How to Get Amare Stoudemire?

[Sptsjunkie]

Ah -- yeah, that's pretty good too, probably better than Toronto's.

I like this one for both teams. Miami pairs two young stars together, including a big man who is ideal for their pick-and-roll offense. They would lose all D inside, but it seems like it would be easier to acquire another Haslem than Amare.

For the Suns you get to still make a run this year by pairing Haslem with Shaq and getting more depth with Beasley. Defintley makes them better on D. Then if you blow things up after the season, you get the expiring Blount contract and young, potential star.

The funny thing is I would imagine that if either team would balk at this it would be Miami if they think that within the next 1-2 years Beasley will be better than Amare.

 

[Peter_Gibbons]

I didn't say Lebron James. But people here are acting as if a second tier star that doesn't fit is going to do wonders for this team, when it's not. This team is playing so poorly that people are looking to get ANYTHING better than what they have and they aren't looking at the bigger picture. I'd rather not get Amare, pay him max, and then have a 40 win team every year that goes nowhere if they make the playoffs, and then look to dump him later on when things don't work out ala Brad Miller. I don't want to settle. And by that, I don't mean getting a Lebron James, but getting a player that makes sense, and getting Amare doesn't make any sense to me.

The thing is FRANCHISE players aren't really available. If they are available, they are usually old or someone thats just not getting along with the team (thats how we got CWEBB).

Other than that, the only realistic way to get a franchise player is to draft one. Now Amare is not a superstar or a franchise player. But the players that we would offer would is not really that much to lose. Considering it will be a combination of Miller, Beno, Greene, Salmons etc. These are either players that aren't working out (Beno), older players (Miller), "up side" guys that hasn't proven anything (Greene), or solid but not great (Salmons). The 1st rd pick via Rockets is not too much to give up because its a hit or miss, and how often do you get a star that late?

While Amare is not a superstar, he is an all star. Even with a bad yr where the offense is not working with him at all, he is still averaging around 21pts & 9rebs. He is also only 26 yrs old. I wouldn't mind giving up a combo of the mentioned players for him. If he walks after 2010, we just got rid of Miller+Beno+???'s contract.

 

[wonjaeyou]

If Hawes continues down his current back up he is a future solid back up Center. Also, don't forget, those 4...or was it 5 surgeries?? I can't remember, I lost count....Those will catch up to him in a few years.

Agreed! Hawes might be a good player later on, but not a great player nor a leader of the team. Even if he does become a great player, his surgeries on his knees will break him down soon or later.

I would rather keep Thompson over Hawes.

 

[Section 101]

Agreed! Hawes might be a good player later on, but not a great player nor a leader of the team. Even if he does become a great player, his surgeries on his knees will break him down soon or later.

I would rather keep Thompson over Hawes.

And Amare had them as well with a year + rehab.

 

[MassachusettsKingsFan]

If we can get him to sign a longer deal - absolutely.

His injury's are a little nerve racking, but it looks like he is in good shape with the knee situation.

I wouldnt hesitate to trade hawes to phoenix - maybe even both hawes and Thompson if it means we get to keep our pick. Amare - Griffin combo would be nice. If we decide Amare is better of at PF then an Amare - Thabeet lineup could be sweet athletically and defensively..

I know a lot of people here think thompson is the second coming of chris webber - but you just cant be sure. Amare is alot closer to Webbers level and not a whole lot older than thompson .. keep that in mind.

again, only if we can extend him.

 

[Kingzrool]

I have seen this proposed:

Stoudemire for Martin and Thomas.

I like it.

 

[nbrans]

I have seen this proposed:

Stoudemire for Martin and Thomas.

I like it.

I don't think Phoenix would go for that. Because Phoenix is already thin on their front line and beacuse I don't think they want to give up hope in the postseason just yet, I think whatever trade happens has to leave them with a decent power forward (preferably young) while still retaining some salary cap flexibility in 2010.

That basically leaves a rough framework of:

New York: Marbury/Lee for Amare/Barbosa
Toronto: Jermaine O'Neal/pick for Amare/Barbosa
Miami: Haslem/Blount/Beasley
Chicago: Hughes/Thomas/pick
Detroit: Rasheed plus young players/picks
Portland: LaFrentz/Aldridge
Minnesota: Mike Miller/Jason Collins/Love
Oklahoma City: Wilcox/Smith/Green
Sacramento: Miller/Hawes or Thompson/pick

 

[Showtime]

The thing is FRANCHISE players aren't really available. If they are available, they are usually old or someone thats just not getting along with the team (thats how we got CWEBB).

