Tobias Harris

[Jkbiker]

Why should we spend a max contract on Harris for a 4 when our starting 4 for the future is Bagley?
Just Dont!

Bagley needs a 5 next to him that will spread the floor and will compliment our star 4

Vuc for 27m, Horford for 25M,Lopez for 16M,Dedmon for 15M?

No 1st for Capela, No max for Harris Get us a C that will fit with Marvin

 

[ESP47]

I've always been hesitant for Bagley to play the 5 because I don't think he can guard them at all. But I've really re-thought about it. The natural center is becoming a dying bread. Look at the top scoring centers in the league:

1. Embiid: 27.5ppg, MVP caliber
2. KAT: 24.4ppg, All-Star
3. Vucevic: 20.8ppg, All-Star (not really though..)
4. Jokic: 20.1ppg, All-Star
5. Drummond: 17.3ppg, (see Vucevic)
6. Capela: 16.6ppg, starter
7. Ayton: 16.3ppg, starter
8. Gobert: 16ppg, DPOY
9. Nurkic: 15.6ppg, starter
10. Adams: 13.9ppg, starter
...
15. Turner: 13.3ppg, DPOY candidate

Of the four 20ppg scorers, 2 of them aren't in our conference. How often will we have to face a bruiser? I think it's perfectly fine if we start Bagley at center, but sign a legitimate center who can actually defend in those match ups. You really don't want to put Bagley in foul trouble either.

Rebounding would be a legitimate concern on our front, although Tobias is an solid rebounder. Fox an Barnes aren't very good rebounder.

I don't know if facing bruisers is what Bagley's weakness is. I think it's defending in general, especially the pick and roll. He looked terrible defending the 5 when Joerger let him do it to close out the year and it wasn't because he was being taken advantage of strength wise like Giles was.

 

[LPKingsFan]

I don't know if facing bruisers is what Bagley's weakness is. I think it's defending in general, especially the pick and roll. He looked terrible defending the 5 when Joerger let him do it to close out the year and it wasn't because he was being taken advantage of strength wise like Giles was.

That’s not really an argument for him defending 4 or 5, though. At some level, if we’re talking about building around Bagley, we’re assuming he’s going to improve here. The question is, is it easier for Bagley to develop his defense guarding 4s or 5s? If we’re looking to add a big that can cover his deficiencies, what position does that big play?

 

[206Fan]

I don't know if facing bruisers is what Bagley's weakness is. I think it's defending in general, especially the pick and roll. He looked terrible defending the 5 when Joerger let him do it to close out the year and it wasn't because he was being taken advantage of strength wise like Giles was.

Whether Bagley plays the 4 or 5, he’s going to have to defend the PnR and guard the perimeter. His defensive IQ is his flaw there

 

[ESP47]

That’s not really an argument for him defending 4 or 5, though. At some level, if we’re talking about building around Bagley, we’re assuming he’s going to improve here. The question is, is it easier for Bagley to develop his defense guarding 4s or 5s? If we’re looking to add a big that can cover his deficiencies, what position does that big play?

If Bagley doesn't become an adequate defensive center, then you'd have to play him at the 4 with a Horford type center who can defend as well as stretch the floor. Problem is there aren't many of them to go around. In the end Bagley very well might be the floor stretcher so you may be able to get away with a more standard center that's good defensively but limited offensively.

Whether Bagley plays the 4 or 5, he’s going to have to defend the PnR and guard the perimeter. His defensive IQ is his flaw there

You're going to be put in the pick and roll more as a 5 than you are a 4, otherwise the spacing for the offensive team is going to be terrible unless they have a good shooter at center. He didn't spend a whole lot of time being put in the PnR until late in the season when he played more 5. That's when he really got exposed in my eyes. Previous to that he was defending better than I was expecting because his lateral quickness allowed him to stay in front of stretch 4s on the perimeter.

I just don't trust him to play what I think is the most important defensive position on the court right now. It's just too risky when the team is as close to making the playoffs as they have been in well over a decade.

 

[Kingster]

Why should we spend a max contract on Harris for a 4 when our starting 4 for the future is Bagley?
Just Dont!

Bagley needs a 5 next to him that will spread the floor and will compliment our star 4

Vuc for 27m, Horford for 25M,Lopez for 16M,Dedmon for 15M?

No 1st for Capela, No max for Harris Get us a C that will fit with Marvin

I agree with everything except for Horford. I'm not paying 25M for at least a three year contract (he wants it long term) for a 33 year old who had injury problems last year. Just ain't happening for me. Everything else makes perfect sense.

 

[Gguod]

If Bagley doesn't become an adequate defensive center, then you'd have to play him at the 4 with a Horford type center who can defend as well as stretch the floor. Problem is there aren't many of them to go around. In the end Bagley very well might be the floor stretcher so you may be able to get away with a more standard center that's good defensively but limited offensively.




You're going to be put in the pick and roll more as a 5 than you are a 4, otherwise the spacing for the offensive team is going to be terrible unless they have a good shooter at center. He didn't spend a whole lot of time being put in the PnR until late in the season when he played more 5. That's when he really got exposed in my eyes. Previous to that he was defending better than I was expecting because his lateral quickness allowed him to stay in front of stretch 4s on the perimeter.

I just don't trust him to play what I think is the most important defensive position on the court right now. It's just too risky when the team is as close to making the playoffs as they have been in well over a decade.

Good analysis and I agree with you on it other than getting away with a more standard center. I mean we could get by but imo it would limit our ceiling considerably. For me the highest ceiling for this team is that if Bagley becomes adequate as center defensively. The offensive potential would be just huge with Bagley as C with Barnes and another above average versatile wing at forwards (like Harris). Defensively if that group could be even an average team, this team would have potential to go far in the playoffs.

The question is how likely it is that Bagley becomes adequate at defending as a C. I would really want to see how it looks in his second year before committing big money money to the position. If it doesnt work then its a shame but imo you got to try if thats the way to become as good as you can possibly be. And even if it doesnt work the best solution still imo is to find that specific type of center and allocate the rest of the money elsewhere rather than paying big bucks for a non ideal fit.

 

[jcassio]

Its pretty clear that Vlade sees Bagley as a 4 and even said that in time he could play some 3.

That was Vlade’s take when he drafted Bags a year ago. I’d like to think Vlade has refined his assessment since then.

 

[ParniValjak]

That was Vlade’s take when he drafted Bags a year ago. I’d like to think Vlade has refined his assessment since then.

That was also Vlade's assesment as recently as the end of the season and not only when he drafted Bagley. He is looking to build a certain type of team where he seen Bagley as a PF who might spot at SF some if really needed. May also spend some time at the 5 but primarily he is seen as a 4 by those that make the decisions.

 

[Entity]

Any news on Tobias? He has feel off the radar for everybody the last few days