AleksandarN
Starter
Who is crying?
I am disappointed.
- Thread starter AleksandarN
- Start date
Who is crying?
rainmaker
Hall of Famer
I would rather have the cap space right now, and as I'm typing this KT was just waived. We can get a better prospect than Hill in the draft, and whoever we draft needs time on the floor. That wouldn't happen with Hill, Landry, JT, Spencer, Brockman, and our draft pick. I see where you're coming from, but I really think we can add a good FA this summer to go along with our pick. I like the freedom the cap space gives us more than Jeffries, Hill, and protected draft picks which might not mean much if Lebron and/or Wade/Bosh goes to NY.
Packt
Starter
Take the toliet out of your mouth.
One or the other. Jefferies comes our way and we dump Noci or Beno on Houston.
Doesn't require the Knicks approval. We'd be negotiating with Houston.
Trade would still go down as it did. We'd just include Noci or Beno to houston and get Jeffries shorter contract back. Or just take the NY pick without changing anything. Houston got an even better deal than they would've gotten without us getting involved. We helped them and got very little back.
ParniValjak
All-Star
We don't HAVE to sign anyone this off-season. Though I would say that a few FAs will look at Tyreke and see a superstar and the good young pieces around him and that could well be intriguing enough.
Even if we don't spend on the FA in the summer we are still a MAJOR trading partner because of the cap room. We can pick up some cheap young talent and picks from teams looking to cut salary. OKC have picked up how many draft picks from teams that are trying to get under the luxury tax?!
In a perfect world it would be nice to walk away with a pick or 2 but this is a good deal for us regardless.
kennadog
Dog On It!
If you accept as truth anything a GM or agent says before an actual trade, especially GP, I've got a great land deal in Florida for you.
kennadog
Dog On It!
It's a gigantic leap to assume Houston would have even been interested in Beno or Noc.
est.1999
Starter
You are.
Gary
All-Star
First off, believe me, you do NOT want Hill.. He's a glorified Mikki Moore (not just because of the dreads).
We probably are better without Martin.. No more Evans wondering who's team it is anymore. He should get to play his game now, and not worrying about how many times he needs to get Martin his shot. As for Landry? We didn't get an allstar.. Noting even close to an allstar. We got an undersized athletic PF who can play D, and is great on the offensive boards, but is meh on the defensive boards.
We will see improvements right away though because of Tyreke knowing now that this is HIS team.. But we still need to get more talent of course.. It's still a 30-35 win team at best right now.
We probably are better without Martin.. No more Evans wondering who's team it is anymore. He should get to play his game now, and not worrying about how many times he needs to get Martin his shot. As for Landry? We didn't get an allstar.. Noting even close to an allstar. We got an undersized athletic PF who can play D, and is great on the offensive boards, but is meh on the defensive boards.
We will see improvements right away though because of Tyreke knowing now that this is HIS team.. But we still need to get more talent of course.. It's still a 30-35 win team at best right now.
Luv4Kings
Bench
I don't recall Petrie saying he expected an all-star big man in return, because what team ever trades an all-star big man for anybody?
I believe it was some people here thinking that's what would happen.
What triggered it was probably Kevin wanting the trade 'behind the scenes'. If you read his comments, he's extremely happy about going to Houston and quite vocal in saying it just wasn't working out here. I'm guessing he hinted to Petrie that he wouldn't be all that upset to be traded.
Packt
Starter
They wouldn't want the big contract, but you force them. It's not unreasonable to swap the two contracts (jefferies for Beno or Noci) because we're giving up Martin and helping them get the NY deal done. Houston and NY needed to get this done. We didn't.
Luv4Kings
Bench
But if Tyreke is a point guard, shouldn't he be "worrying about how many times he" gets any of his teammates a shot?
But, of course, Tyreke is not a traditional point guard. He's more an Iverson type of point guard. So Casspi and Greene can settle back and get 6-8 shots a game each and be happy. Someone like Martin who can be productive on a lot of shots is just in the way for Tyreke.
Luv4Kings
Bench
And now that the Martin-Evans experiment has truly failed, we'll need Beno a lot more.
