Grades v. Thunder 03/07/10

Assuming we add a major piece this summer, what position would you like them to play?

  • Center

    Votes: 87 83.7%
  • Power Forward

    Votes: 8 7.7%
  • Small Forward

    Votes: 1 1.0%
  • Shooting Guard

    Votes: 4 3.8%
  • Point Guard

    Votes: 4 3.8%

  • Total voters
    104
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Capt. Factorial

trifolium contra tempestatem subrigere certum est
Staff member
#61
I'm not sure these results are for several games or just last nights game.
They're just last night's game. I would be very careful when trying to draw conclusions from a single game played against one of the better rebounding teams in the league. I think it's fair to say Hawes didn't have a great rebounding night last night. I think it's fair to say that Hawes has been a disappointing rebounder overall for the whole season. But that sample size is way too small to draw any reasonable conclusions from.
 
#62
They're just last night's game. I would be very careful when trying to draw conclusions from a single game played against one of the better rebounding teams in the league. I think it's fair to say Hawes didn't have a great rebounding night last night. I think it's fair to say that Hawes has been a disappointing rebounder overall for the whole season. But that sample size is way too small to draw any reasonable conclusions from.
I'll say this about Hawes: Aside from a block and a nice post move, he didn't contribute anything last night. ANYTHING. I don't know where he was for most of the game.
 

Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
#63
I'll say this about Hawes: Aside from a block and a nice post move, he didn't contribute anything last night. ANYTHING. I don't know where he was for most of the game.
On the bench as JT, Landry and Noce(?), and even Dom McGuire took his minutes.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#65
I've only seen them play a few times this year, but if they're the #4 rebounding team, then it's not because they are just incredible rebounders. Westbrook and Durant are both obviously above average rebounders for their positions, but does that make up for Krstic and Collison, who barely average ten rebounds a game between the two of them? I guess so. But the only reason they beat us on the glass last night is that they hustled more, plain and simple. I didn't come away from that game thinking "we've got to get better rebounders." I was thinking "we've got to work harder."
I would agree. Apparently the Thunder must hustle all the time to maintain being the fourth best in the league. The game last night was a replay of the last game we played against them as far as rebounding goes. I did think that our rebounding improved when Thompson and Landry were on the floor together. Its hard to believe that Krstic can grab 10 boards and Hawes can only grab 2.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#66
They're just last night's game. I would be very careful when trying to draw conclusions from a single game played against one of the better rebounding teams in the league. I think it's fair to say Hawes didn't have a great rebounding night last night. I think it's fair to say that Hawes has been a disappointing rebounder overall for the whole season. But that sample size is way too small to draw any reasonable conclusions from.
Yeah if it was just for one game, then I agree. It doesn't make my frustration with Hawes any less though. If I thought he wasn't capable that would be one thing. But when you know he's capable of more, it just drives you crazy. I was sitting there last night thinking to myself. When was the last time I saw Hawes diving for a loose ball. Or flat on his back on the floor for any reason. He has all the right facial expressions. Just not the results.
 

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#67
I stole some interesting stats from another site that will remain nameless. I won't go into all the details, but it has to do with defensive rebounding percentage. The league average is 73%.

A combination of Hawes and Landry = 56% defensive rebounding.
A combination of Hawes and Thompson = 20% defensive rebounding
A combination of Thompson and Landry = 72% defensive rebounding.

A combination of Thompson, Landry, Udoka, Evans, and Udrih was the best combination on the Kings. Somehow they came up with a 100% defensive rebounding result. Not sure how they arrived at that figure, because it seems almost impossible to me. But non the less thats the best rebounding combination the Kings have.

I'm not sure these results are for several games or just last nights game. But the question that looms is why is Thompson a good rebounder with just about anyone else on the team but Hawes. I'm sure there's an answer in this mess, but I don't know what it is.