First off, I didn't say I wanted only franchise players. I said that's what this team needs. I also didn't say I wouldn't like a second tier star. What I said was that I don't want a second tier star who doesn't fit (in both style and pay). Also, Webber is a different player than Amare.

While Amare is not a superstar, he is an all star. Even with a bad yr where the offense is not working with him at all, he is still averaging around 21pts & 9rebs. He is also only 26 yrs old. I wouldn't mind giving up a combo of the mentioned players for him. If he walks after 2010, we just got rid of Miller+Beno+???'s contract.

I'll use Brad Miller as an example. What's wrong with Brad other than his deal? Not much. Would we be complaining if Brad was making 6 mil a year? Probably not. With Amare, he's a second rate PF ala David West. He's not a franchise player, but he wants a MAX deal and to be featured in the offense. What does that do to the team? It hampers it's ability to build a contender with those contracts and attitude. He's not a franchise player, but he wants to be treated like one with his role on the team and the zero's in his paycheck.

I don't have a problem with getting a second tier star, as long as it's one that fit into what the team is going for, and Amare doesn't fit IMO because of his play style, attitude, and contract that he wants.

Also, him being 26 is irrelevant to me considering the milage on his body and his surgery.

 

[kingzzzfan4ever]

How about this:

Sac In:

Stoudemire, Amundson, Barnes

Sac Out:

Miller, Salmons, Douby

Does anyone think this is realistic?

 

[SacTownKid]

I don't think I would trade Martin for Amare myself. Amare is a good scorer and all but he really isn't the guy that's going to turn around this franchise. He doesn't strike me as the type of player that could do that. The Suns were arguably better without him.

 

[Emma]

How about this:

Sac In:

Stoudemire, Amundson, Barnes

Sac Out:

Miller, Salmons, Douby

Does anyone think this is realistic?

No, they need a forward, no Douby, and our HOU pick has to be included for that to even seem interesting to Kerr.

 

[Kings Faithful]

Apparently Houston are offering Artest and Scola and maby a little extra for Amare right now. If this goes through I will officially kill myself. If it happens, the thought of having a chance at Amare Stoudamire for Artest and getting a #20+ pick, Bobby Jackson, and an unproven rookie instead will always be engraved in my mind....

 

[RKid]

Who is your source? Not questioning your honesty I just want to know.

I heard from another forum RG that the Kings and another team have contacted Kerr.

According to Yahoo sports everyone in the Suns is tradeable with the exeption of Nash. Isnt there another player the Kings may trade for aside from Amare?

 

[SacTownKid]

Apparently Houston are offering Artest and Scola and maby a little extra for Amare right now. If this goes through I will officially kill myself. If it happens, the thought of having a chance at Amare Stoudamire for Artest and getting a #20+ pick, Bobby Jackson, and an unproven rookie instead will always be engraved in my mind....

Word also is that because they can't guarantee a 1st round pick they're chances aren't very good. Hmmmm...wonder who has that pick?

Wouldn't that be funny if the Kings traded for Amare and that pick was a part of the trade. Hahaha.

 

[KingsCitizen]

If Kerr says, everyone on the Suns roster is available other than Nash. I'd rather trade Miller and Thomas for Shaq, instead of Amare.

For the SUNS:

- The Suns would never accept an offer of Miller with any package (except Thompson) for Amare. But trading for Miller for Shaq might shake up a lot for both teams.

- Even if Shaq is playing well this season. His just not a good pair with Amare. And they will never end up with the finals on that roster. Miller, however, can be a compliment to Amare's game. Plus if you have the best passing PG and the best passing Center of the league, it just adds a lot of possibilities to the offense.

- Suns still have their rookie, Robin Lopez who can play C from time to time. And Amare may just rejuvinate, considering Miller will surely have less touches than Shaq used to have.

- Miller and K9 expires have contracts with the same length as Shaq's so its almost even financially.

Now for the KINGS:

- Shaq on the Kings would not lead us to the finals or even the playoffs coz we still suck next season. But he will bring a lot of attention back to Sacramento, which what we need right now to keep the fan base. Isn't it a weird feeling that what was once the nemesis of the Kings are now playing on the team?

