Trade / Luke or both

#61
Exactly. There are enough people here that recognize that Fox is damn good but Walton is effing it all up. How many of these guys are playing above or at their norm. It’s bad.
Thing is that Fox has very publicly supported Luke even when he didn't need to last year, and he's played we relatively well under two years of Walton prior to this season. So to say that Luke is the source of Fox's struggles is somewhat suspect.
 
#62
If it were me I would make the Simmons trade and see how it goes. Luke wants to play a movement style like Golden State and Simmons is a good player for that type of game whereas Fox is a ball stopper:

You have a set of good line-ups:
Holmes, Barnes, Simmons, Hield, Haliburton

Small line-up of
Simmons, Barnes, Hield, Haliburton, Mitchell

Defensive stopper
Holmes, Simmons, Barnes, Haliburton, Mitchell

Shooters and Simmons:
Haliburton, Hield, King, Barnes, Simmons

I could well see going offense/defense at the end of games swapping Holmes and Hield.
Simmons may be what the team needs, but I have my concerns. Fox seems to be struggling to find his way when playing off the ball. Something I think he'll figure out in time, but, it is a concern. It's the same concern I would have with Simmons. Matter of fact, my concern would be even greater with Simmons because he doesn't want to play off the ball. At least Fox is willing.

In my opinion, the best pure PG on the team is Haliburton, and he's most effective with the ball in his hands. That's not to say he's not effective off the ball. He is! But to get the most out of him you have to put the ball in his hands, and that's not a bad thing. He's dam good with the ball in his hands. Trade for Simmons and you have to make him the primary ball handler. At least if you want to make him happy, and that means not playing Haliburton to his strengths.

I'd rather trade Fox for a wing, like Jerami Grant. If you want to shoot for the sky then go for Tatum or Jaylen Brown. Or how about Brandon Ingram. Point is, a trade like that would help balance this team, which is very unbalanced at the moment. I'm all for getting rid of Walton, who isn't a terrible coach, but this team because of its lack of experience and youth, needs a great coach. The fact that the players love him actually makes me more apprehensive. A lot of well liked coaches have been losers.

That said, I'm not sure what firing him now would accomplish other than pleasing the fans, and getting his stench out of the locker room. And maybe that's enough reason. But whatever happens, this team needs to take its time and find the right coach for this team. As for McNair, I would leave him in place. In a way he reminds me of Geoff Petire. Petrie inherited a mess when he was hired. The team had no cap space and was filled with an odd mix of players that didn't want to be here. But he had a plan! A plan that took five years from the day he signed on in 1994. Five years later Vlade, Webber, Peja and company opened thier first season together. And I remember him getting booed the day he drafted Peja.

Back then, people were calling for Petrie's head, but ownerships patience paid off. I think McNair inherited a mess as well. The Bogi situation was created by Vlade. McNair almost pulled off a trade that would have been beneficial for both teams. I guess you can be critical of the fact that so far, it's been almost, and not finished. But that happens sometimes. I'd rather have a GM that's patient and careful than a GM that makes knee jerk decisions. Not as much fun for the fans, but long term it's a better approach.

The point is, McNair seems to have a plan. The players he's brought in all have one common trait for the most part. They can all defend and most are skilled. No, he hasn't make the big blockbuster yet, but as they say, it takes two to tango. Or, it takes the ability to resist giving away the house just to make a big trade. So far, I'm OK with what he's done. Do I wish it was more? Sure, but my gut tells me something is going to happen. Probably has to if were going to any chance to save the season.

As a side note, I thought our starting five got off to a very good start to the game. But when Metu, Hali, and Barnes went to the bench replaced by Buddy, Mitchell, and Thompson, the wheels came off for some reason. The next time the starting five were on the floor together at the same time was the beginning of the 3rd quarter. The game was essentially over by then, or at least we played like it was..
 
#63
Is Fox still exceptional since he had Covid? He does not look astonishingly fast to me. Shots are short a lot. I wonder if Covid took something out of him that he has not gotten back and may not get back. Yes a supreme athlete is gonna survive it, but unscathed?? maybe not. Watching Fox's play if you told he he is 36 and on the downside of his career I'd believe it. hope he pulls out of it
 
#64
The Kings just don't have enough talented shooters. Metu ain't going to do it. He shouldn't even be a starter. Down by 14pts and you're in dire need of a bucket, you let Metu shoot? You let Len do a hook shot? Nah, that ain't going to work. What kind of coaching is that? Bagley is a waste of #2 pick sitting on the bench. Harkless isn't a great shooter, not sure why they even sign him along with Terrance Davis. The other problem with the Kings every year is that they like to settle around 7-10 picks in the NBA draft because they're trying to fight to get into the Playoffs even though there isn't a remote chance. So rather than tanking, they keep trying to win preventing them from getting top 5 picks. Other teams tanking and getting top picks in the draft and built off of those drafts like the Suns and Bulls. Granted the Kings were lucky that Fox, Haliburton and Mitchell dropped to their lap...but without those luck, they would have been even worst. Even the Warriors know how to get top picks by tanking in the couple of years without Klay lol and look where they're now?
 
