Hassan Whiteside...?!
- Thread starter Darth Divac
- Start date
So let me get this straight. You claimed earlier that Reggie Evans is a full sized PF and Thomas Robinson is not despite the fact that they have almost EXACTLY the same height, reach, wingspan and weight and are now also saying that having extra body fat is not only a good thing but that it's what makes Cousins a better player than Howard?
And I'm the one whose basketball knowledge should be questioned?
Just checking.
If you want to argue that Blake Griffin came in with a frame that could add more muscle and that Robinson's narrow shoulders and already well developed physique didn't leave much room for improvement then that's a reasonable argument. If you want to claim that Robinson never played as big as his height (largely because of poor fundamentals, footwork, lack of post moves and a tendency to drift to the perimeter) then that's a reasonable argument. But to quote the measurements and say that 3/4 of an inch is what separates ideal PF size and too undersized for the position or that a difference of four pounds equates to a "better frame" (never mind that all four of them would be fat weight since Robinson had more lean body mass than Griffin) then I can't take that arguments seriously. I was assuming you know this but (and honestly I saw this without a trace of snark in case you aren't familiar with it) body fat percentage is literally that. The percentage of your weight made up by fat. If two guys have the same weight and one has a higher body fat, the obvious implication is that (1) the other guy has more muscle and (2) at least in the NBA he's in better shape. I wouldn't argue that Stauskas has a better NBA body than KJ McDaniels just because he came into the league weighing 9 lbs more.
Kevin Durant tested out as the WORST athlete by the Combine's flawed metric, largely due to slow shuttles and a zero in the bench press. Monta Ellis did too. A player's body is only one part of the reason they succeed and fail and yet you want to make it the entirety of the reason and with incredibly steep slopes between ideal and unacceptable. And I'm generally combative with my posts but when questioned on it your response isn't to back up your opinion in any way but resort to insults and I take issue with that.
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Peter_Gibbons
Starter
Marc J. Spears ✔ @SpearsNBAYahoo
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On being cut by Kings who he plays Friday w/Miami, Hassan Whiteside: "The guys that cut me, they're not there anymore. How smart was that?"
It will very interesting to see how Cousins schools his old teammate.
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On being cut by Kings who he plays Friday w/Miami, Hassan Whiteside: "The guys that cut me, they're not there anymore. How smart was that?"
It will very interesting to see how Cousins schools his old teammate.
Darth Divac
Bench
Closer to 6'11.
Thanks funkykingston, that's more or less what I was trying to say. I was just too exasperated to type it all out.
I think it's certainly fair to question whether Thomas Robinson has the requisite skill and work ethic to succeed in the NBA as a starter. His raw athleticism and size make him a decent backup right now even if he never improves, but that's considerably less than what he was billed to be coming out of college. If you'd argued in that way 206Fan, I wouldn't have disagreed. But you seemed to have a problem only with his "size" however you choose to define that and I think a general survey of the league's PF's should show that Robinson is not in any way undersized, or at least his size is not the reason he's struggling so far. Kevin Love by most measures was one of the top 5 players in the NBA last season and he's the same height as Thomas Robinson with shorter arms. He may have more body mass but his Body Fat % was 12.9 at the pre-draft camp to Robinson's 5. I've never seen anyone try to argue that having more fat on your body makes you a better athlete than an equivalent player who's got more muscle mass. It's just nonsensical.
Let me ask you this, what position is Giannis Antetokuonmpo? At 6'11" with 7'3"+ wingspan he's taller and longer than most of the league's starting centers. At 217 lbs (give or take) he's skinnier than most of the league's wing players. He can handle the ball and pass like a guard. He can gather the ball behind the three point line, take two strides and dunk it. He doesn't fit the typical description of any position. He'll probably end up playing PF for Milwaukee with Jabari Parker at SF. Or vice-versa. Which is fine, they're both terrific young talents and they'll adjust the rest of their roster accordingly. I'm not trying to pigeonhole positions down to physical appearance. If Kevin Durant wasn't a top 5 shooter in the NBA and instead had a post game, he probably would be considered a PF. If Thomas Robinson could handle, pass, and shoot like Lebron James he probably would be considered a SF.
