Old Trade Thread (no longer need to post all trades here)

[Kings113]

Name me the PG's that play "defense" that are worth anything.

Brevin Knight, though has an ankle injury he's playing through right now.

Probably not realistic, but Baron Davis. Same for Kidd.

Mike James, guy is having a break-out and best season. I'd love him in Sac.

Still young and all, but, Marcus Banks. Who I really like, and think has a nice future.

Tyronn Lue.

Older, but still good, Eric Snow.

Earl Watson. Ditto James (on in Sac).

Kirk Hinrich and Chris Duhon. Really like watching these two, again, would love either on the Kings.

Antonio Daniels.

Of course, Bobby Jackson, but is injury prone.

 

[LPKingsFan]

Jason Kidd, Chris Duhon come to mind too.

But the whole point of this is that point guards on the whole aren't looked to be defensive stoppers. I think there are many PGs out there (Bibby included) who can be on good defensive teams, but aren't stoppers in themselves.

So I disagree foretaz.

 

[SacTownKid]

Most of the names you mentioned. Would you trade Mike Bibby for them straight up?

 

[Kings113]

Most couldn't be done straight up. As far as replacing?:

Hinrich/Duhon/Banks/James/Watson. Who knows if any would be a key/main piece, depends.

Davis/Kidd I don't think would be realistic, the others, nay.

 

[Bricklayer]

As I am/was with Jason Hart, I am morbidly curious what the fascination is with Marcus Banks, who by all accounts has been a major disappointment so far?

I mean, I haven't watched him that much. Am I missing something?

 

[Kings113]

He just came back in December from injury, and is obviously in Boston with a bunch of other young PGs and players. I just dig and enjoy Banks' style, and as a young PG. I haven't seen a ton of Banks, but I've seen a decent deal, I guess.

 

[ParniValjak]

Name me the PG's that play "defense" that are worth anything.

Chauncey Billups
Chris Paul
Kirk Hinrich
Jason Kidd

Those are just 4 players off the top of my head.

 

[foretaz]

sorry...but in indy if ur gonna make 12-14 million, given our payroll, u better be able to hold ur own at the defensive end....

u dont pay a guy that much money and then try to hide him....my opinion, of course....

our payroll is tough.....to bring in a guy making that kinda money he would have to be very special....and unfortunately, bibby just wouldnt really fit that bill....to some hes really just an undersized sg that is very poor on the defensive end....

we would rather have earl watson for 5 million....

 

[Bricklayer]

sorry...but in indy if ur gonna make 12-14 million, given our payroll, u better be able to hold ur own at the defensive end....

u dont pay a guy that much money and then try to hide him....my opinion, of course....

our payroll is tough.....to bring in a guy making that kinda money he would have to be very special....and unfortunately, bibby just wouldnt really fit that bill....to some hes really just an undersized sg that is very poor on the defensive end....

we would rather have earl watson for 5 million....

Note: Reggie Miller.

Was worht much MUCH more than Trenton Hassel, and could not defend a lick.

 

[foretaz]

Note: Reggie Miller.

Was worht much MUCH more than Trenton Hassel, and could not defend a lick.

hmmmm....well its a little off topic, but bibby makes reggie look like bruce bowen....reggie was never a bad defender....bibby is...only when he reached his late 30s was he ever a liability defensively-and even then no moreso than bibby is....

anyway...as i said, its first and foremost about the contract....we have 4 pgs on the roster that collectively dont make what bibby does....

it just wouldnt make sense....like i said...if he were a star, then maybe u try to be tempted....but theres just no way the p's could justify it.....

 

[piksi]

Chauncey Billups
Chris Paul
Kirk Hinrich
Jason Kidd

Those are just 4 players off the top of my head.

Snow, Iverson, Parker, Davis, Arenas,

 

[BMiller52]

does jameer nelson play d?

 

[captain bill]

Snow, Iverson, Parker, Davis, Arenas,

Iverson is not a good defender. Not his fault, but he's six feet tall, if that. Watching the Sixers-C's game, Delonte West should be put on the list of PGs who can defend, and he's only in his second year.

 

[SacTownKid]

Snow, Iverson, Parker, Davis, Arenas,

I think you should really watch these players specifically, you may be surprised in what you see.

 

[the_crusher]

Parker can't play D. I think Marko Jaric of Minnesota Timberwolves is a good defender, and I think he wasn't mentioned before.

 

[Kings113]

You're right Bill, I've seen a number of Celts games this year, and West is a good defender. Just forgot about him. Tonight reminded me of that.

