[Grades] Grades v. Bulls 2/3/2016 (with actual grades included)

[RichieInRocklin]

Good points. But even when you slow down the pace of your own offense, you don't change the way teams are defending us. Slowing down the offense and grinding it out in the halfcourt needs incredible efficiency. With the way teams are defending today, every missed posession will hurt you, while every TO and missed shot might lead to a 3 on the other side of the court.
The whole idea of playing fast is, that it is easier to score against a defense struggling to set up correctly. Scoring in the halfcourt may be less efficient and slowing down on purpose will hinder the ability to go on quick runs.

IMHO I think is not an either/or situation. If you get the opportunity to run fast pace, then you do it. If the opportunity doesn't exist, then you go into your half-court offense and work real hard on good spacing and passing. The problem with the Kings, I feel, is their inconsistancy on defense!! They can't/won't play good defense for a full 4 quarters. And I agree that the coaching staff has been very inconsistant also

 

[Livinthedream]

I stopped being invested when in the Grizzlies presser, Karl said our poor defense was a result of bad offense. He said we defend better after a made basket. That said it all right there and all hope went away that something may change in his approach. He will try to use offensive point totals to overcome defensive weakness. Never factoring in that strong defense leads to easy baskets. Or good, patient offensive sets can lead to better efficiency as well as grind down your opponents and take away their energy to play offense.

As long as Karl is coaching, I won't be fully invested. Even if we start winning regular seasons games. Because I know those wins will be built on a shaky foundation that will get exposed when we play games that matter.

 

[dude12]

Karl wouldn't know defense if it walked up to him and slapped him in the face.

 

[dude12]

https://twitter.com/hpbasketball/status/695149915123507201

Words of wisdom




Hardwood Paroxysm ‏@HPbasketball
This is Michael Malone on Cousins, from a question @dempseypost asked about Cousins.

 

[kingjatt]

Troy Daniels got a DNP last night. A night that the Hornets were missing Kemba Walker. The same Troy Daniels that killed us last week.

George has got to stop with this Darren-Rondo lineup mess. Teams are specifically picking on those two and just shoot right over the top. Collision should be in for 12-15 mins a game while Rondo is resting only.

And I dont care how many fancy jumpers Belineli hits he is a net negative out there on the floor because he cannot defend/help defend at all. He should be a 10-14 min guy or only out there to spread the floor late in a game. George is insane if he thinks going small with Beli at the 3 and Darren at the 2 is going to work in this league. That combo is killing us everynight.

 

[biltalent]

Non shooting bigs on the Spurs? Now this caught me a bit off guard.

I should have used the term "non-stretch big" to be more precise.
What I was trying to say is that you can post up one big while the other is on the opposite block and this does not kill your spacing. On the other hand you can have four 3-point shooters and still no spacing aka the way we post up Cousins (with Casspi at the 4)

 

[mac]

I should have used the term "non-stretch big" to be more precise.
What I was trying to say is that you can post up one big while the other is on the opposite block and this does not kill your spacing. On the other hand you can have four 3-point shooters and still no spacing aka the way we post up Cousins (with Casspi at the 4)

The way I see it it depends on how you're posting up that big though. A guy like Cousins wants to get right to the rim, right under the rim. You can't have a big on the opposite block then or Cousins will get trapped under the rim. If you're posting a Pau Gasol then it's a different story, because he can turn away from the basket and score, and is also a much better passer.

To your earlier post, I don't disagree that you can't incorporate post play and 3 point shooting. In fact, that's what I'm trying to advocate in saying that we don't have good 3 point shooters to complement Cousins. I also agree that it would be great if we could have more off the ball movement, better screening etc. But I also think good ball movement is a product of guys being threats to shoot the ball. That's why the Hawks and Spurs and Warriors are so good at it. If Cousins kicks it out to an open Rondo or WCS the defense is not going to start scrambling to close out. With our current roster all teams have to do is double or triple team Cousins once he puts the ball down, and what will usually result is a TO, a bad Cousins shot or Rondo open for an outside shot.

 

[biltalent]

The way I see it it depends on how you're posting up that big though. A guy like Cousins wants to get right to the rim, right under the rim. You can't have a big on the opposite block then or Cousins will get trapped under the rim. If you're posting a Pau Gasol then it's a different story, because he can turn away from the basket and score, and is also a much better passer.

