HighTopKicks
Bench
Yea, I know. I just didn't want to see some of these guys killing each other over it.
sidney
Starter
KT 8.5 (expiring)
Nocioni 7.5 OR Beno 6 (not expiring)
for
Jeffries 6.5 (not expiring)
Curry 10.5 (not expiring)
Hill 2.5 (not expiring)
So next year they have only Beno or Nocioni at 6.5 instead of the 21M in salary those 3 Knicks will make in 2010. Make sense? We of course can take back more salary now because we are under the cap.
Probably not happening anyway but it work work and clear up a ton if space for them next summer and bring us 2 young prospects (pick + hill).
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
I would hope the ??? would be Beno Udrih, however something tells me the ??? would be either Jason Thompson or Spencer Hawes. To that I say no thank you very much.
kingsnation
All-Star
HighTopKicks
Bench
It would probably be top 10 protected the 1st year and top 5 the second yr. So, we probably wouldn't get it before 2015.
Dreadnought
Bench
I don't like this trade. Who's to say right now that the Kings might not be able to potentially sign a player like Joe Johnson or someone else in 2011? I feel like this trade really hinders us, unless they take on Beno I suppose. Jordan Hill is a great prospect, but we don't really need him.
bluntsnbball
G-League
i PRAY that this year we see that OJ MAYO and GAY cant play together and rudy becomes available for trade. grizz are also a team with a lot of prospects, maybe they would benefit from having a vet like NOC or BENO on their roster. i know they need a backup pg desperately. the problem is that rudy is still on his rookie contract so there would have to be lots of pieces to make it work if we include thomas in the trade. we could tae back someone like haddadi as a backup also and it looks like they no longer need him. far fetched, i know, but no reason i cant dream....
Kingster
Hall of Famer
To me, there would have to be a third team involved for this to make sense. The third team ends up with Noc or Garcia. The third team then send a player to NY with one year left on his contract. So, NY gets two players with one year left, we get the players noted in the ESPN article, and the third team ends up with Garcia or Noc. I'd do it, especially if Noc was the traded along with Thomas. I'd prefer Garcia to stay.
Utah could deal Harping(likely to retire) expiring deal and gain the services of Nocioni, IMO. He'd be a nice fit in Utah.
coolhandluke
Starter
Guide to BSPN
Is it an ESPN Insider article? If yes, then it is probably a waste of time.
Confirmed reports = Main page
Inane rumors = Insider
Is it an ESPN Insider article? If yes, then it is probably a waste of time.
Confirmed reports = Main page
Inane rumors = Insider
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AriesMar27
Guest
if the numbers werent so jacked up i would do it in a heartbeat.... there is no way that martin isnt included in this deal. no one else makes enough money unless the knicks want to take back garcia and beno. but that would be counter productive. and this is where not having miller hurts.... and why i hate having nocioni on the team. just like bibby and webber they traded him a year too early.... and got screwed over in the process....
bluntsnbball
G-League
small forwards who i have a feeling could potentially be be the trade block based on how their teams do: caron butler, josh howard, corey maggette, stephen jackson, gerald wallace, shane battier, ak47.
id personally like to see wallace or ak47
id personally like to see wallace or ak47
Kingster
Hall of Famer
Perfect fit for Utah.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Martin would not be included guys -- this is us doing New York a FAVOR. Doesn't look like it. But that's what it is. New York is still playing its high risk nab a LeBron/Wade backcourt or whatever game for next year. Anybody who will relieve them of long term contracts = instantly their friend, no matter how much material it costs them.
Also remember that we are still under the cap, so we can absorb more contracts than we send out.
Also remember that we are still under the cap, so we can absorb more contracts than we send out.
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AriesMar27
Guest
we're under the cap? since when? oh wait, the one time that geoff gets to actually spend cash he doesnt. but when we werent under the cap he would throw out 5 million dollar contracts to mediocre players....
