Oh Boy, Kings look set with players

[CruzDude]

Finally. Finally the Kings look done with getting or trading players. Petrie said as much yesterday in the Bee. And Wayne Cooper likes Woods. Time now to get on with summer conditioning in the 6 weeks leading up to training camp.

They have 17 bodies under contract and will need to get down to 15 or less by 3rd week in October. I like what they have considering what was and is out there. I think Salmons is a real steal and can replace Garcia in the rotation if Cisco doesn't pick up his game, particularly his scoring, early on. It looks like Bonzi will be left as a FA with no S&T and the Kings stay under the luxury tax.

And Brad looks like a keeper on the USA Basketball team as one of only 2 real "bigs" they will have. Looks like he'll show up in camp in the best shape of this pro life.

Ahhhhhhhhhhhh.

 

[OldSchoolKing]

It is nice to read some optimism once in a while here. I'm just as pleased with the offseason as you Cruz.

 

[ForlornKing]

He never said he was done trading players.


He only said it's unlikely that we add any players through free agency.

 

[NoBonus]

He never said he was done trading players.


He only said it's unlikely that we add any players through free agency.

That is what I read, as well.

 

[Jkbiker]

the quote from todays bee article said

"Petrie also said the Kings likely are finished with offseason upgrades, barring unforeseen trades"

That indicates to me unless someone calls with a deal too good to pass up, he is done.

 

[BigWaxer]

Your excited that no more moves will be made Cruz?

This year we are older, fired a coach that brought us to the playoffs every year for an unproven coach... picked up another SG in the draft... lost our best rebounder, picked up 2 players in Salmons and Woods- BTW both have never done a thing.

I like Martin over Bonzi starting and I actually think we would have gained if we shored up a strong starting PF.

Right now it seems like a mash of players that don't fit.

Do I give them all the benefit of the doubt... of course, am I happy with this off season as of today... no way, I don't think we going in the right direction at all.

If this is it, I am not happy and I am usually a happy guy DANGIT!

 

[piksi]

The way things are going the season might be a looooooooong one. Might be worse than TDOS

 

[nbrans]

The offseason is over. I'm just ready for the godforsaken season to begin.

I liked last year's offseason -- getting Wells, SAR and Garcia seemed to be the best moves available at the time, and Petrie was able to get them done. This offseason didn't go as well.

But really, this offseason might have been overrated. The key to the Kings improvement is the development of the young guys, moreso than moves that could have been made this offseason. To be sure we still need KG, but the trading deadline and next offseason seem to be a more fertile ground for big deals.

The Kings are still in transition, a few pieces here a few pieces there. If Kevin Martin develops into a star, Bibby and Miller regain their 2004-2005 form and the chemistry works with Musselman, the Kings could be pretty close to being serious again. But still, a disappointing offseason.

 

[Bricklayer]

This is not an "oh boy!" its an "oh boy ".

It also would seem to be confirmation that when Geoff threatened to sit on his hands and enter next season with the same obviously deficient team so that Muss could "evaluate" their obvious deficiencies himself, he perhaps meant it. Not sure what Geoff is getting paid these days, but give me 4 months of "work" and I'm sure I could lose Bonzi, overpay for John Salmons, and sign Loren Woods off a scrap heap. And if that's all you need me to do, I'll work cheap, go home early, and go work on the golf game.

 

[chaps]

Loren Woods isnt the answer for a rebounding/shotblocking big. Having him, or not having him doesnt make a difference.

 

[NoBonus]

This not an "oh boy!" its an "oh boy ".

It also would seem to be confirmation that when Geoff threatened to sit on his hands and enter next season with the same obviously deficient team so that Muss could "evaluate" their obvious deficiencies himself, he perhaps meant it. Not sure what Geoff is getting paid these days, but give me 4 months of "work" and I could lose Bonzi, overpay for John Salmons, and sign Loren Woods off a scrap heap. And if that's all you need me to do, I'll work cheap, go home early, and go work on the golf game.

Good points... and I am not normally critical of Petrie... I am guessing he was really hoping the Bonzi deal would have happend.

 

[kingsfanofthemonth]

This year we are older

Lost Bonzi and gained Douby, I think we got youthier, and a year of experience helps the young core of KMart, Garcia, and Price. If your going to say we got older, then the players that's a disadvantage to is Mike and Brad, and Brad's coming into camp in the best shape he's been in years.