To your earlier post, I don't disagree that you can't incorporate post play and 3 point shooting. In fact, that's what I'm trying to advocate in saying that we don't have good 3 point shooters to complement Cousins. I also agree that it would be great if we could have more off the ball movement, better screening etc. But I also think good ball movement is a product of guys being threats to shoot the ball. That's why the Hawks and Spurs and Warriors are so good at it. If Cousins kicks it out to an open Rondo or WCS the defense is not going to start scrambling to close out. With our current roster all teams have to do is double or triple team Cousins once he puts the ball down, and what will usually result is a TO, a bad Cousins shot or Rondo open for an outside shot.

Very good point! Thats why I would like us to get Ryan Anderson and more of a 3 point shooter than Collison as back up PG so we can mix it up a bit

 

[ArcoKings]

I was fooled again by the Kings. During our brief five game winning streak I thought the team was steering the ship in the right direction. The team hasn't been the same since. Last night's loss was very disappointing. Karl does not animate his players. Karl has no energy. He's very stale.

Coach Karl will finish the season but I'm doubting his return next season. The ownership needs to give Vlade the green light to pick HIS coach.

 

[pshn80]

Last 6:16 of 4th Q:
Kings scoring
Cuz. 8pts
Marco 5
Collisn. 2
Rondo. 2
Total. 17pts

Summary of Shots Missed and TOs:
TOs. FTs. 3PTers. 2PTers
Cuz. 2. 3. 2. 2
Marco. - 1. 1. -
Darren. - - - 1
Rondo. - - - 1

We scored 17 but we missed shots worth 21. You can slice this info many ways but one is: w/o Cuz we scored 9 and missed shots worth 8.

Note: sorry about my chart but it was too hard doing to try and correct. Sort of like the end of our game last night.

 

[kupman]

Stick a fork in them - this team is done!

Feel free to stick a fork in me as well because I am done with this team.

 

[VF21]

Feel free to stick a fork in me as well because I am done with this team.

I hope you come back when things improve.

 

[SacKings384]

I too noticed that the board is very negative during games (myself included). I think it has to do with poor starts to the game. Sort of a "here we go again" type thing. At the end of the day, what I'm not seeing is EFFORT. The defensive scheme is atrocious. I feel like Karl has completely lost the team. You could probably just throw this team out there without a coach and at least defensively probably play just as well if not better. It's really hard to tune in and watch when you feel like the team isn't giving it 100%, and the defensive side is so pathetic it's almost painful.

 

[kupman]

I hope you come back when things improve.

Don't get me wrong, I am not going anywhere. I still watch every minute of every game ( I may have an illness). I am simply ready for big changes and that can include the roster and/or coaching. This team irks the heck out of me like no other team before.

 

[Bricklayer]

Well, I mean, that's the thing isn't it? What do you need to win games in the league right now? Look at the list of top scorers in the league and their team's record:

1. Stephen Curry (45-4)
2. James Harden (26-25)
3. Kevin Durant (38-13)
4. DeMarcus Cousins (21-28)
5. Lebron James (35-13)
6. Russell Westbrook (38-13)
7. Damian Lillard (24-26)
8. DeMar DeRozan (33-16)
9. Paul George (26-23)
10. Anthony Davis (18-30)

Only Sacramento, Portland, and New Orleans can't find a way to win with top 10 scorers on the team. Portland gutted their team and replaced their vets with young unproven players and they're still winning more than we are. New Orleans has the same mix of good offense and terrible defense that we have. You can keep going down the list if you want to. Is IfAt1st right that the current rule set punishes post play and rewards teams with perimeter stars? If that's the case don't you need to cash in on your Anthony Davis or DeMarcus Cousins right now and get yourself an elite wing instead? Let's get real here and consider the possibility that everyone else is right, maybe dominant big men are done and you can't win that way. Maybe it's not George Karl's fault, we just need more shooters, more wings who can hit threes and we'll be right at the top of the standings too...

I think you could try to make an argument that it's impossible to win in the league right now without elite 3pt shooting. Golden State and San Antonio are the best shooting teams by far and they're lapping the pack. I would counter though that we're not even trying to eschew the long ball, so it doesn't make a lot of sense to use our lack of success to justify it. We shot more 3 pointers than free throws today. On our home court, with Boogie Cousins and Rudy Gay on our team. Against Milwaukee it was 26 3pt attempts and 30 free throw attempts. The Memphis game was a more sensible mix, but in the loss to New Orleans we shot 28 threes and only 20 free throws. We're letting 'em fly along with the league trend and our team 3pt% is tied for 9th out of 30. So what is actually going on here? I honestly don't know. I'm not enough of a rules expert to differentiate between correlation and causation here. But I do know that you're not going to win a lot when you allow the other team to score 108 points a game and that's one aspect of the game that we should have some control over.