I do know this though. Both Thompson and Landry are very good at blocking out, and both are good at tipping the ball and keeping it alive. Both are very aggressive at going after the ball. I keyed in on Hawes last night. He doesn't block out at all at times. When he's under the basket with Thompson, he tends to become a spectator instead of going after the ball. Perhaps that explains the poor percentage between them. When he was on the floor with Landry he became a little more aggessive. I saw several times where Landry or Thompson tipped the ball to a teammate. Not so with Hawes.

All in all Hawes is very frustrating to watch at times. On at least four occasions he had position and instead of going up after the ball he waited for the ball to come to him. In everyone of those occasions Krstic jumped and reached over him for the rebound. I have no explaination for what goes on in Hawes mind. But if he has an aggression button, he needs to push it before every game..
Regarding Thompson and Hawes, it depends where Thompson plays. If he plays with Landry, he's the center and he's getting more defensive rebs because of his position on the floor. If he plays with Hawes, then he's the pf and he's further away from the basket. I'm not exactly sure about the Hawes/Landry combo. Landry is pretty quick. Maybe he can make up some ground from the pf position whereas Thompson can't get there.

I wish Westphal would have tried that mega-lineup in the OKC game. It makes perfect sense. Put Tyreke at the 3. He could guard Greene. If the Kings get some ultra quick guards, they could at times do a lineup with the ultra-quicks in the backcourt and Tyreke at the 3. Right now they don't have the personnel.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#68
Regarding Thompson and Hawes, it depends where Thompson plays. If he plays with Landry, he's the center and he's getting more defensive rebs because of his position on the floor. If he plays with Hawes, then he's the pf and he's further away from the basket. I'm not exactly sure about the Hawes/Landry combo. Landry is pretty quick. Maybe he can make up some ground from the pf position whereas Thompson can't get there.

I wish Westphal would have tried that mega-lineup in the OKC game. It makes perfect sense. Put Tyreke at the 3. He could guard Greene. If the Kings get some ultra quick guards, they could at times do a lineup with the ultra-quicks in the backcourt and Tyreke at the 3. Right now they don't have the personnel.
I hope putting Reke at the three isn't supposed to solve our rebounding woes? One of our few rebounding advantages is having him at the PG.
 
#69
Yeah, I don't get how that qualifies as a "mega lineup." Sounds like small ball to me...

A "mega lineup" for last night would have been Reke, Greene, Landry, Thompson, Hawes. That's as big as we could get. Put Casspi in for Greene, and it might be a little better rebounding group.
 
#70
I still think the palace brawl became what it was because the fans in that game were complete douchebags... Ben Wallace is nuts too. Seriously, what kind of retarded fans start throwing stuff at players over a small "fight" that was started by their own player pushing Artest? Ron was at fault for going into the stands and punching fans but I can understand the emotions he was going through, when you're trying to cool off and someone throws something at you it'll get you really mad and irrational. The best part is fans continued to run on court taunting the pacers ... only to get punched. They truly are not a very bright bunch
 
#71
I'm curious as to what will happen to Reke should we bring in someone like Bosh this Summer, who is an obvious star as well...Reke is the franchise right now, but how will his game/role/mentality change should we land a marquis free agent this offseason??
 
#72
On a side note, there was a steal by Evans that resulted in a fast break where Tyreke stole the ball in the front court and it was 2 on one with Udoka and Tyreke. 'Reke took the ball all the way to the rim and it was partially deflected by the defender (looked like Evans got fouled no call). Udoka, who was totally open the whole time grabbed the deflection and put it in for a +1. The Camera was on Udoka right after the play and you could read his lips as he said "Pass the Ball !" Looking at 'Reke. Did Tyreke take it all the way because he thought that Udoka would screw up a layup too, or is Tyreke trying to pad his numbers? Anyway, that is very odd that Tyreke would not pass it because Udoka really was wide open and 'Reke missed the shot because the defender was playing him all the way. He must not think much of Udoka to force the ball up through a defender to the rim rather than chance passing it to a player who was wide open and had an easy layup.
Yea, I saw that too because I was yelling pass him the ball. There were also a couple of plays to where Tyreke didn't give the ball up and Garcia was WIDE open for a corner 3. You could hear Garcia clapping his hands loud. Another play was Hawes was open down low but Tyreke didn't pass the ball, instead he shot a jumper and missed.

