Damian Lillard

[sactowndog]

According to RealGM, Sacramento is one of the teams aggressively pursuing Dame.

My thoughts:

1) the strength of this team is it’s young backcourt in Fox and Haliburton. They will set this team up for a number of years.

2) acquiring Dame would have to include at least one of them making a long term strength into a short term one.

3) Dame does nothing to fix the defense as Portland’s defense was horrible.

4) Dame does nothing to fix the front court which has been the weakness of this team.

Conclusion: it appears Vivek will push Monte to take any short term steps to avoid missing the play-offs this year even if it dooms this team to another 10 years being out of the play-offs. The Kings once again proving they have the shortest perspective in the league.

 

[sauce-26]

Dame is my absolute FAVORITE non-Kings player. However, we are not in a position to win by adding him. First of all, we do not have a lot to give up to get him that Portland would want, and what it would take to get him he would be the only player any good once the trade is done. And you can forget about building around him as our draft picks will be gone for the next couple years due to the trade. Dame is an absolute superstar. I am not against having him on the squad. Its what we give up and how far it sets us back that I am against.

 

[iowamcnabb]

Conclusion: it appears Vivek will push Monte to take any short term steps to avoid missing the play-offs this year even if it dooms this team to another 10 years being out of the play-offs. The Kings once again proving they have the shortest perspective in the league.

Probably every single GM in the league would trade Fox or Haliburton for Dame so I don't how you have concluded this is a Vivek short term thinking situation.

Having said that, there is no way he ends up on the Kings. Dame wants to win a championship not help a young start up. I still say he ends up in Denver for Murray and MPJ. That is an ideal landing spot for him.

 

[The_Jamal]

My guess is we're getting involved as a 3rd team with Philly to help facilitate things. McNair is smart enough to not sell the farm to probably be a worse team after the trade.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Two problems I see is that Dame moves the needle but at our lowest area of need, so it's an upgrade but a minor upgrade. And then you have to consider what else will be outgoing besides Fox or Haliburton.

Second is as @iowamcnabb pointed out the whole reason Dame is ready to sail on from Portland is because they can't sniff a championship, well guess what, it won't happen here either.

 

[Padrino]

My guess is we're getting involved as a 3rd team with Philly to help facilitate things. McNair is smart enough to not sell the farm to probably be a worse team after the trade.

This would be my line of thinking, as well as my preference. Unless McNair is under directive from Vivek to do something short-sighted like acquire Lillard at any cost, I don't imagine McNair would be interested in selling the farm to leave the Kings with a 31-year-old superstar and no way to improve the team around him.

 

[Dime Dropper]

While it obviously would make more sense that we would be a third team, that doesn't fit the report that we're aggressively pursuing Dame.

Doesn't make much sense if we are trying to get him.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

My guess is we're getting involved as a 3rd team with Philly to help facilitate things. McNair is smart enough to not sell the farm to probably be a worse team after the trade.

Are you suggesting that you think we'd be involved in a Philly-Portland trade where Simmons and Lillard swap places? What do you think our role would be?

 

[King Baller]

Dame should go to the Eastern Conference. Either Philly or Miami would be a good fit.

 

[itzcoatl]

Are you suggesting that you think we'd be involved in a Philly-Portland trade where Simmons and Lillard swap places? What do you think our role would be?

I think that could work with us getting Simmons and Portland getting a bunch of picks.

 

[Padrino]

Are you suggesting that you think we'd be involved in a Philly-Portland trade where Simmons and Lillard swap places? What do you think our role would be?

Likely a scenario where Philly gets Lillard, we take on Simmons, and Portland ends up with first rounders and assorted young players.

 

[Joshoua]

Likely a scenario where Philly gets Lillard, we take on Simmons, and Portland ends up with first rounders and assorted young players.

If you’re Portland why take picks instead of Simmons?

And a Fox/Simmons pairing ain’t gonna work

 

[Jkbiker]

Like my post on Friday:
Portland gets Buddy 3yr,Hill 1 yr, Bagley 1yr 2021 Kings#9,2022 Phil 1st,2023 Kings 1st,2024 Phil 1st, 2026 Phil 1st
Portland trades CJ and Nurkic for a ton more picks
Portland is the new OKC

Philly gets Lillard
Kings get Simmons and Thybulle

It worked under trade machine
Portland gets 5 #1 picks and Buddy is cheaper per yr than CJ
For Kings , Buddy and Bagley dont want to be here
We get two defensive players

 

[Capt. Factorial]

I think that could work with us getting Simmons and Portland getting a bunch of picks.

Likely a scenario where Philly gets Lillard, we take on Simmons, and Portland ends up with first rounders and assorted young players.

I guess I wouldn't really consider that to be "facilitation" - that's being a major player in the deal in my eyes.

