SAR coming to the Kings discussion (merged)

[BonziFan]

Lets not forget the upgrade in ownership from Jim Thomas. We had nothing until they came and opened up their wallets. Now that they have been here for awhile it is like they are outdated. It seems that nothing is ever good enough.

 

[Gary]

If you lived through the 13 years of "rebuilding" than that is the last thing you want again. I know its a different owner/GM/coaching staff, but I would not be able to stand another lottery year where going into the season you know that you will be that lottery team.

Miller/Bibby/Peja alone in the starting lineup is a playoff team. Wells and SAR are not bad additions. I am not sure which defensive minded player you were wanting, but face the facts. Chandler, Garnett, and the others named on this board are UNAVAILABLE. You guys want to offload players that other teams don't want? SAR is an upgrade from KT. I see people wanting KWAME BROWN to play PF. WTF? KWAME BROWN is better than SAR how?

 

[Padrino]

i'd like to comment quickly on the possible SAR acquisition, as well as the "something bigger" that people seem to think SAR can be packaged and traded for. its not gonna happen. here's why: instead of 3 mediocre tweeners at the big man positions, we now (quite possibly) have 4. at least he wouldnt cost us much. he's definitely a moveable piece at his price, but its unlikely that we'd be able to include him in a deal that would also include one of our other high-priced tweeners. that said, the kings are just dancing in tweener heaven right now. jamal sampson is a nice addition at backup C, but we're logjammed at the PF, and none of the four PF's (rahim, thomas, skinner, williamson) we have are all that great. SAR is the best of the four, but considering what they are costing us all together, thats not saying much.

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

Lets not forget the upgrade in ownership from Jim Thomas. We had nothing until they came and opened up their wallets. Now that they have been here for awhile it is like they are outdated. It seems that nothing is ever good enough.

Ooh, I thought 'Jim Thomas' was a vulgarity no longer allowed to be spoken in our beloved city...even in remembering the 'good ole days'. Oh wait, or was that 'Dick Motta'....or 'Bill Russell'...ehh screw em' all!*L* Welcome to Sacramento Mr. Rahim!(Oh, and next time you want to know a good place to get some breakfast in Sac, I wont send you to the Back Door Lounge in Old Sac, again*L*)

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

i'd like to comment quickly on the possible SAR acquisition, as well as the "something bigger" that people seem to think SAR can be packaged and traded for. its not gonna happen. here's why: instead of 3 mediocre tweeners at the big man positions, we now (quite possibly) have 4. at least he wouldnt cost us much. he's definitely a moveable piece at his price, but its unlikely that we'd be able to include him in a deal that would also include one of our other high-priced tweeners. that said, the kings are just dancing in tweener heaven right now. jamal sampson is a nice addition at backup C, but we're logjammed at the PF, and none of the four PF's (rahim, thomas, skinner, williamson) we have are all that great. SAR is the best of the four, but considering what they are costing us all together, thats not saying much.

Oh, and I think that in getting SAR, it is allowing Thomas to come off the bench at SF and Skinner off the bench at PF, rather than both at PF. I think probably solidifies our line-up a bit more than most people think...and remember, not to compare us to anybody or anything...but a TEAM in a midwestern city won an NBA title a year ago with a couple of ALMOST superstars and a bunch of pieces on the bench. So dont discount anything...we are alot deeper than most teams in the NBA by getting SAR...and whats upcoming in the way of a trade, probably involving Corliss and a draft pick or something like that, whoever we get with that will make us even more deep, and pretty damn good if you ask me.

 

[SacTownKid]

I mean.... no, SAR is not as good as Chris Webber, and it's not going to turn the franchise around like Webber did. But Shareef Abdur-Rahim would be the biggest free agency acquisition since Divac. And what's most important about acquiring a player like him through free agency is that it's creating value. For the last several years we've just been turning over our existing talent into different talent. We haven't really added to the equation, except through shrewd moves. SAR adds completely because we wouldn't have to give up anything to get him. It would be the first major influx of talent without a trade since Webber, Divac and Williams.

So, I'd say that signing SAR would be up there with the Webber trade, but of course it's hyperbole to suggest that they're equal.

Well I would say talent wise he would probably be the biggest FA the Kings ever landed. IF he comes that is....

 

[Venom]

If you lived through the 13 years of "rebuilding" than that is the last thing you want again. I know its a different owner/GM/coaching staff, but I would not be able to stand another lottery year where going into the season you know that you will be that lottery team.

Miller/Bibby/Peja alone in the starting lineup is a playoff team. Wells and SAR are not bad additions. I am not sure which defensive minded player you were wanting, but face the facts. Chandler, Garnett, and the others named on this board are UNAVAILABLE. You guys want to offload players that other teams don't want? SAR is an upgrade from KT. I see people wanting KWAME BROWN to play PF. WTF? KWAME BROWN is better than SAR how?