SacKings7
Starter
The state of the economy aside, there's really not many people to throw cash at, unless of course you are referring to this particular trade. Sessions is really the only guy I wanted and he's still available, but we'd then have 4 PG's
ParniValjak
All-Star
And who is it you would sign?! Fact is there is no one worth persuing and we are much better off saving the money and spending next year when there should be a number of quality FAs. $6 million this year and if we don'r spend it, potentially max type money next year.
Isn't it logically better to sit out a year and get a bigger cap space next year?! I would have thought so!
A
AriesMar27
Guest
its not about signing any one player its the fact that it can be added in trades... we have thomas who is a 8 million expiring contract and 6 million in cash to add to it. we have enough cash to make a move to improve this team without sacrificing any young players which wouldve been a given years before. thompson and hawes dont have to be included in any trade... but we are sitting on our asses doing nothing. everyone says that hindsight is 20/20 but if we are not learning from our mistakes we will suck forever. i wouldve loved for petrie to get in on the okafor/chandler trade. we need defense, rebounding and shotblocking and oddly enough both of those player bring just that. even the shaq trade wouldve been cool, the suns ended up waiving wallace anyways...
even if people around here rip the idea of trading for any of those players we would be a better team afterwards and would have a better chance at the deadline to make moves because those players can still play. someone will get hurt next season and we couldve been the beneficiaries in the end.
but we do nothing, i dont want to start another amare trade rehash... but we had the pieces to make a move, any move but we did not. even a little move is something. but the most that we have done this off season is sign sean ****ing may. patience is a virtue but this is some bull****. maybe since i dont live in sacramento i cant deal with watching the rest of the nba pass us by.
i want us to win now... not in 3-5 years. it took one year to turn the celtics into champs. it took 1 trade to get the lakers back to the finals. how many years has it been since we were a competetive team? we havent seen the 2nd round of the playoffs since bush's first term. that next season the celtics lost in the 1st round and the lakers didnt even make the playoffs... how in the hell did they leapfrog us? dont say because they have superstars like kobe and pierce... kobe didnt make the playoffs in 2005 and the celtics didnt win a series that years either. we were all on the same playing field, what happened?
if we have the chance to make a move why dont we go for it? we had the worst record in the nba, what do we have to lose? we lose enough as it is on our own.
I ALWAYS take issue with this stance, because you simply don't know, but yet are willing to declare it as fact. The thing is, it takes TWO to tango. In Free agency, in trades in any personnel movement you need a buyer and a seller. Right now, the things we're trying to sell aren't all that appealing, YET. A LOT of times, you have to allow the dust to settle in the FA and trade markets and then the bargains and clearances begin.
I for one do not want the kings to make lateral, or negative moves to our franchise, so why push the envelope of a signing or a trade when you can afford to wait it out for the opportune moment to land a bargain/clearance item that will dramatically improve your team.
That comment of yours is just pure non-sense.
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AriesMar27
Guest
depends on how you look at it... if they make moves we know because things change. when they dont nothing happens.... has anything happened? no... if nothing has happened then they didnt try hard enough or didnt want to pay the price of making moves. so the end result is no moves being made. it takes 2 to tango but it only takes one to make the right offer. petrie hasnt made an offer that another team wants.
thats like getting laid off from a high paying entry level job and looking for a new job online but never leaving the house. you can apply for high paying jobs online but if they dont call you back you are still unemployed. maybe you need to go to mcdonalds and get a minimum wage job and start from there. that person will complain that the burger job doesnt pay enough and thats why they didnt take it, they didnt want to go backwards... so now they are stuck collecting unemployment. it pays just enough to pay your small bills but not enough to pay your rent or car payments.... so you go no where. thats whats going on here... wow, who wouldve guessed that my roommate getting fired could be applied to petrie being a bad gm or the maloofs being bad owners.
thats like getting laid off from a high paying entry level job and looking for a new job online but never leaving the house. you can apply for high paying jobs online but if they dont call you back you are still unemployed. maybe you need to go to mcdonalds and get a minimum wage job and start from there. that person will complain that the burger job doesnt pay enough and thats why they didnt take it, they didnt want to go backwards... so now they are stuck collecting unemployment. it pays just enough to pay your small bills but not enough to pay your rent or car payments.... so you go no where. thats whats going on here... wow, who wouldve guessed that my roommate getting fired could be applied to petrie being a bad gm or the maloofs being bad owners.
