All I'll say is this. Gonzaga is a very good defensive team and is every year. So as a team defender I think Kispert is fine. He's a smart player as well. So I don't think he'll be this giant liability. As I said, Larry Bird wasn't a great athlete, but he turned out to be a very good defender. That said, he's a very skilled player who I think could be an excellent player to have on your bench. I'am talking 2nd rd here! As to the Guy comparison, the only comp I see is their shooting. Kispert is 6'7" and 220 pounds with an NBA build. He's oversized for the SG position and certainly legit size for the SF position. I can't say the same for Guy.
Following Potential *2020* Draftees
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When I did my mock draft, which is subject to change once the proper order is set, and since I've had a lot of time to watch film, I chose Saddiq Bey, the 6'8" SF out of Villanova. I believe in another post I said I would be happy with any of three players, Bey, Aaron Nesmith, and Devin Vassell. Of those three, the one I think that is less likely to be there is Vassell, and I would choose him first out of the three, now that I've had the time to take a long look at him.
Devin Vassell: 6'7", 198 Lb's, Florida St., SF/SG, Soph.
28.7 mpg - 12.7 ppg - 49,0% fgp - 41.5% 3pp - 73.8% ftp - 5.1 rpg - 1.6 apg - 1.4 spg - 1.0 bpg.
While Vassell put up great numbers stat wise offensively, what makes him most attractive is his defense. Some NBA scouts think he's the best defensive player in the draft. Vassell, while a good athlete, is not a great or elite athlete. However, he has above average lateral quickness, and most of all great instincts to go along with excellent defensive BBIQ. He's able to read plays before they happen and is an outstanding weak side help defender. In team defense he always seems to be in the right spot, and making the right switch at the right time. In time, he should be able to guard 3 or 4 positions.
Offensively he's no slouch either. As posted, he shot 41.5% from the three, and while close to 80% of his shots were assisted, he's quite capable of creating his own shot. He has an excellent mid-range game with floaters and pull up fade away jumpers. He shot 71% at the rim, so he's a good finisher. He has a very high release on his jump shot along with good vertical, making it very difficult to block. Of the three players I mentioned as my choice, Vassell is the most likely to be a star and a starter in the NBA. That doesn't mean the others won't, it simply means that if I had to bet, he would be my choice.
I can't verify it, but Vassell is reported to have a 7 foot wingspan. He can't outrun Fox, but he runs the floor hard and has a nose for the ball. It's also reported that he's a gym rat and is constantly working on his game. The one quality all three of the players I mentioned have, is the ability to step in and contribute right away, which is what I think the Kings need. Bear in mind, these three players are my choice if the Kings remain at the 12th pick in the draft. If the Kings get lucky and move up, then we'll have a do over.
Here's another video showing Vassell's defensive abilities:
Devin Vassell: 6'7", 198 Lb's, Florida St., SF/SG, Soph.
28.7 mpg - 12.7 ppg - 49,0% fgp - 41.5% 3pp - 73.8% ftp - 5.1 rpg - 1.6 apg - 1.4 spg - 1.0 bpg.
While Vassell put up great numbers stat wise offensively, what makes him most attractive is his defense. Some NBA scouts think he's the best defensive player in the draft. Vassell, while a good athlete, is not a great or elite athlete. However, he has above average lateral quickness, and most of all great instincts to go along with excellent defensive BBIQ. He's able to read plays before they happen and is an outstanding weak side help defender. In team defense he always seems to be in the right spot, and making the right switch at the right time. In time, he should be able to guard 3 or 4 positions.
Offensively he's no slouch either. As posted, he shot 41.5% from the three, and while close to 80% of his shots were assisted, he's quite capable of creating his own shot. He has an excellent mid-range game with floaters and pull up fade away jumpers. He shot 71% at the rim, so he's a good finisher. He has a very high release on his jump shot along with good vertical, making it very difficult to block. Of the three players I mentioned as my choice, Vassell is the most likely to be a star and a starter in the NBA. That doesn't mean the others won't, it simply means that if I had to bet, he would be my choice.
I can't verify it, but Vassell is reported to have a 7 foot wingspan. He can't outrun Fox, but he runs the floor hard and has a nose for the ball. It's also reported that he's a gym rat and is constantly working on his game. The one quality all three of the players I mentioned have, is the ability to step in and contribute right away, which is what I think the Kings need. Bear in mind, these three players are my choice if the Kings remain at the 12th pick in the draft. If the Kings get lucky and move up, then we'll have a do over.
Here's another video showing Vassell's defensive abilities:
These late lottery picks are tricky so as always I admire your effort. Its easy to look at Vassell’s size 6’7” <200 lbs and wonder how he will fair against big SF‘s. I thought that of both the Bridges that came out a couple years ago and still not sure about them but then think of Kawhi who was basically the same size entering the draft. I’ll take your word for it on this kids defence abilities and look forward to the draft.
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I think what set Kawhi apart along with his abilities, was his great wingspan, and if you look at the majority of the good to great defensive players, they all share that same quality. As does Vassell. I think Kawhi is a little better athlete than Vassell, but aside from that, they're fairly equal at the same point in time. That's not to say that Vassell is the next coming of Leonard.
Lets remember that Leonard was the 15th pick in his draft and while a lot of GM's liked him, I doubt many, if any, thought he would become the player he is today. So you never know. It's easy to speculate about a players ceiling, but for the most part, except for the rare player, it's fools gold. I prefer to look at a players floor as a more solid base for speculation. But at the end of the day, it's subjective.
Most NBA scouts have their checklist and so do I. Mine has evolved over the years of doing this. It's easy to boast about the one's you got right, but the one's that you get wrong are more important because it gives you a chance to look at where your mistake was, and it helps you in the future. But nothing is fool proof, and I play my part of the fool on occasion.
Lets remember that Leonard was the 15th pick in his draft and while a lot of GM's liked him, I doubt many, if any, thought he would become the player he is today. So you never know. It's easy to speculate about a players ceiling, but for the most part, except for the rare player, it's fools gold. I prefer to look at a players floor as a more solid base for speculation. But at the end of the day, it's subjective.