I don't think they were that bad, and the Kings eventually immerged from them. Teams go in talent cycles. The Bulls were HORRIBLE, then they got MJ and progressed for a while, reeled off 6 titles in 8 years, were HORRIBLE again for almost a decade, and now have one of the best young teams around. This Kings team is being artificially kept at a playoff level with these sideways moves. I'd rather someone pulled the plug and let this era die a natural death. It was a great run, I loved it, but Webber's injury ended it and its time to find the next Kings superstar to pin our hopes on. There is nothing more excruciating than watching an owner/GM try to maintain past greatness inking exceedingly worse deals.

And I want to move our "core", not our undesirables. Of course we have to give a little in order to get something back. But I say we should be looking to move some of these guys before they become untradeable, like Peja will be after his max deal. That will not end well. I would also be shopping Miller. Bibby I would try to hold onto because of age.

 

[SacTownKid]

You know its funny how Kings fans totally rip Shareef apart. You should see how the Nets fans are taking the whole situation. They act like they just lost the second coming of Air Jordan.

I for one think it would be a good signing. If he comes, and he is cheap that is. Now we have 2 low post capable players!!! We never had any of those before!! We have a deep a#@ bench, I think we look pretty good if we land Reef.

 

[kingsofnba]

Now if Koz had said i have a "SMALL OR AVERAGE" announcement... instead of a "BIG" announcement, then everyone wouldn't be so negative about this move???... it seems that just because people were dreaming of a KG trade after Koz made the "BIG" announcement statement, people are getting negative on SAR, because it was a let down announcement by Koz...

People have to recoginize this move as a solid pickup for the kings... are the kings better off with SAR than they were yesterday... i think the answer is definitly YES!!! the kings will be better with SAR... they may not be a championship team... but come on people.... the kings are NOT going to get KG, Elton, or the Wallaces in a trade!!!.... i think people have to be REALISTIC!!!! ...

you have to look at the move objectivley... SAR is the BEST player left in the unrestricted FA market!!!... now the kings have some extra players that they can use for future trade... plus picking up SAR makes this the deepest team the kings have had since the 2002-2003 season... they are 2 deep at every position (as long as martin or garcia pans out)!!!

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

I don't think they were that bad, and the Kings eventually immerged from them. Teams go in talent cycles. The Bulls were HORRIBLE, then they got MJ and progressed for a while, reeled off 6 titles in 8 years, were HORRIBLE again for almost a decade, and now have one of the best young teams around. This Kings team is being artificially kept at a playoff level with these sideways moves. I'd rather someone pulled the plug and let this era die a natural death. It was a great run, I loved it, but Webber's injury ended it and its time to find the next Kings superstar to pin our hopes on. There is nothing more excruciating than watching an owner/GM try to maintain past greatness inking exceedingly worse deals.

And I want to move our "core", not our undesirables. Of course we have to give a little in order to get something back. But I say we should be looking to move some of these guys before they become untradeable, like Peja will be after his max deal. That will not end well. I would also be shopping Miller. Bibby I would try to hold onto because of age.

Agree with most of that, with the exception of shopping Miller...that would be stupid in every way you could serve it up. Miller/Bibby/Peja shouldnt be broken up for any reason...its not every day you have a proven core that, even though they have no titles, is proven to be the big part fo 50 wins a year in route to hopefully getting a ring. They get us to that level, and with everyone else being brought in, anything can happen.

 

[funkykingston]

C Miller, Sampson
PF Rahim, Thomas, Skinner
SF Stojakovic, Williamson
SG Wells, Martin, Garcia
PG Bibby, Hart, Price

That's only thirteen players (unless I forgot someone), and it is also assuming that Price and Sampson make the team.

I only listed players once, and at their primary position, so this isn't exactly a depth chart. In fact, I think we'll see VERY little of Corliss this season, barring injury. I think you'll basically see Thomas and Skinner eat up nearly all of the backup minutes at the frontcourt positions with KT sliding between the 3 & 4 and Skinner sliding between the 4 & 5.

I'm still holding out hope for a big trade (most likely Peja as I don't want to see Bibby go and Miller is basically worthless as trade bait right now) but even without a deal, I feel better about this starting lineup than I did about the one that finished the season.

Glaring weaknesses have been neglected, which means that Petrie has fallen woefully short of turning this team into a contender, but I'll still take improvement (no matter how slight) over decline.

 

[SacTownKid]

So, are you guys getting SAR, then?

