[Game] Kings vs. Suns 3/8/13

[kingsnation]

You know what sucks?

Keith Smart is a good guy. He actually has a personality, and I know he loves basketball.

He's just a bad head coach. After this season is over and he is gone, I don't think i'll have any hard feelings for him. I can't say that about Muss, Theus, or Westy.

Exact opposite for me when it comes to Smart. Great personality. That's all.

I actually liked Theus. The others, not so much.

 

[MassachusettsKingsFan]

Totally disagree. I actually liked Muss. I think he unfortunately followed a great coach in Adelman when we hadn't fully come to grips with the fact that we were done. I think he'll be back in the NBA and will be successful. I think Smart may be a nice guy and a hard worker but he's a moron. Those other guys didn't have the young talent we did and spend 2 seasons repeating the same mistakes while stubbornly acting like he had it all figured it.

Well, Muss is a strange case. Starting off his first season as an NBA head coach with a DUI is bad news. I understand the 'everyone makes mistakes' thing, but man, a few days before your first game?

And I think any excuse we give any of those other head coaches is massively trumped by the excuse for Keith Smart. Relocation rumor after relocation rumor, a completely absent ownership group, and a basically non existent front office.

I'm not making excuses for him, I just wouldn't make excuses for any of them. And before I get people telling me Smart sucks and he's a moron ... I know this. Bad head coach. He's not a moron, he just cannot do his job with any success. He can do other jobs well, though. I still think he'd be a fine assistent.

 

[kingsnation]

I'm not making excuses for him, I just wouldn't make excuses for any of them. And before I get people telling me Smart sucks and he's a moron ... I know this. Bad head coach. He's not a moron, he just cannot do his job with any success. He can do other jobs well, though. I still think he'd be a fine assistent.

For some reason, I think he'd make an excellent NCAA color commentator. Idk why.

 

[The_Jamal]

IT's got a bad habit of forcing the issue, over and over again - whether he's playing well or not. I think that's where alot of the frustration comes from. When he's on it looks nice, but when he's not - he's still trying to do too much, often at the expense of others.

For Reke, it's the opposite - he's rarely aggressive. So, while the 3 TOs were terrible, it was a rarity for Reke to even be that aggressive in the first place.

When it comes to how people react whenever IT does something stupid, I'd argue that on this board - numerous players create a strong negative reaction when they make a dumb play. DMC, no matter how great he's playing, will always evoke a strong negative reaction from certain people. Same goes for Reke, IT, Jimmer, etc. etc.

Which I agree with, at times. Tonight for example, 2 TO's to Reke's 6 and DMC's 4. Is he still forcing the issue? Scoring 27 points on 13 shots is the opposite of forcing the issue. It doesn't matter who's scoring with that kind of efficiency, you get out of the way and let them score. Luckily for us, we had 4 guys who were scoring out of their minds tonight

 

[rainmaker]

Smart isn't a moron. Far from it. As a head coach he's an idiot, but outside of the actual game he's nearly a genius for conning the Maloofs out of 2-3M and two extensions while being arguably the worst in the league at his job.

I have yet to figure out how to con someone legally out of 2-3M over a 36 month period.

 

[kingsnation]

Which I agree with, at times. Tonight for example, 2 TO's to Reke's 6 and DMC's 4. Is he still forcing the issue? Scoring 27 points on 13 shots is the opposite of forcing the issue. It doesn't matter who's scoring with that kind of efficiency, you get out of the way and let them score. Luckily for us, we had 4 guys who were scoring out of their minds tonight

But that's my point with IT. He would've taken those 13 shots even if he was 0-13. Sure, get out of the way and let them score - but whether you get out of the way or not, IT is taking those shots.

As far as TOs, that's not the only way of forcing the issue. IT's shot selection as well as the way he runs (or doesn't run) an offense, as a point guard, will directly effect how efficient (or not-efficient) his teammates are.

 

[The_Jamal]

More exaggerations.

K. 2 points for being able to spot an exaggeration.

 

[MassachusettsKingsFan]

Smart isn't a moron. Far from it. As a head coach he's an idiot, but outside of the actual game he's nearly a genius for conning the Maloofs out of 2-3M and two extensions while being arguably the worst in the league at his job.