I wonder if the folks in the "TRob looked like a SF, he's too small" crowd have considered the possibility that the biggest reason Robinson appeared smaller to them is that he's a fluid enough athlete that he moves more like a SF. I already showed in another thread that he's the same height or taller than half of the PFs starting in the NBA this season. I'm a big believer in the eye test when it comes to scouting and evaluating talent, but when the empirical data conflicts (and physical measurements are right there in black and white) you have to be able to re-evaluate your perceptions.
"Fat on your body makes you a better athlete" said no one ever. Not even me.Thanks funkykingston, that's more or less what I was trying to say. I was just too exasperated to type it all out.
I think it's certainly fair to question whether Thomas Robinson has the requisite skill and work ethic to succeed in the NBA as a starter. His raw athleticism and size make him a decent backup right now even if he never improves, but that's considerably less than what he was billed to be coming out of college. If you'd argued in that way 206Fan, I wouldn't have disagreed. But you seemed to have a problem only with his "size" however you choose to define that and I think a general survey of the league's PF's should show that Robinson is not in any way undersized, or at least his size is not the reason he's struggling so far. Kevin Love by most measures was one of the top 5 players in the NBA last season and he's the same height as Thomas Robinson with shorter arms. He may have more body mass but his Body Fat % was 12.9 at the pre-draft camp to Robinson's 5. I've never seen anyone try to argue that having more fat on your body makes you a better athlete than an equivalent player who's got more muscle mass. It's just nonsensical.
I've always respected your opinion, but this is something you're totally incorrect about. Are we really debating whether Thomas Robinson is undersized? If you do not know that a barely 6'8 240lb Thomas Robinson isn't undersized, it really hurts the credibility of your basketball knowledge. His size has always been a weakness of his since day 1. I remember at the time of the draft, there were a lot of questions regarding his actual height and size. A lot of people thought his overall athleticism and wing span would make up for his size in the NBA, but fast forward 3 years later, we now know that is not the case. His inability to guard PFs/Cs sets him back. He doesn't have the size nor power to guard bigger opponents. Not to mention that his offense at Kansas hasn't translated to a lick of thing in the NBA.
http://basketball.realgm.com/article/226557/Learning-From-The-Kings-Thomas-Robinson-Mistake "It would be hard to find a worse fit than Robinson, an undersized big man without a consistent perimeter shot"
http://blog.chron.com/ultimaterockets/2013/02/view-from-sacramento-robinson-a-king-sized-mistake/
"...Thomas Robinson as an undersized power forward with bad hands and poor basketball instincts."
http://www.oregonlive.com/blazers/i...ers_approaching_decision_time_on_team_op.html
"For all his potential, Robinson remains an undersized power forward"
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1229694-nba-draft-2012-thomas-robinson-should-be-no-2-pick
"While 6'9'' feels a bit undersized for an NBA power forward, Robinson will make up for any perceived flaws in his stature with the type of play that led his Kansas Jayhawks to the National Championship Game."
""Thomas Robinson is the same kind of guy: undersized, big motor, but more skilled,""- NBA Executive
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1219798-2012-nba-draft-a-closer-look-at-kansas-thomas-robinson
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But of all the data you've provided, according to them, he was the most smallest. Out of all of those guys. T-Rob doesn't have the size, the actually body to guard PFs because his frame is not big enough. There are a lot of starting PFs who rebound and dunk. The thing that limits T-Rob's ceiling right now to just a big off the bench is himself. I agree with that.
The reason why T-Rob looks more like a SF is because of his body build. He is one of the most mobile 6'8+ guys in the NBA.
I have a question. Do you believe that Derrick Williams is an undersized PF?