#65
Thing is that Fox has very publicly supported Luke even when he didn't need to last year, and he's played we relatively well under two years of Walton prior to this season. So to say that Luke is the source of Fox's struggles is somewhat suspect.
If his role was consistent then yes. The last few years he’s played mainly pg. This year he’s playing off the ball and struggling. We don’t know why he’s struggling. People mention possibly personal stuff, Covid, disinterest since he got paid etc, but playing out of your best role could do it too. Look at buddy. He’s been up and down under Walton. Did well as a sg but suffered a bit when moved to sf and really bad when put as a main ball handler. All under the same coach. Just play the players at their best position.
 
#66
Simmons may be what the team needs, but I have my concerns. Fox seems to be struggling to find his way when playing off the ball. Something I think he'll figure out in time, but, it is a concern. It's the same concern I would have with Simmons. Matter of fact, my concern would be even greater with Simmons because he doesn't want to play off the ball. At least Fox is willing.

In my opinion, the best pure PG on the team is Haliburton, and he's most effective with the ball in his hands. That's not to say he's not effective off the ball. He is! But to get the most out of him you have to put the ball in his hands, and that's not a bad thing. He's dam good with the ball in his hands. Trade for Simmons and you have to make him the primary ball handler. At least if you want to make him happy, and that means not playing Haliburton to his strengths.

I'd rather trade Fox for a wing, like Jerami Grant. If you want to shoot for the sky then go for Tatum or Jaylen Brown. Or how about Brandon Ingram. Point is, a trade like that would help balance this team, which is very unbalanced at the moment. I'm all for getting rid of Walton, who isn't a terrible coach, but this team because of its lack of experience and youth, needs a great coach. The fact that the players love him actually makes me more apprehensive. A lot of well liked coaches have been losers.

That said, I'm not sure what firing him now would accomplish other than pleasing the fans, and getting his stench out of the locker room. And maybe that's enough reason. But whatever happens, this team needs to take its time and find the right coach for this team. As for McNair, I would leave him in place. In a way he reminds me of Geoff Petire. Petrie inherited a mess when he was hired. The team had no cap space and was filled with an odd mix of players that didn't want to be here. But he had a plan! A plan that took five years from the day he signed on in 1994. Five years later Vlade, Webber, Peja and company opened thier first season together. And I remember him getting booed the day he drafted Peja.

Back then, people were calling for Petrie's head, but ownerships patience paid off. I think McNair inherited a mess as well. The Bogi situation was created by Vlade. McNair almost pulled off a trade that would have been beneficial for both teams. I guess you can be critical of the fact that so far, it's been almost, and not finished. But that happens sometimes. I'd rather have a GM that's patient and careful than a GM that makes knee jerk decisions. Not as much fun for the fans, but long term it's a better approach.

The point is, McNair seems to have a plan. The players he's brought in all have one common trait for the most part. They can all defend and most are skilled. No, he hasn't make the big blockbuster yet, but as they say, it takes two to tango. Or, it takes the ability to resist giving away the house just to make a big trade. So far, I'm OK with what he's done. Do I wish it was more? Sure, but my gut tells me something is going to happen. Probably has to if were going to any chance to save the season.

As a side note, I thought our starting five got off to a very good start to the game. But when Metu, Hali, and Barnes went to the bench replaced by Buddy, Mitchell, and Thompson, the wheels came off for some reason. The next time the starting five were on the floor together at the same time was the beginning of the 3rd quarter. The game was essentially over by then, or at least we played like it was..
The roster construction is completely on McNair. Richardson, Len, Jones, Thompson, Metu, Harkless, Davis, Haliburton, Mitchell, Woodard, Jones,

Are all his doing…..

His trades (when he has actually made one) have been abysmal. He has wasted multiple 2nd Round picks. He has let assets walk for nothing.

The only thing he has done is show a proclivity to let guards fall in his lap because everyone else is trying to get forwards.