47 more games

[tyrant]

kings have won 14 so far. if we go 47-0 then we'll have the same record as we did in 2002. fat chance, i know!! the door hasn't slammed shut just yet. 47 games is alot. and considering how bad some of the other western conference teams are playing we can still make the playoffs if we win at least 32 of these 47 games. 32-15 is possible IF at least 4 of our starting 5 is healthy; but they're gonna have to want it.

when chris webber got injured may of 2003 we had to start the 03-04 season without him. we managed to win 43 out of 58 games with brad, doug, bibby, peja and vlade as our starters. we still have mike, peja, brad and a new bonzi (younger than doug); so why do we suck so bad!!!!

 

[Tenacious D]

Mainly because we still have Bibby, Miller, and Peja. Thanks to the half time show we got to see what they do in the off season. Nothing. They are used to winning but no one is scared of them anymore. When they are offense only and people figure out how to stop you then you have to change or at least play at the level you did.

 

[BawLa]

when chris webber got injured may of 2003 we had to start the 03-04 season without him. we managed to win 43 out of 58 games with brad, doug, bibby, peja and vlade as our starters. we still have mike, peja, brad and a new bonzi (younger than doug); so why do we suck so bad!!!!

We suck so bad because we have no cohesion. It takes time to mold togethter and the injuries/bench are not helping.

 

[piksi]

so why do we suck so bad!!!!

lack of talent

 

[Variant]

Injuries, lack of athleticism, too much youth and most importantly, NO LEADER.

With a leader on this team I think we'd be +.500 at least. Adelman's never really been a leader type, Bibby hasn't turned out to be much of one, and Peja certainly is not at all.

We need a star player who will lead by example and in the locker room. That will make up for having a "players" coach.

 

[tyrant]

i just dont understand. we've been running the same offense through everyone's throats for years and no one has been able to contain it. we started the 03-04 season without webber and had mike, peja and brad as our 3 best (core) players. before webb came back mike, peja and brad was able to carry us to a 43-15 record. 43-15

now with the same core we can't even break .500

what's the deal?

 

[Variant]

There's no question there's a mental change now as well. The team doesn't really believe in itself and anyone with that type of attitude (and especially a group) is not going to find it very easy to give 100%.

They believed in themselves back then because they still had some leaders on the team and they had some recent success to build off of. They believed in themselves.

For whatever reason they don't now, and who knows what it's going to take to shake them out of that funk.

Can anyone think of any teams recently that were in a really bad funk like this and managed to work themselves out of it without making a major trade or coaching change?

 

[Bricklayer]

i just dont understand. we've been running the same offense through everyone's throats for years and no one has been able to contain it. we started the 03-04 season without webber and had mike, peja and brad as our 3 best (core) players. before webb came back mike, peja and brad was able to carry us to a 43-15 record. 43-15

now with the same core we can't even break .500

what's the deal?

Its an interesting point, and also a somewhat annoying one. Not annoyed at you. But I think a large part of the abrupt supidity that has infested our front office has been precisely them running around for the last 2 years trying to recreate half a season of basketball from a different era. When the fans get fascinated by that stretch, its one thing. But a front office should know better.