Funny how all of those articles but one are AFTER he had a horribly disappointing rookie season. Opinions seem to change a bit once games are played. Go back and look on the draft sites for their analysis of Robinson. I don't remember anybody calling him undersized then. In fact his body was listed as a positive, even in the Draft Express analysis video. And it wasn't like he hadn't been measured at that point. His height in shoes and wingspan were measured at LeBron's camp. But he didn't play like a PF on the NBA level. We all saw that the first game of summer league. He played like a blown up SF.
Again, in every important category, Thomas Robinson is bigger than Kevin Love. Is Kevin Love undersized? Robinson was 3/4" shorter than Blake Griffin and 4lbs lighter but with a longer reach and wingspan. Is Griffin undersized? Reggie Evans came into the league both shorter AND lighter than Robinson but you claim he's got the right size for the position.
Let's be clear - I did not like the Robinson pick. I thought he was an awful PF to put next to Cousins who needed either an athletic shotblocker or a stretch 4 next to him. Feel free to go back to the draft threads from 2012. I wanted Drummond, Lillard or a trade down with Houston to net Lowry and Henson. Robinson was a terrible fit to me. So I'm not defending him as a player. And what's really funny is that I'm not even arguing that he's not relatively short for the position. What I began to argue was your claim that Blake Griffin and Reggie Evans are not undersized but yet Robinson was.
Relative to Aldridge, Bosh, even Jason Thompson Robinson is undersized. And yet he's nearly two inches taller than Kenneth Faried who plays much more of a power game despite being significantly shorter and lighter. He's slightly bigger than LeBron who Miami played at the four. It's all relative. And go back and read my first post responding to this argument. I was never arguing that Thomas Robinson was among the biggest PFs in the league. What I was taking issue with was the claim that he was undersized and yet Blake Griffin and Reggie Evans weren't.
Robinson didn't have an offensive game at Kansas. That was the big concern. No post moves, really just face up and drive or points off transition and offensive rebounds and a jumper that started improving his junior year. I saw him as a poor man's Larry Johnson at best. That was because of his game, not his size, though obviously Robinson was signficantly taller than grandmama. In fact, if the measurements from the Dream Team are to be believed, Robinson was only a quarter of an inch shorter than Karl Malone.
Again, in every important category, Thomas Robinson is bigger than Kevin Love. Is Kevin Love undersized? Robinson was 3/4" shorter than Blake Griffin and 4lbs lighter but with a longer reach and wingspan. Is Griffin undersized? Reggie Evans came into the league both shorter AND lighter than Robinson but you claim he's got the right size for the position.
Let's be clear - I did not like the Robinson pick. I thought he was an awful PF to put next to Cousins who needed either an athletic shotblocker or a stretch 4 next to him. Feel free to go back to the draft threads from 2012. I wanted Drummond, Lillard or a trade down with Houston to net Lowry and Henson. Robinson was a terrible fit to me. So I'm not defending him as a player. And what's really funny is that I'm not even arguing that he's not relatively short for the position. What I began to argue was your claim that Blake Griffin and Reggie Evans are not undersized but yet Robinson was.
Relative to Aldridge, Bosh, even Jason Thompson Robinson is undersized. And yet he's nearly two inches taller than Kenneth Faried who plays much more of a power game despite being significantly shorter and lighter. He's slightly bigger than LeBron who Miami played at the four. It's all relative. And go back and read my first post responding to this argument. I was never arguing that Thomas Robinson was among the biggest PFs in the league. What I was taking issue with was the claim that he was undersized and yet Blake Griffin and Reggie Evans weren't.
Robinson didn't have an offensive game at Kansas. That was the big concern. No post moves, really just face up and drive or points off transition and offensive rebounds and a jumper that started improving his junior year. I saw him as a poor man's Larry Johnson at best. That was because of his game, not his size, though obviously Robinson was signficantly taller than grandmama. In fact, if the measurements from the Dream Team are to be believed, Robinson was only a quarter of an inch shorter than Karl Malone.
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When I said guys like Reggie Evans actually had the size weight, frame, and etc, I meant to guard larger opponents and actual PF size players.. I think everyone in the NBA knows that Reggie Evans is an undersized PF/C. Blake Griffin is not undersized.