SCKingsfan
Bench
Jeez y'all. We got rid of Martin and his contract, and we got Landry in return. If that were the end of it, I'd say we are already in the positive. Martin was going to contribute NOTHING to this team as it stands - there is a glut at his position, he lacks the toughness our team needs, etc, you know the drill. He was a borderline all-star? Come on, the guy is a scorer who disappears in the 4th quarter and has never proven to be a guy to count on in the clutch. To say Landry isn't an improvement and doesn't fit an immediate need is selective blindness or Kevin homerism or something. Beyond that we now have two expirings that will allow us to compete this summer. Most thought Petrie would do nothing before the deadline. We should have gotten picks? I appreciate a good deal when I see one - no one got clowned in this deal. Bellyache all you want but we just got better now and in the future. I was prepared for nothing. It's snowing here in CO and it feels like christmas.
kingsfan101
Starter
Probably I am the only one who doesn't want the Kings to sign a major FA this summer.
The team is clearly couple of years away (at least) from contending for anything major. A top FA like LeBron can of course change that in a hurry, but realistically, which major FA would like to come to Sac.
The best case scenario I can think of is David Lee, and while he is the type of player we certainly need, he might not look so great if we overpay him (which we shall almost certainly need to do to get him).
With an year's experience behind them, a good front court player in Landry, and another high draft pick, we should see significant improvements from the kids next year. It might even be enough to keep us in playoff hunt for greater part of next season.
So what to do with all the cap space? One possibility would be to try and pick some draft picks from some other teams, like OKC has done very successfully recently. One concern with that though is, that lot of teams got under the cap this year. Don't think there are a lot of team over the LT next year. These are the ones most interested in giving out picks/kids to take some salary off their hands.
Knock off the Martin bashing. It's over and done. And you can quit with the "homerism" stuff, too. There's been enough friction over Martin around here the past couple of months. It's time to let it go. Seriously.
But just to clarify? The glut wasn't at the SG.
allrightythen
Starter
I was disappointed too when I heard what happened. I first heard the deal was just Kings/Rockets with the Kings trying to move McGrady to NY. Then this afternoon I find out thats not the case and we could have gotten the same thing just dealing with the Rockets alone. We didn't gain by including the Knicks in the deal and I wonder if we were strong-armed by someone into having this be a 3 team deal.
If it had been 2 separate trades with the Rockets then the Knicks we would have gotten some of the assets from the Knicks we get a bit better of a deal. I'm really not convinced those assets are going to be all that great, but a little more would have made losing Martin a little easier. In reality the success of this trade depends on what we do with all the cap space this offseason so I have to wait until then to decide what to really think. For now I guess we just watch and enjoy that we got Carl Landry out of the deal (I only hear good things about him so I'm interested to see what he does with our group).
Go Kings!!!
If it had been 2 separate trades with the Rockets then the Knicks we would have gotten some of the assets from the Knicks we get a bit better of a deal. I'm really not convinced those assets are going to be all that great, but a little more would have made losing Martin a little easier. In reality the success of this trade depends on what we do with all the cap space this offseason so I have to wait until then to decide what to really think. For now I guess we just watch and enjoy that we got Carl Landry out of the deal (I only hear good things about him so I'm interested to see what he does with our group).
Go Kings!!!
Luv4Kings
Bench
Thanks. I almost responded to the "selective blindness" of Martin bashers but figured it's over now anyway. Time to move on and embrace the new guys.
I was encouraged that the Rockets fans are really upset at losing Landry and I can't wait to see what he can do.
Not really man, Landry is really good and Dorsey has great potential, plus Hughes is an expiring contract.
Expiring contracts:
Hughes
KT
Noccini
Amory
Bench
Agreed.
I was really hoping for any 1/2 way decent big.
If we could have gotten a draft pick out of the trade I would have felt a little better...
AleksandarN
Starter
So me having a logical discussion on how things went down is crying? Give me a break. Read other threads today. I actually defended Petrie. So please read before you insult people thank you.
SCKingsfan
Bench
Greene, Garcia, Udoka can all play that position servicably. I call that a glut.
That is hardly Martin bashing. I've said nothing that cannot be proven empirically. No knock on his character, just his play.
Edit: ok, yes I did say he lacked toughness and contributed nothing (given our current roster, not historically speaking) so granted that is personal. Just my opinion.