- He is a very big expiring in 2010, which will make us big FA contenders in 2010 but will surely be a much better player to hold us through 2010 with more charisma. And he will be a good example if we draft Thabeet. Hawes and Thompson plays the PF, while Thabeet and Shaq at the C. Now, how big is that frontline?

- Most likely, Shaq may just retire before ending the season, so the Maloofs maybe able to offer a buyout. Then we will continue to suck but in a more entertaining way than this season. Then hopefully, we will land a top 5 pick next season where Rubio, Hall, Holiday, and Walker (all good PG prospects) are expected to declare.


- Anyway, I just want to tease on the possibility of having Shaq on the Kings. It's like a payback of having Vlade retire as a Laker. LOL

 

[=LarryLegend=]

Amar'es knee scares me.......am I the only one?

 

[Bricklayer]

I think people probably have to get over the Amare knee thing -- that was three years ago, since that time he has played in 208 of 211 possible regular season games, and I think all the playoff games except the one for which he was suspended.

His attitude is a much bigger question mark than his kness at this point.

 

[Peter_Gibbons]

First off, I didn't say I wanted only franchise players. I said that's what this team needs. I also didn't say I wouldn't like a second tier star. What I said was that I don't want a second tier star who doesn't fit (in both style and pay). Also, Webber is a different player than Amare.

No one said you said that you only want a franchise player. It was just a response. Everyone has their own opinion.

I'll use Brad Miller as an example. What's wrong with Brad other than his deal? Not much. Would we be complaining if Brad was making 6 mil a year? Probably not. With Amare, he's a second rate PF ala David West. He's not a franchise player, but he wants a MAX deal and to be featured in the offense. What does that do to the team? It hampers it's ability to build a contender with those contracts and attitude. He's not a franchise player, but he wants to be treated like one with his role on the team and the zero's in his paycheck.

I don't have a problem with getting a second tier star, as long as it's one that fit into what the team is going for, and Amare doesn't fit IMO because of his play style, attitude, and contract that he wants.

Also, him being 26 is irrelevant to me considering the milage on his body and his surgery.

There is nothing wrong with Brad Miller. He's been great for many yrs for the Kings. But he is getting old, and he does have that high salary that the Kings are actively trying to get rid of. I'm suggesting that if we can get Amare for a combo of players with Miller and not give up JT, its worth it. Because the truth is the Kings are looking to get rid of Miller's contract by bringing in players with expiring contracts that are much worse than Amare as a player. If we got the Marion deal for example, we will most likely let him walk after that. So I rather get a better player. How bad can having Amare be? If he walks or we simply don't want his services after his contract, we still get the cap room that we wanted all along.

As long as we don't have to give up JT in return. But thats probably a deal breaker for Suns.

 

[Sptsjunkie]

If we can get Amare to sign an extenstion, than I think we would have to trade for him. This could be the closest we get to another Webber trade scenario.

When Webber was traded to us it was in an almost identical scenario. The Wizards had just had a dissapointing season (missed the playoffs), Webber had a bad attitude including off the court incedents, his stats were down from the previous couple of seasons, and everyone said he was allergic to contact and drifted outside as opposed to posting up.

This sounds nearly identical to Amare who is also an athletic freak. This is a definite buy low opportunity on a potential franchise player.

 

[Showtime]

If we can get Amare to sign an extenstion, than I think we would have to trade for him. This could be the closest we get to another Webber trade scenario.

When Webber was traded to us it was in an almost identical scenario. The Wizards had just had a dissapointing season (missed the playoffs), Webber had a bad attitude including off the court incedents, his stats were down from the previous couple of seasons, and everyone said he was allergic to contact and drifted outside as opposed to posting up.

This sounds nearly identical to Amare who is also an athletic freak. This is a definite buy low opportunity on a potential franchise player.

You are equating Webber to Amare, which just isn't true. In situation, there's a similarity, but the end result was due to the fact that Webber was a superior player. Just because they are in a similar situation doesn't mean the result will be the same.