 

[Jkbiker]

If you’re Portland why take picks instead of Simmons?

And a Fox/Simmons pairing ain’t gonna work

Because if you trade Dame you do a full rebuild for picks
Trade CJ also for picks and youth
Simmons will not get them to a rebuild

 

[Jkbiker]

If Portland tries to keep Dame, they will push for CJ for Simmons trade
If Portland decides to blow it up-my trade makes sense

The Sacramento Bee confirmed the Kings have expressed interest in 76ers All-Star Ben Simmons, but Fox has not been discussed in trade talks despite Philadelphia’s reported demand for an All-Star caliber player. The 76ers would be very happy to acquire Lillard instead, so maybe McNair is trying to put the Kings in position to be part of a blockbuster three-team trade.

 

[kb02]

Would love to see Dame playing with Bags. Rap battle at the beginning and end of each game!

But seriously, 9, Buddy, Bags, and two future firsts for Dame works, right? It’s like 6 first rounders for him. Lolzzz.

Three team deal please. As long as Simmons ends up in a Kings uni.

 

[Padrino]

I guess I wouldn't really consider that to be "facilitation" - that's being a major player in the deal in my eyes.

That's fair. It's not exactly facilitation in the strictest sense of the term, but Philly wants to move on from Simmons, and Lillard is the apple of Morey's eye. Portland isn't likely to consent to a Lillard/Simmons swap, however. It does nothing for their competitiveness in the west, nor does it aid them in jumpstarting a rebuild. So a team like the Kings could step in to help all parties involved get what they want.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

If you’re Portland why take picks instead of Simmons?

And a Fox/Simmons pairing ain’t gonna work

Because Portland is going to be far worse off with Simmons for Dame and I guess one or two Philly picks or maybe a few of their B-tier players.

But if they got picks from Sac, picks from Philly, plus Hield and Bagley they can get out of their cap hell, take a gamble on Bagley (who will probably show well for them because they always seem to do ok with our cast off bigs) and Hield's deal is declining. There are rumors that Jody Allen is looking to sell the team in the coming years so I think having a blank canvas is going to appeal to new owners. Especially since firing Olshey will also be a popular first move by new owners.

 

[TaxMan]

Because Portland is going to be far worse off with Simmons for Dame and I guess one or two Philly picks or maybe a few of their B-tier players.

But if they got picks from Sac, picks from Philly, plus Hield and Bagley they can get out of their cap hell, take a gamble on Bagley (who will probably show well for them because they always seem to do ok with our cast off bigs) and Hield's deal is declining. There are rumors that Jody Allen is looking to sell the team in the coming years so I think having a blank canvas is going to appeal to new owners. Especially since firing Olshey will also be a popular first move by new owners.

I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility that Bagley does actually have some good value in a deal like this. In isolation, I don't think teams are lining up to give up a significant asset to us for him; however, as part of a collection of picks and youth for a rebuilding team, he still has high upside and I could see it as a potential get for Portland (at least in selling the deal to their fans).

 

[pdxKingsFan]

I don't think that Portland is going to be able to sell the loss of Dame to fans. But if it's part of a total reset including eventual new ownership it won't matter.

 

[TaxMan]

I don't think that Portland is going to be able to sell the loss of Dame to fans. But if it's part of a total reset including eventual new ownership it won't matter.

Oh, absolutely. It will be crushing.... but I think a haul of draft picks and youth can at least be seen as "turning the page". That would be better to me than pulling in a lesser star for Dame to try to carry on the current status quo. Either way, I would guess Dame is possibly the most popular Portland athlete of all time (you would know....), so won't be great for ticket sales.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Portland isn't likely to consent to a Lillard/Simmons swap, however. It does nothing for their competitiveness in the west, nor does it aid them in jumpstarting a rebuild. So a team like the Kings could step in to help all parties involved get what they want.

So the trouble I'm having here is this: If Simmons doesn't help Portland's competitiveness in the west, then why do we think he's going to help our competitiveness? His warts are going to be the same whether he goes to one team or the other. If Portland, basically being forced to trade away their star, doesn't want Simmons back...are we fleecing ourselves getting in on the deal?

 

[The_Jamal]

Are you suggesting that you think we'd be involved in a Philly-Portland trade where Simmons and Lillard swap places? What do you think our role would be?

Helping Philly send more assets to Portland. I assume Portland would want more than just a straight Simmons-Lillard swap. Or maybe they want to full fire sale and just collect a bunch of assets. I think the Warriors would be the team there though with 7/14/Wiseman as really nice future assets.