Most NBA scouts have their checklist and so do I. Mine has evolved over the years of doing this. It's easy to boast about the one's you got right, but the one's that you get wrong are more important because it gives you a chance to look at where your mistake was, and it helps you in the future. But nothing is fool proof, and I play my part of the fool on occasion.
The defensive tools are super intriguing as wing defense is one of the most important skill-sets a team needs to be successful. But I also like the fact that I think you could plug Vassell in on offense and he would find a way to contribute without taking possessions, similar to how Richaun Holmes makes an impact offensively on minimal possessions. On a team with Fox, Buddy, Bogi and Bagley, it'd be difficult to add another real high USG player without stepping on some toes. Vassell looks like an absolute glove fit with the core while filling a valuable role as a spacer and wing defender. If you believe in the above 4 as the core, he's the type of player you want to surround them with.
I do not really suppose it's a frame hassle. My impact is that he's got a significantly higher frame than his brother (who changed into drafted at #fifty two ultimate yr) and from an athletic point of view, he is all each person may want to ask for buy portable basketball.
A lot of people talk about this being a "weak" draft. I'm not so sure it is. It just doesn't have those big, blue chip prospects at the top. There are a lot of prospects in this draft that I like from 6-25.
I really like (in no particular order):
I really wish/want three 1st round picks in this draft that would allow us to walk away with:
I don't think Vassell will be there when we pick though. However, I'm not so sure Green is that much different than Vassell. He seems viewed as a poor man's Vassell, but when it's all said & done, I could see him end up being as valuable if not more valuable than Vassell in the NBA. Green has a longer wingspan, is 15lbs heavier, slightly younger, is a better FT shooter (bodes well for his 3PT shooting in the NBA), and more athletic. I think he's a good bargain later in the draft while focusing on a bigger SF with our #12 pick (S. Bey, Williams).
I'd be willing to move Hield, Bogdan, Barnes, Bjelica, and/or Holmes to pick up those two extra 1sts to round out the young core.
If we could walk away with (for example) J. Green, S. Bey, & J. Smith, I would be very pleased.
PG - Fox
SG - Green
SF - S. Bey
PF - Smith
C - Bagley
That young core complements each other very well. That's a lot of shooting, defense, length, & athleticism (and they are all on the same timeline).
I really like (in no particular order):
- Devin Vassell
- Patrick Williams
- Aaron Nesmith
- Saddiq Bey
- Josh Green
- Jalen Smith
- Tyler Bey
I really wish/want three 1st round picks in this draft that would allow us to walk away with:
- Vassell, Green, or Nesmith
- S. Bey, Nesmith, Williams
- Williams, Smith, or T Bey
I don't think Vassell will be there when we pick though. However, I'm not so sure Green is that much different than Vassell. He seems viewed as a poor man's Vassell, but when it's all said & done, I could see him end up being as valuable if not more valuable than Vassell in the NBA. Green has a longer wingspan, is 15lbs heavier, slightly younger, is a better FT shooter (bodes well for his 3PT shooting in the NBA), and more athletic. I think he's a good bargain later in the draft while focusing on a bigger SF with our #12 pick (S. Bey, Williams).
I'd be willing to move Hield, Bogdan, Barnes, Bjelica, and/or Holmes to pick up those two extra 1sts to round out the young core.
- Perhaps POR (#14), ORL (#15), MIN (#16), or DEN (#21) are interested in a full sized, 3&D SF (Barnes).
- Perhaps DAL (#18), PHI (#22), or UTA (#24) are interested in a SG (Hield/Bogdanovic)
- Perhaps POR (#14), DAL (#18), DEN (#21), PHI (#22), UTA (#24), BOS (#26), LAL (#29), or BOS (#30) are interested in a cheap, floor spacing PF (Bjelica)
- Perhaps PHI (#22), BOS (#26), or BOS (#30) are interested in a cheap, defensive, rim running C (Holmes)
If we could walk away with (for example) J. Green, S. Bey, & J. Smith, I would be very pleased.
PG - Fox
SG - Green
SF - S. Bey
PF - Smith
C - Bagley
That young core complements each other very well. That's a lot of shooting, defense, length, & athleticism (and they are all on the same timeline).
@bajaden referencing my post above, what is your take on Josh Green? I didn't see any post about him in the first 8 pages (maybe i missed it), but I think he could be a 3&D SG with great athleticism. He's also shown some playmaking ability which raises his ceiling in my eyes. His 3PT% was okay, but his 78% FT% makes me feel comfortable with his ability there.
I'd rather spend a later 1st on Green vs. spend 6-12 on Vassell.
I'd rather spend a later 1st on Green vs. spend 6-12 on Vassell.
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Well first, you like a lot of the same players that I do. I think we differ on what the Kings should give up to acquire a couple more of them, but that's a response for a different time. I still have a few Arizona games I want to watch before doing a write up on Green, but right now, I'm not as high on him as you are..
There are several different ways to judge a player. The first is the wish judgement. You judge the player totally on potential regardless of what you see. In some cases the potential is so great the player looks like a can't miss star. Another way is judge the player totally on what you see on the floor now and mostly disregard the potential. This is as flawed as the first way. Of course the preferred way is to judge him on both potential and what you see on the floor and then judge the balance between the two.
In Green's case, at least to my eye, his potential outweighs what he produces on the floor. His on the floor performance defensively is very good and well above average. Offensively not so much. His 3 pt shot is a little funky and needs some retooling. He was very inconsistent with his 3 pt shot, going 4 for 5 in one game and then 0 for 5 in the next. Overall I think he shot around 36%, which isn't bad, but not good when compared with some of the others like Bey, Nesmith or Vassell, all of whom I have ranked higher than Green.
But as I said, I have three more games I want to watch before coming to any conclusions. I cut him some slack because he went to Arizona, where players there tend to under perform, but once in the NBA, surprise people by being better than thought. I know you love to make trades, and I don't for the most part unless I feel, no, unless I know, it will significantly help the team. I like youth, but too much potential youth is usually a recipe for failure, at least in the short term.