Robinson is 6'8.75 in shoes, let's just give him 6'9. Well, Griffin is 6'8.5 without shoes. There's a difference between every inch. Thomas Robinson and Blake Griffin do not have the same build nor body type.
Both Reggie and T-Rob are undersized for a PF. Reggie is undersized because he's too short, but he has the actually body frame. T-Rob is undersized because he's short, and doesn't have the body frame. He's pure muscle and athleticism, and he's always needed to add more mass to his frame and figure. That's the main reason why he's undersized.
This is something I don't see you agreeing on, but it's really unusual if you believe that Blake Griffin is undersized considering he's never been faulted for being undersized.
Size was something that was a weakness for T-Rob as I edited in earlier. There were question marks around his size, but people thought his wing span and various other measurements would help cover it.
Edit: I don't believe that he can actually play PF in the NBA because of his actual all around size. He has difficulty posting up, partly because of his skills, and size.
I think we both can agree on the fact that T-Rob lacks skills in the NBA. Part of that may be due to the fact that he may be a tweener. We saw a glimpse of a jumper at Kansas, but it seemed like he went away from it and tried to improve on his post game in the NBA. His only production for any NBA team is a big off the bench to provide a small bit of spark.
Irony of the draft? Everyone said T-Rob was the most NBA ready, while Drummond was going to be a project for teams.
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See, that's a much more reasonable post than what you said earlier. You can understand the cognitive dissonance that arises when someone claims that Reggie Evans isn't undersized but a guy taller than him is. Or that body fat is part of what separates Boogie and Dwight.
Jerry Krause thought Elton Brand would play bigger than his height due to his reach and wingspan. For the most part he was right. Thomas Robinson was half an inch taller and had a greater reach and nearly the same wingspan. The difference is that Robinson didn't play bigger than his height. In fact he played significantly smaller. I don't think he had an ideal frame (more of a beach body than a basketball body) but honestly I would think the same of Serge Ibaka and he's been able to succeed.
I never thought Blake was undersized. Nor Kevin Love who came into the league shorter and weaker than Robinson. And while I'd say Robinson IS on the lower end of what I'd consider the normal height range of a PF (around 6'8" to 6'11") I don't hold that out as a reason why Robinson didn't succeed. He was plenty big and strong enough. In fact, he rarely got backed down in the post if you watched him in man defense. What did happen (way to often) is that he'd be totally out of position and let his man catch the ball way too deep. Chuck Hayes is undersized (6'5.5" in bare feet IIRC) but he's one of the better post defenders in the league. Part of that IS frame as he's got a low center of gravity and strong legs and Robinson isn't built like that at all, but the other part of that is knowing how to play to your strengths. If Robinson had come out like the second coming of Karl Malone (and the Mailman as a rookie wasn't significantly bigger/stronger than Robinson) nobody would have talked about him being undersized. It was BECAUSE of how he played that it came to be part of the book on Robinson.
Again, I'm not defending Robinson. But let's be honest - it wasn't a half inch of height or 5 extra pounds that meant the difference between being an all-star or a guy who bounced around the league. Is he on the shorter end of the PF range? Sure. But honestly so is Blake. And Love. And Vonleh and Evans and Randolph. And that's without getting all the way down to LJ, Barkley who were both 6'4"-6'5" and all stars. I guess it's a sliding scale but I don't think 6'8" is undersized. Not if the dude can play.
Jerry Krause thought Elton Brand would play bigger than his height due to his reach and wingspan. For the most part he was right. Thomas Robinson was half an inch taller and had a greater reach and nearly the same wingspan. The difference is that Robinson didn't play bigger than his height. In fact he played significantly smaller. I don't think he had an ideal frame (more of a beach body than a basketball body) but honestly I would think the same of Serge Ibaka and he's been able to succeed.