Things in no particular order:
-- that team had leadership
-- Vlade ran that show and set the tone. He led the offense.
-- Doug ran the defense (although that team sucked defensively and on the glass -- why it was a mirage).
-- Bobby Jackson was there and healthy right through that whole stretch. He was like a 6th starter and instantly catapulted our bench far above the current one.
-- so right there -- gone are the offensive leader, defensive leader and bench leader
-- We were completely injury free with the top 6 guys. Not only missing no games, but not even banged up.
-- We had players who complimented each other better, and who had been running the system for years.
-- We were bigger + started two seven footers, although obviously the size was soft.
-- Peja's game was critically dependent on the two guys who are gone -- Vlade and Doug.
-- We had chemsitry.
-- We had the lingering beleif in ourselves as an elite team. A critical component. We still had bigtime pride.
-- And here is the one that people repeatedly miss -- we were never supposed to have to do it on our own! We had hope, expended tremendous energy, in the belief that the cavalry (#4) was coming, and when he returned we would vault right up and kick everyone's ***. Webb was still right there, right on the sidelines, and we were still the Kings. There were no concerns about roles, about who was going to be the Man etc. (until the end when it fell apart obviously) because Webb was supposed to be back in January. Then February. Then March. It was basicaly an extended version of the run San Antonio put together last year without Duncan, or the one in Phoenix now without Amare. You know he is coming back, so you are just out busting your butt trying to keep it afloat for as long as possible. Every win you feel good about because its not really expected, and soon the burden will be lifted away by somebody else. If you knew that guy was never coming back, it would change things.
-- also think its a rather critical mistake people make about who the best players on those old teams were. Of course what we are finding out now. Or maybe a better term would the engines. We have left the finishers. But the engines, the guys who creatred everything, created opportunities for the finishers and covered up their flaws, are precisely the names missing now. Why this was never a viable "core". They are actually an anti-core. They are all the guys we surroudned the REAL core with. More than roleplayers. But players dependent on the true core for their high-level success.

 

[tyrant]

as far as teams that start the season sucking but begin winning when the seasons' half over without any player or coach changes? there aren't any within this decade or the last. all i could think of is that 03-04 season the spurs started a horrible (their the spurs) 10-10. but after that they won like 10 straight.

 

[tyrant]

-- And here is the one that people repeatedly miss -- we were never supposed to have to do it on our own! We had hope, expended tremendous energy, in the belief that the cavalry (#4) was coming, and when he returned we would vault right up and kick everyone's ***. Webb was still right there, right on the sidelines, and we were still the Kings. There were no concerns about roles, about who was going to be the Man etc. (until the end when it fell apart obviously) because Webb was supposed to be back in January. Then February. Then March. It was basicaly an extended version of the run San Antonio put together last year without Duncan, or the one in Phoenix now without Amare. You know he is coming back, so you are just out busting your butt trying to keep it afloat for as long as possible. Every win you feel good about because its not really expected, and soon the burden will be lifted away by somebody else. If you knew that guy was never coming back, it would change things.

well said bricklayer. well said

 

[coolhandluke]

Its an interesting point, and also a somewhat annoying one. Not annoyed at you. But I think a large part of the abrupt stupidity that has infested our front office has been precisely them running around for the last 2 years trying to recreate half a season of basketball from a different era. When the fans get fascinated by that stretch, its one thing. But a front office should know better.

Things in no particular order:
-- that team had leadership
-- Vlade ran that show and set the tone. He led the offense.
-- Doug ran the defense (although that team sucked defensively and on the glass -- why it was a mirage).
-- Bobby Jackson was there and healthy right through that whole stretch. He was like a 6th starter and instantly catapulted our bench far above the current one.
-- so right there -- gone are the offensive leader, defensive leader and bench leader
-- We were completely injury free with the top 6 guys. Not only missing no games, but not even banged up.
-- We had players who complimented each other better, and who had been running the system for years.
-- We were bigger + started two seven footers, although obviously the size was soft.
-- Peja's game was critically dependent on the two guys who are gone -- Vlade and Doug.
-- We had chemsitry.
-- We had the lingering belief in ourselves as an elite team. A critical component. We still had bigtime pride.
-- And here is the one that people repeatedly miss -- we were never supposed to have to do it on our own! We had hope, expended tremendous energy, in the belief that the cavalry (#4) was coming, and when he returned we would vault right up and kick everyone's ***. Webb was still right there, right on the sidelines, and we were still the Kings. There were no concerns about roles, about who was going to be the Man etc. (until the end when it fell apart obviously) because Webb was supposed to be back in January. Then February. Then March. It was basicaly an extended version of the run San Antonio put together last year without Duncan, or the one in Phoenix now without Amare. You know he is coming back, so you are just out busting your butt trying to keep it afloat for as long as possible. Every win you feel good about because its not really expected, and soon the burden will be lifted away by somebody else. If you knew that guy was never coming back, it would change things.
-- also think its a rather critical mistake people make about who the best players on those old teams were. Of course what we are finding out now. Or maybe a better term would the engines. We have left the finishers. But the engines, the guys who created everything, created opportunities for the finishers and covered up their flaws, are precisely the names missing now. Why this was never a viable "core". They are actually an anti-core. They are all the guys we surrounded the REAL core with. More than roleplayers. But players dependent on the true core for their high-level success.