The problem with the long term is that teams usually don't have any patience, especially when they've been on the wrong side of the ledger as longs as the Kings have. This team needs to start winning now, not 3 years from now, and with a giant infusion of youth, three years from now is more likely.
If I were to make a trade for the future, it would be for the chance at next years draft where there are at least 6 players, and maybe up to 12 players that would be the number one pick in this years draft. If I'm going to trade a Buddy Hield I want at shot at drafting Jonathan Kuminga, or another Green (Jalen), or Cade Cunningham. Kuminga is going to be a superstar in the NBA in my opinion. He dominates in highschool without even making it look hard.
What I'm saying is that if I'm trading away an very good experienced player that's already proven, then I want a chance at a can't miss player in the draft. No one other than Haliburton or Toppin leap out at me as low risk players. There will be surprises of course, there always are. Someone like Cole Anthony might end up being one of the best players out of this draft three or fours years from now, but he was God awful this year at North Carolina.
I think you summed it up with your 6 to 25 analysis. This is a very volatile draft where a player picked at 25 could end up being a top five player a few years later. In a draft like this, I tend to lean toward players that can play now, rather than hope they can play later. If I'm going to bet on potential, then it's going to be a player that can go out and still look dominating despite lacking some of the necessary skill sets. Only one player in this draft comes close to that and that's Anthony Edwards. And even he scares me.
There are several different ways to judge a player. The first is the wish judgement. You judge the player totally on potential regardless of what you see. In some cases the potential is so great the player looks like a can't miss star. Another way is judge the player totally on what you see on the floor now and mostly disregard the potential. This is as flawed as the first way. Of course the preferred way is to judge him on both potential and what you see on the floor and then judge the balance between the two.
In Green's case, at least to my eye, his potential outweighs what he produces on the floor. His on the floor performance defensively is very good and well above average. Offensively not so much. His 3 pt shot is a little funky and needs some retooling. He was very inconsistent with his 3 pt shot, going 4 for 5 in one game and then 0 for 5 in the next. Overall I think he shot around 36%, which isn't bad, but not good when compared with some of the others like Bey, Nesmith or Vassell, all of whom I have ranked higher than Green.
But as I said, I have three more games I want to watch before coming to any conclusions. I cut him some slack because he went to Arizona, where players there tend to under perform, but once in the NBA, surprise people by being better than thought. I know you love to make trades, and I don't for the most part unless I feel, no, unless I know, it will significantly help the team. I like youth, but too much potential youth is usually a recipe for failure, at least in the short term.
The problem with the long term is that teams usually don't have any patience, especially when they've been on the wrong side of the ledger as longs as the Kings have. This team needs to start winning now, not 3 years from now, and with a giant infusion of youth, three years from now is more likely.
If I were to make a trade for the future, it would be for the chance at next years draft where there are at least 6 players, and maybe up to 12 players that would be the number one pick in this years draft. If I'm going to trade a Buddy Hield I want at shot at drafting Jonathan Kuminga, or another Green (Jalen), or Cade Cunningham. Kuminga is going to be a superstar in the NBA in my opinion. He dominates in highschool without even making it look hard.
What I'm saying is that if I'm trading away an very good experienced player that's already proven, then I want a chance at a can't miss player in the draft. No one other than Haliburton or Toppin leap out at me as low risk players. There will be surprises of course, there always are. Someone like Cole Anthony might end up being one of the best players out of this draft three or fours years from now, but he was God awful this year at North Carolina.
I think you summed it up with your 6 to 25 analysis. This is a very volatile draft where a player picked at 25 could end up being a top five player a few years later. In a draft like this, I tend to lean toward players that can play now, rather than hope they can play later. If I'm going to bet on potential, then it's going to be a player that can go out and still look dominating despite lacking some of the necessary skill sets. Only one player in this draft comes close to that and that's Anthony Edwards. And even he scares me.
Interesting. I didn’t think his shot looked funky (other than his knees bending a bit inward when he shoots). What do you think is funky about it?
I mentioned it before but he is a very good FT shooter (78%). Better than Vassell and Bey in fact (both their freshmen & sophomore season). It makes me think he maybe struggles from 3 due to footwork, alignment, etc. but you got to think those are all fairly correctable.
I mentioned it before but he is a very good FT shooter (78%). Better than Vassell and Bey in fact (both their freshmen & sophomore season). It makes me think he maybe struggles from 3 due to footwork, alignment, etc. but you got to think those are all fairly correctable.
Maybe funky was a bad choice of words. Inconsistent would be a better choice. On occasion he lets his left elbow flair out. He doesn't square up the same way every time, and right now he's basically a catch and shoot 3 pt shooter. If you only watched youtube videos you would think he's the best shooter in college, when in fact Nesmith is a far better shooter, who shot a better 3 pt percentage off the dribble than he did on catch and shoot.
But let me clear, I really like Green, I just don't have him rated as high as you. He may be the best player out his class five years from now. I doubt it, but hey, your guess is as good as mine. Defensively, he's terrific, and that's the one thing he can really hang his hat on. He's a terrific athlete as well, but other than finishing when going down hill, he seldom creates for himself. He also has games where he turns the ball over a lot. But as you said, most of his flaws are correctable.
Like I said, I have three more games recorded that I'm going to watch and I'll give my updated opinion after that. I've had some serious medical problems for the last 4 or 5 months, that hopefully are behind me now. But they also put me behind on some of the things I do on the forum. So I'm in my catch up mode..
But let me clear, I really like Green, I just don't have him rated as high as you. He may be the best player out his class five years from now. I doubt it, but hey, your guess is as good as mine. Defensively, he's terrific, and that's the one thing he can really hang his hat on. He's a terrific athlete as well, but other than finishing when going down hill, he seldom creates for himself. He also has games where he turns the ball over a lot. But as you said, most of his flaws are correctable.
Like I said, I have three more games recorded that I'm going to watch and I'll give my updated opinion after that. I've had some serious medical problems for the last 4 or 5 months, that hopefully are behind me now. But they also put me behind on some of the things I do on the forum. So I'm in my catch up mode..