 

[Rowdyone]

It occurs to me that what was supposed to be our core this year is actually our core of rot. Now, Bibby, Peja and Brad are all skilled players but the league is no longer a league that accepts their skills over new skills...quickness, speed and athleticism. Yes, their skills when meshed properly on any given night can overcome the newly accepted ones but what are the odds that 3-5 men are going to play well every night? Yet on every night quickness, speed and athleticism will be available. Now, there still is a market for skilled veterans to teach and direct the youngsters but having more than one on the floor at a time creates unacceptable mis-matches. So what I propose is a series of trades to net us the talent we need.
A. Bonzi to Indy for Artest
B. Bibby and SAR to Boston for Pierce, Banks and Perkins.
C. Peja and Brad to Chicago for Chandler, Gordon and Piatkowski.
These are all trades that work contractually and give us much more talent for both starters and the bench. And, I believe, that much like baseball where you want to be strong defensively up the middle the same holds true in basketball, you need a good defensive point guard and a good defensive center who can rebound. So it would work out like this:

PG - Banks, Price and Hart
SG - Pierce, Gordon, Martin, Piatkowski
SF - Artest, Garcia, Corliss
PF - Perkins, Thomas, Sampson
C - Chandler, Skinner

No time to go into reasoning why each team does each trade but I think it makes a certain amount of sense for all.

 

[Kings113]

Sounds like a good roster to me. That would be one tough, athletic team.

Chicago papers or announcers even mentioned they'd like to have Brad Miller back. Ben Gordon's been d'ing up lately, along with his surge on offense.

 

[SLAB]

How about this for a blockbuster?

Kings Get...

Carmelo Anthony... 25.0 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 2.7 apg

Andre Miller... 14.3 ppg, 4.9 rpg, 8.5 apg

Kenyon Martin... 11.9 ppg, 5.7 rpg, 1.6 apg

Nuggets Get...

Mike Bibby... 19.3 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 5.5 apg

Peja Stojakovic... 16.6 ppg, 5.0 rpg, 2.2 apg

Shareef Abdur-Rahim... 16.5 ppg, 6.4 rpg, 3.2 apg

Change in Team Outlook: -1.2 ppg, +1.7 rpg, +1.9 apg

PG: Andre Miller/Jason Hart/Ronnie Price
SG: Bonzi Wells/Kevin Martin
SF: Melo Anthony/Cisco Garcia/Corliss Williamson
PF: Kenyon Martin/Kenny Thomas/Corliss Williamson
C: Brad Miller/Brian Skinner/Jamal Sampson

However...I don't really see that trade happening.

 

[VF21]

^^There is no reason in the world Denver would do that.

Come on... If you're going to make a trade proposal, shouldn't it have at least a scintilla of possibility? Just having the numbers work through reamGM isn't enough, IMHO.

 

[SLAB]

^^There is no reason in the world Denver would do that.

Come on... If you're going to make a trade proposal, shouldn't it have at least a scintilla of possibility? Just having the numbers work through reamGM isn't enough, IMHO.

I know that it has no chance in the world...Just thought I'd throw it out there for discussion's sake...

 

[VF21]

I know that it has no chance in the world...Just thought I'd throw it out there for discussion's sake...

And that, in a nutshell, is why so many people simply cannot abide most trade threads.

Realistic possible trade scenarios are one thing, and most people will discuss them. But these NBA LIVE 2006 fantasy-type proposals just turn off discussion, rather than actually stimulate it.

/rant

 

[DaMan]

It occurs to me that what was supposed to be our core this year is actually our core of rot. Now, Bibby, Peja and Brad are all skilled players but the league is no longer a league that accepts their skills over new skills...quickness, speed and athleticism. Yes, their skills when meshed properly on any given night can overcome the newly accepted ones but what are the odds that 3-5 men are going to play well every night? Yet on every night quickness, speed and athleticism will be available. Now, there still is a market for skilled veterans to teach and direct the youngsters but having more than one on the floor at a time creates unacceptable mis-matches. So what I propose is a series of trades to net us the talent we need.
A. Bonzi to Indy for Artest
B. Bibby and SAR to Boston for Pierce, Banks and Perkins.
C. Peja and Brad to Chicago for Chandler, Gordon and Piatkowski.
These are all trades that work contractually and give us much more talent for both starters and the bench. And, I believe, that much like baseball where you want to be strong defensively up the middle the same holds true in basketball, you need a good defensive point guard and a good defensive center who can rebound. So it would work out like this:

PG - Banks, Price and Hart
SG - Pierce, Gordon, Martin, Piatkowski
SF - Artest, Garcia, Corliss
PF - Perkins, Thomas, Sampson
C - Chandler, Skinner

No time to go into reasoning why each team does each trade but I think it makes a certain amount of sense for all.