I have yet to figure out how to con someone legally out of 2-3M over a 36 month period.

Professional Sports! it happens all the time.

 

[The_Jamal]

But that's my point with IT. He would've taken those 13 shots even if he was 0-13. Sure, get out of the way and let them score - but whether you get out of the way or not, IT is taking those shots.

As far as TOs, that's not the only way of forcing the issue. IT's shot selection as well as the way he runs (or doesn't run) an offense, as a point guard, will directly effect how efficient (or not-efficient) his teammates are.

But IT isn't some inefficient chucker. He's putting the ball in the hoop with great efficiency. Do we need to find better ways to get him looks within the flow of the offense? Absoultely. That's on coach to design a better offense. The solution is not to take shots away from one of the most efficient and effective scorers we've had on the team since our glory days. He's a quality 3rd option worthy of 10-12 shots/game

 

[kingsnation]

But IT isn't some inefficient chucker. He's putting the ball in the hoop with great efficiency. Do we need to find better ways to get him looks within the flow of the offense? Absoultely. That's on coach to design a better offense. The solution is not to take shots away from one of the most efficient and effective scorers we've had on the team since our glory days. He's a quality 3rd option worthy of 10-12 shots/game

I don't want IT to be our scorer, I want him to make DMC, Reke and MT better. IT's looks will come as option number 3 or 4 and that's how it should be, you're right. As a point guard, I want him to run and initiate the offense. That's his job. When IT is running down the floor and jacking up shots - it kills our momentum and completely freezes our offense. IT and our coaching staff often seem to view his role as option number 1. That will not win many games.

 

[Glenn]

Which I agree with, at times. Tonight for example, 2 TO's to Reke's 6 and DMC's 4. Is he still forcing the issue? Scoring 27 points on 13 shots is the opposite of forcing the issue. It doesn't matter who's scoring with that kind of efficiency, you get out of the way and let them score. Luckily for us, we had 4 guys who were scoring out of their minds tonight

IT had a very good game. As far as I was concerned, he could fire away as much as he wanted in the second half. What I didn't like is when he fired two threes at the beginning of the game not knowing he was hot or not. I don't think anyone was in rebound position. The fact they went in is irrelevant as there are no guarantees. This was at a time when Cuz and Reke looked like they were going to dominate Phoenix when they scored the first 16 points. Why not be a PG and feed those two guys?. It's like he can't stand having someone else get the credit. His judgment is off.

In his post game interview he said he was going to turn the team around eventually and in that mind set is the problem. I sincerely think he believes it is all up to him when there are two or three guys better than him on the court. I have now heard two interviews where he mentions no one but himself. Cousins had a good game. So did Reke and MT but he doesn't mention their contribution. It's all about IT.



IT is a 44% shooter on the year with 3.5 assists per game.

 

[Bricklayer]

The solution is not to take shots away from one of the most efficient and effective scorers we've had on the team since our glory days.

Oh lord.

The problem with IT is that's he's a borderline problem personality. Now most of the time at least he's on the ok side of the border I think right now. But he's got an inherently selfish and almost punky edge to him that may have served him well in reaching this point, but serves us very poorly when you want a guy to back off for the sake of the team. Its like asking Allen Iverson to just score more within the offense (there's a gulf, but I am using it as an iconic example). When you're a little combative guy who thinks its his godgiven right to run or break any play for your own points, when you control the dribble and most of your offense comes off that dribble pulling up whenever you feel like it, then what you really need is a disciplinarian to break you of those habits and bench you when you do it, not an offense. No offense can contain a player like that so long as he's still playing for himself. Not the triangle, not the Princeton, none of it. What's needed is discipline and self sacrifice, not different plays. The guy with the dribble can always break any play, make any irresponsible decision. Its about his attitude/willingness to be smart/team oriented, not the offense.

