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Kingsguy881
Guest
Wow!
Phoenix game Post-Game discussion
- Thread starter CruzDude
- Start date
Wow!
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Kingsguy881
Guest
Ummm.....Wade avg'd 3.5 to's a game.....4+ the year before. I guess you either don't watch much basketball or have never played fantasy. Wade is a turnover machine. Trust me, I know. I have had him on my fantasy squads the last 4 years.
HighTopKicks
Bench
only in Kings land is giving up 143pts a congrats
Its the old traditional trap Phoenix used to trick you into under D'Antoni -- they convince you to run around like idiots trying to play their pace and putting up big exciting numbers...whiel you miss the fact that this is the way they play every game and that they are steadily putting you away while you're having fun.
I agree, the Kings made a big mistake not playing at their own pace, especially after Nash went out.
I had two thought going into the game. Don't run with the Suns and Frye is going to take more 3's than Hawes. Both killed us.
I listened to the game, so I can't tell you that I know this for a fact. But, I felt during the 3rd, we lost control of the game when Beno came in for Tyreke at the 4 minute mark. We were down by 5 at the time and ended the quarter down by 15.
During that 4 minute strech we had no assists and the only player able to score was Martin. Defensively, our bigs sent 4 players to the FT line and we never recovered. I can't say for certain, but my gut feeling is that the backcourt of Beno & Martin, wasn't able to stop penetration.
I have to agree with some of the others that have expressed an interest in seeing more of Sergio at the PG. Without Tyreke on the court we need a playmaker more than a shooter. And, Sergio's 4 assists in short minutes, during the 4th quarter, should be a wake-up call to PW. Beno is capable to scoring and handing out dimes, but it's not consistent as in the PHO games. Beno just was nowhere to be found and got outplayed big time by his countryman.
IDidntDoDat
Bench
I'm not a stat guy, but I'm pretty sure at this point Tyreke is throwing about twice as many TOs as Wade...no?
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Kingsguy881
Guest
Not quite.....4 to's a game which is VERY Wade-like. Wade avg's 3.8 on his career.
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Kingsguy881
Guest
I agree with you wholeheartedly. And I love the Sergio over beno attitude. I honestly think Sergio is a better backup for Evans and I have harped constantly on how poor Beno is at stopping penetration. Good post.
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AriesMar27
Guest
i never said that i disliked evans... its true that i wanted petrie to draft he who shall remain nameless.... not because evans is a bad player but because i wanted a pure pg to be drafted. evans is a good player, i never denied that.... i just dont think that he is a pg... thats it. every player has their weaknesses, me criticizing his jumper or lack of pg skills is no different than me criticizing martin for his weak ball handling or hawes being a scared little girl in the post.
the suns flat out beat the kings... you dont let teams score that much in a regulation game, preseason or not.... no excuses.... its a damn shame that a group of professional basketball players would allow that to happen.
i dont have a man crush on sergio, i wanted petrie to draft sergio instead of douby. now i am happy that the player that i wanted is finally on the team and is playing well. i just wish that he got more minutes.
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Kingsguy881
Guest
No, the bottom line is you don't like Evans. If you had nothing against him then you wouldn't be rooting for him to fail just so you can say "I told you so!" It still wouldn't get you a job in the front office homie.
Phoenix was the highest scoring team in the league last season. There stats from last night were inflated because they took 50+ ft's and hit the majority of them. That will NEVER happen once the regular refs are back in the game.
Now, Phoenix would have scored 110 - 130 points last night with regular officials and a regular game flow, but we scored 127. WE ARE GETTING BETTER, and all anyone hears from you is "Yeah, we still suck".
So again, I ask you, if you hate this team so much, then why are you here? Why root for a team if you don't like them? You get seemingly NO enjoyment out of it, and I bet constant ribbing from your Laker buddies, so why keep torturing yourself?
Phoenix was the highest scoring team in the league last season. There stats from last night were inflated because they took 50+ ft's and hit the majority of them. That will NEVER happen once the regular refs are back in the game.
Now, Phoenix would have scored 110 - 130 points last night with regular officials and a regular game flow, but we scored 127. WE ARE GETTING BETTER, and all anyone hears from you is "Yeah, we still suck".