A. No because it is like trading a big nutcase for a small nutcase doubt that pacers would want to do that.
B. No Boston does not want big contracts.
C. Maybe because i don't think they would want to lose both chandler and gordon for a weak center and peja who they could get next year. Chi town is in a need for a post up player so i think they would rather have sar. i like bricks trade with the bulls.

 

[SLAB]

Makes sence, VF.

Onto a more serious thought...Tyson Chandler.

HE only played 4 minutes off the bench tonight for Chicago...Potential problems?

Can we swoop in on damaged goods? I wish...

Maybe...

Kings Get...

Tyson Chandler... 4.8 ppg, 7.6 rpg, 1.0 apg

Luol Deng... 13.7 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 1.7 apg

Bulls Get...

Brad Miller... 14.6 ppg, 7.8 rpg, 5.3 apg

Kevin Martin... 7.2 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 1.2 apg

Future First Round Pick?? (Not this year)

Change in Team Outlook: -3.3 pts, +2.8 rpg, -3.8 apg

We do it because: Kings get an extremly young, athletic, defensive-minded center with loads of potential...All of a sudden makes our front-line at least semi-respectable on the defensive side of the court...We lose an offensive piece, but you don't need 5 offensive parts on the floor all at once...With Luol Deng we get a super sixth man when Peja is healthy, and definatly someone who can easily step into Peja's spot when he walks at the end of the year...And Peja now becomes easily expendible (Peja/SAR/Corliss/our next 5 years worth of draft picks for KG) . We brng in youth, and with years those two will be keepers...Plus you can play Chandler and Skinner at the PF/C spots and have one helluva hustling/defending, albiet offensivly horrible, tandem diving around the court.

PG: Mike Bibby/Jason Hart/Ronnie Price
SG: Bonzi Wells/Cisco Garcia
SF: Peja/Luol Deng/Corliss Williamson
PF: SAR/Kenny Thomas/Jamal Sampson
C: Tyson Chandler/Brian Skinner/Jamal Sampson

They do it because: They want to push for a playoff run now...Right now they have a pretty bad offense with no "The man." Well Brad sure as hell doesn't solve that problem, but he IS sure as hell head and shoulders (and body and legs and etc) above Chandler offensivly...Losing Deng hurts, but it's made better by getting a youngster with Kevin, and a future draft pick...The team still stays young, but possibly improves for the now in the process.

PG: Chris Duhon/Jannero Pargo
SG: Kirk Hinrich/Ben Gordon/
SF: Andres Nocioni/Kevin Martin?
PF: Mike Sweetney/Darius Songaila/Othella Harrington
C: Brad Miller/???

 

[atxrocker]

Makes sence, VF.

Onto a more serious thought...Tyson Chandler.

HE only played 4 minutes off the bench tonight for Chicago...Potential problems?

Can we swoop in on damaged goods? I wish...

Maybe...

Kings Get...

Tyson Chandler... 4.8 ppg, 7.6 rpg, 1.0 apg

Luol Deng... 13.7 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 1.7 apg

Bulls Get...

Brad Miller... 14.6 ppg, 7.8 rpg, 5.3 apg

Kevin Martin... 7.2 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 1.2 apg

Future First Round Pick?? (Not this year)

Change in Team Outlook: -3.3 pts, +2.8 rpg, -3.8 apg

We do it because: Kings get an extremly young, athletic, defensive-minded center with loads of potential...All of a sudden makes our front-line at least semi-respectable on the defensive side of the court...We lose an offensive piece, but you don't need 5 offensive parts on the floor all at once...With Luol Deng we get a super sixth man when Peja is healthy, and definatly someone who can easily step into Peja's spot when he walks at the end of the year...And Peja now becomes easily expendible. We brng in youth, and with years those two will be keepers...Plus you can play Chandler and Skinner at the PF/C spots and have one helluva hustling/defending, albiet offensivly horrible, tandem diving around the court.

PG: Mike Bibby/Jason Hart/Ronnie Price
SG: Bonzi Wells/Cisco Garcia
SF: Peja/Luol Deng/Corliss Williamson
PF: SAR/Kenny Thomas/Jamal Sampson
C: Tyson Chandler/Brian Skinner/Jamal Sampson

They do it because: They want to push for a playoff run now...Right now they have a pretty bad offense with no "The man." Well Brad sure as hell doesn't solve that problem, but he IS sure as hell head and shoulders (and body and legs and etc) above Chandler offensivly...Losing Deng hurts, but it's made better by getting a youngster with Kevin, and a future draft pick...The team still stays young, but possibly improves for the now in the process.

PG: Chris Duhon/Jannero Pargo
SG: Kirk Hinrich/Ben Gordon/
SF: Andres Nocioni/Kevin Martin?
PF: Mike Sweetney/Darius Songaila/Othella Harrington
C: Brad Miller/???

