean ya gotta ride them... get the starters back in when there rest is up and let them figure it out.. .christ, we keep losing anyway.
 
i really don't understand where Westphal's brain is right now, hopefully he figures it out soon or he'll be getting a boot at the end of the year.
 
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