So again, I ask you, if you hate this team so much, then why are you here? Why root for a team if you don't like them? You get seemingly NO enjoyment out of it, and I bet constant ribbing from your Laker buddies, so why keep torturing yourself?
MassachusettsKingsFan
All-Star
Spencer needs to get his act together on defense. You cant let Channing Frye do that to you ..
I would include JT, but he had his hands full with Amare - there arent many bigs who can stop that guy.
I would include JT, but he had his hands full with Amare - there arent many bigs who can stop that guy.
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Kingsguy881
Guest
You have no idea how true this statement is. Lets look at this: so far, Spencer has been abused in the post and on the perimeter. The only person he matched up well against was garbage/junkman Biedrins who has no offensive game whatsoever to speak of. Spencer lacks any semblance of defense, strength, physicality, smarts, what have you.
Wade is a TO machine, which isn't unusual for a SG who turns combo guard. His TO per game are very similar to Tyreke's (so far), although his A/TO ratio is 1.75, compared to Tyreke's (so far) of 1.3. If Tyreke increases his assists by 35% without making any additional turnovers, they will be dead even on those particular stats.
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AriesMar27
Guest
because i am a kings fan, its what we do...
just because you are okay with watching your team lose doesnt mean that i do too... are they better than they were last year? yes, martin not being injured alone makes them a better team, though garcia is now out for 4 months. but losing is still losing and i dont like to watch my team lose. if they are losing then they havent progressed far enough... how many posters here have been saying that it will take 2-3 years?. they have been saying it since petrie drafted douby... or traded webber depending on who you ask.... and now everyone is saying 2-3 years... its going on 5 years and the team still sucks, 2 years from now the team will probably still suck.
in the past 2 seasons this team has won a grand total 55 games... i am not going to be doing any back-flips over a rookie unless he is lebron james.... who oddly enough wasnt a pg either... but played one as a rookie.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
The difference being Wade acquires those TOs while putting up 30pts a night playng OG, so they've always got a second ballhandler/passer in the backcourt next to him.
But this is still too much hand wringing about a 20 yr old rookie who hasn't played a regular season game yet. There will be ugly nights, that's a given. And you know what? It really doesn't matter. Bring them on. We aren't going anywhere, and Reke's got to learn. We can bring this conversation back up next offseason and see where's he's at after a season of seasoning.
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Kingsguy881
Guest
Dude....ok, I have to ask you if you know how to read. Because I previously stated, and I quote, "Nobody is congratulating the team for losing. Losses suck". I have no idea where you would glean from that statement that Iim ok watching my guys lose.
I guess you have some very high standards, because I would do back flips for us drafting CP3, Kobe, Rose, Deron Williams, Bosh, Dwight Howard, Danny Granger, Kevin Durant, Melo, Roy, Al Jeff.....I guess you see where I'm going. Evans could potentially be listed with any one of these previously mentioned franchise cornerstones. But no backflips for you.
Agreed. What we're doing is like looking at a 7 year old girl's measurements and comparing them to the measurements of the reigning Miss America when she was 7, to try to figure out the 7 year old's odds of getting the title in 2024. And yet... it's The Kings. What else is there to talk about? We can only make so many posts about how much better Westphal seems than Natt.
So I'm sure the talk will continue, despite being speculative and meaningless.
TaxMan
Starter
Well, to be fair....As much as Aries annoys me (which I've commented on), he has been pretty darn consistent in his comments regarding Evans. He clearly doesn't think he is a PG and given that seems to be the main topic of debate among many in the media, seems like a reasonable position to take. I don't agree with the assessment, but it's clearly not a slam dunk that Evans will be a successful PG.
Not that I want to make Aries out to be the victim, but he takes a pretty unfair beating from time to time. Everyone keeps piling on and saying he hates Evans, but I've seen him say NUMEROUS times (in many of his annoying posts
) that he thinks Evans can be a very good SG. To his credit, he has not wavered from this opinion. Whether he will ever admit if he's wrong (not sure what it would take to convince him Evans is a success as a PG....an allstar? championship? hall of fame?) is another question.Not sure I can get inside his head to know if he's rooting for Evans to fail, or if he's even a Kings fan at heart, however, I'd like to give him the benefit of the doubt.
