Bibby to Dallas??
- Thread starter BRad1055
- Start date
Harris is younger. I don't think he's a "leader" type, but then again, neither is Bibby.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Okay, I checked the site and Baron and Mike have only faced each other 15 times over their careers, mostly because Davis has a propensity to be injured a lot of the time.
http://basketball-reference.com/fc/h2h.cgi?p1=bibbymi01
The thing that sticks out the most, of course, is the disparity in rebounding. Davis has led in almost everything but Bibby has been more efficient with higher FG% and FT% figures.
I thought it was interesting, but since Kingster has already pronounced it meaningless it cannot be used to show either Davis' strengths or Bibby's weaknesses.
Huh, that's an interesting little tool. Never seen it before. I'm guessing that about all it can do is just matchup starters who have started across form each other in games? i.e. if you tried to matchup Corliss Williamson and tim duncan it woudln't count a game in whih Corliss came off the ebnch adn played 4 minutes at SF?
It appears to show stats for less than starters. Here's your example:
Duncan v. Williamson
http://basketball-reference.com/fc/h2h.cgi
It shows Corliss with as few as 8 minutes, so it might actually have any and all encounters.
EDIT: Oops. I guess you can't link to the results. I'm bookmarking the link, though.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Hmmm..that's kind of too bad. Unless they actually have minute by minute breakdowns of who was matched with who during the games to try to justify it -- remotely possible today, but i sincerely doubt it from a decade ago -- that makes it kind of...more like what were Corliss's numbers in games played against the Spurs over his career, than really him vs. Duncan.
Oh well. Using it just for starters it could still be a fun little tool if not necessarily a very enlightening one.
Oh well. Using it just for starters it could still be a fun little tool if not necessarily a very enlightening one.
Big Cuz 15
All-Star
how old do you think he will be when we are back in the post season?? 3 years from now? he'll be 33...........
Ouch.
I'm not saying you're not right, but that's a bitter pill to try and swallow. Being mediocre really has a whole different picture associated with it.
Double-K
Starter
Ouch.
I'm not saying you're not right, but that's a bitter pill to try and swallow. Being mediocre really has a whole different picture associated with it.
I remember how the forums used to be when I first joined.....
quick dog
Starter
I think some fans might be jumping the gun on trading Bibby so easily. VF21 reminded us of the probable impact of last season's injuries. Bibby may have a lot more in the tank. I would not want to face him after a nasty trade deal. If they dump him, it ought to be in the East, and it should be for a pretty good young player.
SacKings4Life21
Bench
trade bibby for 10mil in expiring contracts. An absent player will play better defense than bibby.
PurpleHaze
All-Star
Last season Bibby came into the season lighter because he said he hoped to be quicker. Previously he'd bulked up a bit which apparently slowed him down. Unfortunately, although he's still in his late 20's Bibby seems to have prematurely aged by losing a step and quickness with the passing years. I still believe he's overall more of a liability on the court (plus that huge contract) than Artest. I hope he goes somewhere else (for acceptable return value), because it's all downhill from this point for Mike Bibby on the NBA hardwood - IMO.
SacKings4Life21
Bench
Purple haze your a genius. seriously.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
1) No context - Are we going young or not? How does Bibby fit into a rebuilding picture?
2) No stats for defensive performance
3) No stats for "chemistry"
4) No stats for future performance
Meaningless exercise.
You clearly have your mind made up. That's fine. Some, however, may not and may actually be trying to figure out if they agree with keeping Bibby or trading him away.
While the comparisons may be a meaningless exercise to you, it might be of interest to someone else. If you're not interested, just move on to the next thread.
Problem solved.
Here's a thought:
We can agree that Bibby had a bad year while Harris had a good year. Yes? (For the sake of this argument.)
Given this information, Bibby had an efficiency rating of 14.6 while Harris had an efficiency rating of 11.6. What is an efficiency rating?
NBA.com evaluates all players based on the efficiency formula: ((Points + Rebounds + Assists + Steals + Blocks) - ((Field Goals Att. - Field Goals Made) + (Free Throws Att. - Free Throws Made) + Turnovers)).
For example, compare the following stat lines:
MIN FGM-A FTM-A REB AST STL BS TO PTS
Player A 43 5-22 7-9 8 6 3 0 4 17
Player B 29 5-8 3-4 4 7 0 0 2 15
Player A had a better game, right? Not exactly. Player B, who shot 5-8 from the field and committed two turnovers, registered a +20 efficiency total while Player A, who shot 5-22 from the field and committed four turnovers, posted a +11.
What does this mean? Arbitrarily, we can say that Bibby in an injury-plagued year, did better at managing the team than Harris, who was teamed with Nowitzki during his MVP season. Thank you, and good night.
We can agree that Bibby had a bad year while Harris had a good year. Yes? (For the sake of this argument.)
Given this information, Bibby had an efficiency rating of 14.6 while Harris had an efficiency rating of 11.6. What is an efficiency rating?