There is nothing wrong with Brad Miller. He's been great for many yrs for the Kings. But he is getting old, and he does have that high salary that the Kings are actively trying to get rid of. I'm suggesting that if we can get Amare for a combo of players with Miller and not give up JT, its worth it. Because the truth is the Kings are looking to get rid of Miller's contract by bringing in players with expiring contracts that are much worse than Amare as a player. If we got the Marion deal for example, we will most likely let him walk after that. So I rather get a better player. How bad can having Amare be? If he walks or we simply don't want his services after his contract, we still get the cap room that we wanted all along.

As long as we don't have to give up JT in return. But thats probably a deal breaker for Suns.

I would think including Hawes or JT would be required, and considering their age and upside, there's no way I would do that deal.

 

[Sptsjunkie]

You are equating Webber to Amare, which just isn't true. In situation, there's a similarity, but the end result was due to the fact that Webber was a superior player. Just because they are in a similar situation doesn't mean the result will be the same.
.

I defintley don't think they are similar players. Webber had a high IQ and was more fluid. Amare is more powerful and stronger. My point is that Amare is a special talent, even if he has been unable or unwilling to tap into his full potential so far. Right now he is undervalued and if we could get him in a good deal, that would be a potential steal.

 

[vfettke]

Apparently Houston are offering Artest and Scola and maby a little extra for Amare right now. If this goes through I will officially kill myself. If it happens, the thought of having a chance at Amare Stoudamire for Artest and getting a #20+ pick, Bobby Jackson, and an unproven rookie instead will always be engraved in my mind....

But we didn't have a Scola to pair with Artest. It would've had to be Artest and Thompson to get it done if that's what they want

 

[Showtime]

I defintley don't think they are similar players. Webber had a high IQ and was more fluid. Amare is more powerful and stronger. My point is that Amare is a special talent, even if he has been unable or unwilling to tap into his full potential so far. Right now he is undervalued and if we could get him in a good deal, that would be a potential steal.

How is he undervalued? I would like to know. Amare can do one thing: score...sometimes. He's a face up player that doesn't work on the block with his back to the basket. Despite his freakish athleticism, he is a poor rebounder and defender. He built up a reputation playing with Nash in D'antoni's system, and now that the Suns play more in the halfcourt, Amare is getting exposed. He can't create a shot consistently. He isn't a facilitator on the block, so an offense can't be run through him. He's a face up scorer, who has an ego and thinks he's better than he really is. How is he undervalued?

Look at what happened to Marion. Overrated from D'antoni's offense that inflates numbers. People ignored HOW he played and only looked at the statlines. Now he's in Miami putting up Jason Thompson numbers because nobody thought to consider his game and how it would fit. The same goes for Amare. I've got nothing against him, just the peripheral factors. That's why I brought up Brad Miller. Just looking at him as a player, he's still good. It's the peripheral things like his age, contract, etc. With Amare, it's his attitude, play style, and contract.

 

[Sptsjunkie]

How is he undervalued? I would like to know. Amare can do one thing: score...sometimes. He's a face up player that doesn't work on the block with his back to the basket. Despite his freakish athleticism, he is a poor rebounder and defender. He built up a reputation playing with Nash in D'antoni's system, and now that the Suns play more in the halfcourt, Amare is getting exposed. He can't create a shot consistently. He isn't a facilitator on the block, so an offense can't be run through him. He's a face up scorer, who has an ego and thinks he's better than he really is. How is he undervalued?

Look at what happened to Marion. Overrated from D'antoni's offense that inflates numbers. People ignored HOW he played and only looked at the statlines. Now he's in Miami putting up Jason Thompson numbers because nobody thought to consider his game and how it would fit. The same goes for Amare. I've got nothing against him, just the peripheral factors. That's why I brought up Brad Miller. Just looking at him as a player, he's still good. It's the peripheral things like his age, contract, etc. With Amare, it's his attitude, play style, and contract.

I have always thought that Shawn Marion was overrated. Amare is an elite scorer who has the physical tools to be more. Even in a slower offence, playing alongside another good rebounder in Shaq, Amare is still averaging close to 10 rpg. His defence is subpar, but so was Webber's when he first came to Sac. 26 year old PFs who can score and rebound at Amare's level don't grow on trees.

 

[Section 101]

If we can get Amare to sign an extenstion, than I think we would have to trade for him. This could be the closest we get to another Webber trade scenario.

When Webber was traded to us it was in an almost identical scenario. The Wizards had just had a dissapointing season (missed the playoffs), Webber had a bad attitude including off the court incedents, his stats were down from the previous couple of seasons, and everyone said he was allergic to contact and drifted outside as opposed to posting up.