... fired a coach that brought us to the playoffs every year for an unproven coach...

Fired a coach who couldn't win a championship with the most talented team top to bottom.

...picked up another SG in the draft...

Lost an aging shooting gaurd to free agency/greed.

... lost our best rebounder ...

Who was a shooting gaurd. I'm going to knock Bonzi's rebounding, he stole at least half of his rebounds from our 4's and 5's who had them easily. He was playing for numbers and I believe we're much better served having a quick two gaurd like KMart who will run the outlet.

...picked up 2 players in Salmons and Woods- BTW both have never done a thing.

Petrie is no fool. These are the best players that wanted (that's important because not everyone you offer a deal to will sign) to come play here.

I'm very optimistic about the direction of the team, I think our 1, 2, 3 positions have the potential to be the best and most versitile rotation in the NBA given a year or two of playing time and experience. And with our current contracts, we have enough salary to make an offer to greatly improve our frontcourt next season.

 

[Diabeticwonder]

I think that Petrie tried a lot of things this offseason, but was unable to land any of the players we had hopes of getting (Pryz, Wilcox, Speedy, Bonzi, and others). I think that rather than criticize Petrie for his lack of "BIG" offseason moves, blame has to be laid at the feet of the Maloofs for tying his hands with respect to money. They do not want to go over the cap and that does make it difficult. Sure, Petrie may have paid too much for Salmons, but time will tell. I'm also going to give Petrie the benefit of the doubt with Salmons since both PHX and Toronto (Colangelo) wanted him...that must say something about the kid. Obviously the jury is out on Douby and the Woods signing, although not appearing to be that significant, isn't a bad gamble considering that 7'2" guys who can block shots and rebound better than anyone we have already are not easy to come by.

 

[Sac.Kings]

I think we are a good team, not great. we still have too many pieces missing to contend.

 

[GoGoGadget]

This is not an "oh boy!" its an "oh boy ".

It also would seem to be confirmation that when Geoff threatened to sit on his hands and enter next season with the same obviously deficient team so that Muss could "evaluate" their obvious deficiencies himself, he perhaps meant it. Not sure what Geoff is getting paid these days, but give me 4 months of "work" and I'm sure I could lose Bonzi, overpay for John Salmons, and sign Loren Woods off a scrap heap. And if that's all you need me to do, I'll work cheap, go home early, and go work on the golf game.

Golf game? How boring!

There are much better things to work on if you go home early.

 

[Bricklayer]

I think that Petrie tried a lot of things this offseason, but was unable to land any of the players we had hopes of getting (Pryz, Wilcox, Speedy, Bonzi, and others). I think that rather than criticize Petrie for his lack of "BIG" offseason moves, blame has to be laid at the feet of the Maloofs for tying his hands with respect to money. They do not want to go over the cap and that does make it difficult. Sure, Petrie may have paid too much for Salmons, but time will tell. I'm also going to give Petrie the benefit of the doubt with Salmons since both PHX and Toronto (Colangelo) wanted him...that must say something about the kid. Obviously the jury is out on Douby and the Woods signing, although not appearing to be that significant, isn't a bad gamble considering that 7'2" guys who can block shots and rebound better than anyone we have already are not easy to come by.

While pointing a finger at the Maloofs for not wanting to go into the tax is at least semi-accurate, its really no excuse because basically NOBODY wants to go into the tax anymore. That tax limit is right around $64-$65mil this season. And there are only FOUR teams in the entire league more than a million above that:

New York $138mil
Philadelphia $93mil
Dallas $92mil
Lakers $77mil

Nobody else is at more than $66mil (which is about $3mil more than us I think). And half the league is clumped right with us int he high 50s to low 60s. (Getting this from hoopshype BTW -- http://hoopshype.com/salaries.htm (our # not including Douby or Woods yet)).

That tax really did change everything -- its almost comical how teams treat it like a hard cap anymore. But basically ALL teams do. Geoff is not working with his hands anymore tied than any other GM in the league with the exception of those in New York and Dallas (I think Philly and the Lakers would both like to get back down to the tax threshold -- Philly certainly). Things have changed since the halcyon days when he could spend whatever it took, but that just means that with that advantage taken away, and working within the same financial constraints as everybody else, Geoff is looking mortal.