I hope you're over the hump with everything. Basketball can wait.
As for Green, I'd feel worse about taking him at 10-12. He seems like a better option if we're picking 17-25.
Let's say our name comes up on the draft board on draft day, and the following players are still on the draft board:
How would you rank them in order of your preference for the Kings?
As for Green, I'd feel worse about taking him at 10-12. He seems like a better option if we're picking 17-25.
Let's say our name comes up on the draft board on draft day, and the following players are still on the draft board:
- Saddiq Bey
- Aaron Nesmith
- Devin Vassell
- Patrick Williams
How would you rank them in order of your preference for the Kings?
First let me set the parameters of why I'm choosing the way I'am. I want a player that's ready to step in and contribute now more than later. I want a player that fits the style of play that were trying to develop, and lastly, I want a player that fits a need, or a possible need in the short term future. So with that in mind, my choices are:
1. Devin Vassell
2. Aaron Nesmith
3. Saddiq Bey
4. Patrick Williams
It's sort of unique to have two Florida St. players on that list, and of all those players, the one that might have the most potential is Williams. However I feel he is the furthest away from contributing immediately, and the team needs to win now, not two or three years from now. Vassell can play both ends of the floor, and multiple positions. He would give us a legit backup SF to play when we move Barnes to PF. He's a very good athlete and has great basketball instincts.
Nesmith would be insurance against Buddy being traded, and he can also legitimately play SG and SF. He's not the defender the other three are, but he's the best shooter in college and will be a better defender than Buddy, and maybe, a legit NBA defender in time.
Bey is a good shooter, particularly in the catch and shoot, and he was asked to guard the best player on the other team regardless of position last season. I don't think he'll be quite as good a defender at the NBA level, but he'll still be above average. He's sort of a not great at anything, but good at everything type of player. Like Barnes, he's capable of playing either the SF or PF position, and like Vassell, he would give the Kings a legit SF when we move Barnes to the PF position.
Williams, who may have the biggest upside of the four, is still a bit lacking in his skill set, and right now, he's basically a PF. He's probably the best athlete of the group, with only Vassell as a possible comp. If you thinking long term, maybe he's your choice, but I don't think the Kings are in the long term mode right now. He could probably play center in a small ball lineup, but I don't see him having the skillset to play SF at the moment, if ever. I thought he could have rebounded better, and his 3 pt shot needs to become more consistent. Yes, I know he's a good freethrow shooter, but the NBA is littered with players that are good freethrow shooters who aren't particularly good 3 pt shooters. It's an indicator, and that's all it is.
1. Devin Vassell
2. Aaron Nesmith
3. Saddiq Bey
4. Patrick Williams
It's sort of unique to have two Florida St. players on that list, and of all those players, the one that might have the most potential is Williams. However I feel he is the furthest away from contributing immediately, and the team needs to win now, not two or three years from now. Vassell can play both ends of the floor, and multiple positions. He would give us a legit backup SF to play when we move Barnes to PF. He's a very good athlete and has great basketball instincts.
Nesmith would be insurance against Buddy being traded, and he can also legitimately play SG and SF. He's not the defender the other three are, but he's the best shooter in college and will be a better defender than Buddy, and maybe, a legit NBA defender in time.
Bey is a good shooter, particularly in the catch and shoot, and he was asked to guard the best player on the other team regardless of position last season. I don't think he'll be quite as good a defender at the NBA level, but he'll still be above average. He's sort of a not great at anything, but good at everything type of player. Like Barnes, he's capable of playing either the SF or PF position, and like Vassell, he would give the Kings a legit SF when we move Barnes to the PF position.
Williams, who may have the biggest upside of the four, is still a bit lacking in his skill set, and right now, he's basically a PF. He's probably the best athlete of the group, with only Vassell as a possible comp. If you thinking long term, maybe he's your choice, but I don't think the Kings are in the long term mode right now. He could probably play center in a small ball lineup, but I don't see him having the skillset to play SF at the moment, if ever. I thought he could have rebounded better, and his 3 pt shot needs to become more consistent. Yes, I know he's a good freethrow shooter, but the NBA is littered with players that are good freethrow shooters who aren't particularly good 3 pt shooters. It's an indicator, and that's all it is.
See I like Nesmith, but I worry about our team's defense (not to say that I think he's a bad defender or can't become a good defender)...
Fox has good potential on defense, but has to focus on offense a lot where I feel like he's not making the biggest impact defensively.
Hield & Bogdan are below average defenders.
Barnes is probably an average defender.
Bagley/Bjelica are below average
Holmes is an above average defender
We don't have a lot of defense across our core players so I worry about drafting just another guy who is below average to average on defense. On the flip side, Hield & Nesmith on the floor together would be insane. Fox would have a field day driving to the lane.
I would probably flip Bey & Nesmith in your list. Bey is a better defender (which we need), he is a SF/PF whereas Nesmith is more of a SG/SF and we already have Hield, Bogdan, & Barnes (and James) taking up those SG/SF minutes. Although Nesmith is an elite shooter, his passing & ball handling give me pause in regards to his ceiling. Similar to how Hield's ballhandling & passing limit his ceiling, I could see Nesmith being somewhat limited in his offensive ability. Nesmith's ball handling doesn't seem as advanced as Hield's was which makes me think his ceiling is a longer, better defending, worse ball handling Buddy Hield. Which is not a bad player, but I question his ability to grow into someone who can create for himself & others.
Bey, on the other hand, has shown some ability as a ball handler, passer, being able to run the PnR, etc. (and doing so with true SF size), I think that raises his ceiling in today's NBA (meaning players who can shoot, put the ball on the floor, & find the open man are prioritized). He's obviously still a very good shooter (not as good as Nesmith) but solid nonetheless. However, I do think his release is quicker than Nesmith (would be curious to hear your opinion on this) which is something that I think is underrated by some.
Fox has good potential on defense, but has to focus on offense a lot where I feel like he's not making the biggest impact defensively.
Hield & Bogdan are below average defenders.