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Kingsguy881
Guest
THATS what I'm screaming. I hate, HATE watching Garcia play, but I support him because he is a King and all he really wants is to win some games. I can't STAND Beno, but if he does something good you better believe I'm cheering for him.
Petrie made a mistake in Beno, but people make mistakes. Honestly, what were our choices last season for the position? Beno is now an overpaid backup, but Petrie made up for his mistake in drafting Evans. Do I harp on him signing Benover? Do I ***** and moan and complain because (truth be known I wanted Rubio and to hell with anyone else on the board) he drafted Evans and not Rubio? Nope, I supported the pick. And I still support the pick.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
I've also been wondering why Sergio hasn't won more playing time. Frankly, I thought it was a done deal that Sergio would be the #2 option and Beno #3. I guess it will work itself out over time....
bajaden
Hall of Famer
Well, no. Because he hasn't played in an official NBA game yet. These games don't count you know. I'm not sure some of the people on this fourm are aware of that, the way their blood pressure is going up. We're playing strange rotations, and strange minutes. I'm sure that Westphal is seeing what he has..
Wade does make his share of turnovers, but he has improved in that area over the years. However its fair to assume that the person that handles the ball the most just might lead the team in turnovers, unless your John Stockton of course.
HighTopKicks
Bench
First of all, Hawes wasn't in the game everytime Frye scored. In the 3rd when Frye did his most damage (11pts), Hawes was on the bench when Frye scored 9 of those pts. Frye got 8 pts off FT's from fouls by Casspi (2), Brockman, & Martin. Of the 29pts Frye scored, Hawes wasn't on the floor for 13 of them. And, JT wasn't the only one covering Amare, expecially considering the foul trouble he had, and the fact that he fouled out of the game with 9:47 left in the 4th.
One more point. Everyone of Frye's made shots were assisted except 1. I wasn't at the game, but I'm pretty sure everyone of those assisted baskets wasn't Hawes fault alone. The Kings front line which includes Hawes by the way, held Frye to 3 rebounds in 35 minutes. If Frye doesn't make 4 out of 5 from the 3, he has an unremarkable game.
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Circa_1985_Fan
All-Star
Oh how I couldn't agree more! You have to play way more aggressive on defense against mediocre players(at best)like Frye...there's just no excuse for that! That just like last season when I was sitting in the third row at the last Laker game...Luke Walton blew by Nocioni, Garcia and JT and dunked over everyone like it was nothing...I was like 'Are you KIDDING me!!...You let Luke Freaking Walton do THAT to you?!?!' And now Channing Frye goes off for 30?!?!
Arby's Roast Beef
Starter
Turnover prone rookies tend to progress much farther than ones that aren't turnover prone. Considering how much he's going to be a part of our perimeter offense, I'd be surprised if he wasn't turnover prone--and that shouldn't necessarily be taken as a bad sign. We're a losing team regardless, and any turnovers Tyreke accumulates should be attributed to growing pains at this point.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
Lets assume for a moment that the foul situation was an abberation. Just for the hell of it. Lets assume that the temps have a man crush on Stoudemire.. OK..
Now with that aside, lets look at the game. Without any freethrows for either side, the Kings win the game 103 to 92. The Kings FGP was 50%, shooting 49 out of 98. Their 3pt percentate was 53%, hitting 8 out of 15 shots. The Suns FGP was 47.1% hitting a total of 41 out of 87. their 3pt percentate was 47.6%, hitting 10 out of 21 shots.
So the Kings shot the ball better from 3pt range and better overall than the Suns did. The Kings out rebounded the Suns 46 to 43. So, when you consider that foul calls are somewhat subjective, and at times biased, the Kings didn't play that bad a game. They led at halftime. The Suns put a run on in the third quarter with Evans and Thompson out of the game.
So some of us see some bright spots. I personally don't care about the score of a preseason game. A win is nice, but its meaningless. Right now I'm sure Westphal is just trying to see what he has. But if you want to get your pantyhose in an uproar about it, have at it. But its much ado about nothing mi amigo.
Section 101
All-Star
Do you have season tickets?