Regardless, I'd be in if we kept Fox/Hali, no matter what else the cost. Maybe something like

Blazers get: #9(kings)/#28(Sixers)/future Kings 1st/future Sixers 1st/Maxey/Bagley then their choice of Barnes/Buddy to match salary

Sixers get: Dame

Kings get: Simmons

Maybe not enough good draft capital for the Blazers, but I imagine that's the sort of framework they'd want if they didn't want to take back Simmons. Pile of 1st rounders and some young talent. I think that's why you'd get a 3rd team involved; to help bridge that gap of draft capital.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Oh, absolutely. It will be crushing.... but I think a haul of draft picks and youth can at least be seen as "turning the page". That would be better to me than pulling in a lesser star for Dame to try to carry on the current status quo. Either way, I would guess Dame is possibly the most popular Portland athlete of all time (you would know....), so won't be great for ticket sales.

I moved here in 2005, absolutely in my time here. Clyde, some of the players from the 77 team, Jack Ramsay, Kevin Duckworth, Cliff Robinson and Brandon Roy all have spots in many hearts but none achieved the accolades Dame has.

There's a few Timbers who have achieved legend status - Clive Charles chief among them - but he died in 2003 and many people are too young to understand his legacy.

I think Marcus Mariota was the next most loved pro in Portland and he was a UO guy who never actually played here.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

So the trouble I'm having here is this: If Simmons doesn't help Portland's competitiveness in the west, then why do we think he's going to help our competitiveness? His warts are going to be the same whether he goes to one team or the other. If Portland, basically being forced to trade away their star, doesn't want Simmons back...are we fleecing ourselves getting in on the deal?

Simmons would be great if they kept Dame and moved McCollum. I think Simmons as the clear cut #1 star is the potential problem. He would not be that in Sacramento either, assuming we kept Fox, Hali and probably Barnes and the outs were Bagley, Buddy and picks it's a lot different situation?

 

[itzcoatl]

So the trouble I'm having here is this: If Simmons doesn't help Portland's competitiveness in the west, then why do we think he's going to help our competitiveness? His warts are going to be the same whether he goes to one team or the other. If Portland, basically being forced to trade away their star, doesn't want Simmons back...are we fleecing ourselves getting in on the deal?

Yeah I agree that a player that is too shook to shoot is a potential red flag in any era, but especially in this modern era with teams relying so heavily on 3s. I think the hope with bringing him here would be that he could be third option behind Fox and Halli, while still providing his top-notch defense.

Edit: also our timeline is not so immediate like Philadelphia’s. This could give him some seasons to grow into this team.

 

[Padrino]

So the trouble I'm having here is this: If Simmons doesn't help Portland's competitiveness in the west, then why do we think he's going to help our competitiveness? His warts are going to be the same whether he goes to one team or the other. If Portland, basically being forced to trade away their star, doesn't want Simmons back...are we fleecing ourselves getting in on the deal?

In a straight-up trade with the Sixers, Portland would be swapping a genuine superstar in Lillard for a flawed all-star in Simmons, and would be left without the means to improve their team around Simmons. They're already in a position where they're going to struggle to improve their team around Lillard. So why consent to such a deal? They might as well just keep Lillard and see if they can improve on the margins of their roster.

But unlike Portland, the Kings would not be parting with a superstar in order to snag Simmons. In the scenario I described, they'd be entering the deal as a third team who would be dealing some combination of players/picks, preferably any asset outside of Fox/Haliburton. The Kings aren't being forced to trade a home-grown superstar like Lillard, so I don't see the situations as equitable. If they don't have to trade away the farm, the Kings can take a risk on Simmons.

That said, if Fox is part of the deal, then it's a hard "no" for me. Haliburton is pretty close to a hard "no," as well. If neither has to be included, then the Kings surely aren't getting fleeced in any deal for Simmons, whether they're functioning as a third team or are dealing with the Sixers straight-up. As ever, time will tell what kind of package Morey's able to get in return for Simmons, and whether or not it ends up a plus acquisition for the receiving team.

 

[gunks]

Like Sactowndog, I read that report and instantly thought Vivek. Trying to get Dame just seems very short sighted. Very….Kangz.

I think Fox and Hali are the future. Dame is in the latter end of his prime, and I’d rather have the 10 year window (potentially) of Fox/Hali to try to build a contender, rather than roll the dice on a -however many years Dame has left on his contract- year window just to scrape into the playoffs.

I’m cool with McNair trying to get into a multi team blockbuster though!

The triple headed monster of Fox/Dame/Hali some people are proposing would be interested as well, but I think Portland can do better than Buddy/Bags/#9… They’re going to want Fox or Hali back.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

I think Portland can do better than Buddy/Bags/#9… They’re going to want Fox or Hali back.

Presumably they would also get multiple future firsts (4-5 picks in total) from Philly and Sac in addition.

Also reports have also had Maxey and/or Thybulle outgoing so some question would be how many picks are given on the Kings side and if they receive one of those guys.