This sounds nearly identical to Amare who is also an athletic freak. This is a definite buy low opportunity on a potential franchise player.

But we gave up 2 aging vets for Webber. We are talking young players here. Now if they want Miller/thomas it's a no brainer.

 

[Sptsjunkie]

But we gave up 2 aging vets for Webber. We are talking young players here. Now if they want Miller/thomas it's a no brainer.

Like I said in the beggining, depends on who we have to give up. Obviously we will have to give up a young player, the Suns will not go for a Miller/KT package and I would be fine with that. However, I would balk if we had to start giving up multiple young player or picks.

 

[kingzallday]

Man, I would love to have Amare in Sacramento but giving up a pick, a young player, and a expiring.....I dont know. I think we should have confidence in Jason developing into a good player and maybe even a great player. The Kings just need to find a productive point guard, then we will be on the right track. I know the draft is kinda shaky this season but lets not give up yet because alot of players came out of nowhere and end up being taken high in the draft after March Madness.

A player that im going to be watching (if his team makes the Tournament) is Ben Woodside. He has great numbers but, i've never seen him play. Hopefully they beat out Oral Roberts and get into the Big Dance so I can analyze this player a bit more.

 

[Showtime]

Amare is an elite scorer who has the physical tools to be more.

I don't consider him an elite scorer. As far as pure production, he's putting up 21 PPG, which isn't top ten. As far as style, he's purely a face up scorer. He has a midrange jumper, and can finish on the pick and roll, but he can't post up anybody and create his own shot from the block consistently. How is that elite? Is David West an elite scorer? Because West averages 20 ppg and is more polished offensively. He must be an elite scorer too, right?

Even in a slower offence, playing alongside another good rebounder in Shaq, Amare is still averaging close to 10 rpg.

Amare is averaging 8.1 rebounds a game, not ten. He has proven throughout his career that he can have monster games in that department on occasion, but on a consistent basis, he's not a good rebounder. He doesn't box out or get position well at all despite his size and athleticism. He's often been called out for his lack of effort in that area. Did you know, playing in one of the fastest paced teams for years, and even playing center for a time, the highest his rebounding average he EVER has had is 9.6? He never became a good rebounder because he didn't have to in D'antoni's system.

His defence is subpar, but so was Webber's when he first came to Sac.

Once again, stop bringing up Webber. Why? Because despite whatever defensive deficiencies he had, it was offset by his superior offensive skills, production, and rebounding. Amare isn't in Webber's league offensively, and doesn't offset his deficiencies as much in that area. He does one thing well, and when he's not scoring, he's not making a difference on the floor. He's the Kevin Martin of PF's.

26 year old PFs who can score and rebound at Amare's level don't grow on trees.

Amare doesn't rebound well at all considering his abilities, and his scoring isn't elite. So, he's not that rare. Now, that is fine because he is who he is, but when he wants a franchise paycheck with a franchise role on a team when he isn't a franchise player, then I have a serious issue with that.

Once again, I don't know why there is a misunderstanding here. I have nothing against getting a player on Amare's level. I would LOVE to have a player of Amare's caliber on the team. The problem is the peripheral things. I would love an all star, but not a second tier player at his position that wants to be a franchise player with a max deal and be featured in an offense where he's not a good fit. I just can't imagine giving David West or Carlos Boozer max deals to come to Sac, let alone giving up JT or Hawes for them just for a couple years.

 

[MassachusettsKingsFan]

I was reading a suns blog and there main page mentioned about 10 or so trade rumors / ideas that would make sense for the suns .. ( according to there fans at least )

one of them was Amare for Hawes, Udrih + Filler.

I'd think we have to at least throw in houstons pick. And that still looks like were getting the better side of it IMO. If this deal is out there we sould be stupid to say no.

It looks like this has been a down year for Amare. I think its a direct result from the good year shaq is having... No shaq = more touches and more rebounds for amare .. shaq is a big dude who takes up alot of space in the paint.. I would think it would be hard playing as another big next to shaq.

Here we are as kings fans saying no to another all star. I highly doubt hawes will be better then Amare when its all said and done.

 

[Showtime]

If Hawes is dealt for Amare who leaves after a couple years, I'm done with this team until they get a new front office.