You're not the first one I've seen arguing that Rajon Rondo is hurting the team. He's shooting 36% from three this season though, which is hardly as awful as people make him out to be. If defenders are leaving him wide open, good! Only Omri Casspi and Seth Curry have a significantly better chance of making that shot and we want them shooting it don't we? I've mentioned elsewhere that the scoring leaderboard has been trending smaller for awhile now. There are currently 7 starting PGs in the top 20. 5 of them are also the leading scorer on their team. If you expand the list to the top 30 scorers you add three more point guards for a full 1/3 of the league that has a top 30 scorer in the starting PG spot. Guards who pull up and shoot are dominating the league overall. That makes Rondo an outlier as a PG who doesn't look to create his own shot. And outliers are suspect. Outliers, in fact, bear many superficial similarities with scapegoats. My question is -- if we already have a 20 point scorer on the wing (Rudy Gay was the #12 overall scorer in the league last year!) would it actually make sense to have a PG trying to pour in points too? Rondo is notching 12 assists a game -- that means more made baskets for DeMarcus and Rudy. Doesn't that fit our personnel better than a guy like IT who leads his team in FGA from the PG position?

This is what it comes down to for me: we need to make a decision if we're going to be a run and gun high scoring powerhouse or if we're going to be a deliberate defensive squad who maximizes their possessions by converting in half-court sets. If run and gun is who we deep down want to be, if that's how we think we're going to win in this league, then it's time to seriously consider cashing in the biggest asset we have for a dynamic wing player who can light up the three point line every night. If we're going to reverse course and utilize a bruising post presence in the manner that has historically been the most effective, than Rajon and Rudy are ideal running mates at PG and SF and you absolutely have to swap out George Karl with a more traditional half-court minded coach who will drill defense all day long until it comes out our players ears. You have to. Anything else would be irresponsible.

And then there's this: More than any other team in the league (even Memphis who's core is aging rapidly) we have a roster ideally suited for a grind it out half court style of game and we're trying to outrun and out shoot Golden State. It's a crime against basketball that this roster and this coach are paired together. It's a relationship which benefits nobody. Either George Karl should have free reign to reshape the roster as he sees fit or he shouldn't be here. That's the gutcheck. If you do still believe he's the right coach for the job, than you have to be willing to give him the roster he wants.

Your post does not make sense on its own terms.

You correctly identify the problem -- Sacramento and New Orleans feature decent offense and lousy defense -- then proceed to get confused and try to blame it on having big men centered teams.

So I am assuming then that somehow in your head if we swapped in Kevin Durant for Cousins that our DEFENSE would suddenly get acceptable and we'd start winning? That's tortured.

The rest of the league isn't right about big men, they just don't have them. What they ARE right about is you win with DEFENSE. That's the true common denominator. Its the single reason why this franchise has been bad for so long. Its the single reason why Vivek's meddling last year was so incredibly offensive. Ignorance. Its basketball ignorance and nothing better to focus on offense without establishing a steady defense behind it. Even Steph Curry would still just be the chucker by the bay if, and people largely missed this, Golden State had not established the best DEFENSE in the NBA to go with the offense. Doesn't matter where your scoring is coming from if you can''t defend. And one of the real advantages of a back to the basket big man was always, and will always be that he allows you to control the tempo of the game, to SLOW THINGS DOWN, and hence have time to get back and set your defense up on every play. Except of course we don't do that because we as a franchise have a top-down sickness.

 

[dude12]

The sad thing is that a defensive squad is fun to watch and this fast paced era which in theory is supposed to be more enjoyable, isn't really any better. Sure you have some moments like when Casspi and Curry were going toe to toe knocking down 3's but the reality is that playoff basketball which is great is quite a bit of defensive intensity....it's awesome to watch when professionals give that effort as opposed to run up and down and just launching.

This could be a solid defensive team.....maybe not great but could be solid.

 

[Glenn]

I enjoy defensive basketball far more than I enjoy offensive basketball. It seems any kid can work on his shot in isolation and have that work evolve into whatever offensive player he will be. He can work on his dribbling alone. Defense on the other hand has to be a team oriented effort. I can appreciate that. Maybe the average fan wants three point shooters to dominate but not me. I have said all of this before as have many others.