Right on! Brick wins the "Post of the day" honors.

 

[VF21]

Its an interesting point, and also a somewhat annoying one. Not annoyed at you. But I think a large part of the abrupt supidity that has infested our front office has been precisely them running around for the last 2 years trying to recreate half a season of basketball from a different era. When the fans get fascinated by that stretch, its one thing. But a front office should know better.

Things in no particular order:
-- that team had leadership
-- Vlade ran that show and set the tone. He led the offense.
-- Doug ran the defense (although that team sucked defensively and on the glass -- why it was a mirage).
-- Bobby Jackson was there and healthy right through that whole stretch. He was like a 6th starter and instantly catapulted our bench far above the current one.
-- so right there -- gone are the offensive leader, defensive leader and bench leader
-- We were completely injury free with the top 6 guys. Not only missing no games, but not even banged up.
-- We had players who complimented each other better, and who had been running the system for years.
-- We were bigger + started two seven footers, although obviously the size was soft.
-- Peja's game was critically dependent on the two guys who are gone -- Vlade and Doug.
-- We had chemsitry.
-- We had the lingering beleif in ourselves as an elite team. A critical component. We still had bigtime pride.
-- And here is the one that people repeatedly miss -- we were never supposed to have to do it on our own! We had hope, expended tremendous energy, in the belief that the cavalry (#4) was coming, and when he returned we would vault right up and kick everyone's ***. Webb was still right there, right on the sidelines, and we were still the Kings. There were no concerns about roles, about who was going to be the Man etc. (until the end when it fell apart obviously) because Webb was supposed to be back in January. Then February. Then March. It was basicaly an extended version of the run San Antonio put together last year without Duncan, or the one in Phoenix now without Amare. You know he is coming back, so you are just out busting your butt trying to keep it afloat for as long as possible. Every win you feel good about because its not really expected, and soon the burden will be lifted away by somebody else. If you knew that guy was never coming back, it would change things.
-- also think its a rather critical mistake people make about who the best players on those old teams were. Of course what we are finding out now. Or maybe a better term would the engines. We have left the finishers. But the engines, the guys who creatred everything, created opportunities for the finishers and covered up their flaws, are precisely the names missing now. Why this was never a viable "core". They are actually an anti-core. They are all the guys we surroudned the REAL core with. More than roleplayers. But players dependent on the true core for their high-level success.

Brick - I've read pretty much every single post you've made on this board. And, of all of them, I think this one should go down as one of your all-time best. You not only hit the nail on the head, you drove it clear through with one swing of the hammer.

You, sir, deserve a standing ovation.

 

[Bballkingsrock]

Its an interesting point, and also a somewhat annoying one. Not annoyed at you. But I think a large part of the abrupt supidity that has infested our front office has been precisely them running around for the last 2 years trying to recreate half a season of basketball from a different era. When the fans get fascinated by that stretch, its one thing. But a front office should know better.