Bibby/Wells/Peja/SAR/Miller

Pretty solid, you guys are a contender if you can get that bunch to play defense well.

Well I don't care who we get at PF. The odd names on that list are going to have to improve. Simple fact.

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

You know its funny how Kings fans totally rip Shareef apart. You should see how the Nets fans are taking the whole situation. They act like they just lost the second coming of Air Jordan.

I for one think it would be a good signing. If he comes, and he is cheap that is. Now we have 2 low post capable players!!! We never had any of those before!! We have a deep a#@ bench, I think we look pretty good if we land Reef.

Amen brother! Depth people...Depth!

 

[Sluggah]

"something as big as the Webber deal"

everyone is complaining...

but really, it was not specified WHICH Webber deal, as there were two...

you guys were thinking GETTING Webber deal, as in receiving a franchise changing super star...hence, KG trade

but clearly Koz must have been thinking about the LOSING Webber deal, as in a team dumping a player past his prime with knee issues...alla SAR! we just happen to be on the other end of this particular deal.

weeee!

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

C Miller, Sampson
PF Rahim, Thomas, Skinner
SF Stojakovic, Williamson
SG Wells, Martin, Garcia
PG Bibby, Hart, Price

That's only thirteen players (unless I forgot someone), and it is also assuming that Price and Sampson make the team.

I only listed players once, and at their primary position, so this isn't exactly a depth chart. In fact, I think we'll see VERY little of Corliss this season, barring injury. I think you'll basically see Thomas and Skinner eat up nearly all of the backup minutes at the frontcourt positions with KT sliding between the 3 & 4 and Skinner sliding between the 4 & 5.

I'm still holding out hope for a big trade (most likely Peja as I don't want to see Bibby go and Miller is basically worthless as trade bait right now) but even without a deal, I feel better about this starting lineup than I did about the one that finished the season.

Glaring weaknesses have been neglected, which means that Petrie has fallen woefully short of turning this team into a contender, but I'll still take improvement (no matter how slight) over decline.

WTF?!?!?! Miller is worthless as trade bait?? He's an All Star Freaking Center!!! I tend to agree with alot of what you have to say most of the time, but that kinda crossed the line a bit.

 

[Padrino]

a lot of you are missing the point here, i think. SAR is a solid player. at his price, he's a great acquisition...but this offseason was supposed to be about addressing the kings NEEDS!!! the kings do not need another offensively oriented tweener. we need size and defense, and considering 4 of the 5 starting spots are locked, all that leaves is the PF spot. if the kings organization is promoting "defense," and are serious about it, then i dont see the point of acquiring another undersized, defensively shy big man. maybe i'm way off base here...wait, no i'm not.

 

[funkykingston]

WTF?!?!?! Miller is worthless as trade bait?? He's an All Star Freaking Center!!! I tend to agree with alot of what you have to say most of the time, but that kinda crossed the line a bit.

I suppose I should have taken more time and explained my point a little better. Miller is worthless as trade bait IMO because the Kings could not hope to get back equal or better value right now. Miller is 29, coming off an injury plagued season, has a huge contract and (in large part because of those injuries) looked awful in the playoffs.

I simply can't see a situation where the Kings could deal Miller for a better player or a young kid with a load of potential, at least not right now.

Just to clarify, I like Brad a lot. I just hope we see some real fight in him on the defensive end this upcoming season.

 

[PacMan]

Amen brother! Depth people...Depth!

Depth mean squats in the playoff and we proved that years ago when webb went down.

 

[sauce-26]

a lot of you are missing the point here, i think. SAR is a solid player. at his price, he's a great acquisition...but this offseason was supposed to be about addressing the kings NEEDS!!! the kings do not need another offensively oriented tweener. we need size and defense, and considering 4 of the 5 starting spots are locked, all that leaves is the PF spot. if the kings organization is promoting "defense," and are serious about it, then i dont see the point of acquiring another undersized, defensively shy big man. maybe i'm way off base here...wait, no i'm not.

I totally agree with what you said. the only problem is we cant get a decent pf who defends and rebounds for what we can afford. You just cant wave a wand and get kg for nothing. we dont have the pieces to get him unless we gut the whole team and he would have nobody to play alongside. Maybe gp sees sar as the best he can do at the present time? It is not necessarily gps fault, other gms have to go along with it too.

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

I suppose I should have taken more time and explained my point a little better. Miller is worthless as trade bait IMO because the Kings could not hope to get back equal or better value right now. Miller is 29, coming off an injury plagued season, has a huge contract and (in large part because of those injuries) looked awful in the playoffs.

I simply can't see a situation where the Kings could deal Miller for a better player or a young kid with a load of potential, at least not right now.