It is so discouraging when a coach thinks the only way out of a problem is to shoot more. Twice in the last week or so one of the Lilliputian coaches chatted with Kayte at halftime and said the team had to pick up the pace. Is that really what they discuss at half time?

Someone mentioned they had given up on the team. That doesn't mean he/she and I don't like the Kings. It means we no longer are going to waste effort trying to figure out what is wrong. We know what is wrong and we suspect that it won't be fixed this year. Maybe it shouldn't be fixed this year. What more is there to say?

 

[sdballer]

It is so discouraging when a coach thinks the only way out of a problem is to shoot more. Twice in the last week or so one of the Lilliputian coaches chatted with Kayte at halftime and said the team had to pick up the pace. Is that really what they discuss at half time?

Exactly. We'll give up 60+ points in a half and the coaching staffs answer seems to be "well we need to score 70". Yet the run we went on earlier this month was driven primarily on the defensive end of the court.

This won't change until we have a new staff in place.

 

[hrdboild]

Your post does not make sense on its own terms.

You correctly identify the problem -- Sacramento and New Orleans feature decent offense and lousy defense -- then proceed to get confused and try to blame it on having big men centered teams.

So I am assuming then that somehow in your head if we swapped in Kevin Durant for Cousins that our DEFENSE would suddenly get acceptable and we'd start winning? That's tortured.

The rest of the league isn't right about big men, they just don't have them. What they ARE right about is you win with DEFENSE. That's the true common denominator. Its the single reason why this franchise has been bad for so long. Its the single reason why Vivek's meddling last year was so incredibly offensive. Ignorance. Its basketball ignorance and nothing better to focus on offense without establishing a steady defense behind it. Even Steph Curry would still just be the chucker by the bay if, and people largely missed this, Golden State had not established the best DEFENSE in the NBA to go with the offense. Doesn't matter where your scoring is coming from if you can''t defend. And one of the real advantages of a back to the basket big man was always, and will always be that he allows you to control the tempo of the game, to SLOW THINGS DOWN, and hence have time to get back and set your defense up on every play. Except of course we don't do that because we as a franchise have a sickness.

Brick... read my post again. The statements you take issue with are reductio ad absurdum. We're both arguing the same thing. I just took it one step further to say that keeping George Karl and continuing to follow his basketball philosophy means embracing the hysteria of run and gun three point shooting guards and wings ruling the league and what lies at the end of that path can only be trading DeMarcus Cousins. Might take 3 years, might take more but we're getting nowhere with George Karl/DeMarcus Cousins as the core elements of our identity. Essentially what I'm arguing, to Karl's remaining defenders, is that you can't have your cake and eat it too. You can't say Cousins is your building block and continue to play this way. I like the roster Vlade constructed. I was happy with Mike Malone's offensive system. I've been arguing vehemently all season long that George Karl needs to be gone ASAP. I'm sick and tired of all the "trade Rondo, trade Cousins, trade Rudy, trade Ben" talk and the continued psychological need among Kings fans to find a scapegoat after every loss. I've done it too. It's self-defeating. Sometimes players make mistakes, even the best players in the world. And this absurd notion that we just need to find more shooters more shooters more shooters... is like trying to squeeze soup from a stone. Ain't nothing there.

I wasn't deliberately trying to mislead people, I'm just fed up. In plain terms, I want the front office of the Kings to finally embrace who this team is with Cousins/Gay/Rondo and hire a coach that fits or save us all the headaches and blow it up. If they're not going to fire George Karl (which is what I would prefer a million times over) than man up and do the deed already, repulsive as it may be. A nation divided against itself cannot stand.

 

[ParniValjak]

https://twitter.com/hpbasketball/status/695149915123507201

Words of wisdom




Hardwood Paroxysm ‏@HPbasketball
This is Michael Malone on Cousins, from a question @dempseypost asked about Cousins.

This man just ****ing gets it! Get a coach that gets it, and preaches and teaches defense and this roster as currently constructed is good to win 45 games with the right system. I am just sick and tired of this franchise's allergic reaction to defense. We got the right coach once who started turning things around defensively for us. Sure out offence was not pretty but hell, he was a coach with less than 100 games as a head coach to his name and is intelligent enough to start figuring things out.