Barnes is probably an average defender.
Bagley/Bjelica are below average
Holmes is an above average defender
We don't have a lot of defense across our core players so I worry about drafting just another guy who is below average to average on defense. On the flip side, Hield & Nesmith on the floor together would be insane. Fox would have a field day driving to the lane.
I would probably flip Bey & Nesmith in your list. Bey is a better defender (which we need), he is a SF/PF whereas Nesmith is more of a SG/SF and we already have Hield, Bogdan, & Barnes (and James) taking up those SG/SF minutes. Although Nesmith is an elite shooter, his passing & ball handling give me pause in regards to his ceiling. Similar to how Hield's ballhandling & passing limit his ceiling, I could see Nesmith being somewhat limited in his offensive ability. Nesmith's ball handling doesn't seem as advanced as Hield's was which makes me think his ceiling is a longer, better defending, worse ball handling Buddy Hield. Which is not a bad player, but I question his ability to grow into someone who can create for himself & others.
Bey, on the other hand, has shown some ability as a ball handler, passer, being able to run the PnR, etc. (and doing so with true SF size), I think that raises his ceiling in today's NBA (meaning players who can shoot, put the ball on the floor, & find the open man are prioritized). He's obviously still a very good shooter (not as good as Nesmith) but solid nonetheless. However, I do think his release is quicker than Nesmith (would be curious to hear your opinion on this) which is something that I think is underrated by some.
I wouldn't have a problem switching Bey for Nesmith. I think both are equally talented, just a bit different. Nesmith is a good athlete, and I don't think he would be a defensive liability, and perhaps he could be more. But no way to really predict. In my mock I had the Kings taking Bey, so obviously I like him. As I said, I leaned toward Nesmith because of Buddy's rumored issue of coming off the bench, which may be just that, a rumor.
I have no problem with Nesmith's ball handling or passing ability. Nesmith is a far superior ball handler to Buddy coming out of college and I think his BBIQ is superior as well. He had no problem getting his own shot anytime he wanted it. He has a lightning quick high release that I never saw anyone come close to blocking. Buddy's ball handling was always good enough to get him into trouble, and it still is. Most of Buddy's turnovers come off his handles or his trying to make a pass that isn't there. Buddy's always been a bit loose with the ball.
I have Vassell ranked just ahead of both Bey and Nesmith, but barely. Truth is, I don't think he'll be there when the Kings pick. Another player that I really like who is projected by ESPN to go in the 2nd rd is Desmond Bane, who I've mentioned before. To be honest, I'd almost bet my life that some team will snatch him in the 1st rd. Bane is Nesmith with terrific defense. He shot over 40% from the three all four years at TCU and shot 44.2% this past season. He shot just a tick under 80% from the free throw line. He also averaged just a tick under 4 assists a game. He has great size at 6'6" and 215 Lbs along with a large wingspan.
I'd love to have him, but grabbing him at 12, if we stay that is too high, and I don't think he lasts to us in the 2nd rd. Dam shame!
I have no problem with Nesmith's ball handling or passing ability. Nesmith is a far superior ball handler to Buddy coming out of college and I think his BBIQ is superior as well. He had no problem getting his own shot anytime he wanted it. He has a lightning quick high release that I never saw anyone come close to blocking. Buddy's ball handling was always good enough to get him into trouble, and it still is. Most of Buddy's turnovers come off his handles or his trying to make a pass that isn't there. Buddy's always been a bit loose with the ball.
I have Vassell ranked just ahead of both Bey and Nesmith, but barely. Truth is, I don't think he'll be there when the Kings pick. Another player that I really like who is projected by ESPN to go in the 2nd rd is Desmond Bane, who I've mentioned before. To be honest, I'd almost bet my life that some team will snatch him in the 1st rd. Bane is Nesmith with terrific defense. He shot over 40% from the three all four years at TCU and shot 44.2% this past season. He shot just a tick under 80% from the free throw line. He also averaged just a tick under 4 assists a game. He has great size at 6'6" and 215 Lbs along with a large wingspan.
I'd love to have him, but grabbing him at 12, if we stay that is too high, and I don't think he lasts to us in the 2nd rd. Dam shame!
Desmond Bane? His wingspan is reported at 6'4" which is abysmal for his size. I honestly think his wingspan & age is what is pushing him back to 2nd round projection, but I would definitely target him at the end of the 1st or in the early 2nd.
He makes me think of Dillon Brooks. SG who was great in college with good skills, but lacked good length and fell to the 2nd round. We all know how Brooks is doing now. Bane is one of those guys that I feel will get overlooked because of his measurables but will be a solid contributor when it's all said & done.
Back to Nesmith/Bey, do you think Nesmith's release is quicker than Bey's release? I get the sense that Bey gets his shot off quicker but curious to see if you had an opinion there.
He makes me think of Dillon Brooks. SG who was great in college with good skills, but lacked good length and fell to the 2nd round. We all know how Brooks is doing now. Bane is one of those guys that I feel will get overlooked because of his measurables but will be a solid contributor when it's all said & done.
Back to Nesmith/Bey, do you think Nesmith's release is quicker than Bey's release? I get the sense that Bey gets his shot off quicker but curious to see if you had an opinion there.
I see your Dillon Brooks comparison, but Bane is a far better shooter than Brooks was coming out of college. Don't know what his wingspan is, but I've seen him play enough to know the Kid can play. As for as who has the quicker release between Bey and Nesmith, I have no idea. I've never looked at it that way. I just know both players can get their shot off. I guess I'll have to get a shot meter for the future. The thing is, both players know how to create space for their shot.
A player that I haven't talked about much is Precious Achiuwa: 6'9", 225 Lbs, 7'2" wingspan, SF/PF, Memphis.
30.4 mpg - 15.8 ppg - 49.3% fgp - 32.5% 3pp - 59.9% ftp - 10.8 rpg - 1.1 stl's - 1.9 bpg
I just finished watching a couple of Memphis games that I hadn't gotten to yet. I had intended to watch Memphis a lot, but after Wiseman withdrew from college, I turned my attention elsewhere. Some scouts feel that Wiseman's departure placed more pressure on Achiuwa to carry more of the load, which contributed to his excessive turnovers and forced shots. That said, there's a lot to like about Achiuwa.