So you're actually saying that you would prefer that we make a bad trade than do nothing?
Petrie could easily make an offer that another team wants, but that doesn't mean it would be a good move. I would bet the house that the Pacers would have taken JT and Spencer for Tinsley straight up (before they cut him). Should we have done that just for the sake of making a move, and not be worried that it's a "backwards" move?
ParniValjak
All-Star
Oh FFS, it took one trade to make Celtics champs but how many years did it take to get the assets to pull of those trades?!
The Lakers already had a building block. They already had the foundations. I am pretty sure that our approach would be a lot different too if we had a Kobe level player on our roster.
Fact is we don't and we need to get one. And the only way we can realistically get one is to draft one. The only way you will draft one is of you suck and get lucky.
As for tha Chandler/Okafor trade, what is it exactly that we could have traded for those. Larry Brown likes his centers to be defenders only which is exactly what Chandler is and NO obvioulsy wanted to continue to compete.
Nothing we had on our roster would have raised too much interest from either team.
If you are not patient thats your problem. If you are not realistic, again, you problem but please do not make half cooked comments about how Celtics and Lakers were turned into contenders over night without actually analysis each situation and comparing it to the Kings.
2 VERY difference scenarios than where we are right now.
A
AriesMar27
Guest
patient? this team hasnt been competetive for 5 years now... this team wasnt even competetive for 5 years in the golden webber/divac era.... the rebuild has been longer than the time that we were contenders. i was patient 2-3 years ago when everyone was saying that we had to wait 2-3 years....
maybe its because i wasnt a kings fan before jwill arrived... im not used to these 5-7 year droughts...
people need to stop making excuses for this team sucking. kobe is one man, a damn good player but he was a 1st round exit player before gasol got there without gasol the lakers are bottom dwellers, a 7th or 8th seed playoff team at best. and the celtics were rebuilt in 1 summer with only 2 trades. the assets they used to make the trades took all of 2 seasons of sucking to acquire. if they had gotten the number 1 pick for tanking they would have oden and not allen and they still wouldve won a ring.
take the blinders off... the entire league passed us by.
maybe its because i wasnt a kings fan before jwill arrived... im not used to these 5-7 year droughts...
people need to stop making excuses for this team sucking. kobe is one man, a damn good player but he was a 1st round exit player before gasol got there without gasol the lakers are bottom dwellers, a 7th or 8th seed playoff team at best. and the celtics were rebuilt in 1 summer with only 2 trades. the assets they used to make the trades took all of 2 seasons of sucking to acquire. if they had gotten the number 1 pick for tanking they would have oden and not allen and they still wouldve won a ring.
take the blinders off... the entire league passed us by.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
All your arguments are in the abstract. You argue points that may or may not have happened, and then criticize the results of a non fact. Its like saying only 20 people were eaten by sharks last year, and coming to that conclusion by the facts of how many remains were actually found. What we don't know is how many people were eaten and their remains wern't found. You base all your arguments on the past history of what we know to be true, and then surmise what Petrie has tried to do, and failed to do, by the expectations that you have.
You have no idea how many phone conservations he's had. How many deals that may have fallen through because a third team backed out, or a player with a no trade clause decided he didn't want to be traded somewhere. Two years ago I was as upset as everyone else. I wanted the rebuild to begin and I was frustrated at the snail pace the FO was taking in that direction. Now, I beleive the team has finally turned in the right direction. If your too blind to see that, then thats your problem. There are people that solve problems in this world and there are people that just sit and point fingers and blame the world. You pick which shoe you want to wear.