 

[Warhawk]

I have the feeling that the Maloofs might open the checkbook next year - I think this is a holding pattern year for a couple reasons.

1. The arena issue. If the vote doesn't pass, they are hemmoraging more money without a chance to recoup some of their losses in the near future. If it passes, I think the $$$ will flow a little easier.

2 a + b. New coach and evaluation of young players in new system. Look at the development of all the youngsters to look for keepers. See if Muss is going to work out or not. Evaluate his use of talent and ability to develop young players. See if busting the bank for higher-priced talent is worth it with this coach.

Just my $0.02.

 

[Sac.Kings]

I have the feeling that the Maloofs might open the checkbook next year - I think this is a holding pattern year for a couple reasons.

1. The arena issue. If the vote doesn't pass, they are hemmoraging more money without a chance to recoup some of their losses in the near future. If it passes, I think the $$$ will flow a little easier.

2 a + b. New coach and evaluation of young players in new system. Look at the development of all the youngsters to look for keepers. See if Muss is going to work out or not. Evaluate his use of talent and ability to develop young players. See if busting the bank for higher-priced talent is worth it with this coach.

Just my $0.02.

I agree, but the thing that makes this questionable is that everyone is a year older and thats fine for the young players, but what about the older players. We also lose Williamson.

 

[Rome]

Well I wasn't certiantly pleased with the moves GP made this offseason but I'll give it some time and wait until the season begins before being negative some like people in this forum.

 

[CruzDude]

Musselman's style is a lot different than Adelmans. Musselman will go with who plays on the team the best. I think he will embrace Coach K's philosophy a bit on the Team USA and use the best "team" not necessarily just the best individual players.

Adelman let the team who had been together 3-4 years run their own game to the conf finals in 02. When Vlade left a couple of years later his philosophy broke down.

Now with Artest as the enforcer and defensive initiator, Martin, Salmons, and Garcia on the outiside and a bunch of real runners and gunners who defend, it is a whole new philosophy. Letting the defense dictate the offense is the best of both worlds and if the younger guys can run and finish, that will be the bulk of what is needed.

Woods, Williams and Amundson will add something to the middle the Kings have been lacking for years and be battling like h_ _ _ for a roster spot. Most all of you haven't seen them yet. So I say let's go with that and tweak it in pre-season. GP has been a genius so far so I'm gonna chill out and watch.

 

[BRad1055]

Is anyone really expecting us to contend? I know i am not. I expect we will be a good 40 to 50 win team and get the 5th or 6th spot in the West and go out in round two. Those are my expectations for this year. This team is in "transition" and I for one did not expect a big free agent signing or trade because we just don't have the salary cap room or players other teams would want to do a big signing or trade. Wait til next offseason when we have a little more money.

 

[Bricklayer]

Is anyone really expecting us to contend? I know i am not. I expect we will be a good 40 to 50 win team and get the 5th or 6th spot in the West and go out in round two. Those are my expectations for this year. This team is in "transition" and I for one did not expect a big free agent signing or trade because we just don't have the salary cap room or players other teams would want to do a big signing or trade. Wait til next offseason when we have a little more money.

Actually, while we will have a little more money, we will still be over the cap, hence next year we won't have the money to do anything more than sign another MLE guy. Hopefully somebody a little more worthy of it than Salmons, but not still not a stud.


Now Geoff comes from the great Portland tradition of just make the playoffs every year rather than ever try to truly rebuild, but I could make a pretty good argument why now would be the tiem to trade a few vets with long term deals for other team's enders + maybe a pick or two so that we actually COULD get far enough under the cap to sign a major free agent. That's how you rebuild.

 

[BLH]

Well I wasn't certiantly pleased with the moves GP made this offseason but I'll give it some time and wait until the season begins before being negative some like people in this forum.

You know, I completely agree...finally kings get a chance to play with a young, talented and athletic roster...they might not be star caliber players, but take a look at last years' dallas..they were basically all role players being led by dirk. Kings will have a similar situation, being led by artest. Of course, Our players are a bit younger and have less experience, but its always good to know that there's always room for improvement...here come yourrr sacramentoooo kiiinggssss

 

[Kings113]

He never said he was done trading players.


He only said it's unlikely that we add any players through free agency.