He's an elite athlete who runs the floor like a gazelle, has great hops and terrific lateral quickness. Although most mocks have him listed as a SF, I think he's better suited right now to play the PF position. Athletically, he can play either, but needs to improve his outside shot for the SF position. His calling card right now is his defense. He has the lateral quickness to guard the one through four, and his shot blocking instincts are terrific. He could probably step in and play defense on an NBA team right now. I think he has the ability to be a lock down defender.
Offensively, he has a lot to work on. He scores most of his points inside of 10 feet from the basket, with put backs, alley oops, or some nice quick spin post moves. Once he gets out beyond 15 feet, it's a crap shoot. To be fair, his form doesn't look that bad and he has a pretty quick release. But too many of his shots are off line, short, or long. Add in that his free throw shot is less than desired, it doesn't give one confidence that he'll ever be a good shooter.
Thing is, I have no idea how much he's worked on his free throws or his outside shot. The fact that his form looks good on both, makes me think that with a lot of work, he could become competent at both. He plays with a lot of energy on both ends of the floor. Some of the scouts have compared him to Gerald Wallace at the same point in time. I agree that he has similar athleticism but I think Achiuwa is a little taller and longer. Achiuwa is Nigerian born and didn't start playing basketball until the 8th grade when his family moved to the United States, so he's probably a bit behind the curve by comparison to other players his age.
As I watched him play, I kept getting the feeling that this kid could eventually be a star. Quite a jump I know, but there's something about him that screams special. Contrary to what I've been requiring, that who we pick we ready to play sooner rather than later, Achiuwa will need some time to develop. However, he might be the kind of player whose worth waiting for.
30.4 mpg - 15.8 ppg - 49.3% fgp - 32.5% 3pp - 59.9% ftp - 10.8 rpg - 1.1 stl's - 1.9 bpg
I just finished watching a couple of Memphis games that I hadn't gotten to yet. I had intended to watch Memphis a lot, but after Wiseman withdrew from college, I turned my attention elsewhere. Some scouts feel that Wiseman's departure placed more pressure on Achiuwa to carry more of the load, which contributed to his excessive turnovers and forced shots. That said, there's a lot to like about Achiuwa.
He's an elite athlete who runs the floor like a gazelle, has great hops and terrific lateral quickness. Although most mocks have him listed as a SF, I think he's better suited right now to play the PF position. Athletically, he can play either, but needs to improve his outside shot for the SF position. His calling card right now is his defense. He has the lateral quickness to guard the one through four, and his shot blocking instincts are terrific. He could probably step in and play defense on an NBA team right now. I think he has the ability to be a lock down defender.
Offensively, he has a lot to work on. He scores most of his points inside of 10 feet from the basket, with put backs, alley oops, or some nice quick spin post moves. Once he gets out beyond 15 feet, it's a crap shoot. To be fair, his form doesn't look that bad and he has a pretty quick release. But too many of his shots are off line, short, or long. Add in that his free throw shot is less than desired, it doesn't give one confidence that he'll ever be a good shooter.
Thing is, I have no idea how much he's worked on his free throws or his outside shot. The fact that his form looks good on both, makes me think that with a lot of work, he could become competent at both. He plays with a lot of energy on both ends of the floor. Some of the scouts have compared him to Gerald Wallace at the same point in time. I agree that he has similar athleticism but I think Achiuwa is a little taller and longer. Achiuwa is Nigerian born and didn't start playing basketball until the 8th grade when his family moved to the United States, so he's probably a bit behind the curve by comparison to other players his age.
As I watched him play, I kept getting the feeling that this kid could eventually be a star. Quite a jump I know, but there's something about him that screams special. Contrary to what I've been requiring, that who we pick we ready to play sooner rather than later, Achiuwa will need some time to develop. However, he might be the kind of player whose worth waiting for.
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I believe in picking the best player available and that doesn't always equate to the player with the best upside. Most would say that Anthony Edwards has the highest upside in this draft, and most of those same scouts would also say that he has the biggest bust potential in the draft as well. The Kings are in a position where they can't afford to take a chance on pure potential, especially when there are players that are more proven and safer picks. I should also point out that safe doesn't always mean less talent, it just means the players development is further along. You have a better chance of knowing what your getting.
Bey isn't the only player that I would take at 12, but Williams isn't one of them. Doesn't mean I don't like him, but I'll tell you right now, that if I were to make a small reach I would take Achiuwa over Williams. Just my humble opinion. Just like I would take his teammate Vassell over him. But hey, if the Kings take Williams, I'll be his biggest fan..
As far Precious being a small ball five, I'm sure he could play the position in certain matchups. But he's solid at the four, and as I said, if he can become a little more consistent with his 3 pt shot, he could easily play the three. He gets up and down the floor with the best of him and I could see him running along side Fox. If you put him at the four then you lock in Bagley at the five. Achiuwa's defense is outstanding. Terrific lateral quickness along with great instincts.
I know a lot of mocks are in love with Okongwu from USC, but if I'm looking for a big man, I would take Achiuwa over Okongwu. I love Okongwu's hustle and defense, but I think Achiuwa's defense is as good or better, and he actually has game away from the basket. Right now, Okongwu is strictly a post guy, and I'm not sure how well that will work in the NBA where he'll be going up against bigger players. But hey, what do I know.
I'll tell you who the sleeper is in this draft and that Cole Anthony. He was downright terrible at North Carolina this year, but then, NC was a very bad team. As I re-watched a couple of their games it was obvious that Anthony was double teamed more often than not, resulting in his taking a lot of bad shots. So the question is, is he really that bad, or was it a result of being on a very bad team? He was one of the highest ranked players coming out of highschool. Did he suddenly forget how to play? Is he a player where you ignore this past season and draft him anyway. Maybe you get a star. Or not.....