I know he will learn because he is young.
 

Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
#73
Yea, I saw that too because I was yelling pass him the ball. There were also a couple of plays to where Tyreke didn't give the ball up and Garcia was WIDE open for a corner 3. You could hear Garcia clapping his hands loud. Another play was Hawes was open down low but Tyreke didn't pass the ball, instead he shot a jumper and missed.

I know he will learn because he is young.

Ba humbug. Rubio
 
#76
only got to see the last 5mins of this game... looked competitive... but dang Spencer Hawes with 2 boards in 24mins..... hmm...

i'll leave it at that.

Good to see Evans bounce back in a big way.

other than the obvious weaknesses... this team of ours is exciting and its nice to have all these close games
Assuming we add a major piece this summer, what position would you like them to play?

CENTER = 83%

I think you won this thread again. :D

Just like you, a lot of us seems wanting an upgrade at the center position too. That means among the starter players we have now in every position, Hawes is the worst in doing his job.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#83
Relevant to the grading theme:
[yt=Sportsmanship Fail]KrYyJL6N4EA[/yt]

Heh -- liked that second one especially.


Just for kicks I played one season of soccer in a city league. Now I consider soccer mostly a weenie non-contact sport, but I manage to make anything I play into a contact sport. I made tennis into a contact sport. I would probably find a way to throw an elbow in competitive poker. But these guys were amazing. Entire league was filled with chain smoking latino guys, maybe late 20s, 30s, some in their 40s. And it was dirty. I mean DIRTY. Elbows were flying, every slide tackle left cleat marks somewhere on you, guys were kicked in the groin, if you came up to challenge you had to be careful because they WOULD cheerfully kick the ball right into your face. In order to get carded in that league you actually had to kill somebody. Not even sure then. Maybe if you ate them afterward.
 
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#84
I was a very dirty soccer player and one of the other kid's dad used to always tell me how he loved how sneaky I was with my elbows. Then one day the ref didn't show and he volunteered to jump in. I was red carded in about 10 minutes. Sometimes being impartial sucks.

What about the Danny Ainge fight? Perhaps my first fight memory in basketball as a kid.
 
K

Kingsguy881

Guest
#87
Dude soccer is brutal! Another brutal sport that you just don't know how rough it is until you play it? Water Polo. That sport is VICIOUS! Especially when you play with women. Women love to kick a guys nuts, they will literally try to drown you with groin shots. Rio Americano's girls team used to practice with us sometimes (Jesuit is where I went). Man, those girls were the toughest chicks I ever met in my life. Protect your nuts!!!
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#88
Heh -- liked that second one especially.


Just for kicks I played one season of soccer in a city league. Now I consider soccer mostly a weenie non-contact sport, but I manage to make anything I play into a contact sport. I made tennis into a contact sport. I would probably find a way to throw an elbow in competitive poker. But these guys were amazing. Entire league was filled with chain smoking latino guys, maybe late 20s, 30s, some in their 40s. And it was dirty. I mean DIRTY. Elbows were flying, every slide tackle left cleat marks somewhere on you, guys were kicked in the groin, if you came up to challenge you had to be careful because they WOULD cheerfully kick the ball right into your face. In order to get carded in that league you actually had to kill somebody. Not even sure then. Maybe if you ate them afterward.
Soccer was a big sport in St. Louis when I went to school. I believe our Kuttis team once repesented our country. I learned quickly that the knee is meant to bend only one way. By the way, I suffered more injuries playing tennis than any other sport I ever played. I pulled groin muscles. Hyperextended my knee. Tore a ligiment in my elbow and tore my rotator cuff. Not all at the same time of course. It was back to baseball for me..
 
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