I never thought Blake was undersized. Nor Kevin Love who came into the league shorter and weaker than Robinson. And while I'd say Robinson IS on the lower end of what I'd consider the normal height range of a PF (around 6'8" to 6'11") I don't hold that out as a reason why Robinson didn't succeed. He was plenty big and strong enough. In fact, he rarely got backed down in the post if you watched him in man defense. What did happen (way to often) is that he'd be totally out of position and let his man catch the ball way too deep. Chuck Hayes is undersized (6'5.5" in bare feet IIRC) but he's one of the better post defenders in the league. Part of that IS frame as he's got a low center of gravity and strong legs and Robinson isn't built like that at all, but the other part of that is knowing how to play to your strengths. If Robinson had come out like the second coming of Karl Malone (and the Mailman as a rookie wasn't significantly bigger/stronger than Robinson) nobody would have talked about him being undersized. It was BECAUSE of how he played that it came to be part of the book on Robinson.
Again, I'm not defending Robinson. But let's be honest - it wasn't a half inch of height or 5 extra pounds that meant the difference between being an all-star or a guy who bounced around the league. Is he on the shorter end of the PF range? Sure. But honestly so is Blake. And Love. And Vonleh and Evans and Randolph. And that's without getting all the way down to LJ, Barkley who were both 6'4"-6'5" and all stars. I guess it's a sliding scale but I don't think 6'8" is undersized. Not if the dude can play.
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Glenn
Hall of Famer
TRob frequently seemed a bit lost on the court. Given what has happened with Hassan and BennyMac, I wonder if having a little patience would have been worth it. Hassan and TRob didn't seem to understand the game and Hassan had "jumper's knee' - patellar tendonitis.
I suspect it is almost impossible to hold onto a non-productive draft pick for 4 years but if we had been able to do that with Hassan, it would have been great.
Now you're just getting silly.
I posted a long list of heights already and linked to them in my earlier post (this one -- click it, it's a link to a link
). At the time I suggested that less than an inch of height is not that big of a factor and if you look at these guys heights barefoot (which is the only way to compare them all equally) there are very few PFs that are significantly taller than 6'9" and skilled enough to pose a problem for a shorter defender. I believe the list was LaMarcus Aldridge, Anthony Davis, and Nene. Then you said that it wasn't about height, it was about weight so I compiled a new list of PFs everybody knows who are the same height or taller than Robinson and similar weight or skinnier. Your comments about Reggie Evans "Guys like Reggie Evans actually have the size, body shape, fat, and weight wise." seemed to me to imply that a higher body fat% was seen by you as a positive. Considering they're physically identical in nearly every way, I don't see how else you expected me to take that.Regarding Derrick Williams, I have always maintained that he's a SF who can play some PF in certain situations but really needs to focus on his jumpshot, ball skills, and perimeter defense because he's not skilled enough in the post to be a full-time PF.
We could play this game all day. Robinson is 6'7.75" barefoot. Kevin Love is 6'7.75" barefoot. Robinson is 6'8.75" in shoes. Kevin Love is 6'9.5" in shoes. Wait, what? This is why I never use the listed "in shoes" measurement. It's complete nonsense. If you actually want to compare heights, you should use the measurement which is actually accurate -- the barefoot one. Blake Griffin is 6'8.5" barefoot. That's 3/4 of an inch taller than Robinson. You want to argue that the difference between "full-sized" and "undersized" is less than an inch? Come on, that's ridiculous. Not to mention entirely arbitrary. I know there's still a general perception that 6'10" is full-sized for a PF, but take a look around. That's really an outdated perception. Guys 6'10" are starting at C for a lot of teams now. 6'9" is the new average height for the PF position.
I don't actually think Blake Griffin is undersized. I do think that anyone who believes 3/4" of height and 5 or 6 lbs of "body mass" is the difference between undersized and full-sized is grasping at straws. That's what I've been trying to make you realize. Think about this for a minute. Let's say you're 6' and weigh 165lbs and I'm 6'3/4" and weigh 170lbs. Is one of us substantially bigger than the other? Does one of us have a significant advantage on a basketball court which derives from our physical attributes? This is what we're talking about here. Now I could put on shoes which make me 6'2.5" and call myself 6'3" and your perception of me might change, but did the reality of the situation actually change? Obviously not.