Bey isn't the only player that I would take at 12, but Williams isn't one of them. Doesn't mean I don't like him, but I'll tell you right now, that if I were to make a small reach I would take Achiuwa over Williams. Just my humble opinion. Just like I would take his teammate Vassell over him. But hey, if the Kings take Williams, I'll be his biggest fan..
As far Precious being a small ball five, I'm sure he could play the position in certain matchups. But he's solid at the four, and as I said, if he can become a little more consistent with his 3 pt shot, he could easily play the three. He gets up and down the floor with the best of him and I could see him running along side Fox. If you put him at the four then you lock in Bagley at the five. Achiuwa's defense is outstanding. Terrific lateral quickness along with great instincts.
I know a lot of mocks are in love with Okongwu from USC, but if I'm looking for a big man, I would take Achiuwa over Okongwu. I love Okongwu's hustle and defense, but I think Achiuwa's defense is as good or better, and he actually has game away from the basket. Right now, Okongwu is strictly a post guy, and I'm not sure how well that will work in the NBA where he'll be going up against bigger players. But hey, what do I know.
I'll tell you who the sleeper is in this draft and that Cole Anthony. He was downright terrible at North Carolina this year, but then, NC was a very bad team. As I re-watched a couple of their games it was obvious that Anthony was double teamed more often than not, resulting in his taking a lot of bad shots. So the question is, is he really that bad, or was it a result of being on a very bad team? He was one of the highest ranked players coming out of highschool. Did he suddenly forget how to play? Is he a player where you ignore this past season and draft him anyway. Maybe you get a star. Or not.....
not a Precious fan. They say the tweener has moved from the 3 / 4 to the 4 / 5. Precious is not big enough to be a 5 and can’t shoot well enough to be a 4. With his 50% free throw rate it doesn’t bode well for success. We already have Bagley in that same spot and I don’t want to see two guys there. Here is his shot chart
https://www.thestepien.com/2020/02/10/precious-achiuwa-scouting-report/
BTW. I like Vassell quite a bit also. If he is there he is easily my pick. I also wonder about Jaden McDaniels. He also had a horrible freshman year but he does have tools.
https://www.thestepien.com/2020/02/10/precious-achiuwa-scouting-report/
BTW. I like Vassell quite a bit also. If he is there he is easily my pick. I also wonder about Jaden McDaniels. He also had a horrible freshman year but he does have tools.
I've been watching highlights of some of the potential picks. I'm pretty narrowed down to either Precious Achiuwa or Isaiah Stewart. I really like Stewart and think if he's at the Kings pick they are stupid to pass on him. I see a big, physical C that is in the mold of a player like Willis Reed with his faceup abilities and physical nature. I'm not saying he's the next Reed but he's like a Zo/Reed type that can shoot and post up and will body up without fouling. I think his floor is Antonio Davis. And to preface, I'm not saying Achiuwa is going to be as special as he was in the same areas but defensively I see a little bit of Rodman in him. Offensively probably Ibaka. That can be a huge asset at the NBA level. His defensive switch potential is off the charts.
Much like Bagley though he has shown touch on his shot. I think he can easily develop into a big that you have to respect from outside. And size wise he'll be fine as a split 4/5 because of his tenacity and because he doesn't look totally averse to contact. Those are positive signs for someone like him.
I seem to be another of the few Stewart fans in the basketball world. He's got a lot of throwback, to be sure, because who in the world runs a post game these days, but he's got great touch around the basket and super soft hands that catch every entry pass no matter how lousy. I really hope to see his hand measurements because they might be in the Kawhi range. He's shorter than ideal for the position at 6'10" unofficially but has a reported 7'5" or 7'6" wingspan to make up for it. Big strong and physical, good rebounder, and has a credible jumper out to 15 with reports that he nails threes in practice but Hopkins didn't want him taking them in games. I see mocks where he falls out of the first round - or a notable two-round podcast I listened to where he went undrafted through 60 - and I just don't get it. He looks like lottery talent to me.
Well, I like Stewart, and I think he has more potential than we've seen. I wish he were a little taller, but he does appear to have a big wingspan. Personally, I'll be stunned if he were to go undrafted. Not going to happen. I have him going somewhere between 20 and 30. 10 years ago he would have been a lottery pick. I know the current trend is positionless basketball, but like all trends, it will change again, probably when the next Wilt or Shaq comes along and starts dominating.
Your right about Mike Hopkins who runs a tight ship. Washington had a lot of so called scorers like Carter, Green, and McDaniels. Of that group only Green was close to efficient, but Carter wanted Stewart down low playing to his strengths. Reminds me of Calipari and Cousins. Calipari told Cousins he only had two positions on the team. In the post, or on the bench.
Your right about Mike Hopkins who runs a tight ship. Washington had a lot of so called scorers like Carter, Green, and McDaniels. Of that group only Green was close to efficient, but Carter wanted Stewart down low playing to his strengths. Reminds me of Calipari and Cousins. Calipari told Cousins he only had two positions on the team. In the post, or on the bench.
Right now, I wouldn't touch McDaniels with a ten foot pole, and I was extremely high on him coming into this season. Is he talented? Yes, but I question his BBIQ and his desire. He reminds me of his brother, which isn't a compliment. I wish him well, but on another team. As a comparison, if I were able to pit McDaniels one on one against Achiuwa, Precious would destroy him on both ends of the court.
I know your a big stat guy, but I'm not, and let me explain that. About 85% of my judgement is based on what I see with my own eye's, and I've seldom been wrong. I put about 15% of my judgement on stats. The reason is, my eye and my brain can tell me things that stats never can. Stats are fixed in time. A missed shot will always remain a missed shot, and if you judge a player on that moment in time, then your a fool (I'm generalizing). Point is, were talking about players that most times are 18 or 19 years old.
In Achiuwa's case, he didn't start playing until the 8th grade. He didn't get serious instruction until highschool, and then college. So he came to the game a bit late, which I have to take into consideration, unlike a player like McDaniels who was likely playing BB when he was 5 years old. So I look at the growth rate of both players, and I move Achiuwa ahead of McDaniels. You give consideration to McDaniels, who shot 33% from the three, but disparage Achiuwa who shot 32.5% from the three. Really? Simply because of McDaniels free throw percentage?
