Would you....

[VF21]

^^Very nice post, although I wouldn't have necessarily called Brad an "overpriced, soft center." (Not disagreeing, just saying I probably wouldn't have said it.)

I would love to see Kevin Garnett out there with Bibby, possibly Artest, and our kids. Even if they didn't go deep into the playoffs -which I'm predicting right now they would - they'd certainly be a lot more exciting to watch than the mismatched group of guys who happened to find that box of uniforms...

 

[Löwenherz]

And that's the thing: I'd prefer rebuilding by getting multiple picks from this draft and dumping salary for next year's FA pool.

But if we somehow ended up with KG and teamed him with Artest and Bibby ... I wouldn't exactly be mad about it.

 

[Superman]

He has certainly had the talent around him for that, if he is actually the leader and MVP that so many claim. The great leader allowed that same WCF team to collapse the next year.

The exact same team, just with Cassell playing a much more limited role due to injuries, and without Sprewell at all.

No big changes, just the same two players that helped them finally get out of the first round weren't contributing like they did the year before...

Moreover, an MVP in his prime has missed the playoffs for the past three years. That is inexcusable.

The T-Wolves only missed the playoffs last year and this year.

I agree that a player like Garnett should be getting his team in the playoffs every single year, but in his twelve year career, he's only missed the playoffs twice, if memory serves me correctly. That's not evidence that he's past his prime; just proof that one player can't carry a team and a franchise forever. Paired up with a complementary player like Mike Bibby and an All-Star like Artest, minus off the court problems, and that's a formidable lineup for several seasons, possibly. Add to that Petrie's ability to find solid role players, and we have ourselves a team, I think.

I am not interested in another half-arsed attempt at contention that centers around three feckless leaders in KG, Artest, and Bibby. I'd much rather start a rebuild around high-character guys like Martin, Garcia, and a draft pick, possibly keeping Miller as a mentor.

Because Brad Miller is a much better leader/champion than Kevin Garnett, right? Miller has never been more than the third best player on his team.

You can build a championship contender around Garnett. He's a monster rebounder, he's unselfish, extremely competitive, and wants to win. Still in his prime, desperately needs a change of scenery, and could definitely lead a well-built squad deep in the playoffs. I don't think acquiring one of the five best players in the League qualifies as a "half-arsed attempt" at anything. It would make us a bonafide contender for several seasons, assuming chemistry isn't an issue.

Chemistry might very well be an issue, and that's a fair concern to have, but to impugn the abilities of a guy like Kevin Garnett (who would easily be better than anyone we've ever had suit up for the Kings, no disrespect to Webber) is absurd.

 

[Venom]

Googs is, at best, a third option scorer for a decent team. He was a "star" in Minny when KG got there because the T-Wolves sucked that badly.

Perhaps that's merely conjecture on my part -- but he was merely above-average for the Bullets, was traded twice his third year in the league, and spent the last six years in the NBA as a roll player averaging less than 10 ppg.

The only two years he averaged more than 20 ppg, he did it playing along side KG.



Cassell was little more than a talented journeyman before joining the T-Wolves (his sixth team), and to a degree still is. He established himself a little in Milwaukee, but never really made the Bucks relevent.

And he won 2 championships with a "real post-oriented stud" his first two seasons in the league as an offensive spark plug off the bench -- averaging less than 10 points both years.



For the second championship, Hall of Famer Clyde Drexler, who basically rescued the struggling defending champions when he was brought over in a mid-season trade.

But you're right, the first year Olajuwon did it mostly by himself ... and carried Otis Thorpe, Vernon Maxwell, Robert Horry, Sam Cassell, Kenny Smith and Mario Elie.

Or maybe depth can be considered an elite #2 as well.



A lot is made about the 7 straight first round losses. But the T-wolves were huge, huge underdogs in every single one of them.

KG's first year in the playoffs the T-Wolves lost to the Rockets with Olajuwon, Drexler and Barkley on the team.

His second year they lost to Gary Payton, Vin Baker (when he was still All-Star caliber) and Detlef Schrempf during the Sonics' third straight Pac Div Championship -- pushing them to the full 5 games.

