Draft Combine Measurements !!!!

funkykingston said:
I just don't agree that a weakside shotblocker is what the Kings need. I know many people have been wanting a Camby/Chandler/Thabeet type player and Whiteside could be that but to me the biggest thing the Kings lack is a big man who can hold position and stop other team's bigs from scoring in the post. I love shotblocking and the idea of someone to challenge/block/alter shots but Whiteside was pushed around and targeted on the NCAA level. He'd be a complete liability as a man-on-man defender and his weakside help wouldn't make up for that. Not to mention he can't score in the post and generally looks a step slow or out of place on offense.

Again, I'm intrigued but far from sold.
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We need both actually. Good defensive teams have both. However I would always value the shotblocker over the post defender in the draft. Lean, weak players can add core strength and use to learn leverage and their length. Carlos Boozer stinks against Pau Gasol. Rasheed Wallace has always been skinny and weak, and now he's fat and weak. But he uses his length and feet well and is a great post defender.

Shot-blocking you can't teach.
 
Vlade4GM said:
How were you proven right that Evans has Wade upside? And I don't see the connection anyway.

College production does not = NBA production. I think he'll probably be a good rebounder and maybe a solid post defender still, but if we're going to take a center that doesn't add much offensively, he better have the upside to be a damn good post defender.
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Not gonna argue about Evans... I assume I wouldn't get much argument at all at this point if I were to say he has Wade upside though.

I understand what you're saying about Aldrich and I agree that he needs to be a very good post defender to justify the selection. I think he will be exactly that though and while I'd rather have Turner, Cousins, Wall, or Favors Aldrich is clearly #5 at this point imo. His measurements didn't scare me off in the slightest.
 
roasthawg said:
Not gonna argue about Evans... I assume I wouldn't get much argument at all at this point if I were to say he has Wade upside though.

I understand what you're saying about Aldrich and I agree that he needs to be a very good post defender to justify the selection. I think he will be exactly that though and while I'd rather have Turner, Cousins, Wall, or Favors Aldrich is clearly #5 at this point imo. His measurements didn't scare me off in the slightest.
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Is Aldrich clearly better than Spencer to you?
 
Well, to each their own, but he has a lot going against him physically and that's not good enough for me to pass up on Johnson.
 
Vlade4GM said:
You want "playable" from a guy that offers little scoring ability?
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Well, there's where yours and my scouting reports differ. I like Monroe's game a lot and think he's got a high floor with an underrated ceiling. However that's contingent on his having acceptable size for an NBA center and I think he proved that today.
 
rainmaker said:
290lbs at 16% bodyfat means he's in good shape. 290lbs at 10%-12% would be a borderline freak of nature. Weight on a scale means nothing. Body composition is much more important.
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You beat me to it. I know that one time, a long, long, long, long, time ago, Shaq really had his body fat down to an insane %. But for most guys that weigh over 280, 16% isn't that unusual. I mean it could and probably will get better, but its certainly not cause for alarm.

I always get a kick out of when people compare verticals. And they'll compare a player, ususally a guard with a 38' or 40", to a guy like Cousins who may have a 28" vertical ( I just made that up. I don't know the results yet). To that I say, let me hang another 6o or so pounds on the guard and see how high he jumps.

By the way, it looked like Monroe didn't get more than 6" off the ground when I was watching him do the standing vertical. I'm sure it was more than that, but thats how it appeared on Televison. Good thing he's tall with a good wingspan, because he's definitely vertically challenged.
 
Surprises:

Anderson is 6'6 w/ shoes..not as unsized as we would of thought

Patterson is 6'9 w/ shoes..so he's not that undersized after all

Orton is the same height as Ed Davis...

Monroe at 6'11...
 
Peter_Gibbons said:
Is Aldrich clearly better than Spencer to you?
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skill wise? no

effictiveness wise? YES

he does what we need/most teams want in a C..block shots..rebound..play D

ill take that over a "skilled" C who can shoot the 3 and do the BS Spencer does without blocking out, blocking shots, or playing D
 
I know Aldrich gets compared to Hawes alot. Its the whole unathletic white center thing. I get it. Easy comparison.

Really though, they are completely different players. Aldrich is much much much better on defense. Hawes gets that 'soft' tag put on him. Aldrich doesnt have that at all. Hes a bully.
 
hammystyle said:
Well, there's where yours and my scouting reports differ. I like Monroe's game a lot and think he's got a high floor with an underrated ceiling. However that's contingent on his having acceptable size for an NBA center and I think he proved that today.
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You weren't talking about Aldrich?
 
bajaden said:
You beat me to it. I know that one time, a long, long, long, long, time ago, Shaq really had his body fat down to an insane %. But for most guys that weigh over 280, 16% isn't that unusual. I mean it could and probably will get better, but its certainly not cause for alarm.