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AriesMar27
Guest
can you read? YOU... were the one that brought up evans. YOU were the one talking about how well he played and that i never want to give him credit for playing well. so with that said, YOU are the one congratulating players for losing.
i would love all of the players that you mentioned besides al jefferson. only because of his injury. we have enough of those on this team. but i wouldnt want granger, durant, melo, roy, bosh, dwight or kobe to be our pg. paul, deron and rose can come on over and play pg for the kings anytime they want.
evans can turn into a franchise player, appear in multiple all-star games and even win mvp. that would be cool and i would love it. he has all of the tools to become a great player which i mentioned in other threads. but if he does he wont do it as a pg. he is a good player. i never said that he wasnt, i am happy that he is on the team and i will support him like any other kings player. i just dont see him as a pg. a sg, sure... if evans were our starting sg i would be almost as ecstatic about him as you are; almost because he cant or wont dunk. thats the only part of his game that resembles a traditional pg.
now that we have that taken care of... we can get back to being a bad team.
Section 101
All-Star
Lets assume for a moment that the foul situation was an abberation. Just for the hell of it. Lets assume that the temps have a man crush on Stoudemire.. OK..
Now with that aside, lets look at the game. Without any freethrows for either side, the Kings win the game 103 to 92. The Kings FGP was 50%, shooting 49 out of 98. Their 3pt percentate was 53%, hitting 8 out of 15 shots. The Suns FGP was 47.1% hitting a total of 41 out of 87. their 3pt percentate was 47.6%, hitting 10 out of 21 shots.
So the Kings shot the ball better from 3pt range and better overall than the Suns did. The Kings out rebounded the Suns 46 to 43. So, when you consider that foul calls are somewhat subjective, and at times biased, the Kings didn't play that bad a game. They led at halftime. The Suns put a run on in the third quarter with Evans and Thompson out of the game.
So some of us see some bright spots. I personally don't care about the score of a preseason game. A win is nice, but its meaningless. Right now I'm sure Westphal is just trying to see what he has. But if you want to get your pantyhose in an uproar about it, have at it. But its much ado about nothing mi amigo.
I'm not even going to get into any analysis of this game. First, I didn't see it. Second from the games I have watched the refs were beyond horrible and it's pretty pointless to make any judgements on any of their calls or non calls. To me the preseaon has been pretty much a waste with these refs.
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AriesMar27
Guest
Lets assume for a moment that the foul situation was an abberation. Just for the hell of it. Lets assume that the temps have a man crush on Stoudemire.. OK..
Now with that aside, lets look at the game. Without any freethrows for either side, the Kings win the game 103 to 92. The Kings FGP was 50%, shooting 49 out of 98. Their 3pt percentate was 53%, hitting 8 out of 15 shots. The Suns FGP was 47.1% hitting a total of 41 out of 87. their 3pt percentate was 47.6%, hitting 10 out of 21 shots.
So the Kings shot the ball better from 3pt range and better overall than the Suns did. The Kings out rebounded the Suns 46 to 43. So, when you consider that foul calls are somewhat subjective, and at times biased, the Kings didn't play that bad a game. They led at halftime. The Suns put a run on in the third quarter with Evans and Thompson out of the game.
So some of us see some bright spots. I personally don't care about the score of a preseason game. A win is nice, but its meaningless. Right now I'm sure Westphal is just trying to see what he has. But if you want to get your pantyhose in an uproar about it, have at it. But its much ado about nothing mi amigo.
thats unfair to the suns if you eliminate the fouls and freethrows. how many shots were missed because thompson or martin fouled someone? how many dunks or layups were missed due to legitimate fouls? i know there were a lot of bad calls, the replacement refs have been horrible. but there were some real fouls committed in the game.
my only beef with the whole loss issue was the score... 143 points is a lot of points, preseason or not... if you are fouling that much you would think that it would at least slow down the tempo of the game yet they still scored 143 points.
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Kingsguy881
Guest
<sigh>
Ok, you win, I told them each and every one, "Congratulations for losing guys. Thats what we want to see. Losers."
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AriesMar27
Guest
everyone cares what i think... i thought you knew, didnt you get the memo?
petrie also drafted douby, signed beno to a 5 year deal and traded chris webber for kenny thomas.... its done we cant go back and havent won more than 3 playoff games since that day(the webber trade)....
had he drafted sergio instead of douby we wouldnt have signed beno to a 5 yr deal even if we did pick him up after he was waived by the twolves.