Indeed. I'm not ruling trades out yet, who knows. At least until late Sept. As I've said before, that's when I think our off-season is done.

Musselman's style is a lot different than Adelmans. Musselman will go with who plays on the team the best. I think he will embrace Coach K's philosophy a bit on the Team USA and use the best "team" not necessarily just the best individual players.



Adelman let the team who had been together 3-4 years run their own game to the conf finals in 02. When Vlade left a couple of years later his philosophy broke down.



Now with Artest as the enforcer and defensive initiator, Martin, Salmons, and Garcia on the outiside and a bunch of real runners and gunners who defend, it is a whole new philosophy. Letting the defense dictate the offense is the best of both worlds and if the younger guys can run and finish, that will be the bulk of what is needed.



Woods, Williams and Amundson will add something to the middle the Kings have been lacking for years and be battling like h_ _ _ for a roster spot. Most all of you haven't seen them yet. So I say let's go with that and tweak it in pre-season. GP has been a genius so far so I'm gonna chill out and watch.

Agreed.

I saw Amundson/Williams both in the SL, and have read about them extensively. We'll get at least one of them.

 

[Real_fan]

I don't understand how that works luxury is 64.5 (this year) next year we'll be at about 53 in guaranteed contracts. Why would we only have a given MLE?

 

[rings4Kings]

Is anyone really expecting us to contend? I know i am not. I expect we will be a good 40 to 50 win team and get the 5th or 6th spot in the West and go out in round two. Those are my expectations for this year. This team is in "transition" and I for one did not expect a big free agent signing or trade because we just don't have the salary cap room or players other teams would want to do a big signing or trade. Wait til next offseason when we have a little more money.

If we win only 40 games we wouldn't even get the 5th or 6th seed in the East! If we win less than 45 games that will get us ping-pong ball for our efforts come playoff time. In order for us to win 50 games and get to the second round, another deal is a necessity.

 

[VF21]

I'm not giddy with optimisim but I'm not going to grab the torches and pitchforks quite yet, either.

Although I'm not by nature a patient person, I'm going to wait until training camp and give the new pieces a chance to prove themselves. These acquisitions may not be our saviors, but I don't think they're anywhere near as inadequate as some seem to be painting them.

I guess we'll all just have to see what happens.

 

[HndsmCelt]

Actually IF the game plan was to scrap the season, evaluate the roster, look at long shot potentials and give Muss a year to tinker I'd be thrilled! and short of the over priced paper on Salmon's that's what it looks like... Next off season COULD be a great year for rebuilding. Some reall tallent in the lottery and asome good FA's going on the market. What puzzles and frustrates me is I don't see long contract dumps or other jockying for the FA market, not do I see the kind of rebuilding that will get the Kings out of the first round assuming they manage to MAKE the paly offs with this roster... very confuseing. "Fish or cut bait!"

 

[Bricklayer]

I don't understand how that works luxury is 64.5 (this year) next year we'll be at about 53 in guaranteed contracts. Why would we only have a given MLE?

Whether you can sign free agents or not is determined by the salary cap, not the luxury tax limit.

Basically there are two thresholds now. One is the salary cap itself which is somehwere around $50+mil. The other is the luxury tax, which is up around $64mil. As long as you stay below $64 mil you don't have to pay the penalty for being in the luxury tax area. But unless you actually get down underneath the CAP, you can only use the MLE + LLE exceptions. Since the MLE is about $5.5mil anymore, you actually have to be at least $5.5 mil below the cap for there to be any advanatage to you (i.e., if you were only $2mil under the cap, you would obviously be able to spend more just by using a $5.5 mil MLE). So you probably have to get down around $45 mil in salaries next year for it to matter at all, and $40 mil to be able to sign a big free agent.

 

[Bricklayer]

"Fish or cut bait!"

Yep -- like that phrase here. Being caught straddling the fence is awkward and can be painful if you're not careful.

I have no objection to rebuilding...or to contending. But to do neither, to try to have your cake and eat it too while doing neither thing well is just very frustrating. If we want to rebuild, let's move the older guys for enders, picks, maybe a kid or two, slip into the lottery next year during a great draft, have lots of caproom to use on free agents, and reemerge in 2007 with loads of young talent, mayeb Ron and Bibby (or not even Bibby), a nice free agent, and look to get back to the top in a few years.