Things in no particular order:
-- that team had leadership
-- Vlade ran that show and set the tone. He led the offense.
-- Doug ran the defense (although that team sucked defensively and on the glass -- why it was a mirage).
-- Bobby Jackson was there and healthy right through that whole stretch. He was like a 6th starter and instantly catapulted our bench far above the current one.
-- so right there -- gone are the offensive leader, defensive leader and bench leader
-- We were completely injury free with the top 6 guys. Not only missing no games, but not even banged up.
-- We had players who complimented each other better, and who had been running the system for years.
-- We were bigger + started two seven footers, although obviously the size was soft.
-- Peja's game was critically dependent on the two guys who are gone -- Vlade and Doug.
-- We had chemsitry.
-- We had the lingering beleif in ourselves as an elite team. A critical component. We still had bigtime pride.
-- And here is the one that people repeatedly miss -- we were never supposed to have to do it on our own! We had hope, expended tremendous energy, in the belief that the cavalry (#4) was coming, and when he returned we would vault right up and kick everyone's ***. Webb was still right there, right on the sidelines, and we were still the Kings. There were no concerns about roles, about who was going to be the Man etc. (until the end when it fell apart obviously) because Webb was supposed to be back in January. Then February. Then March. It was basicaly an extended version of the run San Antonio put together last year without Duncan, or the one in Phoenix now without Amare. You know he is coming back, so you are just out busting your butt trying to keep it afloat for as long as possible. Every win you feel good about because its not really expected, and soon the burden will be lifted away by somebody else. If you knew that guy was never coming back, it would change things.
-- also think its a rather critical mistake people make about who the best players on those old teams were. Of course what we are finding out now. Or maybe a better term would the engines. We have left the finishers. But the engines, the guys who creatred everything, created opportunities for the finishers and covered up their flaws, are precisely the names missing now. Why this was never a viable "core". They are actually an anti-core. They are all the guys we surroudned the REAL core with. More than roleplayers. But players dependent on the true core for their high-level success.

GREAT POST. I think that should be on the home page of KINGSFANS.com!

 

[6th]

Yes! I'm in favor of featuring that on the Home Page. We are very fortunate here to have members with such wonderful ways with words.

Bravo, Brickie!!

 

[Daniela]

Its an interesting point, and also a somewhat annoying one. Not annoyed at you. But I think a large part of the abrupt supidity that has infested our front office has been precisely them running around for the last 2 years trying to recreate half a season of basketball from a different era. When the fans get fascinated by that stretch, its one thing. But a front office should know better.

Things in no particular order:
-- that team had leadership
-- Vlade ran that show and set the tone. He led the offense.
-- Doug ran the defense (although that team sucked defensively and on the glass -- why it was a mirage).
-- Bobby Jackson was there and healthy right through that whole stretch. He was like a 6th starter and instantly catapulted our bench far above the current one.
-- so right there -- gone are the offensive leader, defensive leader and bench leader
-- We were completely injury free with the top 6 guys. Not only missing no games, but not even banged up.
-- We had players who complimented each other better, and who had been running the system for years.
-- We were bigger + started two seven footers, although obviously the size was soft.
-- Peja's game was critically dependent on the two guys who are gone -- Vlade and Doug.
-- We had chemsitry.
-- We had the lingering beleif in ourselves as an elite team. A critical component. We still had bigtime pride.
-- And here is the one that people repeatedly miss -- we were never supposed to have to do it on our own! We had hope, expended tremendous energy, in the belief that the cavalry (#4) was coming, and when he returned we would vault right up and kick everyone's ***. Webb was still right there, right on the sidelines, and we were still the Kings. There were no concerns about roles, about who was going to be the Man etc. (until the end when it fell apart obviously) because Webb was supposed to be back in January. Then February. Then March. It was basicaly an extended version of the run San Antonio put together last year without Duncan, or the one in Phoenix now without Amare. You know he is coming back, so you are just out busting your butt trying to keep it afloat for as long as possible. Every win you feel good about because its not really expected, and soon the burden will be lifted away by somebody else. If you knew that guy was never coming back, it would change things.
-- also think its a rather critical mistake people make about who the best players on those old teams were. Of course what we are finding out now. Or maybe a better term would the engines. We have left the finishers. But the engines, the guys who creatred everything, created opportunities for the finishers and covered up their flaws, are precisely the names missing now. Why this was never a viable "core". They are actually an anti-core. They are all the guys we surroudned the REAL core with. More than roleplayers. But players dependent on the true core for their high-level success.