Whether you say it or some other internet commentator or free-lance journalist says it makes little difference to me. Re-read that last paragraph again. That's what we're talking about. It's a common fallacy that gets passed around like truth and I'm sorry to say, you seem to have fallen for it. Once the term "undersized" gets associated with a guy (and it's really just PFs and PGs for some reason) it sticks to them like a plague no matter how inaccurate until they prove otherwise.
Also there's a lot of equivocating going on in these articles. Sometimes when people say "undersized" what they actually mean is that the player in question is not "ideal size". If the perfect PF is 6'10" or taller and a guy is 6'9" he may not be below average for the position, but he fails to attain the Platonic ideal of PF height. Like I said, it's arbitrary and stupid in my opinion. List the measurements, talk about skillsets, and let the guy's play on the court speak for itself.
There's a lot of different ways to go with this, I'm just going to bring up Kevin Love again. Nothing about his physical attributes impress. But when you watch him play he's got tenacity to him. He doesn't wait for the ball to come to him, he goes out and gets it. That's what allows him to pull down 20 boards against frontlines which almost always stand taller than him. He had a bit of a jumper in college and now he's full-on three point threat unmatched at his position.
I see something in Robinson's game that makes me think he's better than a 15 minute warm body off the bench. A lot of people disagree, which is fine. I don't have any problem with disagreements of this kind. But don't tell me a guy is destined to fail because of his size when there are countless examples of players who fail the same "perfect size and weight" test and dominated regardless. For some players it really is about their physical limitations. But those are extreme cases. A guy who's 6'4" and dominated at PF at a smaller school for instance but doesn't have the skills to play on the perimeter in the taller, more physical NBA. When we're talking about fractions of an inch, body fat index, and perceived "body mass" and/or skeletal structure somebody is trying really hard to create an issue out of something which is not really an issue.
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What are you even talking about? Cousins does not have more "meat" than Dwight Howard. He has more post-scoring talent in his pinky than Howard has in his entire body. That's why Cousins can bully opponents down low and the baskets go in while Howard generally does most of his "bullying" from the free throw line.
Also, your "body type" argument is ridiculous.
This is Blake at Oklahoma:
This is Blake now:
What's the difference? 6 years of work in an NBA weight room. It's not body type.
This is Thomas Robinson at Kansas:
If anything, he's got a more NBA ready body than Blake did at the same age.
Here he is in year 3 of his NBA career:
This is not a lanky player.
Or if you prefer:
EDIT: All bullcrap aside, I think you watched 40 games of Thomas Robinson in his rookie season and made up your mind about what kind of player he was going to be. You've thrown out all sorts of potential justifications, but honestly isn't that really what this is about? Try being a little more open-minded about young players. It's more fun for one thing, and you'll be ahead of the curve when the rest of the league finally gets around to praising a player that you've known about all along. I might be wrong about Robinson in the end, but I'm going to wait for him to prove me wrong, not anyone else.
Same with Hassan for that matter, who's doing a good job right now of proving all the doubters wrong. (I'm at least trying to get things back on topic.)
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bajaden
Hall of Famer
I'm not going to get into this debate about who is undersized and whose not. All that matters is whether you can play or not. Robinson coming out of Kansas simply lacked the skills necessary to succeed. I thought that perhaps he could be a hustle player like Faried, but he didn't have that mentality. Unlike Faried, he didn't seem to realize his limitations, and that's a weakness. Knowing what you can and can't do is important. It appears that he's progressed since then. However I'm not sure he's what were looking for. When it comes to athleticism, skill set, and overall size, I don't see a lot of difference between Robinson and D. Will.
What are you even talking about? Cousins does not have more "meat" than Dwight Howard. He has more post-scoring talent in his pinky than Howard has in his entire body. That's why Cousins can bully opponents down low and the baskets go in while Howard generally does most of his "bullying" from the free throw line.
Also, your "body type" argument is ridiculous.
This is Blake at Oklahoma:
This is Blake now:
What's the difference? 6 years of work in an NBA weight room. It's not body type.