SLAB- I would do this trade without a blink, no doubt about it. I would love to see it happen.

 

[DaMan]

Makes sence, VF.

Onto a more serious thought...Tyson Chandler.

HE only played 4 minutes off the bench tonight for Chicago...Potential problems?

Can we swoop in on damaged goods? I wish...

Maybe...

Kings Get...

Tyson Chandler... 4.8 ppg, 7.6 rpg, 1.0 apg

Luol Deng... 13.7 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 1.7 apg

Bulls Get...

Brad Miller... 14.6 ppg, 7.8 rpg, 5.3 apg

Kevin Martin... 7.2 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 1.2 apg

Future First Round Pick?? (Not this year)

Change in Team Outlook: -3.3 pts, +2.8 rpg, -3.8 apg

We do it because: Kings get an extremly young, athletic, defensive-minded center with loads of potential...All of a sudden makes our front-line at least semi-respectable on the defensive side of the court...We lose an offensive piece, but you don't need 5 offensive parts on the floor all at once...With Luol Deng we get a super sixth man when Peja is healthy, and definatly someone who can easily step into Peja's spot when he walks at the end of the year...And Peja now becomes easily expendible. We brng in youth, and with years those two will be keepers...Plus you can play Chandler and Skinner at the PF/C spots and have one helluva hustling/defending, albiet offensivly horrible, tandem diving around the court.

PG: Mike Bibby/Jason Hart/Ronnie Price
SG: Bonzi Wells/Cisco Garcia
SF: Peja/Luol Deng/Corliss Williamson
PF: SAR/Kenny Thomas/Jamal Sampson
C: Tyson Chandler/Brian Skinner/Jamal Sampson

They do it because: They want to push for a playoff run now...Right now they have a pretty bad offense with no "The man." Well Brad sure as hell doesn't solve that problem, but he IS sure as hell head and shoulders (and body and legs and etc) above Chandler offensivly...Losing Deng hurts, but it's made better by getting a youngster with Kevin, and a future draft pick...The team still stays young, but possibly improves for the now in the process.

PG: Chris Duhon/Jannero Pargo
SG: Kirk Hinrich/Ben Gordon/
SF: Andres Nocioni/Kevin Martin?
PF: Mike Sweetney/Darius Songaila/Othella Harrington
C: Brad Miller/???

Why would the bulls trade deng? Martin will be no where as good as martin in the future. We should just stick to trying to get chandler.

 

[Kings113]

A. No because it is like trading a big nutcase for a small nutcase doubt that pacers would want to do that.
B. No Boston does not want big contracts.
C. Maybe because i don't think they would want to lose both chandler and gordon for a weak center and peja who they could get next year. Chi town is in a need for a post up player so i think they would rather have sar. i like bricks trade with the bulls.

Jermaine O'Neal has said twice he'd want Bonzi on the Pacers.

Bonzi hasn't been a nutcase for awhile. Same for Artest, IMO.

 

[SLAB]

Why would the bulls trade deng? Martin will be no where as good as martin in the future. We should just stick to trying to get chandler.

I agree, Martin won't be nowhere as good as Deng...BUT, if we give up our 2007 draft pick, we could push a "You now have two shots at potentially landing Greg Oden!" angle at them.

Our 2007 pick, if we make this trade, could very well be a lottery pick...Maybe the Bulls would be enticed with the gamble?

But with our luck, it would end up being the top pick, and Oden would be the next coming of Shaq, and the Bulls will win 5 more titles, and we'd continue to wallow away in mediocrity.

I changed my mind...

Here's my final call.

-Brad Miller
-Kevin Martin/Cisco Gracia (Interchangable, both work salary-wise...So whoever the Bulls want more...On a quick glance, it seems Cisco fits there lineup better if they trade Deng)
-2007 First Round Pick, Number 1 Protected, if it indeed gets protected, they also get 2008 second rounder as "compensation"...2008 pick would be completly unprotected.

For

-Tyson Chandler
-Luol Deng

 

[DaMan]

Jermaine O'Neal has said twice he'd want Bonzi on the Pacers.

yea, but i really do expect bonzi to act up, wait until his contract year is over and sign a new one then u will see the real bonzi and so will jermaine.

 

[GoGoGadget]

And that, in a nutshell, is why so many people simply cannot abide most trade threads.

Realistic possible trade scenarios are one thing, and most people will discuss them. But these NBA LIVE 2006 fantasy-type proposals just turn off discussion, rather than actually stimulate it.

/rant

Unless they involve the Kings aquiring Kevin Garnett. Then it's all good.