His other opponents? Tim Duncan, David Robinson and the Spurs (twice) The Trailblazers during their run to the WCF. Dallas and the Big Three. And Kobe and Shaq's Lakers.

You may think he had the talent around him to upset at least one of those teams, but that just may be an unreconcilable disagreement between us, which is fine.



I don't think he's been an MVP candidate since 2004. And during those past three years no one could look at the T-wolves roster and say "yeah, they're going to the playoff".

Substitute KG with any one star in the league onto the T-wolves roster and tell me they would carry that team to the playoffs.

That's not sarcasm, I'm actually curious who we might come up with.



And on this, we are in complete and utter agreement -- on most of your points.

The last thing I want is another "win now" situation with a window that closes in two years -- when the draft won't be as rich and we will have missed out on next year's talented FA crop.

But I don't understand your characterization of Garnett. Is it because of the alleged assualt charges when he was in High School -- because I saw Behind the Glory too.

Or is it just his on-court, in your face, power game persona, mixed with futility in the playoffs that you assume he's a thug?

Most Minny fans seem to have great things to say about his character and community involvement as well as passion for the game. Maybe I'm just not privy to the same info as you.

The irony is, you don't want KG as a mentor, but you do want Miller. Why, cause he's a good ole boy?

The last thing I want is an overpriced, soft center who also has never won anything mentoring the next generation of our team.

I never said he was a thug, although he certainly does not seem to like teammates of a particular skin tone. I am just adamantly against mortgaging the future, again, when (just about) everything Petrie has been doing has been building towards a youth/FA movement this summer and next.

I wouldn't mind keeping Miller because he is the least movable piece on the roster, honestly. All my beefs with KG such as lack of time in the weight room, lack of leadership, and on-court posing go eight-fold for Miller. If this was the NFL he would have been cut two years ago. But it's not, and I think he would accept coming off the bench, so you might as well make the most of it.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought Googs was felled by injuries. The Bullets trading him does not mean much. They also traded Rasheed Wallace and Chris Webber. Cassell has been a stud wherever he's played. If anything, he elevated the play of KG by removing the need to deliver in the clutch.

This will be pure conjecture, but I think any MVP in his prime gets the T-Wolves to the playoffs. I really do. Whether it's Lebron, Kobe, Time Duncan, or Steve Nash, I think they make it. I know that, outwardly, KG sure seems to care alot. He screams and stares alot, and maybe that looks like leadership. But I've learned that the most demonstrative person is never the real leader. And I don't want to roll the dice on a guy who I feel is a paper tiger.

But whatever. I have been making this argument for at least seven years now, and ninety-five percent of the people I talk to disagree. Meanwhile, Garnett keeps on doing not much more beyond piling up stats. All I'm asking for is proof of leadership. Why don't any of these "second-rate" stars want to stay in Minnesota if Garnett increases their games so much? Money? Garnett is the guy who killed their cap space. And sure, he's just getting his. But if you want to win, really want to win, then you have to sacrifice to do it. I just flat don't want him. He's a #2 guy trapped in a #1's body with a #1's ego. We did that with Webber, whom I love and take over Garnett every day of the week, but I don't want to do it again.

 

[Löwenherz]

Like I said, I'm totally with you on rebuilding and not mortgaging the future. Even if we did get KG (which let's be honest, isn't happening) and teamed him with Artest and Bibby, regardless of how successful it was, they'd all likely be gone in two years, putting us right back where we are now, just in a worse situation.

But I think you're either overestimating the league's superstars or the T-Wolves roster ... because it really is terrible.

You put Kobe, Lebron or Nash on that team without KG and your other four starters are probably Blount, Madsen, Davis, and either Hassell or James.

Even if the star plays out of his mind, I'm just not seeing that as enough, especially in the West with that pathetic frontcourt.

Your best bet would probably be Duncan or Dirk, which is more fair considering their similar positions. And you could possibly post a good arguement with either of those two, but it's debatable.

Really, I think whether KG is overrated or not, the roster around him shows just how terrible McHale is at building a team -- despite being named the best GM in sports by Forbes.