I always get a kick out of when people compare verticals. And they'll compare a player, ususally a guard with a 38' or 40", to a guy like Cousins who may have a 28" vertical ( I just made that up. I don't know the results yet). To that I say, let me hang another 6o or so pounds on the guard and see how high he jumps.

By the way, it looked like Monroe didn't get more than 6" off the ground when I was watching him do the standing vertical. I'm sure it was more than that, but thats how it appeared on Televison. Good thing he's tall with a good wingspan, because he's definitely vertically challenged.
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Athletic testings are interesting, but not really that reliable. If they were taken on several spread out days and averaged out, then maybe they'd be worth more, but they still wouldn't be able to tell you how quick they get off the ground.

I'm pretty sure Shaq had a low body fat around 300 lbs, but it went a lot higher when he was 330+.

Honestly, I don't want Cousins at 290-300 lbs. I'd prefer him at 270.
 
=LarryLegend= said:
I don't know but at the Combine he hit all most every vert measure tab.
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You have to remember that its not just how high you go on the tabs. It also has to do with your arm length and standing reach. So if Nate were able to hit all the tabs but the top two, and Wall was able to duplicate that, their vertical wouldn't be the same. Nate is 5'11" and Wall is 6'4". Not to mention that Wall has a pretty good wingspan.

Having said that, I'm sure that Wall has a very good vertical. As did Stanley Robinson.
 
The Aldrich height really turned some of you guys off? He's .5 inches shorter than Cousins. And Im willing to guess there similar athletes. Standing Reach, Wingspan .. very similar to Cousins.

I would take Cousins over Aldrich, but the height isnt an issue for me.
 
MassachusettsKingsFan said:
The Aldrich height really turned some of you guys off? He's .5 inches shorter than Cousins. And Im willing to guess there similar athletes. Standing Reach, Wingspan .. very similar to Cousins.

I would take Cousins over Aldrich, but the height isnt an issue for me.
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In terms of strength, Cousins kicks his ***. He also kicks his *** in terms of standing reach. If you take out Aldrich's ridiculous shoe thickness, his standing reach is more around 9'2.5 compared to Cousins' 9'5.

Sorry, it's not comparable.
 
bajaden said:
You have to remember that its not just how high you go on the tabs. It also has to do with your arm length and standing reach. So if Nate were able to hit all the tabs but the top two, and Wall was able to duplicate that, their vertical wouldn't be the same. Nate is 5'11" and Wall is 6'4". Not to mention that Wall has a pretty good wingspan.

Having said that, I'm sure that Wall has a very good vertical. As did Stanley Robinson.
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yeah I know that I am just saying he does have atleast a 40" vert.
 
My last memories of Whiteside were of the game Marshall played against Tulsa and Jerome Jordan. If you had seen that game you wouldn't be so confident about sticking Whiteside out there against NBA centers. Jordan backed him up in the post at will and scored at will against him. And I'm not that high on Jordan.

I'm not saying he wouldn't be a nice piece to have on the bench developing, but I don't know that he would be much of a difference maker right now. Add in that his work ethic has been questioned and that he's not very mature with a low basketball IQ, I'm not sure he's the guy.
 
Baja, what do you think of Udoh's measurements? He measured about what you'd expect height wise, but his reach is disappointing.
 
I think we all agree Whiteside will take some time to develop. Big men always take longer to mature... like Bynum who is still learning. His measurements are good, it'll all depend on how he works out. Thats the only way to tell


bajaden said:
My last memories of Whiteside were of the game Marshall played against Tulsa and Jerome Jordan. If you had seen that game you wouldn't be so confident about sticking Whiteside out there against NBA centers. Jordan backed him up in the post at will and scored at will against him. And I'm not that high on Jordan.

I'm not saying he wouldn't be a nice piece to have on the bench developing, but I don't know that he would be much of a difference maker right now. Add in that his work ethic has been questioned and that he's not very mature with a low basketball IQ, I'm not sure he's the guy.
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Vlade4GM said:
In terms of strength, Cousins kicks his ***. He also kicks his *** in terms of standing reach. If you take out Aldrich's ridiculous shoe thickness, his standing reach is more around 9'2.5 compared to Cousins' 9'5.

Sorry, it's not comparable.
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eh. Heres my issue:

Your saying Aldrich is too small, standing reach, weight, height ..

Can we agree that Aldrich is a better defender than Cousins?

Cousins measured out better than Aldrich, but Aldrich being the superior defender, and the measurment being close .. are you convinced Cousins is going to be able to defend anyone? They both came out shorter than I would have hoped. 6'11 would have been great, 7' would have been even better.

Cousins defense was suspect before this information, but knowing Aldrich is better on D, and the size being comparable .. I dont know. Im still fairly confident Aldrich is going to be able to play good defense in the NBA. I wasnt sure about Cousins before this, and I think these measurement might hurt him more than they hurt Cole.

The variable here is that Cousins has the offensive game to play power forward if he ends up being a liability on defense.
 
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