I have absolutely no doubt that with a coach like Michael Malone, this roster as currently constructed would be top 5 in the west this season. We might not be #1 in pace, and we might not be regularly scoring 100 points per game but our record would sure as hell look a lot better than it does now. I am done with the mad scientist approach that we have had with Karl. You have to be a real jerk to be sacked after you win coach of the year award. That in itself should tell us all we need to know.

I just can't believe that we are still paying for the sins of little gerbil and the cancers that is known as Chris Mullin. Just cut the cord and bring in a legitimate NBA coach in their prime to take this franchise forward.

 

[LPKingsFan]

How do we achieve going big, having a rim protector and someone who can cover stretch 4s, and someone who can hit a midrange shot all in one position?

Honestly, I think WCS can be that guy. Or close enough.

The bigger problem, to me, is that when your perimeter core is Rondo and Gay, neither is a great shooter or defender, so you need the SG to be a great shooter and a great defender. That's asking a lot. Ben may be disappointing, but the limitations of our core may make his task impossible.

 

[ParniValjak]

I enjoy defensive basketball far more than I enjoy offensive basketball. It seems any kid can work on his shot in isolation and have that work evolve into whatever offensive player he will be. He can work on his dribbling alone. Defense on the other hand has to be a team oriented effort. I can appreciate that. Maybe the average fan wants three point shooters to dominate but not me. I have said all of this before as have many others.

It is so discouraging when a coach thinks the only way out of a problem is to shoot more. Twice in the last week or so one of the Lilliputian coaches chatted with Kayte at halftime and said the team had to pick up the pace. Is that really what they discuss at half time?

Someone mentioned they had given up on the team. That doesn't mean he/she and I don't like the Kings. It means we no longer are going to waste effort trying to figure out what is wrong. We know what is wrong and we suspect that it won't be fixed this year. Maybe it shouldn't be fixed this year. What more is there to say?

This has been my problem with Karl from the start of the season and he is not adjusting. His defense is about daring teams to shoot 3s which in modern game ain't going to work.

 

[Bricklayer]

Jason Jones: DeMarcus Cousins on another career high allowed: “You should hate somebody scoring on you as much as you love scoring on the next person.”
9 hours ago – via Twitter mr_jasonjones


Maybe we should let Boogie player-coach.

 

[gunks]

This has been my problem with Karl from the start of the season and he is not adjusting. His defense is about daring teams to shoot 3s which in modern game ain't going to work.

It's pretty asinine.

Like, does Karl even watch basketball?

 

[fansinceday1]

Kings fans, I swear.
2 callers now have called grant saying cousins is a cancer and we need to trade him.
I don't even know what to say. I knew they'd be back.

 

[Bricklayer]

Kings fans, I swear.
2 callers now have called grant saying cousins is a cancer and we need to trade him.
I don't even know what to say. I knew they'd be back.

Call in and say the other guys are confused.

 

[Peter_Gibbons]

Kings fans, I swear.
2 callers now have called grant saying cousins is a cancer and we need to trade him.
I don't even know what to say. I knew they'd be back.

Has Grant talked about Cousins approaching Randy Brown last night after the game? I can only imagine what he would say..

 

[fansinceday1]

Call in and say the other guys are confused.

Eh, what's the point. It's just banging your head against the wall.

I just hope the ownership isn't as emotionally stunted as the fans are and trade cousins. It'll set this franchise back 10 years.

Trade cousins but there are no calls to fire Karl. Even grant was asked if we have any defensive players on our team and grant said yes, unfortunately he never plays.
IMO, curry not getting off the bench is enough to fire Karl yesterday.

 

[fansinceday1]

Has Grant talked about Cousins approaching Randy Brown last night after the game? I can only imagine what he would say..

Yeah he said that brown was taunting cousins for not knowing the rule about hitting the rim on a missed FT.
He said cousins just went over there to talk. Nothing threatening.

 

[Peter_Gibbons]

Yeah he said that brown was taunting cousins for not knowing the rule about hitting the rim on a missed FT.
He said cousins just went over there to talk. Nothing threatening.

If that's the case, Brown deserved it. Once Brown talked trash to Boogie, it's all fair game.

 

[Glenn]

Yeah he said that brown was taunting cousins for not knowing the rule about hitting the rim on a missed FT.
He said cousins just went over there to talk. Nothing threatening.

He was either taunting or coaching Cuz. It depends on what suits the outside observer.