Personally I'm starting to beleive that your really a Laker fan that just wants to irritate people. I seldom hear anything positive from you. Strange, when most people are fairly positive right now. You hammer the Maloof's, Petrie, the Kings FO and anything else you can find. And you do it over and over again. Nothing new. Just the same old tired mantra again and again. We all know the story. We all know what happened. We lived it along with everybody else. The happy times, and the sad times that followed. We all wanted Webb to come back and be the Webb of old. We all wanted to hang on to the glory a little while longer. The FO tried to do that, and made a mistake. They should have cleaned house sooner. If they had, maybe, just maybe we would have avoided last season. Maybe we would have recovered a little sooner. Maybe.
But I have no need to relive every mistake on a daily basis. Its the past. Its over! Its time to move on, and see what happens. Do you think your capable of that. If it turns out badly, I'll be there right at your side throwing the mudd. But until then, how about just a little optimism. Be brave! Take a chance. The worst that can happen is that you'll be right back in your comfort zone, firing away. Just a thought.
A
AriesMar27
Guest
All your arguments are in the abstract. You argue points that may or may not have happened, and then criticize the results of a non fact. Its like saying only 20 people were eaten by sharks last year, and coming to that conclusion by the facts of how many remains were actually found. What we don't know is how many people were eaten and their remains wern't found. You base all your arguments on the past history of what we know to be true, and then surmise what Petrie has tried to do, and failed to do, by the expectations that you have.
You have no idea how many phone conservations he's had. How many deals that may have fallen through because a third team backed out, or a player with a no trade clause decided he didn't want to be traded somewhere. Two years ago I was as upset as everyone else. I wanted the rebuild to begin and I was frustrated at the snail pace the FO was taking in that direction. Now, I beleive the team has finally turned in the right direction. If your too blind to see that, then thats your problem. There are people that solve problems in this world and there are people that just sit and point fingers and blame the world. You pick which shoe you want to wear.
Personally I'm starting to beleive that your really a Laker fan that just wants to irritate people. I seldom hear anything positive from you. Strange, when most people are fairly positive right now. You hammer the Maloof's, Petrie, the Kings FO and anything else you can find. And you do it over and over again. Nothing new. Just the same old tired mantra again and again. We all know the story. We all know what happened. We lived it along with everybody else. The happy times, and the sad times that followed. We all wanted Webb to come back and be the Webb of old. We all wanted to hang on to the glory a little while longer. The FO tried to do that, and made a mistake. They should have cleaned house sooner. If they had, maybe, just maybe we would have avoided last season. Maybe we would have recovered a little sooner. Maybe.
But I have no need to relive every mistake on a daily basis. Its the past. Its over! Its time to move on, and see what happens. Do you think your capable of that. If it turns out badly, I'll be there right at your side throwing the mudd. But until then, how about just a little optimism. Be brave! Take a chance. The worst that can happen is that you'll be right back in your comfort zone, firing away. Just a thought.
im not a laker fan, cant stand the lakers though i always liked odom, artest and gasol. maybe im upset because i live in los angeles and all i see is how the same team built a championship team, lost everything and did it all over again. the kings didnt win a ring, that doesnt bother me... but when the lakers traded shaq we had a better team than the lakers. how did they leapfrog us like that? dont say because they had kobe. because before gasol got there the lakers were 1 and done. there are so many teams trying to make moves to compete against the lakers and celtics....
what are the kings doing this offseason? signing sean may... last year we signed beno to a 5 year deal. the year before that we sign mikki moore, salmons before that and rahim before that.... i dont get to hang out with kings fans at bars or see entire malls filled with kings jerseys. hell the kings arent very good so people in sacramento probably dont see it either. but i dont see what you guys seem to see in this team. i want the team to be competetive, i dont care whos name is on the back of the jersey. he can be a rookie or a 12 year vet, i just want them to win some damn games. i dont see that happening with the team that we have right now.
i dont want to say maybe next year we'll make the playoffs... or maybe we'll get the number 1 pick next year. i dont want to be in a position to get john wall. i want us to win. i want to say maybe we'll win the the championship next year. i used to say that about this team and i didnt care who we had on the team. i miss blowing teams out just so i can see gerald wallace come in and dunk on someone. i dont want to see hawes or thompson padding their stats because we got blownout....