NBA.com evaluates all players based on the efficiency formula: ((Points + Rebounds + Assists + Steals + Blocks) - ((Field Goals Att. - Field Goals Made) + (Free Throws Att. - Free Throws Made) + Turnovers)).
For example, compare the following stat lines:
MIN FGM-A FTM-A REB AST STL BS TO PTS
Player A 43 5-22 7-9 8 6 3 0 4 17
Player B 29 5-8 3-4 4 7 0 0 2 15
Player A had a better game, right? Not exactly. Player B, who shot 5-8 from the field and committed two turnovers, registered a +20 efficiency total while Player A, who shot 5-22 from the field and committed four turnovers, posted a +11.
What does this mean? Arbitrarily, we can say that Bibby in an injury-plagued year, did better at managing the team than Harris, who was teamed with Nowitzki during his MVP season. Thank you, and good night.
Emma
Starter
Name G MP FG FGA 3P 3PA FT FTA ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TO PF PTS
Mike Bibby 82 38.9 6.4 14.1 1.3 3.5 1.7 2.3 0.6 3.1 3.7 8.4 1.3 0.1 3.0 1.8 15.9
Mike Bibby's stats year 2000
Name G MP FG FGA 3P 3PA FT FTA ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TO PF PTS
Devin Harris 80 26.0 3.7 7.4 0.2 0.6 2.7 3.3 0.6 1.9 2.5 3.7 1.2 0.3 1.8 3.0 10.2
Devin Harris now.
Hmmmm. Looks like Mike Bibby > Devin Harris at similar points in their career. But Dallas has more players than Vancouver did.
Plus Harris averaged 12 less minutes per game. Maybe on the Kings Harris could break out?
It's Risky.
Mike Bibby 82 38.9 6.4 14.1 1.3 3.5 1.7 2.3 0.6 3.1 3.7 8.4 1.3 0.1 3.0 1.8 15.9
Mike Bibby's stats year 2000
Name G MP FG FGA 3P 3PA FT FTA ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TO PF PTS
Devin Harris 80 26.0 3.7 7.4 0.2 0.6 2.7 3.3 0.6 1.9 2.5 3.7 1.2 0.3 1.8 3.0 10.2
Devin Harris now.
Hmmmm. Looks like Mike Bibby > Devin Harris at similar points in their career. But Dallas has more players than Vancouver did.
Plus Harris averaged 12 less minutes per game. Maybe on the Kings Harris could break out?
It's Risky.
Look at their career numbers per 48 minutes for a little more of an accurate picture. Head to head, Harris is by far the better player. Better FG%, 3PT%, FT%, REBs, ASTs, STLs, BLKs, less turnovers, and only a point less scored per 48 minutes.
Using Hollinger's per 40 minute stats, I can use Bibby's fifth season (2002-03) against Harris' 3rd (2006-07).
Bibby:
47% FG, 86% FT, 19.1 pts, 3.2 REB, 6.2 AST,
Harris:
49.2% FG, 82.4% FT, 15.6pts, 3.8 REB, 5.7 AST
Bibby is a little better, but that was also his 5th season. Do I think Harris is better than Bibby? No. But would I swap 24 year old Harris, who is clearly coming into his own for 29 year old Bibby who has severely lost a step? Yeah.
P
PoundForPound
Guest
Harris cannot shoot to save his life.
P
PoundForPound
Guest
Mike Bibby
CaminoChaos
Bench
Not feelin' it Dog.
BawLa
Starter
You don't compare Bibby to Harris straight up unless if we are in contention for something. And with all due respect, Harris wasn't the #1, #2, #3 or even the #5 option for Dallas. He's just a young buck who contributed more than he was expected to.
The only "potential" that Bibby has left, is to help a team win a championship. He is not "the guy" and I think if he went to a team like Dallas, he wouldn't try to be "the guy". He's responsible with the ball, and can knock down clutch shots. I think he would have good chemistry with Dirk on the high post, much like he has with Miller.
The simple overruling fact is that we are rebuilding. So if Bibby is part of your view of the future Kings, then you keep him. But I don't. And since we are rebuilding, why not try to get something for him? Of course you don't be stupid and take on any long contracts. But if we can snag a young PG like Harris, who still has upside BTW, and maybe even a draft pick, then DO IT! The only reason I would hesitate if I were GP, would be because maybe I can get something better.
Bibby, Miller, Artest, Reef, Thomas - get whatever you can for 'em.
The only "potential" that Bibby has left, is to help a team win a championship. He is not "the guy" and I think if he went to a team like Dallas, he wouldn't try to be "the guy". He's responsible with the ball, and can knock down clutch shots. I think he would have good chemistry with Dirk on the high post, much like he has with Miller.
The simple overruling fact is that we are rebuilding. So if Bibby is part of your view of the future Kings, then you keep him. But I don't. And since we are rebuilding, why not try to get something for him? Of course you don't be stupid and take on any long contracts. But if we can snag a young PG like Harris, who still has upside BTW, and maybe even a draft pick, then DO IT! The only reason I would hesitate if I were GP, would be because maybe I can get something better.
Bibby, Miller, Artest, Reef, Thomas - get whatever you can for 'em.
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