Just to clarify, I like Brad a lot. I just hope we see some real fight in him on the defensive end this upcoming season.

Nice...glad you clarified that bit. I will say one thing, Brad's injury required no surgery, and didnt damage any ligaments or cartilage, it was just a bone break, so that shouldnt be effecting him at all right now...he more than likely is totally healed, and most other people in the league probably see it the same, too. Jordan even had a bone break early in his career, and look how much it effected him.*L*(not comparing him to MJ, but just saying it to explain the possible future effects of that injury.)

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

Depth mean squats in the playoff and we proved that years ago when webb went down.

Well, I think had Keon Clark not been in Adelman's doghouse, he would have proven to be a decent fill in, maybe not scoring wise, but he would have been better than playing Jim Jackson and Hedo, or an injured Pollard out of position to fill that void.

 

[SacTownKid]

I know the plan of attack against the Dirk's, KG's, Duncans, etc. of the league!

We send out Reef for 5 minutes. He punches Duncan in the face, he is ejected. If Tim took that punishment and is still standing, we send out Jamal. He kicks him in the groin as hard as he can. Tim out. Plus we still have Miller, Corliss, Kenny, and Brian to play. We win the game.

See, depth is a good thing.

Seriously people if we land Shareef, and even if we don't, we are a contender. At least on paper. It is up to the players on the team now to improve in the areas where they were lacking last season. Chandler won't make us a defensive stalwart, hes a good player, but c'mon, COME BACK TO REALITY!!! If we need a defensive PF to come in and bail out the other guys than you might as well sign back Vlade to a max deal to make Peja happy.

Petrie knows its time for these guys to step it up big time. Its the ONLY way. And at least our bench looks to have some pretty good defensive players on it so

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

'I know the plan of attack against the Dirk's, KG's, Duncans, etc. of the league!

We send out Reef for 5 minutes. He punches Duncan in the face, he is ejected. If Tim took that punishment and is still standing, we send out Jamal. He kicks him in the groin as hard as he can. Tim out. Plus we still have Miller, Corliss, Kenny, and Brian to play. We win the game.'


Hey, I didnt know that Anthony Peeler was still on our team??*L*

 

[Evenstar]

ahhh

reef.... well if thats the big news, well he and bibby have better gotten over their fueds.

i'm still holding out for sometime bigger to happen

 

[Evilmav2]

But, again, that made the Mavs 1/5 tough...exactly what we are right now.

Methinks you are underrating Josh Howard and Jet as not being good defenders. Last year, Fin and Dirk were the only defensive shirkers we featured in our starting lineup, and now that Fin is almost certainly going to be amnesty cut before this upcoming Monday's deadline, a prospective starting lineup of Jet/Stack (a surprisingly tough and underrated defender)/Josh/Dirk/Damp is more like a 4/1 or 3.5/1.5 toughness ratioed squad rather than the 1/5 you just labelled us as...

Aside from that, congratulations on the Shareef pickup, Kings faithful. Brick makes some very, very cogent points about the pointed lack of toughness that the willowy, finesse-gamed Rahim has shown throughout his career, but I don't doubt one whit that Shareef will help y'all pick up anywhere from 5-10 more regular season wins next year, and he will sure as heck look a lot better as your starting power-forward than a guy like Kenny Thomas. Additionally, once he's out of his BYC year status, his low salary (assuming he is getting MLE money) should make him a very nice trade chip for y'all in the future...

 

[SacTownKid]

Now, we can at least put together a nice little package for KG at the deadline. At least.

So don't lose faith in your Sacramento KG's...er...I mean Kings of the future VF! :\

 

[ParniValjak]

ahhh

reef.... well if thats the big news, well he and bibby have better gotten over their fueds.

i'm still holding out for sometime bigger to happen

There never was any fueds.

Both Bibby and SAR aid they never had any fueds and in fact speak on a relatively regular basis with each other

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

Now, we can at least put together a nice little package for KG at the deadline. At least.

So don't lose faith in your Sacramento KG's...er...I mean Kings of the future VF! :\

The only way the Kings will ever get KG is when he is past his prime and looking for a title still...Minnesota isnt going to give KG up for anything less than Tim Duncan, and they certainly arent going to lose him to free agency. So lets just kill that little thought right now.

 

[SacTownKid]

The only way the Kings will ever get KG is when he is past his prime and looking for a title still...Minnesota isnt going to give KG up for anything less than Tim Duncan, and they certainly arent going to lose him to free agency. So lets just kill that little thought right now.

I'd love too, but I don't think anyone else will.

 

[ikon_zero]

maaan there's a lot of negativity here... poor reef. all I have to say: at least it's not antoine walker. count your lucky stars!