 

[The_Jamal]

I'm not trying to change anyone's opinion. You're all entitled to think IT is a selfish punk, and he does more harm than good for the team. The only way we'll really know how this all shakes out is with a proper coach and see who is successful

 

[The_Jamal]

IT had a very good game. As far as I was concerned, he could fire away as much as he wanted in the second half. What I didn't like is when he fired two threes at the beginning of the game not knowing he was hot or not. I don't think anyone was in rebound position. The fact they went in is irrelevant as there are no guarantees. This was at a time when Cuz and Reke looked like they were going to dominate Phoenix when they scored the first 16 points. Why not be a PG and feed those two guys?. It's like he can't stand having someone else get the credit. His judgment is off.

In his post game interview he said he was going to turn the team around eventually and in that mind set is the problem. I sincerely think he believes it is all up to him when there are two or three guys better than him on the court. I have now heard two interviews where he mentions no one but himself. Cousins had a good game. So did Reke and MT but he doesn't mention their contribution. It's all about IT.



IT is a 44% shooter on the year with 3.5 assists per game.

Now it's my turn for an "Oh lord"

You're reaching big time. IT is a selfish teammate because he didn't talk about his teammates in his post-game interview about his performance? Give me break.

FG% is an outdatted measure for looking at efficiency

 

[kingsnation]

But IT isn't some inefficient chucker. He's putting the ball in the hoop with great efficiency.

FG% is an outdatted measure for looking at efficiency

You're absolutely right. So how then do we measure IT's efficiency?

 

[Bricklayer]

You're absolutely right. So how then do we measure IT's efficiency?

Don't ever ask an "advanced" stats guy that. Ever.

What you will quickly find out is that there is nothing better in life than shooting FTs like the fat guy in the park or bombing threes willy nilly. Hakeem Olajuwon = schlub when you could have Kenny Smith taking that shot instead.

 

[Agent23]

Oh lord. An It vs Reke debate? Look, we all love IT. Heart, hustle, determination. In the modern NBA, a 5'9 shoot first PG is not gonna cut it. He can be a good guy off the bench for a change of pace (ala Barea) but not as this team's starter. Keith Smart has him running the team like he's CP3 or something.

 

[The_Jamal]

Don't ever ask an "advanced" stats guy that. Ever.

What you will quickly find out is that there is nothing better in life than shooting FTs like the fat guy in the park or bombing threes willy nilly. Hakeem Olajuwon = schlub when you could have Kenny Smith taking that shot instead.

Sheesh! Silly me for wanting a better tool for understanding the game! Also, the schlubs are the ones who don't understand how to use advanced stats. Which I do!

 

[Glenn]

Now it's my turn for an "Oh lord"

You're reaching big time. IT is a selfish teammate because he didn't talk about his teammates in his post-game interview about his performance? Give me break.

FG% is an outdatted measure for looking at efficiency

There is no point in debating with you because you exaggerate. I said far more than what you think I said. Did you read the first paragraph and see how I got to the second paragraph or is that too much effort?

 

[mac]

But IT isn't some inefficient chucker. He's putting the ball in the hoop with great efficiency. Do we need to find better ways to get him looks within the flow of the offense? Absoultely. That's on coach to design a better offense. The solution is not to take shots away from one of the most efficient and effective scorers we've had on the team since our glory days. He's a quality 3rd option worthy of 10-12 shots/game

I'm not sure how you get a PG, who handles the ball 90% of the time, better looks within the flow of the offense without asking him to give the ball up, which ... he's not doing. Unless you mean we get 4 guys to set screens for him just so he can score - i.e. we make him our primary offensive option. You may want to do that based on your advanced statistics and all, but I sure as hell don't. I may agree with you that he can be a 3rd option, but I don't think 3rd options should command 12 shots/game, especially when they are PGs that kinda hurt you on the defensive end. You aren't a 3rd option if you average 12 shots/game and dish out 3 assists when you're the primary ballhandler.

All I can say is (since you conveniently exaggerate things and then act like your point still stands), many, many people thought that Tyreke was not running the offense well in his rookie season, and he was putting up 20-5-5 with a good FG%.

 

[UK_King]

*sigh*

 

[GeorgeofSacramento]

Here's a few of the photos I took at the Kings v Suns game. Nice to see the offense being shared.
http://sacramentopress.com/headline...s_in_highscoring_affair_four_players_score_20