If you judged every players ability to shoot on their free throw percentage in college you would have missed out on a lot a great players, who I won't bother to list. Free throw percentage is nothing more than an indicator. But there are other indicators as well that are equally important. I look at a players form. I look at a players shot selection. I look at a players competition, and how he's defended by the opposition. I look at whether his shot is effortless or not. I look at whether most of his shots (at least 90 plus percent) are on line. I look at whether he has the proper rotation on the ball. Is he the best player on the team and being asked to carry more of the offensive load than should be asked?
When I look at Achiuwa, and I see the tremendous effort he puts out on the defensive end, which certainly affects his effort on the offensive end, and I take all those other items I mentioned into consideration, I see a player with tremendous potential. I'm not sure who is calling him a tweener? I haven't heard that, and in today's league, at 6'9" and with a 7'2" wingspan you would would hardly be called undersized at the PF position. He's a great athlete, and as I previously said, if he can become a consistent outside shooter, he can play the three.
Several of the scouts I know have compared Achiuwa to another player that coming out of college was very similar. Pascal Siakam, who was the 27th pick in the draft. Who shot 20.0% from the three his last year at New Mexico and 67% from the free throw line. Pascal is 6'9" and 230 Lbs with a large wingspan, and a great athlete. What set him apart was his desire, hustle, his defense and rebounding. Sound familiar?
His rookie year Pascal shot 20% from the 3 pt line, and 68% from the free throw line. This past season, his 4th, he shot 35.9% from the three and 80% from the free throw line. So the idea that you judge players by some stats they put up in college is pure nonsense. I'm not saying that Achiuwa is the next Pascal, but I'am saying that if you used your standards of judging a player, you would have missed out on him. I believe what my eye's tell me, not some stupid stat sheet. All stats do for me, is occasionally confirm what my eye's tell me. But when they conflict with one another, especially with a 19 year old player, I'll go with my eye's.
Finally, when I say that Achiuwa is mostly potential at the moment, I'm referring to his perceived ceiling, meaning I think he as a fairly high floor. He has some holes in his game right now. His handles need to improve, as does his jumpshot. He has fairly good court vision, but his execution based off that court vision needs work, which will cut down on his turnovers. He's an explosive athlete, but doesn't have any signature off the dribble moves to use that athleticism. A wicked crossover with a step back would help.
This is a kid that at age 14, with little experience, started on his varsity high school team. All these things matter when looking at a player.
I know your a big stat guy, but I'm not, and let me explain that. About 85% of my judgement is based on what I see with my own eye's, and I've seldom been wrong. I put about 15% of my judgement on stats. The reason is, my eye and my brain can tell me things that stats never can. Stats are fixed in time. A missed shot will always remain a missed shot, and if you judge a player on that moment in time, then your a fool (I'm generalizing). Point is, were talking about players that most times are 18 or 19 years old.
In Achiuwa's case, he didn't start playing until the 8th grade. He didn't get serious instruction until highschool, and then college. So he came to the game a bit late, which I have to take into consideration, unlike a player like McDaniels who was likely playing BB when he was 5 years old. So I look at the growth rate of both players, and I move Achiuwa ahead of McDaniels. You give consideration to McDaniels, who shot 33% from the three, but disparage Achiuwa who shot 32.5% from the three. Really? Simply because of McDaniels free throw percentage?
If you judged every players ability to shoot on their free throw percentage in college you would have missed out on a lot a great players, who I won't bother to list. Free throw percentage is nothing more than an indicator. But there are other indicators as well that are equally important. I look at a players form. I look at a players shot selection. I look at a players competition, and how he's defended by the opposition. I look at whether his shot is effortless or not. I look at whether most of his shots (at least 90 plus percent) are on line. I look at whether he has the proper rotation on the ball. Is he the best player on the team and being asked to carry more of the offensive load than should be asked?
When I look at Achiuwa, and I see the tremendous effort he puts out on the defensive end, which certainly affects his effort on the offensive end, and I take all those other items I mentioned into consideration, I see a player with tremendous potential. I'm not sure who is calling him a tweener? I haven't heard that, and in today's league, at 6'9" and with a 7'2" wingspan you would would hardly be called undersized at the PF position. He's a great athlete, and as I previously said, if he can become a consistent outside shooter, he can play the three.
Several of the scouts I know have compared Achiuwa to another player that coming out of college was very similar. Pascal Siakam, who was the 27th pick in the draft. Who shot 20.0% from the three his last year at New Mexico and 67% from the free throw line. Pascal is 6'9" and 230 Lbs with a large wingspan, and a great athlete. What set him apart was his desire, hustle, his defense and rebounding. Sound familiar?
His rookie year Pascal shot 20% from the 3 pt line, and 68% from the free throw line. This past season, his 4th, he shot 35.9% from the three and 80% from the free throw line. So the idea that you judge players by some stats they put up in college is pure nonsense. I'm not saying that Achiuwa is the next Pascal, but I'am saying that if you used your standards of judging a player, you would have missed out on him. I believe what my eye's tell me, not some stupid stat sheet. All stats do for me, is occasionally confirm what my eye's tell me. But when they conflict with one another, especially with a 19 year old player, I'll go with my eye's.
Finally, when I say that Achiuwa is mostly potential at the moment, I'm referring to his perceived ceiling, meaning I think he as a fairly high floor. He has some holes in his game right now. His handles need to improve, as does his jumpshot. He has fairly good court vision, but his execution based off that court vision needs work, which will cut down on his turnovers. He's an explosive athlete, but doesn't have any signature off the dribble moves to use that athleticism. A wicked crossover with a step back would help.
This is a kid that at age 14, with little experience, started on his varsity high school team. All these things matter when looking at a player.
I'm kind of hoping he comes out even shorter because in reality for someone like him it doesn't matter at all anyway. My fear is workouts will send him up higher than the Kings pick if an inch or two less in height gets him down then great! He's too skilled to drop too far and this draft is fairly iffy as it is anyway.