Wow! Eloquent, precise, and it's the truth. My compliments Bricklayer.

 

[Kev.in]

-- Bobby Jackson was there and healthy right through that whole stretch. He was like a 6th starter and instantly catapulted our bench far above the current one.

Bobby was so good back then and so consistent. Many times he was outright unguardable. The Kings could be just hanging with a team through one quarter and then Bobby would come in and go on a personal 8-0 run to give us control of the game.

 

[BibityBobtyBoom]

at this point i would rather have a lottery pick than be in the playoffs

 

[DaMan]

We will be no were near the playoffs, we be no were near .500 at season end, we just suck so bad.

 

[GoGoGadget]

Its an interesting point, and also a somewhat annoying one. Not annoyed at you. But I think a large part of the abrupt supidity that has infested our front office has been precisely them running around for the last 2 years trying to recreate half a season of basketball from a different era. When the fans get fascinated by that stretch, its one thing. But a front office should know better.

Things in no particular order:
-- that team had leadership
-- Vlade ran that show and set the tone. He led the offense.
-- Doug ran the defense (although that team sucked defensively and on the glass -- why it was a mirage).
-- Bobby Jackson was there and healthy right through that whole stretch. He was like a 6th starter and instantly catapulted our bench far above the current one.
-- so right there -- gone are the offensive leader, defensive leader and bench leader
-- We were completely injury free with the top 6 guys. Not only missing no games, but not even banged up.
-- We had players who complimented each other better, and who had been running the system for years.
-- We were bigger + started two seven footers, although obviously the size was soft.
-- Peja's game was critically dependent on the two guys who are gone -- Vlade and Doug.
-- We had chemsitry.
-- We had the lingering beleif in ourselves as an elite team. A critical component. We still had bigtime pride.
-- And here is the one that people repeatedly miss -- we were never supposed to have to do it on our own! We had hope, expended tremendous energy, in the belief that the cavalry (#4) was coming, and when he returned we would vault right up and kick everyone's ***. Webb was still right there, right on the sidelines, and we were still the Kings. There were no concerns about roles, about who was going to be the Man etc. (until the end when it fell apart obviously) because Webb was supposed to be back in January. Then February. Then March. It was basicaly an extended version of the run San Antonio put together last year without Duncan, or the one in Phoenix now without Amare. You know he is coming back, so you are just out busting your butt trying to keep it afloat for as long as possible. Every win you feel good about because its not really expected, and soon the burden will be lifted away by somebody else. If you knew that guy was never coming back, it would change things.
-- also think its a rather critical mistake people make about who the best players on those old teams were. Of course what we are finding out now. Or maybe a better term would the engines. We have left the finishers. But the engines, the guys who creatred everything, created opportunities for the finishers and covered up their flaws, are precisely the names missing now. Why this was never a viable "core". They are actually an anti-core. They are all the guys we surroudned the REAL core with. More than roleplayers. But players dependent on the true core for their high-level success.

This post sucks and I disagree with every word.































Okay, that's not even remotely true.

But, c'mon, all the Brick love was making me ill.

 

[Evenstar]

i'm with the rest of the gang brick, that was a damn good post!

 

[SLAB]

This thread has been hijaked into the Brickie apprriciation thread!

And I'll continue the hijaking...

Great post Brick! I second everyone else's words.

 

[BibityBobtyBoom]

i think one humongous problem is basically swagger, confidence, attitude. It is missing. Webber was all of that and he also added leadership. players like garnett, shaq, and iverson feed their teams with that stuff. I don't know where we can find that in artest? maybe? reddick? oh yeah!!!!!!!!!! lol jk, no more guards for us thank you. but that would be an awesome back court, bibby and reddick.

 

[loopymitch]

great post brick, do you want RA's job? Never mind, just take Petrie's.