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discocricket
G-League
After reading both positive and negative evaluations of the trade, I think I'm pretty ok with it, conditionally. My major concern is how we spend the money. If we give Joe Johnson 14 million per year to sell season tickets, it's a stupid trade. If we get someone like Bosh or Lee at a slight premium, it's a fine trade. If we don't spend the money...I will be pretty angry and disappointed.
It concerns me that Petrie got rolled by the GMs of the Rockets and Knicks at the last minute, with some possible contribution from Arn Tellem. I don't really understand the concept of doing an agent or GM a favor. So in 4 years Tellem will...suggest Tyreke accept less than the max? No. Suggest he stay in Sac? Maybe, but we're told that Tyreke's family/clan has the most influence in his decision-making. If we did Houston or New York favors, why? Aren't they competitors? It doesn't matter if it didn't cost us anything. This is a business. Are the GMs supposed to remember these favors and pay them back? What if they are fired before we cash in the favor? If NY wanted the T-Mac contract back, make them give us Hill, or another pick. It bothers me that we don't seem to maximize our take from trades like other smart GMs like Morey, Presti do.
It concerns me that Petrie got rolled by the GMs of the Rockets and Knicks at the last minute, with some possible contribution from Arn Tellem. I don't really understand the concept of doing an agent or GM a favor. So in 4 years Tellem will...suggest Tyreke accept less than the max? No. Suggest he stay in Sac? Maybe, but we're told that Tyreke's family/clan has the most influence in his decision-making. If we did Houston or New York favors, why? Aren't they competitors? It doesn't matter if it didn't cost us anything. This is a business. Are the GMs supposed to remember these favors and pay them back? What if they are fired before we cash in the favor? If NY wanted the T-Mac contract back, make them give us Hill, or another pick. It bothers me that we don't seem to maximize our take from trades like other smart GMs like Morey, Presti do.
What assets would we possibly want from the Knicks (besides David Lee who wasn't going to come here anyway)? We made a good deal with the Rockets, and it ended up being a 3-way deal with the Knicks that got us essentially the same thing (We still get Landry and instead of the huge T-Mac expiring we get to keep the K9 expiring plus the Hughes expiring which add up to about the same - or actually I think it saves us some money this season). So, no harm was done. We weren't going to get a better deal from Houston alone, and no way in hell the Knicks alone would've given us a better deal. All parties benefited from this trade, and I suggest that instead of complaining about a theoretical possibility of getting a slightly better deal that would've never happened in reality, we all just drink a couple of beers tonight and say CHEERS.
allrightythen
Starter
I don't really have a position one way or the other but you did say Martin would contribute "NOTHING" to the team; I'm just curious how that is proven empirically?
bajaden
Hall of Famer
First off It wasn't two draft picks. It was a pick from 2012 and the right to switch picks with NY in 2011 if it was the better pick. Who knows where NY is even picking in 2012. It could be the 29th pick in the draft id they manage to sign two big names.
Plus the only way we could do that was to take on the salary of Jefferies. By not taking on that salary the Kings will have somewhere in the neighborhood of 28 million dollars to work with at the end of this season. I'd much rather be in position to sign someone in the next offseason than wait till 2012 for an unknown player.
Maybe we didn't want Hill and Jeffries. I like Hill, I think he has a chance to pan out on the right team, before Landry entered the picture I think that could have been us, but we are pretty solid at the backup PF spot where we can't really afford to develop both JT and Hill full time. We're a super young team getting younger, we need to add a vet and by not taking Jeffries on we have room to sign someone or make a trade without worrying about the cap.
discocricket
G-League
Any of the cheap ones Houston got, like their 2012 1st, the right to swap 2011 1sts, or Jordan Hill?
SCKingsfan
Bench
SCKingsfan
Bench
indeed. i edited that.
allrightythen
Starter
Apparently I wasn't clear enough. I'm not upset nor do I mean to complain about the trade. I heard about the Houston trade this morning (we were getting T-Mac and Landry then trying to swing T-Mac to the Knicks for a few more assets). The way it turned out I was a little disappointed because we didn't get the additional sweetener I thought we would. I was alright with original deal and I'm fine with it, just thought we'd end up with a little more, thats all.
I'll admit that I think that we dealt Kevin Martin at a discount. At the same time I wasn't sure his value would ever get back to where it was so I wasn't surprised to see him go in a deal like this. But as I said, this deal hinges on what happens with that cap space so I won't say its a good deal yet because I honestly don't know.