This is Thomas Robinson at Kansas:
If anything, he's got a more NBA ready body than Blake did at the same age.
Here he is in year 3 of his NBA career:
This is not a lanky player.
Or if you prefer:
EDIT: All bullpoopoo aside, I think you watched 40 games of Thomas Robinson in his rookie season and made up your mind about what kind of player he was going to be. You've thrown out all sorts of potential justifications, but honestly isn't that really what this is about? Try being a little more open-minded about young players. It's more fun for one thing, and you'll be ahead of the curve when the rest of the league finally gets around to praising a player that you've known about all along. I might be wrong about Robinson in the end, but I'm going to wait for him to prove me wrong, not anyone else.
Same with Hassan for that matter, who's doing a good job right now of proving all the doubters wrong. (I'm at least trying to get things back on topic.)
It doesn't matter what they look like next to each other. It's about the way they play. Ben Wallace wasn't the biggest guy in the world but he played like he was. Other than rebounding, Robinson plays much smaller than he actually is.
You fill your team up with the Robinson's and Whiteside's of the world and I'll build mine up with players with known skills and we'll see who wins. You're going to end up with one Whiteside that develops and a roster full of D-League level guys.
As a fan base, we're trying to see this team win. Getting a guy like Robinson is just watching them spin their wheels. Like I said before, the odds of Whiteside turning out to be a decent NBA player were very low but he's proving the doubters wrong. That's great for him. He has a high ceiling based on his body size alone. Robinson doesn't have that so he needs real skills which he has shown no real improvement in yet. The most "NBA ready" guy in that draft class still isn't ready 3 years later.
Are rebounding and shotblocking not known skills? I don't need a team of twelve rebounders and shotblockers but I sure as hell do need some of those guys.
William Blake
Bench
Good insight from Chad Ford into why he didn´t make it in his first NBA try:
A number of teams reported to me that their interviews with Whiteside were rocky. I can understand why. In the first 15 minutes or so I spent with him one-on-one he projected a confidence that bordered on naïve arrogance. He compared himself to everyone from Dwight Howard to Hakeem Olajuwon (with whom he spent a week training), complained about where I had him on my mock draft (No. 14 to the Rockets) and was insulted that our scouting report didn’t have more on his 3-point shooting ability.
A number of teams reported to me that their interviews with Whiteside were rocky. I can understand why. In the first 15 minutes or so I spent with him one-on-one he projected a confidence that bordered on naïve arrogance. He compared himself to everyone from Dwight Howard to Hakeem Olajuwon (with whom he spent a week training), complained about where I had him on my mock draft (No. 14 to the Rockets) and was insulted that our scouting report didn’t have more on his 3-point shooting ability.
Who are we talking about here, Robinson or Whiteside?
We're doing no better or worse whether Reggie Evans plays or not. One trick ponies rarely make it in the NBA. Even when that one trick is elite, it doesn't always translate to success. Fredette can shoot. Thomas can rebound. Neither make their teams better.
Like I said before, Whiteside is an extremely rare case (and the case is still out). For every 50 Whitesides you take a flyer on, maybe 1 or 2 pan out as legit NBA players.
I'm talking about our current team. We don't need to be taking on any more one trick ponies and we don't need to take on guys who have an extremely small chance of making it even though their ceiling is sky high. We need guys with multiple skills that fit together. I'll take more Darren Collisons. Guys that are a jack of many trades but masters of none, over a bunch of Robinson/Whiteside type players.
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
Sean Cunningham @News10Sean 3m3 minutes agoCaught up with Hassan Whiteside before the game. Will share the conversation. Trust me when I say, the guy has matured a ton. Happy for him
LoungeLizard
Starter
Putting on a clinic...
14 pts 13 boards and 11 BLOCKS!!!
14 pts 13 boards and 11 BLOCKS!!!
theclash4u5
Starter
People are surprised that a former King is playing better elsewhere? What else is new?
Dreadnought
Bench
Do we actually know he had a lack of effort?
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