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Telemachus
Starter
At least be accurate with your statements. You can't say the Lakers lost "everything" when their franchise player was still there. It is much easier to rebuild a team when you still have a player like Kobe to rebuild around. Tell me who have the Kings had on their team of Kobe's calibre???....I'll be waiting for a long time for your answer.
You also can't compare LA with most other teams. When they were down before they went out and signed Shaq. He was chomping at the bit to go there. I guarantee you that he would have turned down more money from the Kings to still go to LA.
Signing top flight FAs will always be a problem for Sacramento. That means they have to do it through the draft or trades. It is hard to get a great player when drafting in the middle to late first round like the Kings have done prior to this year. And even trading for a big time player is difficult unless you have one to give back.
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AriesMar27
Guest
the lakers went from the finals to the lottery in one trade (shaq). then went from 1 and done to the finals in one trade (gasol).
we went from top 5 in the west in february 2005 to rebuilding for the next 5 years in one trade (webber).... and one of the worst regular season records in the nba in that timespan only the 2005 hawks (13-69) and 2008 heat (15-67) have had seasons with fewer wins than the kings did last season (17-65)... we went from having a starting pf who averaged 21/10/5 to kenny thomas overnight... and we have sucked ever since.
we went from top 5 in the west in february 2005 to rebuilding for the next 5 years in one trade (webber).... and one of the worst regular season records in the nba in that timespan only the 2005 hawks (13-69) and 2008 heat (15-67) have had seasons with fewer wins than the kings did last season (17-65)... we went from having a starting pf who averaged 21/10/5 to kenny thomas overnight... and we have sucked ever since.
ParniValjak
All-Star
And here we go with selective analysis yet again. You seem to undersell what having a franchise player to build around actually means in a rebuild.
Replace Kobe in LA with Kevin Martin and I guarantee you they are not contenders even with Gasol - Martin partnership!
Its a hell of a lot easier to rebuild when you have your franchise player. You can bag and under-rate Kobe all you like but facts are that he is one of the best SGs of all time. A certainty for the HOF and arguably the best SG since Michael Jordan of the Bulls graces us with his presence on a basketball court.
Give the kings a franchise player and they turn this thing around a hell of a lot quicker. If you don't have a franchise guy you will NOT win. Simple as that.
And just for the record, Celtics took a lot more than 2 years of sucking to become instant contenders. Al Jefferson was how long in the league before he was traded?! What about Gomes? Not to mention that they still need to suck enough to get some good players that they kept to surround the big 3 with.
Maybe its time you actually started being a bit realistic with where things are at. Miami pretty much sucks but don't you agree they are so much closer to turning it around simply because they have Wade?!
Be a bit realistic. What you are asking for is a $5 million house when all you can currently have is $500K.
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AriesMar27
Guest
the celtics had to suck for 2 years... before that they were a rebuilding team just like we are now. guess what they did.... they traded their young players before they hit their primes and ended up winning a ring. they used their mle to sign vets to fill out their roster, posey and house.... cassell was signed for the minimum after being waived by the clippers.
kobe is a great player but without pau or shaq he wouldnt have a ring. he would just be a great scorer who couldnt win it all by himself. a healthy tmac couldve won with gasol, lebron probably wouldve gone undefeated on that lakers squad. wade won a ring with shaq past his prime then couldnt make the playoffs without him. granted injuries played a huge part in that but still... the lakers lost bynum twice against the same team and made the finals twice. gasol is the reason why the lakers are champs. that team is the same team that lost to the suns 2 years before and had kwame as their center.
kobe is a great player but without pau or shaq he wouldnt have a ring. he would just be a great scorer who couldnt win it all by himself. a healthy tmac couldve won with gasol, lebron probably wouldve gone undefeated on that lakers squad. wade won a ring with shaq past his prime then couldnt make the playoffs without him. granted injuries played a huge part in that but still... the lakers lost bynum twice against the same team and made the finals twice. gasol is the reason why the lakers are champs. that team is the same team that lost to the suns 2 years before and had kwame as their center.
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